(Topic ID: 84472)

Troubleshooting a D-12232 display board... from Diner

By johnwartjr

10 years ago



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#1 10 years ago

Display is out of game #571, which is Diner.

Segments h' and r' are ghosting - lighting during incorrect points.

The display is being tested in a 100% working game with no issues with its 'stock' display.

Video of the behavior:

Looking at the schematic, h' and r' are on different 7180s. h' is on U210, while r' is on U19.

How do I troubleshoot this? My understanding is, since the segment problem is on the alphanumeric segments, it's the 7180...

Looking at the schematic, they both connect to leg 14 of the UDN7180s, which traces back to leg 6 of U7 and U8..

Am I on the right track? U7 and U8 are 4049s.. seems strange that they would both be bad...

#2 10 years ago

first try to find out if there are pins shorted with solder since segment "E" + "R" and segment "F" + "H" are located next to each other on the PCB.

display-diner.JPGdisplay-diner.JPG
#3 10 years ago

Verified no pins shorted with solder - using a meter, not just my eyes

#4 10 years ago

Going from memory, failing resistor networks on the MPU can cause segment ghosting.

#5 10 years ago

the ones on the CPU board are fine though - I'm testing a spare display in a 100% working game.

#7 10 years ago

If you had an extra glass, I'd try touching it to the pins on the bottom display and see if you get the same ghosting. I'm guessing the glass is the problem because the missing segments are not showing any consistency. For example, when there's a "0" in digit 3 on the bottom board, segment h ghosts, but segment r does not whereas it ghosts on all the other ones. Digit 4 is missing the f segment when the number 4 is displayed but it displays in all the other places it should. Digits 8 & 10 miss the f segment on 0 and 4, and digit 8 misses the f segment on 8 & is weak on 9.

The upper display also looks to have an issue on digit 5 (segment g). If that glass is bad it could be dragging the strobes down.

The only thing the ghosting h & r segments have in common is that they (mostly) seem to ghost when their adjacent segments f & e are lit. Both those segments are driven through the 4049 hex buffer at U12. Since it has six separate buffers in it, it's possible two could be bad and the others ok, but if this was the case, I would think either the segment would be locked on or it would never come on. Which is why I think it's a glass issue.

viperrwk

#8 10 years ago

Hmm, you may be right.

Perhaps I should unload this and just stick with a rottendog display Not quite ready to give up, but close.

At the cost of 1 16-digit A/N tube, the rottendog makes sense.

#9 10 years ago
Quoted from johnwartjr:

Hmm, you may be right.
Perhaps I should unload this and just stick with a rottendog display Not quite ready to give up, but close.
At the cost of 1 16-digit A/N tube, the rottendog makes sense.

The economics of these displays are such that when they fail, LED replacement is the only thing that makes sense. A single display glass on 6 or 7 digit displays, I could see replacing the glass.

The only consolation is you have four good 6118s and 7180s you could use in other displays.

viperrwk

#10 10 years ago

Decided to put this one in the marketplace. I've got a few boards with 7180s and 6118s on them, and have been using LED displays in most games that come through here anyways..

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/diner-display-with-issues-d-12232-50-shipping#post-1537310

I do appreciate all the help.

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