(Topic ID: 235105)

Tron VE in 2020

By fattdirk

1 year ago

Topic Stats

  • 604 posts
  • 168 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 19 days ago by yancy
  • Topic is favorited by 19 Pinsiders


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Topic poll

“Tron VE in 2019?”

  • Yes 155 votes
  • Yes 41 votes

(196 votes)

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#17 1 year ago

TRON is a masterpiece...no need for an LCD and the scoring & rules are awesome. I recently picked up an LE and have owned a Pro for many years.

Stern did 3 runs IIRC. Not difficult to find Pro's or LE's, so a Vault is just a way for someone to get a NIB pin (which is just silly). Plenty of great examples in the market today. If you want a TRON, it's not difficult to find one! PLEASE.

#20 1 year ago
Quoted from delt31:

Masterpiece - no. Very straight forward that results in you playing the same way each time.
Amazing game that is one of sterns best - definitely.
I think the vault brings the inflated used market back to reality which people would like.

If you agree TRON is amazing and one of Sterns best...I don't see why it's not a (Stern) masterpiece. There are many ways to play it.

People looking to flood the market with games that *have already been re-run multiple times* are short-sighted and naive about the long-term effects. Don't get me wrong, some games are worthy of being vaulted, however LOTR and TRON are not in short supply. Again, I recently picked up a TRON LE at a fair/reasonable price (considering heavily modded Pro's are going for 7-8k). If Stern did a nice TRON vault, it would sell for 7-8k. Don't see the price savings. In most cases, the sellers aren't making much money...the TRON mods are costly (easy to spend 2k).

#81 1 year ago

All this TRON talk inspired me. Reached Portal (a rare event for me, played Daft Punk MB (aka End-Of-Line MB). What a blast.

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#96 1 year ago
Quoted from Yokimato:

I’ve heard this before and I don’t see it. There’s actually no TSPP on pinside right not, and having been in the market for one, those that do show up in various markets are snatched quickly if prices right or ...8k+ demand.
It’s a great machine but I don’t think 8 grand is very reasonable, at least not on my budget.

TSPP is an extremely expensive pin to build...built before Stern sharpened the pencil. IMHO, one of the best built Stern's ever made...the quality of all the toys is first rate. TSPP and LOTR were my first 2 pins (back in 2004). Still have LOTR, but sold TSPP a long time ago...

Very highly unlikely to ever be vaulted. If Stern decided to bring it back, they would charge LE prices or cheapen it.

#103 1 year ago
Quoted from Goronic:

Also, IF stern does a TRON vault most people won't care about the original LE model...

Such a petty comment...TRON LE rocks, no matter how much you'd like to see it be diminished!

#125 1 year ago

Low-plays, single owner with well over 2k in great mods for $7,200 is a very fair deal (and no way a VE would touch it). If I didn't already own a Pro and an LE I'd be a buyer. I will likely sell my Pro over the next 6 months and will price is similarly.

This silly obsession with "new". Has anyone noticed that Stern's games are more cheaply built now?? I understand why folks like CGC's B/W remakes, since most non-restored AFM/MB's are beat-up. Finding HUO Stern's manufactured after 2000 just isn't that hard.

#127 1 year ago
Quoted from plowpusher:

Guys waiting for the vault thinking 7k is absurd or inflated for the pros on the market need to give up the dream and just grab one . I bought my first NIB tron pro in 2012 payed $4,300 plus $200 shipping add $2,000 or $,3000 in mods gives you 6.5 to 7.5k tied up so not really cutting a fat hog on this one

Couldn't agree more...here is another "data point": I bought my TRON Pro 6/12/2013 for $5,300 from the original owner (250 plays). Had ~$1000 in mods when I purchased it (3D/chick translites, arcade mod, hallmark lit cycles, rails, LED's). I added another 1k in mods (ColorDMD, ramp lights, Titans, etc.). Paid $400 in shipping. So I have ~$6,700 in it. I've owned it almost 6 years and if I sold it for 7k I'd make a whopping $300

If Stern did a vault, street price would likely be close to a Premium and you'd have to go out and spend 1-2k on mods. If the vaults somehow bundled the 2k in mods most folks love, it would be closer to an LE price.

