(Topic ID: 315473)

Toy Story Pinball - You in or out?

By Vino

3 months ago


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Topic Stats

  • 2,513 posts
  • 439 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 hours ago by Jaytech10
  • Topic is favorited by 49 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Toy Story Pinball - In or Out”

  • In 226 votes
    18%
  • Out 944 votes
    77%
  • May-be (please explain) 57 votes
    5%

(1227 votes)

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There are 2,513 posts in this topic. You are on page 24 of 51.
#1151 58 days ago

After seeing the Pin, I am out, not my game. I am waiting of the first JJP Steve Ritchie Pin.

13
#1152 58 days ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

*** It’s Been Decided - TS4 is Fun and it’s Worth the Price. ***
The market has spoken, and most people report enjoying playing the game. Those that hate this offering will quickly add,”but it’s not worth it”. Well that is false too, as evidenced by week 1 sales. IMO JJP sold 1k CE’s and 2.5k LE’s. 3.5k people think TS4 is worth it and have put the money where their mouth is. More TS4 are being sold each day.
There seems to be a couple of posts where after someone plays TS4 then they bought an LE. Hence we conclude it is worth it for them. Some posts even report they will have a CE and LE, and this was after playing one.
But don’t feel mad or feel guilty if TS4 doesn’t hit your buttons. Not every game should appeal to you. It’s only pinball.

From the guy that believes the Forky stand-ups are a “mechanism”.

#1153 58 days ago
Quoted from hesiro:

After seeing the Pin, I am out, not my game. I am waiting of the first JJP Steve Ritchie Pin.

I’m so with you, I can’t wait to hate that too !

#1154 58 days ago

3190DFF6-9B18-451C-BE0D-9AB6CCE18C3D (resized).jpeg

#1155 58 days ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

*** It’s Been Decided - TS4 is Fun and it’s Worth the Price. ***
The market has spoken, and most people report enjoying playing the game. Those that hate this offering will quickly add,”but it’s not worth it”. Well that is false too, as evidenced by week 1 sales. IMO JJP sold 1k CE’s and 2.5k LE’s. 3.5k people think TS4 is worth it and have put the money where their mouth is. More TS4 are being sold each day.
There seems to be a couple of posts where after someone plays TS4 then they bought an LE. Hence we conclude it is worth it for them. Some posts even report they will have a CE and LE, and this was after playing one.
But don’t feel mad or feel guilty if TS4 doesn’t hit your buttons. Not every game should appeal to you. It’s only pinball.

You meant it’s been decided in your household or business, right? Cuz the flippers bought out the CE’s and are now stuck with them and the Distro’s are trying to sell the LE’s.

Just cuz folks ponied up in this market don’t mean it’s a sell out hit.

Or maybe it is…in that case, nope.

#1156 57 days ago

If anything, this did take the wind out of the flippers sails.

-high CE number (they could have sold way more GnRCE than they offered but probably couldn’t sell any more TS4 CE). If you think they could’ve sold more than 1000 TSCe I’d say not because the more they offer the less FOMO and less flipper sales they get.

-expensive base model (more money than GZ LE at an practically unlimited number).

-FOMO has its limits. See Halloween and see TS4.

Not to say they’re bad but they are probably fully priced flippers and Kaneda need not apply.

#1157 57 days ago

There’s no way used LEs will hold their value with a supply of 5k. That’s not a knock on the game - as long as someone can buy a NIB from a distributor why would they pay full price used (and I don’t see 5k units selling anytime soon). I think this will also drag down the price of the CE - the only real difference is the topper. Really really in demand and rare toppers go for about 3k, coincidently the up charge on CEs. How many buyers out there are going to pay 17k on a CE for access to a topper if they can get an LE for 10-11k on secondary market. The extras on CE don’t justify an extra 7 or 8k. Based on other pins, JJP will likely also release a simplified topper for under 500 bucks making a pricey CE even less justifiable. Also, the blue trim is arguable better. I can’t see the CE ever having a market value over msrp, probably more like 12-13k regardless of if it plays well.

#1158 57 days ago

I find these mislabeled in general. The LE is effectively not that limited. The CE however is, so if one wants to collect one and they are sold out then tough luck.

The LE should be called “pro” and the CE should be called IE. Investor Edition.

