ToM vs White Water

(Topic ID: 221889)

ToM vs White Water


By delt31

3 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 36 posts
  • 26 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 months ago by gliebig
  • No one calls this topic a favorite

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    Topic poll

    “Which is a better game - ToM or WH20”

    • ToM 24 votes
      21%
    • WH20 88 votes
      79%

    (112 votes)

    #1 3 months ago

    I'm a sucker for these types of topics and surprisingly I didn't see one recently on these two. Thought I would change that. They also represent two games I've never owned before and knowing me, I will likely buy each eventually (......and then sell one or both depending on how they do!)

    Just an FYI, before I bought my SS, many people said it was too easy/shallow and wouldn't last. I actually held off on buying one b/c of it however I really do enjoy it and it's had staying power in what is likely a very quick turnover to many. I'm not very good although I did change the difficulty b/c it can be a little easy but I love the gameplay, sound, humor, look, and with that spider mode, even though I reach SS, I still feel like I haven't beaten it yet. Do either of these games have that super hard "get" like spider in SS?

    The other game on my mind is revisiting Dialed-In but I already owned it. The question would be how much better is DI compared to these two? 5 pin rotation (IJ, SS, AFM, Tron)

    so vote away....nice WH20 is 5k-high 5. Nice ToM is high 6....

    #2 3 months ago

    Both great pins. Whitewater is my favorite game of all time. Coded better, no real cheap points workaround like in ToM. But both are fun. ToM is usually liked better by non pinball players or newbies, starts to fade a bit after awhile because the wizard mode code was never completed, and the bonus multiplier shot is ridiculously overvalued and makes shooting for illusions completely useless if playing for score. But the toys, layout, animations are all top notch. Whitewater to me is the total package. Great unlicensed theme, tons of unique shots, best ramps and combos in pinball, excellent music and call-outs. A ruleset that makes you hit every shot on the game at one point or another. Wet Willy's is a fun and attainable wizard mode with levels to play, and vacation jackpot is a real MF-er to accomplish. Super difficult, but oh so satisfying when you do. BUT...buy ToM, because I want a WH20 for myself!

    #3 3 months ago

    I'm going to play both today - will update this topic with my own vote after I do. Right now I'm leaning big time towards WH20.

    #4 3 months ago

    Take the Whitewater. I’ve owned mine longer than any pin in my collection. And I’ve been collecting for 15 years. Theatre is fun too I guess but Whitewater can’t be beat and is also my favorite pin of all time. Nordman’s Mona Lisa as I like to refer it as

    #5 3 months ago

    WH20 by 352 frames

    #6 3 months ago

    White Water is a better game and holds up much better over time. Theatre of Magic is great the first bunch of times you play it, but it starts to get stale once you have the shots figured out. ToM definitely a pretty game, but WH2O is a better player.

    #7 3 months ago

    White water.

    #8 3 months ago

    Have owned both. I prefer White Water. The ramps & big foot - just more fun.

    #9 3 months ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    I'm a sucker for these types of topics and surprisingly I didn't see one recently on these two. Thought I would change that. They also represent two games I've never owned before and knowing me, I will likely buy each eventually (......and then sell one or both depending on how they do!)
    Just an FYI, before I bought my SS, many people said it was too easy/shallow and wouldn't last. I actually held off on buying one b/c of it however I really do enjoy it and it's had staying power in what is likely a very quick turnover to many. I'm not very good although I did change the difficulty b/c it can be a little easy but I love the gameplay, sound, humor, look, and with that spider mode, even though I reach SS, I still feel like I haven't beaten it yet. Do either of these games have that super hard "get" like spider in SS?
    The other game on my mind is revisiting Dialed-In but I already owned it. The question would be how much better is DI compared to these two? 5 pin rotation (IJ, SS, AFM, Tron)
    so vote away....nice WH20 is 5k-high 5. Nice ToM is high 6....

    WH20 for sure, traded TOM 2x already and I don't sell/trade much at all. Both good games, but TOM doesn't seem to stick in the collection as the rules get old. WH20 is very challenging compared to TOM.

    #10 3 months ago

    Best looking - ToM
    Best code - WH2O

    I guess it really comes down to: Do you want a great looking game or great playing game?

    I had a ToM. I have 2 WH2Os.

    #11 3 months ago

    I own both and will never sell either. They are very different games and compliment each other well. If you had to pick one I'd go with whatever theme or aesthetics are more your style.

    Both have major modding potential if you enjoy doing that to your games. TOM has a very regal look to it while WH20 is handsome but goofier. Both games have great combo flow. For competitive play both games suffer a bit by having essentially one major feature the player feels forced to go for. On TOM it's the bonus multiplier and on WH20 it's the 5x playfield triple jackpots.

    #12 3 months ago
    Quoted from schudel5:

    Best looking - ToM
    Best code - WH2O
    I guess it really comes down to: Do you want a great looking game or great playing game?
    I had a ToM. I have 2 WH2Os.

    what, one for each hand?

    #13 3 months ago

    WH20 is one of the coolest and most elaborate pins ever made. If you aren't up to the difficulty in shopping this pin, steer clear! On the other hand, it offers the best and most fun ramps ever made. The code isn't deep in the standards of today but it employs some difficult objectives. Getting to Wet Willie's is always a blast as is 5X multiball. If you can get the vacation jackpot, you will be singing the praises of this pin for years to come. A blast for the casual and serious player all around. Truly, one of the best and creative designs ever to grace a playfield.

    #14 3 months ago

    I love them both equally, can’t go wrong.

    But WH20 is super unique and would be a better compliment to your SS.