#134 1 year ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

Well maybe some of us would like to start with a fresh, brand new, unplayed pin and do our own mods. Plus the other countless reasons, a pin that's 6+ years old is not new anymore and shouldn't command new prices, but that's the upside down world of pinball I guess. I also am tired of driving all over the place and hauling a pin out of some guys gameroom, easier for me to just buy a new one and save my time and gas money. I've never enjoyed 15 hour road trips to get a pin. Then there is the thing that gets repeated endlessly on pinside - you shouldn't expect to get your money back on mods. The more I read this thread the more I am convinced we absolutely need a Vault of Tron.

Blah, blah. I've owned a boatload of pin "over 6 years old" that were far better than what's being produced by Stern today. You obviously don't know the pinball market very well and are naive about the amazing job most collectors do with their games. So many games that are dialed in and babied. OTOH, when you unbox a new game, all bets are off. IMDN for example...


#144 1 year ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

Maybe I simply don't want your game, or anyone else's used Tron. Maybe I just want a brand new one. Not seeing the issue here. You seem to think buying a used one should be the only option for anyone wanting a Tron?

Mine isn't for sale. You seem to have a comprehension problem. I'll try one last time. NIB games have become a crap shoot. When you purchase a game from a reputable Pinsider, the games are often dialed in and known to have 0 issues. What's so hard to understand?

Have fun waiting for your "brand new", yet-to-be-announced TRON VE!

1 week later
#160 1 year ago

For all the VE dreamers, here is a nicely modded Pro to consider: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/for-sale-tron-legacy-pro-52

TRON is one of the best playing games of all-time...don't deny yourself.

#168 1 year ago
Quoted from rai:

My experience that no one wants to pay $7200 for my like new pro (loaded ++++) because they feel a vault will be made in the $5500 range but they will need to add $1500 in mods to equal what I have. So it’s as if they’d rather have nothing than spend the same as buying a new +++ mods.
I love my Tron so I’m not selling at a discount. I think Stern will make a vault but not sure when. I think Tron vault is more realistic than LotR because of the BOM on LotR is probably a lot bigger than Tron.

Unlikely the LOTR BOM is more costly than TRON. I own and have worked on both...

#170 1 year ago
Quoted from TwilightZone:

I own both as well. I think LOTR would be a higher BOM. Look at the ramps on LOTR. Metal vs. plastic plus wireframes. I think it has more coils as well. In addition to normal coils (flippers, pops, slings), you have coils for diverter to path of dead, Balrog, VUK on right, and tower in the upper right.
Both are great games

The TRON ramps may be plastic, but they are still costly given the sprawling design. There isn't a big difference either way...

They are both great games! I enjoy playing TRON a lot more...LOTR games are too long

#186 1 year ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

Most of the "no" responses are from current owners.

I own a Pro and LE. If a Vault was released, wouldn't effect me one bit (since they are both keepers).

My concern has to do with oversupply of games in general. Gorgeous TRON's are easily available. Manufacturing new games just so someone can have a brand new one is gluttonous. Unlike the old days, a large % of games built after 2000 are HUO, lightly played examples. If this weren't the case, I'd feel differently.

Stern recently reran Star Trek and got their butt handed to them...very light demand. I'm sure they will do their homework next time they do a re-run or Vault. TRON has been rerun several times and it's unlikely Stern will make business sense of doing a TRON Vault.

#204 1 year ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

I don't want to drive anywhere to get one. I want it delivered NIB straight to my door.
No matter what anyone says, I just don't get the resistance to a Vault. Makes no sense to me. There is obvious demand, not from you, but from a lot of others.
I purchase pins very infrequently. I'd rather just buy new and have it shipped straight to my door versus driving all day and dealing with someone I don't know.

99% of the pins I've owned have been "shipped straight to my door" (from other collectors). I totally "get" why you aren't interested in driving all day and dealing with strangers (carrying bundles of cash

Part of the fun of pinball collecting is "hunting" for great games (and the collectors that baby/restore them). Pinside obviously enables this big-time. Learning how to evaluate games with photos is part of the fun. Most of us who buy/sell games are reviewed on Pinside...you have an entire community to support you. FS threads often help valuing a game (so you don't get ripped off).

