(Topic ID: 212649)

TPF - should there be an EM-only room?


By Model237

2 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 43 posts
  • 25 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by zene10
  • No one calls this topic a favorite

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic poll

    “Would an EM-only room add value to TPF, or detract?”

    • It would add value 44 votes
      69%
    • It would detract 20 votes
      31%

    (64 votes by 0 Pinsiders)

    Topic Gallery

    There have been 2 images uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

    20180316_201122_resized (resized).jpg
    2877E30C-5DCC-4A5E-BC0B-7685FEDDB920 (resized).jpeg

    #1 2 years ago

    TPF was great. But as an EM guy, I could hardly hear the chimes and bells above the general SS din.

    I was curious if anyone else would appreciate a walled-off, EM-only area.

    #2 2 years ago

    Gotta keep them separated!

    #3 2 years ago

    This seems to be an issue at all the shows now. The EMs should be in their own section for sure, and reasonably out of earshot from the loud cacophonous SS/DMD games.
    EMs sound great together, whereas SS/DMD games even clash with each other, let alone the EMs. Their constant repetition can really be annoying if you have to camp near one of them.

    #4 2 years ago

    There should be if it wants to come even close to the variety of pins.....talking about EMs that are at the Museum of Pinball in Banning.

    #5 2 years ago
    Quoted from jrpinball:

    Their constant repetition can really be annoying if you have to camp near one of them.

    Expo 2016 had two Dr. Who's close to one another, near some EM's I was trying to play. I honestly almost lost my mind hearing that constantly repeating sound that kept coming out of the machine. Anyone who has been around a Dr. Who knows what I'm talking about.

    I'm hoping MGC will take note and maybe make a change.

    #6 2 years ago
    Quoted from PapaJohn:

    There should be if it wants to come even close to the variety of pins.....talking about EMs that are at the Museum of Pinball in Banning.

    Yup. Should have skipped Texas for Banning if you wanted a ton of EMs together.

    #7 2 years ago

    19 votes; looks like an EM-only room would be *somewhat* appreciated!

    #8 2 years ago

    Playing games in the pinstadium lights area, I couldn't hear the games I was playing because the EMs on the other side were so loud. So yes, take them to another room.

    #9 2 years ago

    I'm for it.

    #10 2 years ago

    We've kept cfh padlocked & chained away from his computer, phone and iPad for several days so he can't point out the advantages the VFW Showcase has over traditional pinball shows. However, he knows how to pick locks so look out....

    #11 2 years ago

    I prefer games to be intermingled as it helps expose me (and other people) to more games. If EM guys want to sequester in the room off to the side then watch the hobby die for EMs even quicker.

    I also like having popular games flanked by less popular games as it helps keep things spread out a bit and less crowded in one area.

    I think the real issue is that so many people crank their games up so damn loud and then it over powers everything else.

    Shows should just run through with a decibel meter, note the largest offenders and have the owners turn them down. At a show like TPF, the volume just keeps getting turned up throughout the weekend.

    #12 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    I think the real issue is that so many people crank their games up so damn loud and then it over powers everything else.

    Yeah, I forgot there's a volume knob on SS machines. So we get volume escalation and Mutually Assured Hearing Destruction

    This is the first year I noticed a number of people wearing earplugs.

    #13 2 years ago

    2877E30C-5DCC-4A5E-BC0B-7685FEDDB920 (resized).jpeg

    #14 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    If EM guys want to sequester in the room off to the side then watch the hobby die for EMs even quicker.

    Im afraid I have to respectfully disagree, play a few great modern titles then go play a little chief or something similar. Having em’s amongst ss is worst thing I believe. If all the em’s were together on the other hand, they could be judged equally according to their merits from games of their period.

    P.s. I like little chief, just no competition to a mm or met.

    #15 2 years ago

    Sounds like a pain in the ass to me, routing all the EM traffic into one room for little to no actual benefit of the show.

    #16 2 years ago

    We actually talked about this on the way home. It would help with space also as this years TPF was maxed out.

    #17 2 years ago

    I've only ever been to the Texas show. Do any other shows segregate EMs?