#1159 57 days ago
Quoted from Jj557:

There’s no way used LEs will hold their value with a supply of 5k. That’s not a knock on the game - as long as someone can buy a NIB from a distributor why would they pay full price used (and I don’t see 5k units selling anytime soon). I think this will also drag down the price of the CE - the only real difference is the topper. Really really in demand and rare toppers go for about 3k, coincidently the up charge on CEs. How many buyers out there are going to pay 17k on a CE for access to a topper if they can get an LE for 10-11k on secondary market. The extras on CE don’t justify an extra 7 or 8k. Based on other pins, JJP will likely also release a simplified topper for under 500 bucks making a pricey CE even less justifiable. I can’t see the CE ever having a market value over msrp, probably more like 12-13k.

If your statement holds true, that is less than 30% loss after playing countless games (assuming no playfield issues).

I’d gladly take that hit in a resell. However, I sense my CE value will be less than that after all said and done. I did not buy this game for appreciation.

I paid to easily play the game with my family.

#1160 57 days ago
Quoted from zermeno68:

If your statement holds true, that is less than 30% loss after playing countless games (assuming no playfield issues).
I’d gladly take that hit in a resell. However, I sense my CE value will be less than that after all said and done. I did not buy this game for appreciation.
I paid to easily play the game with my family.

Fair enough. I also don’t buy pins to flip and never had an expectation of making money on them when I got into the hobby. With that being said, part of the appeal for me now going with a CE or limited version of a pin is that it will hold its value better if I ever do need space and have to sell. If I ever decide to get Toy Story I am pretty sure it would be an LE because I don’t see that being the case on this one.

#1161 57 days ago
Quoted from galore2112:

The CE should be called IE. Investor Edition.

Investor Edition? Good god no.
The last thing this hobby needs is anything to further perpetuate the absurd idea that pinball machines are investments.

#1162 57 days ago
Quoted from galore2112:

I find these mislabeled in general. The LE is effectively not that limited. The CE however is, so if one wants to collect one and they are sold out then tough luck.

I agree. These are basically "Premiums" and "LEs" but with different names (and prices).

What's amusing to me was the CE was an answer to Stern's SLE with Batman 66. However Stern has kept the SLE a special distinction only used one other time, whereas JJP has made it the new LE.

#1163 57 days ago
Quoted from jfh:

Investor Edition? Good god no.
The last thing this hobby needs is anything to further perpetuate the absurd idea that pinball machines are investments.

I was being facetious.

#1164 57 days ago

It just seems funny to me that EVERY new release around here becomes a referendum on the manufacturer, the “bubble,” and in fact, all of pinball itself.

It’s just a new pinball machine. Like dozens from the last few years.

None of those have radically changed anything. The game is never changed. The paradigm is never shifted. Why do you expect this one to do that? Why does the fate of an entire industry or company have to hang in the balance with every game?

Some people will buy it, some people won’t, and then we’ll move on to the next one. Just like last time.

You guys can see that, right? Or am I the one losing perspective here?

#1166 57 days ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

It just seems funny to me that EVERY new release around here becomes a referendum on the manufacturer, the “bubble,” and in fact, all of pinball itself.
It’s just a new pinball machine. Like dozens from the last few years.
None of those have radically changed anything. The game is never changed. The paradigm is never shifted. Why do you expect this one to do that? Why does the fate of an entire industry or company have to hang in the balance with every game?
Some people will buy it, some people won’t, and then we’ll move on to the next one. Just like last time.
You guys can see that, right? Or am I the one losing perspective here?

The stakes get higher as the prices get higher for many people including Ops

The paradigm shift is that now “flippers” and HUO purchasers are facing the potential reality that they will no longer be able to make money buying pinball machines. Thus, more buyers being priced out every day

Unless one thinks that $20k is the next new normal stop on the pinball road of LE insanity. I don’t.

#1167 57 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

The paradigm shift is that now “flippers” and HUO purchasers are facing the potential reality

JJP is pricing them out!
5C551AA2-0C3D-4602-BC46-5E414FFEFBED.gif

#1168 57 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

The stakes get higher as the prices get higher for many people including Ops
The paradigm shift is that now “flippers” and HUO purchasers are facing the potential reality that they will no longer be able to make money buying pinball machines. Thus, more buyers being priced out every day
Unless one thinks that $20k is the next new normal stop on the pinball road of LE insanity. I don’t.

As long as there’s fomo, there’s flippers. Nothing will change.

I mean, it still boggles my mind people were paying $8k for stern pros a couple months ago. People KNEW those games would be $6800 again someday soon and they still didn’t care.

