Actually, LW3 does have all three movies represented in it.

Meh. Toy Story is not a dream theme for me, but it is one that holds some appeal. Without knowing or reading anything about the title before yesterdays email showing up in my inbox… it feels like there’s something missing. Like all the characters I would want to see. What voices are there?

Where’s the “world under glass”? It looks barren and dominated by a huge LCD blocking everything. And why would I want to play virtual pinball on a real pinball? That’s not cool, that’s going entirely against the purpose of an actual, real pinball machine! Now if that screen had instead been a real miniature EM pinball - which has been done by Pat before, sure, but maybe not to the extent that I would be imagining here - now that would be more interesting.

I’m not sure there is every time, but using the iPad for game action is rare. Don’t know what all they are doing but it does have digital pinball (I know TOM had it and so did JJPGNR) and interactive play (maybe like DI). But Pat seemed to be making a bigger deal about the screen system and how it worked (although this seemed like what they’ve already done on JJPOTC). Maybe what is most unique would be his extensive use of digital with this game. I think TS4 has 8 digital games going on ipad, but can’t be for sure. Most people might ask,” Is digital what I want to see in a pinball machine”? That might be a primary question presented by this game. Also if you want to see some awesome toys, pack it up, turn around and head home. You can put a Forky in it. Toys aren’t showing up, they weren’t invited.

It would depend on what the exact terms are in the JJP / Disney agreement. It's possible that JJP got an exclusive on "Toy Story coin-operated pinball" even if they only got the rights to TS4 for use in their game. It's also possible that they only got exclusive on TS4. It's even theoretically possible that they only got non-exclusive rights to TS4 (though this would be unusual).

It all depends on what Disney was willing to sell, and what JJP was willing to pay. It's also very likely that JJP got the rights for only some fixed time period (like 3-5 years).

You’re comparing live action to animation. Different beasts, different contracts. Toy Story: The License is NOT charged per movie with different movies being different prices. Directors of animated movies aren’t DGA, and the characters on screen don’t have agents and likeness rights contracts.

The sculpts are cake toppers.

Unless you have specific info on the JJP / Disney contract, you don't really know what it includes and what it doesn't. You don't just "get the license" (regardless if it is an animated property or not), the specifics can (and do) change on every deal.

Sure, sometimes the animated properties can be easier because there are less people involved, but not always. And Disney is usually one of the hardest licensors to deal with.

Been there, done that. The Disney license cost (and restrictions that went along with it) almost bankrupted the company I used to work for.

Besides the roof cover on the ball lock and the Gabby Gabby pop up target there are no custom sculpts in Toy Story 4 Here's the closest thing to sculpts customers get for $12k - $15k. Pretty ridiculous considering the price of the game the custom sculpts that have been in past JJP games. Can't believe I'm using this term with JJP but it comes across as a cost cutting move. For a pinball machine that costs $12k - $15k the last thing that should be in the game are cheap store bought plastic figures. Cactus Canyon SE and LE look like a steal by comparison with the number of sculpts in both games.

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You’re not understanding my point.

Of course the contract has specifics and Disney made the rules of what can and can’t be used. All I’m saying is that the people who think Toy Story has different “per film” licenses and costs for consumer products is WRONG. It’s not TS4 because “that’s the cheap one”. Toy Story is an overall valuable IP. There aren’t tiers of licensing prices based on each movie.

I'm not saying it DOES, I'm saying just because it is animation doesn't mean it doesn't. Different people involved with each. Regardless of IP.

In this case you may be mostly correct since it is Disney/Pixar. Much of it is the same across all the films (except the new one coming out).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toy_Story_(franchise)

$12k for the LE and $15k for the CE

But they got Tom Hanks’ brother to do callouts! WTH? That leaves hope they could get Colin Hanks if they ever do a Jumanji pin.

Or maybe his cousin, Jethro Hanks.

He does a ton of Tom's VO stuff and is pretty indistinguishable. It is actually a plus. This coming from a guy who has ZERO interest in TS4 given the missed opportunity on 1-3, so not championing the pin. Just saying that Tom Hanks bro on VO is actually a solid move.