    #18 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    If EM guys want to sequester in the room off to the side then watch the hobby die for EMs even quicker.

    Four years ago at TPF the Dallas / Ft Worth Pinball Club had an EM section and it was visited quite a bit by young and old alike, I know as I had brought two machines. The EM's were not dying there, they were doing well. The Pre War 30's machines have had a separate area now for about 3 years and have only been growing, so this proves there is a real interest from folks young and old when it comes to M and EM technology at TPF. Not my opinion, just a fact and my 2 cents.

    #19 2 years ago
    Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

    This sounds a bit trollish coming from someone who doesn't even have an EM in their collection but is posting here.

    LOL. I personally own multiple EMs (more than you list in your pinside collection), route and maintain about 6 other EMs, and am currently neck deep in a full restoration of an EM from the ground up.

    Not trolling at all. I love EMs and love them right alongside my other solid states, DMDs, and even LCDs.

    #20 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    LOL. I personally own multiple EMs (more than you list in your pinside collection), route and maintain about 6 other EMs, and am currently neck deep in a full restoration of an EM from the ground up.

    Not trolling at all. I love EMs and love them right alongside my other solid states, DMDs, and even LCDs.

    Thank You for clarifying.

    #21 2 years ago

    When I first pondered this question my very 1st thought was yes to an EM room sharing it with the parts/mods vendors. IMO its no biggie for me either way.

    #22 2 years ago
    Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

    Thank You for clarifying.

    My OCD would prefer if a show could actually organize in order from year. I would LOVE to be able to walk through a game hall and play favorites form each era that I love. How amazing would that be!!!

    Would also allow some degree of isoloation from the noisier games (granted i cant hear anything at a show)

    #23 2 years ago
    Quoted from Model237:

    I've only ever been to the Texas show. Do any other shows segregate EMs?

    Banning does. Same hall, but far enough away from the SSs to create a nice refuge from the cacophony (and crowds) a few yards away. During a show I escape to the EM section every other hour to let my ears heal.

    #24 2 years ago

    This is a quote from an exhibitor about the two games he brought to TPF stated in the TPF 2018 thread:

    "Golden Arrow had 460 plays on Saturday and Sunday (I forgot to write down the counter on Friday morning after setup). Batman 66 had 498 plays."

    I played his Gottlieb Golden Arrow and it looked and played beautifully and was not far behind the New Pin in plays (I like Batman 66 by the way and played it too).

    No dying EM here, but rather a strong contender with the new kid on the block.

    Golden arrow is a good game in my book, but had it been a Gottlieb Atlantis or Abra Ca Dabra I'm sure the numbers would have been even as 70's drop target games get a lot of love at TPF.

    Just more proof that EM's are doing well at TPF and deserve a separate area in my book so they can be heard as well as seen.

    #25 2 years ago
    Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

    Just more proof that EM's are doing well at TPF and deserve a separate area in my book so they can be heard as well as seen.

    my point was that the EMs got more plays and exposure because they were int eh same rows as the modern games.

    If you want EM exposure, then you dont want them hidden away in the old fogey room

    #26 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    my point was that the EMs got more plays and exposure because they were int eh same rows as the modern games.
    If you want EM exposure, then you dont want them hidden away in the old fogey room

    How old do you got to be to be considered an "old fogey"?

    #27 2 years ago

    you guys are getting dusty...

    It was said in jest and in reference to the age of the games. EMs are old fogeys. I am an old fogey also.

    I just think it is a bad idea to have EMs all segregated in a single room.
    Intermingling for the pins is good for them. They can meet new friends and play with each other.

    Reality is i just really enjoy being able to play an EM, step to the next game over and play a SS Bally classic, step to the left and play a DMD, turn around and play a new game. And by having them all in 1 room, the people that would normally only seek out the DMDs are going to say "hmm line is too long, what is this old one about?" and then "hey, that was fun!"

    If the EMs are all tucked away then they will get way less exposure and plays.

    Side note, that Golden Arrow was awesome! My wife rolled it and I was one switch away from rolling it.