-3
#1169 57 days ago
Quoted from cooked71:

From the guy that believes the Forky stand-ups are a “mechanism”.

never said it was a “good” mech

#1170 57 days ago
Quoted from underlord:

You meant it’s been decided in your household or business, right? Cuz the flippers bought out the CE’s and are now stuck with them and the Distro’s are trying to sell the LE’s.
Just cuz folks ponied up in this market don’t mean it’s a sell out hit.
Or maybe it is…in that case, nope.

I believe we’ve established in this thread when an order is taken and a non-refundable deposit made, that game gets counted as sold. Just like Stern does. A deposit collected is a sale. True Distributors have TS4LE’s available but they’ve been selling them too. So preliminary indications appear JJP sold 3.5k games (no I have no evidence just trying to take a market pulse and I’ll bet you this estimate is as good as anyone’s, at this point.). JJP has to build the games and fix the couple of issues I mentioned, before I’d consider this game successful. But the sales part of the equation, after 1 week, would have to be interpreted as successful. Right?

#1171 57 days ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

But the sales part of the equation, after 1 week, would have to be interpreted as successful. Right?

No. And, no matter how many times you try to spin it that way, the answer is still “No”.

A deposit is not a sale. If that were true then Stern is significantly undercounting their “sales”.

13
#1172 57 days ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

It just seems funny to me that EVERY new release around here becomes a referendum on the manufacturer, the “bubble,” and in fact, all of pinball itself.
It’s just a new pinball machine. Like dozens from the last few years.
None of those have radically changed anything. The game is never changed. The paradigm is never shifted. Why do you expect this one to do that? Why does the fate of an entire industry or company have to hang in the balance with every game?
Some people will buy it, some people won’t, and then we’ll move on to the next one. Just like last time.
You guys can see that, right? Or am I the one losing perspective here?

The thing is, JJP only releases 1 game every few years, so in some ways it is a referendum.

1. Is this going to cause Stern/other manufacters to raise prices, Yes most certainly. That affects the industry.

2. Shit is about to hit the fan and the bubble, at least the small business barcade owner "bubble" will be having to sell pins. Bubble burst.

I don't think anyone expects JJP to be innovative they're clearly a cash grab co. now.
.

#1173 57 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

The stakes get higher as the prices get higher for many people including Ops
The paradigm shift is that now “flippers” and HUO purchasers are facing the potential reality that they will no longer be able to make money buying pinball machines. Thus, more buyers being priced out every day
Unless one thinks that $20k is the next new normal stop on the pinball road of LE insanity. I don’t.

At this point, I feel lucky getting in on HWN for $9,000. Unless i win the lottery, i doubt I will be buying NIB again(not that its a major dent lol)

#1174 57 days ago

If enough of us say no to the madness of the cash grabbers, they’ll either go out of business or lower their prices.

#1175 57 days ago
Quoted from Roostking:

At this point, I feel lucky getting in on HWN for $9,000. Unless i win the lottery, i doubt I will be buying NIB again(not that its a major dent lol)

Prices are crazy. I can say I’m on the list for a NIB hotwheels deluxe from AP for $7295 delivered!

#1176 57 days ago

At some point, if they want to keep raising the prices, they are going to need to finally add THE up front mech. They have the skills. They have the parts. Now they just need the balls.

#1177 57 days ago

I have a JJP #WOZ RR, I always wanted a #POTC CE (I had the chance but thought I'd pick one up used later on, how wrong I was). I think I have a nice collection, I look at theme, artwork, playfield mechs and gameplay. If a game plays great and the theme and artwork are bad, then ...believe it or not...i'd probably walk away. Pinball is both fun and a piece of mechanical and artistic beauty.

So upon hearing of Toy Story for JJP, I didn't hesitate, I put myself down for a CE.

Now after hearing so many cons about it being solely a TS4 theme, the bare playfield and the off the shelf toys, I'm torn.
The pros include well done artwork and its certainly family friendly.

TBD is how I feel about gameplay...not someone else's opinion.

This price point bothers me, I don't feel like taking a $15K gamble. I feel like giving up my spot and waiting for something else to come out.

#1178 57 days ago
Quoted from Ivanhoe:

I have a JJP #WOZ RR, I always wanted a #POTC CE (I had the chance but thought I'd pick one up used later on, how wrong I was). I think I have a nice collection, I look at theme, artwork, playfield mechs and gameplay. If a game plays great and the theme and artwork are bad, then ...believe it or not...i'd probably walk away. Pinball is both fun and a piece of mechanical and artistic beauty.
So upon hearing of Toy Story for JJP, I didn't hesitate, I put myself down for a CE.
Now after hearing so many cons about it being solely a TS4 theme, the bare playfield and the off the shelf toys, I'm torn.
The pros include well done artwork and its certainly family friendly.
TBD is how I feel about gameplay...not someone else's opinion.
This price point bothers me, I don't feel like taking a $15K gamble. I feel like giving up my spot and waiting for something else to come out.

If you are having any doubts based on what you see then pull the plug. You can always get it later.

11
#1179 57 days ago
Quoted from sidesmack40:

Prices are crazy. I can say I’m on the list for a NIB hotwheels deluxe from AP for $7295 delivered!

By far the best value on the market. Hot Wheels delivers and you're gonna love it.

#1180 57 days ago
Quoted from Ivanhoe:

I have a JJP #WOZ RR, I always wanted a #POTC CE (I had the chance but thought I'd pick one up used later on, how wrong I was). I think I have a nice collection, I look at theme, artwork, playfield mechs and gameplay. If a game plays great and the theme and artwork are bad, then ...believe it or not...i'd probably walk away. Pinball is both fun and a piece of mechanical and artistic beauty.
So upon hearing of Toy Story for JJP, I didn't hesitate, I put myself down for a CE.
Now after hearing so many cons about it being solely a TS4 theme, the bare playfield and the off the shelf toys, I'm torn.
The pros include well done artwork and its certainly family friendly.
TBD is how I feel about gameplay...not someone else's opinion.
This price point bothers me, I don't feel like taking a $15K gamble. I feel like giving up my spot and waiting for something else to come out.

You should never consider buying a toy a gamble, be it a pinball machine, a car or what have you. Did you take a spot from someone else on your distro's list or does he need to keep your spot to make some money? Might be a little bit of a moral dilemma if you were like for sure I'm on the list, then backing out now.

#1181 57 days ago

Had a chance to play it today at Cidercade in Dallas. For me pulling my CE order was the right move. It was fun-ish, But man when the game room is complete I will definitely need to find a Godzilla Premium / LE.

10
#1182 57 days ago

CE flippers right now looooool

FE4059E0-34A9-4C7A-9178-10B15B7B987C.gif
15
#1183 57 days ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

The paradigm is never shifted. Why do you expect this one to do that?

I think it’s because that was the original promise & premise of JJP. Jack created it because his customers didn’t want “cheap, shallow, photoshop Sterns with no mechs”. They were supposed to be “the next Bally Williams”. They’ve never quite reached that promise, and players/buyers are still hoping for it, only to be disappointed in some fashion each new release.

#1184 57 days ago

I'm officially out for now. Have room for 1 more pin and will be picking up a low play HUO Mandalorian Premium. Will happily save about $5k and enjoy a game with more mechs in it, one that actually has mini wizard modes (there are none in Toy Story which is odd) and one with a deeper story based ruleset.

#1185 57 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

enjoy a game with more mechs in it, [...] and one with a deeper story based ruleset.

So you're saying it has toys, and a story?

#1186 57 days ago
Quoted from yancy:

So you're saying it has toys, and a story?

Yes

#1187 57 days ago

While everybody is standing over the corpse of TS4 pinball, I’m wondering what impact the current JJP prices will have on specifically other JJP titles. In the past it has floated along in lock step. I’m contemplating a Wonka and don’t want the prices to rise faster than my trigger finger.

#1188 57 days ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

I’m contemplating a Wonka and don’t want the prices to rise faster than my trigger finger.

The best time to buy any pin is yesterday.

#1189 57 days ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

... In the past it has floated along in lock step....

We know DI won't increase. Although it did follow Wonka into cheaper territory, just didn't come back up

#1190 57 days ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

I believe we’ve established in this thread when an order is taken and a non-refundable deposit made, that game gets counted as sold. Just like Stern does. A deposit collected is a sale. True Distributors have TS4LE’s available but they’ve been selling them too. So preliminary indications appear JJP sold 3.5k games (no I have no evidence just trying to take a market pulse and I’ll bet you this estimate is as good as anyone’s, at this point.). JJP has to build the games and fix the couple of issues I mentioned, before I’d consider this game successful. But the sales part of the equation, after 1 week, would have to be interpreted as successful. Right?