I get your attraction to "Vaults", however the hobby would be really boring if you let it revolve around Stern stepping up Vault production. Personally, I'd much prefer Stern to focus their attention on building new/innovative games.

#222 1 year ago
Quoted from jawjaw:

How do you know Stern got their "butt handed to them" on ST vaults?

I've been buying NIB Stern's for 15 years...as a result, I know lots of distributors that have insight/data on what sells and what doesn't.

Quoted from pcprogrammer:

I'm just saying look at my collection. I have one pin now so clearly I don't buy often. When I do buy my next one I'd rather just get it shipped to me new. I don't have time in my life or money to fix on pins.

I get it, but pinball ownership involves fixing shit (NIB or not). I know you won't believe me, but I've spent more time "fixing" my IMDN Premium than most of my old school B/W games (that have been rock solid for many years). I also spent 1 month fixing/tweaking my DILE (a very expensive, NIB game). The point: pinball manufacturing has become "hit or miss" and this belief/dream that NIB implies flawless is a fantasy. I've owned well over 50 games...I speak from experience. All the games I buy are high-end show pieces...

4 months later
#335 9 months ago
Quoted from tl54hill:

Getting really tired of waiting for Stern to release TRONVE. It’s gonna be great, but get on with it already!

TRON's come up for sale fairly often at sensible prices. Even TRON LE's have become a bit easier to find...I picked one up last year (and there were others on the market as well). Lusting after the fictitious "TRON VE" is silly when beautiful examples are available from loving collectors.

#341 9 months ago
Quoted from Guinnesstime:

All of this is true except for the "reasonable prices" part. TRONs are pretty damn pricey to me.

You misquoted me...I said "sensible prices" 7k for heavily modded pros is sensible. I purchased my TRON Pro 6 years ago for ~6k. I've added another 1k in mods (ColorDMD, ramp lights, etc.). If I were to sell, 7k would be totally "sensible".

#342 9 months ago
Quoted from RustyLizard:

Not sure why people wanting this irritates people who don't so much.

It irritates me because this is a collector community where buying/selling is a major part of the hobby. Having people sit on the sidelines and wait for a VE makes no sense. If someone really wants a TRON, satisfy yourself and another collector!

Ironman VE made total sense...there was a true undersupply of that title. Even though I got "hurt" selling mine, it was still the right thing for Stern and the community. I don't see the same shortage of TRON...the prices reflect all the mods people typically add (not rarity).

#356 9 months ago
Quoted from Trekkie1978:

How about people like me that don't want a modded Tron?

Not all TRON's are heavily modded. Like most pinball hunts, may take some patience (and compromise).

1 month later
#379 7 months ago
Quoted from magnoliarichj:

This is why they would remake it. Instead of the used market high price you could get a new one for a similar price. People would buy new instead of used, the used market will suffer. That is what stern does not care about , the used market.

NIB purchases have become a crapshoot. Let me give you a specific example: I just considered a recent Stern LE from a pinball buddy (not mentioning the title because I want this comment to be anonymous). Game had awful visible wood grain...he purchased it NIB. Same thing happened to me on my IMDN Premium...awful wood grain. Ended up purchasing a Stern Premium instead of the LE (from another collector) because the PF was so much nicer (no visible wood grain). Ended up saving 3-4K as well!

The ONLY benefit to buying NIB is availability/time. In addition, many collectors “dial in” the game which takes time & expertise.

Back to TRON VE...highly unlikely. I’m going to be putting my TRON Pro up for sale and I have no doubt it’s nicer than any “yet to be announced” VE!

3 months later
#388 4 months ago

TRON VE will never happen. Stern did 4 TRON runs from 2011-2013. Plenty of TRON's come up on Pinside...gorgeous Pro's for 6-8k and LE's for 9-11k (depending on "mods", condition, etc.).

Even if Stern did do a TRON "Vault", it wouldn't measure up to the SAM examples currently in circulation. I've owned 3 TRON's and still have 2...one of the best pinball machines ever produced. A tough, very special game!

1 month later
#420 3 months ago
Quoted from vbittnv:

I wanted a tron VE for years now but justed picked up a pro. Original run, built like a tank. I dont trust Sterns quality anymore. They haven't made a consistently solid playfield in years. That's what pushed me.