    #28 2 years ago

    Not a room but we did set up a EM corner, 50s, 60s, 70s, 3 of each, right across from the beautiful Golden Arrown

    20180316_201122_resized (resized).jpg

    #29 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    Reality is i just really enjoy being able to play an EM, step to the next game over and play a SS Bally classic, step to the left and play a DMD, turn around and play a new game. And by having them all in 1 room, the people that would normally only seek out the DMDs are going to say "hmm line is too long, what is this old one about?" and then "hey, that was fun!"

    That's a perspective I hadn't considered.

    Personally, unless it was a machine I really wanted to play, I found myself avoiding EMs sited next to loud DMD/SS machines, both for the noise and the crowds clustered around the DMDs.

    So I guess it can go both ways.

    I find playing a flashy DMD/SS machine puts me in a faster/louder mindset that can make an adjacent EM feel plain and boring. I need a break to change gears and go back into "retro mode", which is a big part of the draw for me.

    I would enjoy an EM-only room not only for the noise isolation, but also because I could pretend I'm back in 1974, playing at the boardwalk.

    Maybe TPF could give EM contributors the choice to place their machines in the EM room or in the main room?

    #30 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    If you want EM exposure, then you dont want them hidden away in the old fogey room

    No one would want them hidden away.
    Just put them in a separate, but equal space. I'm sure young and old would be playing them.

    #31 2 years ago
    Quoted from Model237:

    I've only ever been to the Texas show. Do any other shows segregate EMs?

    Pinagogo had a separate em room when the show was in Dixon. It was beautiful at night and sounded great. A few em titles were mingled in with the solid states in the bigger rooms because the em room was much smaller and filled up. I loved it. It was a big part of my falling for the em world.

    #32 2 years ago

    EM’s, especially multiplayers, offer the most socially dynamic pinball experience, period. They belong together... but not in a way resembling isolation on a desert island.

    Think of multiplayer EM’s like other short-turn multiplayer games: Billiards, darts, cornhole, bowling, etc. One shot, one player. Next shot, next player.

    Ever notice how these games are always clustered together but still remain within the field of view of the other games? So it is with EM’s. Keep them together but still within eyesight of the others as if to say, “Hey... we’re different... but come over and give us a try!”

    That’s only the first part. Other enhancements can be made to the EM experience. I’ll be rolling out some of these design philosophies at RPM soon after I get there.

    #33 2 years ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    Pinagogo had a separate em room when the show was in Dixon. It was beautiful at night and sounded great. A few em titles were mingled in with the solid states in the bigger rooms because the em room was much smaller and filled up. I loved it. It was a big part of my falling for the em world.

    I really liked pin a go go separating the em’s. Played lots of SS and DMD machines, then was great to turn down the noise by going to the em room. And, yes it allowed you to hear the chimes. Also, lots of kids in the em room. Hope the new location in Lodi does the same.

    The Alameda pin museum has separate rooms, really liked it too.

    #34 2 years ago

    The PPE shows in California displayed their pins all in the same large hall in a rough chronological order
    thus effectively separating the woodrails from the 60s and 70s EMS
    with Solid State and Alpha/DMD pin and modern era pins
    in another general area of the same large hall.
    As stated previously the old PinAGoGo show had basically 2 large halls/buildings and one smaller room.
    The small room housed exclusively EMs with mostly woodies and wedgeheads
    with a few Multiplayer pins thrown in.
    About 60-75 EMs in all which also made for a bit of a refuge from the
    constant loud din of the the two other large halls .
    The two remaining buildings would hold about 125-150 pins each
    with a mix of (~15%) EM pins and (~25%) early SS pins (78-85eras)
    and (~35%) alpha/DMD pins (86-99 era) and (~25%) Modern pins (2000-present)
    All pretty much randomly intermixed, with exception of a few groupings
    usually from a few prominent local collectors of say
    classic 80s Bally SS pins or GTB sys80 pins from private collections.
    I appreciate having a semi quiet refuge to escape from the constant and extremely loud noise and din of the 2 main large buildings, a place/area to where one can actually carry on a conversion talking about pinball without having to yell.
    One reason I do not enjoy most shows that have videos and pins in the same hall
    with all era pins randomly intermixed into the same hall; it gets to be way too loud.
    I would not like ALL EMs to be completely isolated or cut off from the other eras of pins,
    some intermixing of all eras of pins is good,
    but there should be at least an attempt to have some separation or private area/grouping of EMs to escape the noise.

