(Topic ID: 160397)

Tron ve: is it really coming?

By bb2j3z

7 years ago


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#693 1 year ago

Tron vault would be easy for Stern and Disney to pull off with the game as is. Most of you clearly have no clue regarding licensing. That being said, I am not so sure we will see a vault with movie assets on the LCD or different art. I think if this Vault happens, this will simply be a test for Stern to see how complex it is to convert a DMD game to the new Spike system and what the expected response will be from customers. Most of the posts here are not thinking about this through the lens of a business. What do you think executives are talking about at Stern right now??? It’s not pinball, it’s the economy. Vault editions are Sterns #1 weapon against slowing demand and protecting margins. They are preparing for a slow down and they will use “the ace in their pocket” when they need to. There doesn’t have to be a license time constraint for a Tron renewal, the property is dead………Disney doesn’t care when Stern remakes it. It’s happening, it’s just a matter of when it’s happening.

#695 1 year ago
Quoted from snaroff:

I agree Disney doesn't care, but what makes you so sure Stern is motivated? Sterns margins are healthy as it is. Historically, VE's haven't doubled in price from the original game. Kind of amazing that this thread is 6 years old, yet you/others seem to think it's inevitable. Stern/Gary has been great at licensing and there is no indication licensing is getting tougher for them. I'm still unconvinced Stern has any incentive to revisit this license...

It’s not about Tron, it’s about good business sense and all of Sterns greatest hits will be remade. The hobby has grown and Stern is healthy, but it can all change overnight. In business, you are expected to grow YOY no matter what hurricane is thrown in your way. Go listen to the last Nike earnings call. Inventories across all industries are about to change from an all time lows, to an all time highs. All of those newbies that got into the hobby can flee just as fast as they entered, they don’t have a decade of devotion to this hobby. I am not saying there will be a crash, but inventories will elevate on the used market and within dealers………..last time I checked Stern doesn’t profit from used pinball sales and I don’t see many new people entering our beloved hobby during an economic slow down.

#813 1 year ago
Quoted from snaroff:

I don't know why you feel compelled to preach/school me on "business", but I'm good.
If the economy goes south as you predict (and Stern can't raise production numbers OR maintain/grow their current margins), I hardly think resurrecting TRON will have ANY impact on YOY growth. They've run the bloody title 3/4 times IIRC...sure, it has a Pinsider/Insider following (as this long lived thread demonstrates), however potential newcomers to the hobby could give a hoot (and you acknowledge that "I don’t see many new people entering our beloved hobby during an economic slow down").

Sorry, I didn’t mean to sound preachy. I just think the conditions that created this mess, will shift, causing a slow down. Tron can absolutely help with Stern maintaining their margin and numbers YOY.

#840 1 year ago

Lol………Converting SAM to Spike is not a difficult task and is not “expensive”, it just takes time, like all things in coding. The fools on this thread are clueless and probably own a LOTR or Tron. There is no question that the total time, effort and cost to vault a SAM game on Spike would be drastically less than the cost of developing a new game, which would equate to a much higher profit for Stern. Now let’s get back to the real mystery, would they really go for full LCD movie assets?

#895 1 year ago
Quoted from Ashram56:

You're right, I got emotional. Apologies.

Sorry, but all of that is actually pretty easy from an engineering perspective, which is why the Spike system exists now. Node boards are not as complex as you are making them out to be, nor is any of the conversions you listed. Go back and think of something else because those are easy obstacles for Stern………It’s happening.

#896 1 year ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

Compared to a new game? Sure
Compared to an existing Spike 2 game? No - and hence why it won't happen for the argument of 'its cheaper than XYZ'
Plus any vault is a lower volume run.. meaning it costs more per unit in terms of setup and lost economies of scale to run than another title.

You are 100% wrong, but it’s ok, I see dead people, but they don’t know they are dead………

-4
#899 1 year ago
Quoted from bigguybbr:

From an engineering perspective… Are you by chance an engineer?

