(Topic ID: 335970)

Troubleshooting a Gottlieb Lawman (Sheriff) Startup

By Fieromaster

11 months ago


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#1 11 months ago

Hi there!

I recently purchased a 1971 Gottlieb Lawman (Sheriff) and it wasn't working when I bought it.

So far, some progress has been made on getting things going, but I'm stuck on getting the startup procedure to complete. I have a manual, and schematic. I have been doing my best to read this schematic, but admittedly it starts to look like spaghetti after a while.

When powered up, the "QB" (game over) and "ZB" (1st ball in play) relays are sucked in. When inserting a coin, or pressing the replay button with credits on the credits wheel, the startup sequence begins. The "SB" (reset control relay) sucks in, and the arm on the control bank resets. None of these relays activate again during this sequence.

Simultaneously the bonus unit makes a few steps, and the inboard facing coil becomes latched on. While that is buzzing away, the 100's score reel is spinning constantly and not resetting on player 1. It does not carry over to any other reels, just spins around and around.

It looks like the latched coil on the bonus unit is activated by the "C" relay (advance bonus relay). The "C" relay is latched on as well, and if I push it out of position, it unlatches the solenoid on the bonus unit. This also allows the spinning 100's score reel to begin carrying the score over to the 1000's unit.

This is as far as the machine gets. I only let it run like this for a few seconds at a time to troubleshoot since I don't want the coil on the bonus unit to overheat. I have checked the switch positions on the 1st player 100s unit to confirm they work properly in 1-8, 0, and 9 positions. I have not verified they work electrically with a meter.

Some background. I have extensive knowledge of automotive 12v systems, and reading automotive vehicle schematics. These schematics are just something else. I have a good meter, and know how to use it, the problem I'm having is not knowing where.

Thanks in advance for reading my post. Hopefully we can get this thing figured out!

#2 11 months ago

If I am understanding correctly you are trying to get the score to reset to zero and start a game. If that is the correct, it is important to note that the score reels do not roll over from one to another during the reset process. Once the start/replay button is pressed all score reels not already resting at zero should begin to count upwards until they reach zero. During this process, if any number continues to count past zero it is most likely going to be an issue with the zero position switch on that digit's score reel. So, if all of your reels are resting at zero but your 100, upon pressing the start button only the 100s reel should move until it reaches zero completing the reset sequence and starting the game.

#3 11 months ago
Quoted from Fieromaster:

the bonus unit makes a few steps, and the inboard facing coil becomes latched on.

This is the first thing to fix. The inside Motor 1A switch should make the Subtract Bonus unit solenoid pulse instead of latch on.

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#4 11 months ago

Awesome. Thank you for the info. I forgot to mention something else about the startup. The score motor just runs continuously as well.

#5 11 months ago
Quoted from Fieromaster:

Awesome. Thank you for the info. I forgot to mention something else about the startup. The score motor just runs continuously as well.

It's normal for the score motor to run pretty much constantly until the reset completes

#6 11 months ago

Hey,

You mentioned having the manual. In the manual does it have some sort of start up sequence or reset cycle sequence. Something that shows what relays have to kick on in order to start the game? If so that would be a good place to start.

#7 11 months ago

While my good friend Sbenedetto is right that the startup sequence is in the Lawman manual (on page 2),
OP Fieromaster has identified a locked on coil. And my recommended order for fixing things is:

When faced with multiple problems, here's the order to fix them:

1) Any solenoid that's locked on
2) Any relay that's locked on that shouldn't be

These are first because they'll burn out their coils if left locked on

3) Problem(s) with the start sequence

These are next because they're responsible for getting the machine into a known state

4) Any other single problem

#8 11 months ago

I have done some testing, and I tested the slate/red wire on switch 1A. I used continuity to check and see if the switch was "stuck closed" and it pulses properly when turning the score motor by hand. Any ideas on some more troubleshooting tips?

#9 11 months ago

I have tried another approach. I unplugged the back box, and started the machine. The coil goes not latch on with the back box disconnected.

I decided to spend some time giving everything a look over in the back box, and noticed that the player motor is not moving. I bumped the player motor up a couple of clicks by hand, and I added points to 1 and 2 player. I started the machine, and it gets almost all the way through the startup sequence. I have attached 2 videos for context.

#10 10 months ago
Quoted from Fieromaster:

I have done some testing, and I tested the slate/red wire on switch 1A. I used continuity to check and see if the switch was "stuck closed" and it pulses properly when turning the score motor by hand. Any ideas on some more troubleshooting tips?

Few questions. In the first video you posted when both player one and player 2 score resets it appears that the lights around the horseshoe moves as if there is a switch on the gamefield advancing the lights. What is the relay that advances those lights doing when you press the reset button?

1 week later
#11 10 months ago

Good catch (The horseshoe lights are related to the bonus). The bonus is advancing, and the bonus advance solenoid is stuck on... I finally figured out what was causing the issue. There were 2 rollover switches that were stuck on and causing the bonus unit to latch on.

One of the rollovers that was stuck was on the left outlane and the other was tricky! On the right side of the playfield, there are 2 lanes with rollovers. The switches all looked to be gapped properly, but on closer inspection, the metal "bar" that is part of the switch assembly was bent toward the playfield and making contact with the bottom part of the switch.

What finally made the connection for me was explaining it to a friend of mine and noticing that the slate red wire in the schematic above (Motor 1A) was part of the trigger for the bonus unit, and so I looked at everything on the playfield with a slate red wire attached to it and discovered the 2 rollover switches.

Thanks for the help on that part. Now I need to work on the lower pop bumper, it is only going down about halfway and not opening the end of stroke switch on that unit, so the pop bumpers are sticking on.

After that I need to find out why the game isn't starting over when pushing the replay switch. It also won't end the game and after ball 5 it just keeps playing. One thing at a time though! Thanks again to all the contributors for the help.

#12 10 months ago

Just wanted to add, you can see the lights on the playfield illuminated for the switches that were stuck on in the first video I attached at 0:31 seconds. It was the blue outlane on the bottom left, and the middle rollover on the most right hand lane mid playfield.

#13 10 months ago
Quoted from Fieromaster:

why the game isn't starting over when pushing the replay switch

Does the 1st Ball in Play (ZB) relay on the control bank ever trip?

7 months later
#14 3 months ago

I wanted to post an update just in case it helps someone else, but the solution to that specific issue, was the fact that someone had tried adjusting the rollover switches on the playfield (incorrectly) and there were 3 that were stuck in the closed position.

I adjusted those 3 switches causing the problem, and checked as many others as I could find.

I'm not on the opposite end of the troubleshooting. I rebuilt the pop bumpers and cleaned up the playfield, but the last issue I need to address is the end of game sequence.

The ball will drain on the last ball, and the game doesn't end. It will kick back into the shooter lane and if you hit any points on the playfield, the score motors will start resetting (counting backward).

I'm going to start investigating the end of game switch/circuit.

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