    #35 2 years ago
    Quoted from NicoVolta:

    EM’s, especially multiplayers, offer the most socially dynamic pinball experience, period. They belong together... but not in a way resembling isolation on a desert island.
    Think of multiplayer EM’s like other short-turn multiplayer games: Billiards, darts, cornhole, bowling, etc. One shot, one player. Next shot, next player.
    Ever notice how these games are always clustered together but still remain within the field of view of the other games? So it is with EM’s. Keep them together but still within eyesight of the others as if to say, “Hey... we’re different... but come over and give us a try!”
    That’s only the first part. Other enhancements can be made to the EM experience. I’ll be rolling out some of these design philosophies at RPM soon after I get there.

    Seems to me a permanent museum and a 3-day festival have certain similarities, but many differences.

    I can understand wanting to keep EMs visible to the SS/DMD crowd, but I have my doubts the young noob set would avoid an EM-only room, as dcrand attests. I suspect the noise isolation would actually enhance the appeal: "Hey, what's in THIS quieter room? Wow, a bunch of wooden bell and chime-ringing machines with cool retro graphics." For me the noise factor trumps the line of sight argument.

    In a museum, you can set your SS/DMD volume knobs appropriately and then the attendance levels are nowhere near as high as a TPF, except maybe at peak hours.

    #36 2 years ago

    My friend Aaron and I did the clean up/resto on the Golden Arrow. It turned out well considering it sat in an old grain elevator storage room in NW Oklahoma with absolutely no care or protection since some time in the 80’s. It was covered with thick dust, cat piss, and loaded full of spider debris. An old operator just pulled the plug, stuck it in the building *screwed* the door shut and left it to rot through nearly 40 years of Oklahoma temperature and humidity swings.

    Personally I’m amazed at how it weathered all those years. And still plays and looks great.

    #37 2 years ago

    I find it kind of challenging and fun to skip from era to era while playing a row at TPF. When I get to an EM its like an oasis in among the din of newer machines. I played the Walking Dead and Bride of Pinbot in the PinStadium area several times and could always hear the bells directly behind them. One of the EMs had no back panel and was especially loud right behind the Bride. On the other hand, the WCS and whatever was next to it were WAY too loud and took away from the rest of the pins. Also, the heat and BO levels were much higher under those canopies. Great way to highlight the product(and I like it!) but wow, some of you guys and gals stink! LOL

    Shawn

    #38 2 years ago

    Personally, I think that separating pins types by room (I think you could come of with many more classifications than just EM vs SS) would detract. Part of the fun is being able to walk the floor and see all types of machines, compare/contrast them, play one type right after the other, etc. I did notice that there were certain groupings in some sections (primarily driven by vendor booths) but maybe more of a pod approach on the floor could be considered where not all of one type were together, but 4-5 and then the pods could be randomly spread across the floor to prevent any concentrated gatherings.

    #39 2 years ago
    Quoted from SilverWings:

    My friend Aaron and I did the clean up/resto on the Golden Arrow. It turned out well considering it sat in an old grain elevator storage room in NW Oklahoma with absolutely no care or protection since some time in the 80’s. It was covered with thick dust, cat piss, and loaded full of spider debris. An old operator just pulled the plug, stuck it in the building *screwed* the door shut and left it to rot through nearly 40 years of Oklahoma temperature and humidity swings.
    Personally I’m amazed at how it weathered all those years. And still plays and looks great.

    It was a gorgeous machine. Loved playing it and talking to you guys.

    #40 2 years ago
    Quoted from Mr_Tantrum:

    Personally, I think that separating pins types by room (I think you could come of with many more classifications than just EM vs SS) would detract. Part of the fun is being able to walk the floor and see all types of machines, compare/contrast them, play one type right after the other, etc. I did notice that there were certain groupings in some sections (primarily driven by vendor booths) but maybe more of a pod approach on the floor could be considered where not all of one type were together, but 4-5 and then the pods could be randomly spread across the floor to prevent any concentrated gatherings.