Nope, just an informed collector, who happens to know a few engineers that work for big tech companies. That being said, let’s just say that the concerns you guys are posting were actually solved by Stern a while ago. They answered the conversion questions while they were building spike 2. Do you really think they would build a new system and not ensure it was easily backwards compatible?? Especially after seeing what CGC has done with old Bally/Williams games. Seriously people, give Gomez some credit/respect, the guy is a visionary and one of the greatest minds to ever enter the hobby. The “ace” has been in Stern’s pocket for years now, it’s just a matter of when it makes sense to play the card.

-4
#910 1 year ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

No dude. Running TWD on Spike as a field test of the hardware was not solving all the problems. It was a task done with a finite scope to achieve a certain result - Test the hardware. It was also something done as a prototype - which means you don't productize the the work. Little reuse, finite scope, hacks allowed.
To redo tron with hardware that is now 7 years newer?
- The entire wiring harness must be redone
- The entire playfield mechanical layout must be redone
- The emulation software or porting must be redone
- Dealing with the change in A/V must be decided and implemented
- With different cabinet and electrical, must go through all approvals again
- All new documentation
And that's just the highlights...
Do you not realize the entire underside of a PF today is done differently than a pre-spike game? Even the flippers are not mounted the same because they must account for the node board 8 location.
Tron PF
[quoted image]
Spike 2 PF
[quoted image]
But you think this is just 'backwards compatible'.. lol. Go check in with your friends again..

They didn't need backwards compatibility - the point of the system was to DO AWAY with the old construct of how a game was built. The platform can run old games because it's a CPU that can run any code... but running emulation only covers the software gap - not the hardware nor driving that harware.
That's why CGC has a simple off the shelf CPU running the game code and large amounts of abstraction layer software to interface between the emulator and the hardware they built to drive the actual physical game.
Stern has similar problems. Achievable, yes... but certainly not easier to do than TO RUN A GAME ALREADY COMPLETED.

Listen Mr. Bus, I am done speaking with your uneducated self. Everything you mention is not a big deal from a technical perspective and was not a big deal for Stern. Bottom line is, you will be wrong and I will be right, the only question is, are you going to admit you were wrong when the game comes out? It is happening, it’s been in motion for a while.

#975 1 year ago

Few things, we lost 3 years due to Covid and no one could have predicted how the hobby would have grown due to lockdowns and the market being flooded with money. Additionally, you don’t just renew licensing. Companies like Disney are “event” driven and like to align with launches. When Disney shut down the Tron 3 movie years ago due to the focus on their Marvel/Star Wars projects, Tron became an irrelevant property…………….until now. Next year the Tron roller coaster will be opening up at Disney and will be a main attraction. Run the numbers folks, that ride wasn’t cheap to build and a lot on people will be riding it annually. People are getting Marvel/Star Wars fatigued and Tron will be making a comeback. Mr. Flynn’s School Bus and all of the pinheads riding his bus will be scratching their heads in 2023. Let’s go!!

#1052 1 year ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

Tron is a game that on-location doesn't do it justice
1 - A stock TRON pro is ugly. It must be mod'd up to show it's true beauty. Minimum light ramps, arcade mod, better lighting
2 - Soundtrack - you can't really hear the game on location well. Get a TRON at home cranked or with a sub and you'll flip out over the difference
The rules are not complex, but it has objectives that keep you coming back trying to get the goal.
A Stock TRON is a diamond in the rough - it really needs polishing to see it for what it really can be.

We finally agree on something Mr. Bus! I hated Tron the first time I played it on location. Then I played it at my friends house and fell in love! It’s a “one more game pinball machine”, partly due to its simple code, but brutal layout, Ironman 2.0. It’s pinball perfection!

1 year later
#1291 74 days ago

Guys, you are way over thinking this! Tron is happening and don’t believe a word of what Gomez says about how difficult it is porting an old game. They are setting expectations because the game won’t be cheap. It will either be rethemed to the original Tron or we will get the new Tron 3 movie. There will be 1000 LE’s and video assets. If they retheme it to the original 80’s Tron, it will only be offered in a premium and LE model, so we will all have to pony up to get it. Expression lighting will work well with this game.

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