A smart decision...I've been saying this for years. I've owned 3 TRON's, and all have been rock solid (still own 2). An amazing game.

#473 3 months ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

And you’re hung up on never understanding what I mean. Display art direction doesn’t mean it has to look like Pixar. Hence, I prefer great dots to shitty HD CG.

For me, it's the image/sound/shot choreography that makes a game shine. Random, poorly choreographed art (low-res dots or high-res cg) doesn't really add to the player experience.

#475 3 months ago
Quoted from smoothbore19:

I'd be happy with the ramps being made again. I am the second owner of my PRO and it'll never get sold.

Didn't realize the ramps were out of production! Glad the LE I purchased came with a set of new LE ramps...

Might want to contact Marco or Stern to see if they plan on running these again.

#482 3 months ago
Quoted from yancy:

I might be crazy but I think the display animations on most Spike 2 games look great. I mean, yeah, it looks like a computer game. It IS a computer game, with a pinball machine attached. Maybe it helps that I don't play console games or expect Hollywood-caliber CGI at 4K 60fps? All I know is I played a bunch of JP2 last night and it looks awesome.

I agree. I'm playing JP2 more than any other NIB game I've owned in the past several years. Really hard/addictive game. I think the callouts & shot choreography could be improved, but the look & quality of the images work for me as well. With the exception of post pauses & MB intros, I can't say I'm looking at the LCD very often...

2 weeks later
#492 72 days ago
Quoted from chooch:

As someone who as owned both versions and is not biased those who are saying a moded Pro is just as good as LE are full of it. Why does everything have to be a dick measuring contest? Can't the pro and LE owners just enjoy their machines for what they are without having to justify why theirs is better. You can tell without even looking at someones collection which version they own just based on their comments.

That is your option and you are of course entitled to it. However I feel at least you are getting some nice tangible features for the extra money compared to what Stern charges today for a Premium over the Pro and the LE over the Premium. Not sure if this list is 100% accurate however it shows some of the extras they put into the LE.
Color changing lighted ramps
Daft Punk Multiball
Silver around PF inserts (I believe extra clearcoat as well)
Drop targets instead of stand-ups
Moving Recognizer
LED insert PCBs (could be viewed as negative however is still a difference)
Alternating color flashers under the spinner
Individually controlled recognizer inserts in front of the 3 target
Chrome trim
Metal apron with clear blue windows w/ flashers
Metal PF rails
Traditional lockdown bar and receiver

I currently own a heavily modded Pro and an LE. Love the LE features, but my modded Pro is just as good (and I'm not "full of it".

Important to note that "modded Pro's" aren't all equal...depends who is doing the modding. For example, my Pro has gorgeous Mike Chestnut chromed armor & apron which is arguably nicer than what the LE has (just to take one example).

I do agree that many modded Pro's aren't as good as the LE...depends on the situation.

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#496 71 days ago
Quoted from chooch:

Not sure who modded the one you got of delt31 but they clearly didn't know how to install the ramp lights leaving that much of gap at the ends [quoted image]

Well, that isn't the only imperfection, but delt31 did a great job on it overall. I tweaked/fixed several things since picking it up from adamross last year, however tightening up the ramp lights wasn't a priority for me. I actually have new LE ramps that I could substitute when the time comes...

#498 71 days ago
Quoted from vicjw66:

There’s no replacing the color changing ramps and Daft Punk multiball. It would be LE or bust for me.

From my perspective, the Eli color changing LED work great...never heard anyone complain about them.

Daft Punk MB is really "meh" (unfortunately). I love the idea of custom LE code, but DP MB is a fairly boring MB. They definitely could have done something more snazzy. Almost every JP2 MB is more exciting to play than DP MB. The only exception might be the DP MB audio (which is awesome).

If heavily modded Pro's with the Eli color changing LED's didn't approx. LE features, the LE would be selling for north of 10k. LE street prices have been closer to 8.5-10.5k over the past several years, it seems.

In any event, TRON is one of the best overall packages ever produced...modded Pro's and LE's all rock.

#503 71 days ago
Quoted from fattdirk:

LE effects blow away a modded pro. It's a distinct difference. I don't know why anyone is saying it's not.

The difference is minor. As I said in an earlier post, if the LE wire effects were so much better than the aftermarket wire mod, the price gap between heavily modded Pro's and LE's would be more significant (like they were BEFORE the aftermarket color changing wire was introduced).

Since I own both, it's my hands-on opinion. My son and I have put thousands of plays on our TRON's...they are the most played games in our collection.

In any event, you guys are certainly entitled to your opinions!

#511 70 days ago
Quoted from monkeyboypaul:

If I ever decide to move mine on I will give you a heads up.
Bought with 821 games on it from new, stripped, cleaned & playfield protector added. HUO, added all the usual tasteful mods (which were all available then), etc. It’s genuinely mint. I called it the Pro Pimped Edition
I hope a VE comes along, not that I’d buy it (see above), just nice to see a new pinball get made and the TRON theme back in the mainstream. What’s not to like?!

Hmm...let's see...how about Stern quality over the past 5 years or so? The SAM Tron's are rock solid...I've owned 3 (and still own 2). If someone wants a TRON, SAM is the way to go.

#516 68 days ago
Quoted from Sinestro:

Agreed, plus real drop targets.
There's no modding one's way out of that.

Meh. I love drop targets, but on this specific game, the switches enable easier GEM bank shots. I own both a Pro and LE and when I’m playing the Pro, I don’t miss the drops at all.

4 weeks later
#558 38 days ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

I’d like an updated Big Bang Bar. It may happen, it may not. We don’t always get what we want...but, the nice thing is - the games we want already exist if we reaaaaally want one that badly.
My ownership of Tron has nothing to do with anything. I wouldn’t be upset at a Tron remake. It’s just bizarre to see some people so convinced it will happen, that the logic about why it hasn’t and probably won’t is just so easily dismissed.

Probably the same crowd that buys lottery tickets? Ya know, the folks who don't want to raise taxes on wealthy folks because they are convinced they will hit the lottery any day now Gotta love our aspirational culture...

#560 38 days ago
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:

5 Trons in the market place for sale...
Im off to play mine now

Exactly. When IM was Vaulted, they sold immediately.

This LE has been listed for over 1 month...gorgeous game very fairly priced.


Yesterday, I got to Portal and Daft Punk MB. TRON is the total package.

The only game that beats it is JP2!

2 weeks later
#575 25 days ago
Quoted from BoJo:

People like NIB and having something new to unbox. Slap new art work on it and these NIB Newbies will be tripping over themselves to get one.

Pathetic. I've had my share of NIB games, but much prefer buying NOB. For example, I have 2 JP2 Premiums...one NIB, one NOB. The NOB has some nice upgrades (hard-to-find Stern shooter, art blades, shaker), was dialed-in, and was less expensive than the NIB.

#577 24 days ago
Quoted from DS_Nadine:

Yet you bought another. XD

Hmm. Assuming you speak english, my point is pretty basic. Do you understand the word "prefer"? If not, look it up and reread my post.

#583 23 days ago
Quoted from DS_Nadine:

I understand perfectly, but since I don't know why, when and in what order you bought your JP2 machines what you wrote get's the meaning of:
"My JP2 NOB is way better, so I bought a second one NIB", wich is pretty funny.
There is propably some good reason that you bought them two times (Edition upgrade or whatever) but without knowing that it just reads funny for me, no ill will intended.

I see, but your quote is (again) off target. I never said, "My JP2 NOB is way better, so I bought a second one NIB".

Explanation is simple...I live in 2 places. TRON & JP2 are my "go to" games, so I have 2 copies of each. Bought my NIB soon after the game was released (before NOB's were available).

Beautifully modded TRON Pro's and LE's are pretty easy to get @ sensible prices (and the PF's are superior to what is shipped now)...no need for a VE.


#586 23 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

Totally agree.....buying a nice HUO used game is by far the best option...opening a NIB is great for about 20 minutes...completely over rated

Yep, and the first 20 NIB minutes can be much worse when you realize there are build quality issues (much more common lately, unfortunately). If you buy a NOB, many collectors have already dialed in the game and fixed issues.

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