    But man, it’s such a pain when a switch goes bad and you have to remove all the ramps to replace... if that ever happens, do yourself a favor and just replace them all LOL.

    #15 3 months ago

    Both have been in my collection for a loooong time, I would keep WH20 over TOM if I had to choose.

    #16 3 months ago

    Weird.

    I had a dream I owned a WH2O last night. Either I didn't do enough drinking or that whack to the head is still affecting me.

    #17 3 months ago

    Wow! I just got my wh20 a couple months ago, and i agree with everything being said about it! I really have no complaints except when u need to fix something it can be a pain to get to.
    My wife has recently got into pinball (praise the lord), and she loves TOM. I never played it, until she told me how much she liked it. It is also an amazing, yet completely different game than wh20. Lots of gizmos!
    Play them both and pick the one u like best, but i can tell u im never gettin rid of white water.

    #18 3 months ago

    Also i predict that wh20 will soon get to 6k or more. Its one of those special williams games like afm or mm. And now its finally being recognized that it can hang w those other games in a collection.

    #19 3 months ago
    Quoted from Dantesmark:

    Also i predict that wh20 will soon get to 6k or more. Its one of those special williams games like afm or mm. And now its finally being recognized that it can hang w those other games in a collection.

    It really is special and in my opinion should be worth more than most B/W pins due to its elaborate nature and flawless gameplay.

    #20 3 months ago
    Quoted from Marvin:

    what, one for each hand?

    Nah. I thought 3 was excessive; so I sold one.

    #21 3 months ago

    Wh20 got away forever being dirt cheap...Int those days anymore for sure.

    #22 3 months ago

    I enjoy both games but WH2O is a true classic. It's a more unique game with a lot more character. Neither are cheap but don't think TOM is worth the premium price they go for. I would love to get a WH2O someday.

    #23 3 months ago

    WH20 by 2000 miles. One of my favs. Popadookie games are beautiful, but way overrated IMO.

    #24 3 months ago

    I’d say WH20 too.

    #25 3 months ago

    Hmmm, Maryann or Ginger? WH20 is faster and deeper but TOM has a slow seductive side that you can't ignore. Can't lose with either one.

    #26 3 months ago

    so after playing both for a few hours tonight, WH20 is the clear winner in my mind. You guys are spot on - ToM is super pretty and is fun but feels generic compared to the uniqueness and style of WH20. My vote goes to WH20.

    #27 3 months ago

    Had both. TOM the prettier game but I sold it because it became boring after a while. Still have WH2O. It seems to me that SS and Wh20 are getting hard to find for sale.

    #28 3 months ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Wh20 got away forever being dirt cheap...Int those days anymore for sure.

    Mainly bc the ramps, boulders and playfields were usually really rough...... now that everything is remade wh20 has went way up bc all that stuff is usually new and its all expensive . I miss mine which was very nice with color dmd and tons of other stuff mods and new stuff.... sold it for 4800 year or 2 ago and people laughed and said it was way to much. I had tons of buyers and it sold quickly. Now i wish i wld of kept it lol.....

    #29 3 months ago

    btw - I love how the ball hits the glass on the left ramp coming down JUST like SS frogs. Nice touch and will be very nice to my SS! I just need to find one!

    #30 3 months ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    btw - I love how the ball hits the glass on the left ramp coming down JUST like SS frogs. Nice touch and will be very nice to my SS! I just need to find one!

    There were plenty made so u will find one.... ive had 2 and passed on many others over the year's.

    #31 3 months ago

    Traded my BOP +$500 for one w/ a colordmd a couple months ago.
    Good deal i think??

    #32 3 months ago

    Wh20 is my favorite game period, love the theme, the way it plays, the music, and the difficulty level is just right in my book. Desert island pin for me

    #33 3 months ago
    Quoted from Dantesmark:

    Traded my BOP +$500 for one w/ a colordmd a couple months ago.
    Good deal i think??

    great deal!

    #34 3 months ago
    Quoted from bigd1979:

    .... sold it for 4800 year or 2 ago and people laughed

    I got mine 5 years and was so Pissed I didn't buy it earlier and pay the ungodly sum of 3100
    I Remeber them around 2k pretty easy to find. Wow.

    #35 3 months ago

    I am actually on WH20 #2 and missed it almost instantly after I traded it plus cash for a HUO Tron Pro back in 2013. Thankfully 2 years later I was able to get another average example without paying too much "pinflation". I've owned my TOM since 2012 and still enjoy playing it to this day along with my non pinhead guests. The game is a visual masterpiece and the shots flow so smoothly especially that repeatable horseshoe shot around the trunk coming back to either flipper.

    If you like deep code than don't blink when you get wizard mode in TOM because you will likely miss it. The main problem with TOM from a competition stand point can be broken down by my friend Adam Becker here:

    http://www.pinballrevolution.com/threads/theatre-of-magic.1446/

    WH20 is also visually stunning and compliments the campy atmosphere it creates. I love the loopy unique ramps and will never forget first time I heard the ball tap the glass when I hit insanity falls. I'll also never forget when I got the vacation jackpot because I thought I broke my machine! I think if I really had to choose which one to keep it would probably be WH20. Thankfully I don't so I will always own both

    #36 3 months ago

    I don't get the left orbit thing. It's rare that I shoot my left orbit and it goes into the rollovers. 95% of the time it flies back via the ramp to the right flipper. One time the gate got stuck and every shot was diverted to the rollovers. I could see then about getting the giant multipliers, but that was once.
    And in the home environment, who would ever play that way anyway? Every time I go to play it, it is to complete everything, which is not easy. Especially midnight madness, unless you are lucky enough to get it as a mystery award.

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