    What makes it difficult is some folks will bring a mixed bag of EM's, SS, DMD games and they generally like to have all their games in one place.

    I'd love to have a game map or locator so you can find a particular game.

    Right now we have 3-4 groups doing mini pods, the Vector group, the prewar, the dfw club, Bob Herbisons booth (we seem to grow this every year), Tex-arkana club etc.

    We could have set aside a show theme area, all space related games, I brought a Jet Spin I would have set up there, but my buddy Howard would not have allowed his F7 to go there.

    Tricky to organize (I wouldnt do it). But yea, an EM corner/pod would be a good idea. Vector was predominately EM away.

    #41 2 years ago
    Quoted from SilverWings:

    My friend Aaron and I did the clean up/resto on the Golden Arrow. It turned out well considering it sat in an old grain elevator storage room in NW Oklahoma with absolutely no care or protection since some time in the 80’s. It was covered with thick dust, cat piss, and loaded full of spider debris. An old operator just pulled the plug, stuck it in the building *screwed* the door shut and left it to rot through nearly 40 years of Oklahoma temperature and humidity swings.
    Personally I’m amazed at how it weathered all those years. And still plays and looks great.

    Nice save of that game. I once owned one that I bought as a "diamond in the rough". It came out looking almost like brand new after I gave it the treatment. I sold it, but it eventually ended up in the hands of a good friend and fellow collector, so I get to see and play it often.

    #42 2 years ago

    When I lived in Seattle I’d attend the Pacific NW show (large show, very well run) and all the games were in one gigantic hall in the convention center but the EMs were together in one section (probably 60 EMs or more) and it worked out great. You could see and hear the SS and DMD games across the room but you could easily hear the EMs and mingle with other EM collectors and aficionados.

    I’m hoping to bring a couple of EMs to the Texas show next year to add to the number of EMs available for people to play. I’d love to have a big EM section adjacent all the other games.

    #43 2 years ago

    Separate room, no. Separate section, maybe.

    I’ve been attending TPF since 2006; Allentown since 2015. If EMs hadn’t been intermingled with SS machines, I doubt I would have played them.

    Started playing pins in the 80’s, and at the time, EMs seemed boring. Now, with the intermingling at shows, I have a different opinion.

    Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
    $ 20.00
    Cabinet - Other
    Filament Printing
    From: $ 9.99
    Eproms
    Matt's Basement Arcade
    $ 12.00
    Playfield - Decals
    Metal-Mods
    $ 229.99
    Lighting - Led
    PinballBulbs
    $ 65.00
    Cabinet - Armor And Blades
    Texas Pinball
    From: $ 10.00
    Playfield - Other
    Slap Save Creations
    $ 79.99
    Cabinet - Armor And Blades
    PinGraffix Pinside Shop
    From: $ 42.00
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    ModFather Pinball Mods
    $ 259.99
    Cabinet - Toppers
    Lighted Pinball Mods
    $ 50.00
    $ 15.00
    Electronics
    PIN-UPS
    $ 40.00
    Gameroom - Decorations
    ArcadeArts
    $ 86.95
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    Super Skill Shot Shop
    $ 40.00
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    SIlverball In Play
    $ 79.99
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    Lighted Pinball Mods
    $ 218.00
    From: $ 42.00
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    ModFather Pinball Mods
    $ 79.99
    Cabinet - Armor And Blades
    PinGraffix Pinside Shop
    $ 229.99
    $ 229.99
    From: $ 220.00
    $ 9.99
    Eproms
    Matt's Basement Arcade
    $ 125.00
    Cabinet - Toppers
    Sparky Pinball
    $ 68.00
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    PinWorlds
    $ 125.00
    Cabinet - Toppers
    Sparky Pinball
    $ 10.00
    Cabinet - Decals
    Pinball Haus
    From: $ 99.99
    $ 69.99
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    Lighted Pinball Mods
    $ 54.99
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    Lighted Pinball Mods
    $ 35.00
    Various Novelties
    Pinball Photos LLC

    Hey there! Got a moment?

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside