I'm not positive, but it might be that game you've made 400 posts telling us you don't like?

You nuked your whole post!

Maybe karma for trying to be snarky. Sigh, another posting failure by moi.

Jason? LOL

You're out of JJP until they come down on prices unirregardless of other factors; but you don't blame JJP for the price increase.

I agreed with it all.

Baby steps with some people.

Looks like JJP might be looking for some guidance from the market. I just filled out a survey that was emailed to me from them. I was honest and fair but delivered brutal truths to them. From no mechanics, price, playfield quality just to name a few. Not sure if they will listen but likely TS4 is going to be a black eye for them.

And full disclosure. I spoke with Jack at Texas pinball festival about buying the next machine. Me and my family were really excited. I also like toy story and can get over ts4. But what they gave the Market is embarrassing for them and pat Lawlor.
Also really wanted to buy a Wonka when it was announced. I passed for the same reason. No innovation no newly created mechanics and toys. All I see is lazy cash grabs. Thankfully godzilla is changing the industry. Setting the standard of what a whole package looks like! Theme is last place when the game is amazing.

Try to remember JJP to produce a game that is a world under glass. Not a barren wasteland

The problem with this game is the laughable 12k price tag. Like that is just insane, literally twice what it should be priced at. I wouldn’t touch this game for more than 6k.

I’m sure $2k of each game goes straight to Disney

Your missing out on Wonka

On the slot machine sounds? Pass.

Put down get LTG : ) Back.

This is a lazy statement on this game and it shows you haven’t really played game much!
Wonka is a great pin and worthy of praise even if it is from JJP

Wonka LE has been pretty darn cool IMO. There's 6 magnets under the center of the playfield with two clustered areas of 3 magnets. The spinning Gobstopper toy is neat, there's a rotating ball lock underneath the Gobstopper that reveals a shot into a subway, there's the large Wonkavator ball lock mech, a kickback, and the Wonkavision mini LCD in compliment the game. There's far more mechanically going on in Wonka versus in Toy Story.

Sounds like a slot machine to me and plenty of others apparently. I've played it enough.

Ya don't say

I’ve never played a pin or video game that has driven me batty like some of the people on pinside claim with Wonka. Having that extreme reaction to sound is definitely not the norm.

Probably because you've only rated games made within the last decade.
Go play some Rocky & Bullwinkle and report back!

I'll look for that one and crank it up to an 11. Wish me luck

THAT TRICK MEVER WORKS!

How much time have you spent in a casino? The wonka and woz A/V is a dead ringer for the slot machines of the same IP.

And I like it because I’ve spent plenty of time in the casinos.

GNR. Just a phenomenal experience playing pinball.

For the tournament players? I don’t care about that.

Don’t know but if TS matches up to Wonka or GNR overall then should be happy campers

Pumpin turds still. TS4 is a joke.

Well sure but you actually win in them; we've seen your pool!

Omg, listening to Jack on the The Awesome Pinball Podcast, and he just explained that they had the license for toy story 1-3. I cannot believe they decided to focus on 4. I thought for sure Disney said “4 or nothing” but they had 1-3 and DECIDED to do 4?! That’s … crazy. Not just crazy… stupid. Dumb. WTF are you thinking dumb.

I still have a TS4 coming, and it looks like it will be a fun game, but … what could have been. I think I would have been better off not knowing this tidbit of information.

I have JJPs WOZ and Dialed In pinball machines. While JJPs prices were always a little higher than Sterns, I did not mind paying the small premium. The customer service and games were great. I just cannot get over the 12k price for there newest machine. I just picked up a godzilla
premium for 8700 from a well established vendor. JJP needs to check itself in the price department.

Hit them in the pocketbook and they'll listen, many people got surveys to fill out and I'm sure it's related to poor TS4 sales.

Hmm, so Godfather 3 confirmed?

Wow, I listened to the same podcast and he really didn’t say it that way. They had the license for 1-3 many years ago and then had to do Wonka first because there was competition for that license and a short window. When they returned to the license, the Disney licensing execs had changed. The new execs seemed to be pushing 4 because the movie release had been moved up. Also better animation technology/assets was another consideration. I am not saying the decision was the right one but at least relay the information correctly!

That makes sense with how long there had been rumors of a TS pin coming from JJP.

Or Bone Busters!!!

Oh Balderdash!

I took the survey also. The games have always been fun but their customer service was lacking for me. Im glad they sent surveys but i think for alot of their use to be customers, the damage is done, its very hard to repair a relationship with a customer that feels wronged. I have played toy story 4 a bunch and i find myself wanting to play more after each game is finished.

What??

DI costumer service was pretty shitty for sure.

Lots of people trying to get out of their CE and LE order spots, it’ll be interesting to see how low they will go to get out of taking delivery. Who would buy a spot (send money to a stranger to cover their deposit) when you can buy directly from a dealer for the same price?