Sucks that they never release sales numbers. No ideas how many CE or LE models Distro’s are sitting on. Pure speculation at this point. But man o man this is one divisive pin.

#1191 57 days ago
Quoted from Ivanhoe:

I have a JJP #WOZ RR, I always wanted a #POTC CE (I had the chance but thought I'd pick one up used later on, how wrong I was). I think I have a nice collection, I look at theme, artwork, playfield mechs and gameplay. If a game plays great and the theme and artwork are bad, then ...believe it or not...i'd probably walk away. Pinball is both fun and a piece of mechanical and artistic beauty.
So upon hearing of Toy Story for JJP, I didn't hesitate, I put myself down for a CE.
Now after hearing so many cons about it being solely a TS4 theme, the bare playfield and the off the shelf toys, I'm torn.
The pros include well done artwork and its certainly family friendly.
TBD is how I feel about gameplay...not someone else's opinion.
This price point bothers me, I don't feel like taking a $15K gamble. I feel like giving up my spot and waiting for something else to come out.

You commit to 15k for this you’ll be, although indirectly as one buyer, helping drive prices up even higher.

Scalpers ask 15k people go huh? What?

Companies ask 15k we’ve got ourselves a huge panic on the 4th of July.

#1192 57 days ago

Played 5 more games on it today. Game not for me. Doesn’t have that one more game feel to me. The game plays to long for my taste also. No desire to really play one again anytime soon.

#1193 57 days ago
Quoted from underlord:

Sucks that they never release sales numbers. No ideas how many CE or LE models Distro’s are sitting on. Pure speculation at this point. But man o man this is one divisive pin.

Best we've got is to compare the numbers in the Pinside owners database. It will at least paint a picture of overall trend.

#1194 56 days ago

Just got a call from my boss. They ordereed an LE for the company office and asked if I could set it up since Im a pinball guy. Shows up next week!

Will give an unbiased review after extensive testing. I don't work in that building, but it's 20 minutes from my house I can put some serious time on it.

They've done Avengers, Led Zeppelin LE, Star Wars LE, and Deadpool LE in the past.

#1195 56 days ago
Quoted from sataneatscheese:

Just got a call from my boss. They ordereed an LE for the company office and asked if I could set it up since Im a pinball guy. Shows up next week!
Will give an unbiased review after extensive testing. I don't work in that building, but it's 20 minutes from my house I can put some serious time on it.
They've done Avengers, Led Zeppelin LE, Star Wars LE, and Deadpool LE in the past.

Awesome. Totally unbiased opinion from neither a collector or a busy arcade player.

Love to see how this holds up in ‘one more play’ setting.

I played it, finally. It was what I was afraid it would’ve been.

#1196 56 days ago

Wonder how much Stern will raise prices for?

Bond next
Jaws and Elwin after that
Then BTTF

3 great licenses.

Is there even a breaking point?

#1197 56 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Wonder how much Stern will raise prices for?
Bond next
Jaws and Elwin after that
Then BTTF
3 great licenses.
Is there even a breaking point?

Oh man it's gonna be something to watch for sure.
I say the next one will stay the same, eXpecially if it's Bond, then go up after.

#1198 56 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Wonder how much Stern will raise prices for?
Bond next
Jaws and Elwin after that
Then BTTF
3 great licenses.
Is there even a breaking point?

Come on buddy, Stern is not totally stupid like your JJP pals. They see the price backlash. They’re in it for the long haul and know we’d be up in arms if they raise them too much if at all. Things are already crashing everywhere, so why would they want to alienate their customer base as the morons at JJP are doing???

#1199 56 days ago
Quoted from Thunderbird:

Come on buddy, Stern is not totally stupid like your JJP pals. They see the price backlash. They’re in it for the long haul and know we’d be up in arms if they raise them too much if at all.

If at all? Stern has raised the price quite a bit in the last 2 years.

#1200 56 days ago
Quoted from Thunderbird:

Come on buddy, Stern is not totally stupid like your JJP pals. They see the price backlash. They’re in it for the long haul and know we’d be up in arms if they raise them too much if at all. Things are already crashing everywhere, so why would they want to alienate their customer base as the morons at JJP are doing???

Man you are living in some kind of nut job bubble! See Law’s post

They have gone up consistently and will keep going up. Along with increasing the number of LEs

$25k for an Elvira 40th meant to make the customer base feel good?

Stern isn’t a non profit charity. And they have 3 killer themes coming out.

He Man though?

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