LOL - Jim’s been doing all the Woody merch/product voices since the 90’s. If you ever had a talking Woody toy that says “There’s a snake in my boot”, it’s Jim, not Tom.

I intentionally played my family (my wife, and boys ages 10, 14 and 15) who all LOVE Toy Story and told them that they were making a Toy Story pin. There were screams of excitement from all! I then said that is was only Toy Story 4, and all but my 10 year old were immediately disappointed and uninterested. I thought to myself how interesting it was that my 10 year old was still excited. Then he realized that TS4 was the carnival one he had only seen once and he joined the sadness crew lol. He thought (and sort of assumed) that it was TS3 set in the daycare because he literally FORGOT about TS4. And frankly, TS3 was the last Toy Story movie. TS4 felt like a really long Pixar short.

And you're not understanding MY point...

Unless you have inside info into their deal, it is certainly possible that JJP bought only the rights to TS4 because it was cheaper than getting the rights to the whole franchise.

It is also possible that the rights to TS 1-3 were already sold to someone else (though this is probably not likely), or were just "not for sale".

My point is that you do NOT (usually) get "all or nothing". You get what they want to sell and what you can afford to buy.

Good info. To me, that is still disappointing. I’d rather have the actual actor who played the role, not someone’s voice that sounds “similar”. Especially for 15k.

But to each their own.

I dont think Tom is interested nor he needs the money. Lol

Well, you can chose to not trust me. But trust me. “Toy Story” is the license. It’s not film by film…there’s no “cheaper”. You’re paying to be a Toy Story product, period. However, for an application like this that uses film assets, it’s likely Disney said “only use TS4” for aesthetic reasons…the films all look so different, it’s more cohesive as a product to just use 4.

shows his acct. has been deactivated now. prob got all kind of nice pm's

My thoughts exactly.

I still can’t believe people are paying 12k for this game it has nothing in it other then another screen and who knows if they fixed their playfield issues too

That would be awesome if they grabbed one of those licenses and blew this disaster out of the water.

I’m in if one randomly pops up on Craigslist under 10

Well, I have no reason to trust you. I've asked (more than once) if you have inside info on this deal, and since you never answer the question - I have to assume that you don't.

I've been involved with licensing with Disney, Paramount, and others - so I know a bit about what I am saying.

I do NOT have inside info on this deal, but it is completely possible (even likely) that Disney sold them the rights to TS4 only. Maybe because JJP didn't want to pay more, or maybe Disney wanted to hold on to those rights for some reason.

I find it highly unlikely that JJP had access/rights to all four films and then voluntarily chose to use only TS4.

I'm no JJP fan but their pins usually at least look very cool. Not this one--seems like a big step back for JJP. I wonder who could have possibly thought this was a good idea and was a nice progression from their last pin.

Hey Butt-Head, what do you think of the new Toy Story 4 pin...???

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Nobody is forcing JJP to take a license from Disney, if all that was offered up was TS 4 or it was too expensive to get other content then just walk away.

Personally I don't really care thats its TS 4 .... when u push the start button I'm sure u feel like your playing TS. I care more about the crazy pricing, and the reduced BOM...oh how I miss the old JJP

From the clips I've seen it looks like you're playing a carnival themed ticket redemption game, the toy story characters are just window dressing.

I could have lived with it being TS4 if it just had some features that jumped out at you and screamed toy story, a slinky dog ramp just seemed like a no brainer especially after they gave GnR that kind of attention to detail with drumstick ramp returns and guitar head ball locks.

From what I’ve watched it looks boring and lifeless which couldn’t be further from the toy story franchise.

Probably wouldn't hurt to buy an extra set of those Amazon cake toppers. It's not like they were designed to withstand hits from a flying steel ball.

My condolences to anyone who likes Toy Story and now has to live with this game in the world. As well as everyone that was looking forward to this title. Hype train is D.O.A.

$15k for the CE. Probably sold out anyway.

From the up close shots there are massive plastic screens in front of the figures in close proximity to the stunt deck/clear upper playfield.

I worked closely with Steve Jobs @ a little company called NeXT when he purchased Pixar from George Lucas. Was fortunate to help Pixar with software development tools back when they were developing Toy Story. I've been waiting for JJP to do this title for years, and am bummed it didn't focus on the original TS...oh well.

