Just read through this thread. I'm relatively new to pinball but I have learned on Pinside that talk of Tron Ve quickly devolves into a humorous mess where the same group of people that feel threatened by the possibility go defensively apesh!t. Again, I was not disappointed. Tron Ve Thread = Good Read Always.Hail Tron Dorks of America.jpg

State your source on this as I'm pretty sure that is a 100% false statement.

The cab - New design
The cab decals - New design as they were decals. 2010's were screen printed (no screen printed cabs sitting around thus the use of decals)
The PF's - New PF's (don't believe me, check the clear coat on the 2010's and the VE's). I highly doubt they would have had them sent back for new clear if they were already just "sitting on the shelf"
The toys - Whiplash (New), War Machine (New), Monger (new). These were new castings vs the same figures that are used in the 2010's
Ramps - No clue on this one.
Translight - No clue on this one on if they had left over stock
Monger Cage - No clue if this one on if they had left over stock

Everything else is not game specific to Iron Man. If you can take the above and show me a source or some sort of proof that they had all that "sitting on the shelves" then I'll agree with you. Otherwise, I think you are spreading false rumors to try and support your theories.

Here's my source:
In 2011, I toured the Stern factory at their annual open house event that they have during Chi. pinball expo. I saw 100's of unused IM play-fields. 100's of them! They stopped production of the Pro version of IM sometime in late 2010/first quarter of 2011. Now, I realize that Stern could have destroyed those PF's but that just doesn't make any sense. I realize those could have been tagged as "defective" PF's and never used... But that doesn't make sense either since the initial IM run had VERY thin clear and they pushed those out the door anyway.

Why wouldn't they send those PF's back to get re-cleared? It would cost a lot less than producing all new PF's and having those cleared. There were around 1,000 IM's sold initially. This was not what Stern or Disney was expecting. IM should have sold extremely well, it simply did not.

The plastic toys cost VERY little. Ramps and translites cost very little to produce as well. (Just ask Jersey Jack. ) The "Decal" method of getting artwork onto cabinets costs significantly less than directly screening/printing them.

All of these "changes" were in line with what Stern did in 2014 for ALL GAMES PRODUCED going forward. New cabinets, LEDs for all bulbs, new method to apply art. THAT stuff was all happening any way. I honestly think Stern was just testing the waters with all of these new procedures, calculating the production/sales of a "Vault Edition" re-release, taking into consideration all of these new changes.

Could they do it again? Certainly. But making a VE takes a different game off the assembly line that could have sold much better for Stern. There is more risk than Pinside fans realize. I just don't know why they would produce another VE again, if they only sold 500 IMVE's. Can someone explain that to me?

I just hope for everyone's sake that any future VE game that Stern makes, will sell 2,000-3,000 units and not 500.

This entire thread is all speculation any way. So am I not allowed to speculate as well? After all, it's only pinball.

New! IM VE Translite has the new Stern Logo

They were most likely used for IM Classic. They took the old playfields and filled the magnet holes with inserts. Some were probably sold to the parts stores as well.

I suppose that's possible. Wondering how many "classic" machines they actually sold though. I have only EVER seen one.

Yes, you can speculate but you are posting info as if it's fact. That is where I'm coming from.

Lots of PF's were sold via many of the pinball parts sources. I know of at least 6 myself (and I only socialize with a handful of pinball people) that were bought as "spares" for later or for replacements of damaged PF's (the damaged ones are now hanging on a couple walls). I seriously doubt that they used the 2010 PF's in the VE's as the 2010 PF were riddled with issues. I'd argue that all had sub par clear on them and then a large percentage of them had registration issues to.

Here is where your argument is hard for me to believe. Let's say they had a couple hundred PF's laying around. They could either sell them for cost to vendors or they could make a VE out of them. Selling to vendors cuts their losses where making the VE added to their cost (remember you say VE's weren't profitable). So they decided to take a larger loss on a game than to just cut their losses and move one. Stern seems to be smarter than that.

Easy, profit. They have the space to make a lot more games than in the past. They also have the staff now too. In between games you want your staff working vs just standing around or having to lay them off. You pop in VE/Re-runs of games that will sell out (to distributors) to make some extra cash. This is nothing new. Stern just calls them VE now but they have been doing this for years with lots of titles.

Well, then only 1 must exist lol

Look - at the end of the day you have to remember that IM is probably the cheapest BOM game Stern has ever made - THAT is why it made sense for a VE, not leftover parts. It's practically a pure profit machine to build at this point in time, even with all new parts.

Sweet I remember when I went down to Disney World In Florida in 2010 and the TRONORAIL ...AKA MONORAIL with the Tron Wrap was available to ride...

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4 years later in 2014 last year while staying at the Bay Lake Tower adjacent to that in the contemporary...I finally for the first time got a chance to play Stern's TRON... and loved it... Hopefully a VE does come out, and I'm in.

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85vette: Ok then, all of your speculation in your latest post must all be true then. You win, LOL.

"I reject your reality and substitute my own" -1984 Dungeonmaster

Why not pick up a PRO now? HUO ones go up for sale every month... Not sure why people are looking for a VE when PROs are already around... its not rare. Do you think they will cost less new? If that's the case then carry on.....

This is certainly part of the conversation as well. If a HUO, stock Tron sells for ~5K and a NIB one is ~5K, is there really enough price difference that people will actually line up to buy a bunch of NIB_VE_Trons?

Also, if THAT actually happens, why does any pinball fan care either way? I realize some people ONLY buy NIB, but I would argue that that is a small % of the Pinside market looking to buy a Tron.

haha....I rode that. I also stay at Bay Lake (going next year too) and played the same lineup.