I think if JJP lowered the prices to $9500 and $12000
Most of this would not even be talked about. The game is pretty fun to play. Great to look at and family friendly. It seems this is all about the pricing.

9,500 and 11,000

Also if they had made just 500 CE they would be harder to find, but at 1K units they are more common than any Stern LE (except Godzilla which cost $5K less when new). TS4 is priced as the most expensive game ever produced but has none of the toys or rarity that would indicate that ultra high price.

I said on the JJP survey that I would consider future JJP pins when they add back in toys and some price value into the pins like was in the past.

At that price, 1,000 is WAY too many. At any price really

And the “LE” edition? It’s time to drop that term with JJP. Yes it’s “limited” to 5,000, so what.

Also, going backwards from GNR in terms of the wow factor imo, charging more and producing more “CE’s” was a HUGE mistake

I think they are paying for it now but the bigger price will paid in the future.

Deliver the CEs months later on a weak offering equals big problem

A better theme might help a bit next time BUT they are in BIG trouble if they don’t significantly raise the bar with what’s in the game or simply reduce the price again.

Tough to put the horse back on the barn.

I’ll say the same thing about Stern. It takes the #1 game in Godzilla to maintain a price above retail for “LEs”.

RUSH, a very good game, ranked in top 20, won’t hold its retail price just like TS. There are a lot of LEs for sale by the flippers and others.

For most titles, 1,000 is WAY to many and they are bastardizing the whole “collector” market and it will come back to haunt all of them.

CGC? The FOMO is there because they take FOREVER to announce a new game and then deliver.

Cactus LE will be my last game from them. There you go CGC, don’t even need a survey monkey

Whats your question?

They did make a lot of mistakes on the CE (IMO) it could have had a better topper for the price (look at CGC toppers for gosh sake). I am not a topper guy but a nice topper like AFM is really a selling point.

Look at GnR they had at least one unique feature that was not on the LE. At least the CE guys could say they wanted the full experience so they got the Coma lock.

The CE should have shipped first or predominately first so the buyers who really wanted one and spend the fat dollars would get the game first. I understand making some LEs first to get on route but to have CE buyers say they already have the LE and therefore they don't need the CE that they also have on order is just insane. Also who the heck is so hyped up on TS4 that they need to order both LE and CE versions.

I understand that TS is a big theme so they wanted to raise the price but to make it the most expensive pin ever (not counting limited Supreme or Elvira 40 small run pins) and then it's not the best of all time except in price doesn't add up. I played it, it's fine it's not any better than Wonka or DI or GnR all of which are significantly cheaper.

The mistake with the CE is to deliver them 6 months after the LE. All the récent Stern releases show people are willing to pay a premium just to get their games faster, while TS4 CE doesn't have much to justify his price point. So they should have started with the CE, get the 500 out in 8 weeks then move on.

So many mistakes on that TS4 game, after almost a decade of perfect successes, it makes me wonder if Jack is still in charge of his business.

CE lacks more than just a feature like the coma lock. No one has mentioned the other perks GNR offered, at a much lower selling price, when compared to TS4.

-The skull housing for the shooter rod and roses on the lockdown bar are both more impressive than just the shooter rod on TS4. Not having a button on the lockdown bar is no excuse for omitting the ornament.

- the laser etched side rails which are beauuuuutiful on GNR in my opinion. There’s that time of day when the sun hits the room that it looks like it’s lit up… really gorgeous. Could have featured so many characters or toys from the film etched just as nicely.

- band member signatures are an added value. Pat and jacks signatures as a feature on a CE are not. Just attend the next show and pick up a signed custom card or ask either of them to sign whatever part you fancy and brought with you.

I am out and canceled my order on this one. I finally got to put an hour on it last week. Fun game! I really enjoyed it. Just not enough for the cost.

Its crazy how bad CGC is at getting games out the door. People will blame covid and the supply chain, but the reality is it's always been this way with CGC. Possibly this is due to the fact they don't seem to consistently make games and theres a lot starts and stops? Not really sure, but they NEVER make schedule. It looks like it will take them almost a year to start getting the LE's out the door.

Gotta say what an absolute disaster this game has been. I remember calling distros trying to get on a CE list and being told their lists were hundreds deep. Now i see distros have plenty of LE's sitting and Ce's(not a lot though)are still available. I'm in on a CE but if i could move down to an LE i would. I think this will be the last nail in the nonrefundable deposit coffin

It just happened with queen and there aren’t even any gameplay videos. The market won’t be like this forever and I think people won’t easily forget if they feel burned. I made the mistake with Halloween and won’t ever consider one of spooky pins before it’s out in the wild. The experience also saved me from putting money down on a TS4 preorder.

I mean, you put down a deposit on a $15k game after their previous game had the worst playfield failures I've seen in my 20+ years in the hobby, so it seems like there's still plenty of meat on the bone.

GNR for sure the worst PF I've seen; just unreal. Looked like a drunk overlay.