One question I've always wondered about wrt pinball licensing...back when most of these games were being coin operated publicly, it would make sense that the licensing fees were high (since they resulted in much wider visibility and profit for the operator). Now that most of these games are in private homes with almost no visibility AND aren't earning money, it just seems like the licensing fees should be much more modest. In other words, the "license" for home use should be much less than public, coin operated use. What am I missing? If the licensing fee is $300 per machine, that's $1,800,000, which is pocket change for Disney. Who knows, they might even be losing money if you consider the resources they've invested working with JJP! With only 6k machines being targeted, it's hard for me to see this being a money maker for Disney/Pixar...unless the licensing fee is closer to $1,200, which I guess is possible. No idea.

Since you seem to be knowledgeable in this domain, I thought I'd tee this up...thanks for shedding any light on it!

LOL, OK. If that makes you feel better.

Who cares, the game is TS4 and there’s nothing we can do now.

Couple quick thoughts:

1) The implementation of the theme reminds me more of Toy Story Land in Disney World, than of the movies. That's okay I guess, since I like the Toy Story section of Disney World, but I was hoping for a more movie-favored approach.

2) I think the game actually looks very fun, but I can't understand the pricing. It's too expensive for the LE. This is frustrating, as I could see myself being a buyer if it was priced closer to 9k or 10k. Which is all ready a lot, but 12k? Come on! I just don't see anything mechanically in the game to justify that price.

There is, we can not buy it

Your forgetting Disney love one thing more than anything… money! And this was supposed to originally be finished and released in tandem with the movie release, JJP couldn’t make that deadline, so with that alone I would say it was TS4 from JJPs end.

They should have gone back to renegotiate and paid up for the entire franchise once they knew they where never going to get near the movies release. Disney licence out all different aspects of the franchise, this had to be JJPs pigheadedness to just continue down the same path rather than course correct.

Yeah, there's no chance they'd do a stand-alone Buzz Lightyear movie with like, Captain America doing the voice.

This is a case study and how to take a homerun IP and get an out when bunting. I will say my Halloween at $9000 is looking 10 times better than this pin at 15000. Wait did I just say $15000 for a nib pin with no Toys? Yep, i did.

Kind of ironic that a game with a theme about TOYS actually have very few of them.

Couple things, they should of released the SDTM vid first because the pics posted first didnt wow me at all, but after watching the SDTM vid a few times and the gameplay vid its like a different machine and ive warmed up to it. They should of just kept those pics.

-I think it looks like a fun design, the Kaboom jump ramp to the clear upper pf that feeds the left inlane so quickly is awesome, especially as 2 disappearing posts install to make it a tight and risky shot.
-I like the whirlwind type physical ball lock and disc; Pat has used that random effect a few times as discs or under pf magnets and upper pf flips into tight shots, so it feels like his design philosophy.
-I dont like tablets on pf's like SW and now TS4 but having a virtual EM as a side mode is so cool to me as I own an EM and can appreciate them but mileage may vary.
-Code seems great, the animations and HUD is well done as usual and you pick Buzz or Woody at game start I think and work toward the Wizard "Meet me at the Carousel" then the Super Wizard "Fireworks" on 2nd time through as the other character; I dig that it, reminds me of SW if Dwight had only put a Super Wizard when you complete 2 characters. I wonder what Pat was talking about when he said beating Fireworks ends the game in a unique way in pinball.
-All that aside, the theme of 4 is pretty gross because it is basically someone in control of an area trying to harvest organs against the subjects consent like the Communists do and Nazi's have done in their concentration camps; so not a fan of the story here at all..BUT I do like the carnival setting as it fits with Pat's Funhouse theme great.

So, am I IN/Out? Out. Its too rich for my blood unfortunately or it would be a yes, Im still reeling from Stern's price hike from 7K Prem last year to 9K Prem this year all for the same title mind you; insane, but I still ordered 1 sigh. TS4 comes in at 12K for their Prem style pin, and I know theyre not really comparable material wise etc but my spending budget does compare them.
Congrats to everyone who will get a TS4.

My “Baby” agrees

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Way out at this price point.