Biggest problem here. Its the Weekly World News of pinball information.

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Tilt last I checked still had a few for 6

It is bullshit how so many people are able to buy NIB sterns and play them for a couple months then trick someone into paying their full price for it.

Most of pinside follows this mantra. They add leds and MODS and bingo its worth more than NIB. USed to be you open the flaps you lost a grand right off the top.

I bought a csi nib and kept ir for a month and had to sell it for 2700 as thats what the market dictated at the time

I'm not seeing any that sell for $5,000.

Mine sat for 2 weeks, then sold at $5k.

I had probably ~$600 in mods installed. I was the only owner.

I was looking for one for about 2 months at that price point and nothing ever came up. I have PMs back and forth with people and they were all in the $6,000 - $6,500 range.

I just blew my Tron fund on a Metallica. Not that I regret it because it's a great pin, but I was initially looking for a Tron but threw in the towel for now. Damn!

You must have found some with lots of Mods... The game should not really be much above 5K, with nothing added to it (stock). Honestly, Tron has over 2K worth of extras you can buy for it.

I went against the grain and decided to NOT mod mine... Except for adding LED's, and I changed the color of the pop bumper skirts.

It is hard to find a used one that is NOT mod-ed out.

Timing and location are part of the pinball market too. Right now in the heat of summer, you may find one for 5. Around C-mas, the price will probably be more like 6200. (Especially the farther West you go.)

Also, I though Terry still had some NIB for 6200 on his site.

Nope, just checked, now they are 6500. http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=3055

Yes, but how many would they actually sell? 500? 2500?
Less or more than a LOTR VE or SM VE? I would bet on less.

I mean, all but one game that Stern has on the assembly line right now is better than Tron.

With the recent news of Hulk Hogan being a racist, maybe it does make more sense to stop producing WWE and run a VE of something.

It makes perfect sense. Companies destroy inventory for tax reasons. Pat Lawlor has talked about this, when he personally watched Williams destroy racks of Addams Family playfields. The ones used for the Gold edition were new, because they had already eliminated the leftover originals.

Ok then, your speculation trumps mine. I'm out.

So do we.....love Bay Lake. We are doubling up and heading to Aulani next year.

I say bring on the TronVE's and I do think they would be cheaper than most available HUO Pro's. I think they could sell more IMVE's as well....as an owner of an IMVE I'd love to see more people get their hands on one. I also think a redone SMVE could be a nice seller for them.

For the record, I do hope Stern makes a bunch of VE's, including Tron. That said, Stern's risk in starting production on a VE is probably directly related to how close the current market price is to a NIB price.

For example, correct me if I'm wrong, but I recall used Iron Man's selling for as much as $6500. That would be approximately a $1000 premium over the *list price* of a NIB. This seems like a great opportunity for Stern.

Tron seems to be available for $5500 used. That would be approximately equal to the *list price* of a NIB. This is not impossible to profit from, but Stern probably needs to think about this a little bit harder.

Please don't take these numbers literally - I'm just using approximate numbers to illustrate a concept.

We were supposed to go this year for our 15th anniversary.... instead I built my dream game room and had to settle for cheaper Disney's Hilton Head instead (we can drive there)

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And now back to the Tron VE thread that I am no longer the center of controversy with my horse beating gif images

Lol. I got a good chuckle from this.

In your opinion.

In my opinion Tron is better than anything currently running at Stern... Except the Tron VE

Still think it would work out well for them (Stern). Everyone looking for a Tron....you going to buy a used one for $4400 or a brand new one delivered to your door for $4800? Seems like a no-brainer. (Assumed prices after a VE gets rolling......with some margin of error, and based upon IM pricing once the VE's hit the market)

Can we please start posting factual info?

Stock IM's were not going for $6500 before the VE was released and if you paid that much for an un-modded one, I'm really sorry but you overpaid. The ones going for mid to upper $6K were modded out ones. Stock IM's could be had for low $5K to mid $5K.

***edit - found a thread with 2 modded IM's for sale in it from a couple months prior to the VE announcement. Both were $6K - https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/wtb-huo-im-1 Figured I should post some proof before people started to claim I was blowing smoke.

Pre VE IM and current Tron pricing is not all that far off from each other. I still think that Tron is not the most likely VE up next but I just don't understand why people are saying that current Tron pricing is not similar to the IM pricing.

Looking at the add I think the fact you didn't want to ship was the cause that it sat for as long as it did and didn't sell for more. Liked like a nice version with a lot of the tasteful mods. I also think that most of the current buyers in that price range ($5.5K asking price) are looking for one with the Eli ramps on them. Either way, sounds like a nice game that sold for a decent price.

Remember a heavily modded IM local to me that the seller was asking $6300 for, but the VE's came out and he pulled it from the market. There was the one guy who did in fact buy a NIB stock Iron Man for $7K and 3 days later the VE's came out. That would have been a bitter pill to swallow.

Also while my wife was doing her thing I decided to go to Disney Quest for the first time last summer.. Surprisingly they actually had a Discs of Tron which is relatively rare to see playable on location. (Notice the mickey heads, they say please give others a chance to play or something along those lines since it's all on free play haha) :::
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The one negative that I must say is lots of games people left mid-game and started a 4-person game on some of the pins it was annoying to drain all of those etc... The games when I went were maintained very poorly. Some were ok others weren't playable. In addition to the Contemporary having a Tron pin as did Disney Quest...
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Also after you ride "Space Mountain" it spits you out into a gift shop but a few Stern Pin's were set up in that location as well....
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Hey, that's a Fix It Felix next to the Tron!!!