(Topic ID: 182351)
Shelburn, IN
Quoted from OLDPINGUY:Some games, simply require a blending of many types of bulbs, as well as various brightness, of course. Others, the same type bulb can go everywhere, and look fine.
Yep. Firepower. 100% comet 5050 smd warm white frosteds.
I'm starting to come around on LEDs, it's just that when they're bad, they're really really bad. 
Most games can look great with them if done tastefully. I'm a stickler for the ramp up and down that incandescents provide, some games absolutely lose something if that effect isn't preserved via an LEDocd board.
One game that I've never seen look as good with LEDs in the GI is IJ, there is just something about the warm glow of incandescents that give that playfield its magic. There's a depth to them that makes you feel good looking at it, like xmas lights used to do... 
Quoted from Rarehero:I find that LEd playfields rarely photograph well....but here you go. Most of these are just a mix of warm and cool white. TOM has a few color spots and pink under the pink plastics which really look incredible.
All of your games look top notch Rarehero but that theatre of magic looks sick dude! I love the colors on it personally, makes it pop!
Quoted from J85M:Which companies does everyone use these days? I know there has been a couple of threads in the past, but there are always new products coming out, so at this moment in time, who is everyone's go to LED vendor?
I use Cointaker ...
I have upgraded all my early SS games to LEDs simply because I hate changing burnt up connectors every time I get home from a show. It also helps with heat on the BG. At first I use the frosted cool white behind the BG and in GI, I have since swapped out some for frosted warm white. The frosted bulbs help diffuse the light so there aren't the pinpoint bright spots. I did find that the cool white washed out the colors on some areas...so I now have mixtures of warm and cool white depending on the BG and colors of the art.
I'm going to post pics...but I'm not good at taking pics of them...
I have my red Jungle Lord first I took a pic of it before...
IMG_20170116_115056383_HDR (resized).jpg so you can see how washed out the cool make the colors look...Then I took 1 during the swap...IMG_20170116_115303001_HDR (resized).jpg I didn't post the after one and for some reason in the pics the hot spots seem to show up alot more than they do in real life...but you can see how much difference there is when they are side by side before I swapped the other half. I did leave a few cool ones here and there behind cool colors, or behind the Williams logo.
Next is Barracora...beforeIMG_20170116_120935130_HDR (resized).jpg and then after...IMG_20170116_121632871_HDR (resized).jpg and here I also took one before I replaced the BG...IMG_20170116_121827739_HDR (resized).jpg
Then Cosmic Gunfight...IMG_20170116_120303965_HDR (resized).jpg and after...IMG_20170116_120737164_HDR (resized).jpg
Last is Star Light...and this was the most dramatic change (IMO)...but I forgot to take a pic before...I was so intent on seeing if the warm white would make a difference that I was done before I thought to take pics!! IMG_20170116_122015597_HDR (resized).jpg
To OP...I think LEDs are a matter of personal preference and very subjective...As I said above I converted all my SS and EMs to LEDs for the heat and stress factor. Plus I don't have to change bulbs nearly as often cause LEDs last longer. I'm not a fan of lots of color in the GI...maybe 1 or 2 to highlight an area or important shot. I do like to color match inserts under the PF, or if the insert is clear or opaque white you can add color...but again strictly an owner preference...so do what YOU like not what the crowd likes! 
Most of all play your games and enjoy them!! 
Phoebe
Quoted from vid1900:Baracorra, your under eyeshadow looks lovely.
Try a blue shot.
Ugh!! Not Bluenon......try Xenon!
I have installed them for 2 other people, but none in my games. I do like them , but at the same time certain applications are overboard...
I used to be against LEDs but that was back in the early days when they really sucked! On early LEDs the whites had a blue hue to them and the leds used to fall out of the sockets all the time and would ghost like crazy. Now that they have no-ghost LEDs and LED OCD boards you have solutions around this. I use LED OCD boards in some of my games where you'd otherwise lose cool light fading effects.
Now I have nearly everything converted to LED and I'm very happy I switched. I use either Comet frosted warm white 2035's or Sunlight white frosted for almost everything.-Just depends on if I want the game to have a warmer or cooler look. I don't usually even color match inserts unless the insert really calls for more color. Usually then it's typically either blue, green or red as frosted warm white works better under yellow or amber inserts.
I know people always tout that LEDs draw less power and produce less heat which is nice but isn't the primary reason I switched as my games aren't on enough for either of these to make a huge difference. The main reason I switched is just that LEDs provide a better and cleaner light and really make your games look and play better because you can better see what's going on.
1 week later
I have done full LED's in my FT and my Baywatch, then I just did a 1980 Stern Flight 2000 with frosted warm white non-ghosting from comet, it came out fantastic with a bit if a retro warm look. I only put in just over 1/2 of the bulbs in the backglass as I wanted to see the great graphic more then a bright assed glass.
Edmonton, AB
Quoted from pezpunk:however, what's not subjective is that LEDs:
- significantly reduce the power draw of a game (reducing cost and reducing load on the boards),
- produce less heat (thus preventing warping of plastics), and
- give off almost no UV radiation, which prevents artwork from fading.
What he said
So I kind of ended up with an LED problem thanks to ryanwanger and Comet... I wanted to convert my JP and T2 over to LEDs for the benefits already listed (less power draw, easier on the game, less heat, etc.)... To say the least, I'm supporting USPS to the fullest extent because I keep changing things up. I don't think the trial kits give you a full feel for what a game looks like so I've been swapping out lots of LEDs.
Did my JP in 1 LED frosted warm whites - was OK with the whole thing. Wasn't as bright as I was really wanting but was a cheap option. Christmas time came around and cometpinball.com did a big sale so I....
Did my JP in all Comet 1 SMD LED warm white - was very satisfied
T2 in all Comet 1 SMD sunlight white - was semi happy - I don't like the cool white look and the sunlight leans more "cool" then "warm"
Un-LED my RFM - it has a lot of dimming going on that LEDs can't handle - love it
Purchased a BTTF - decided to color match and warm white in GI with Comet 1 SMD due to some fading inserts and I really loved the way it looked
It started with "OH, let me see what a green Comet 1 SMD looks like in JP" - ended with me color matching everything on both my JP and T2 - except for orange and yellow - BUT I'm very close to ordering a whole bunch of Comet orange's and doing those as well - I think yellow looks great with warm white under it but I'll probably order some 1 SMD yellow's anyway. I also have removed over 1/2 of the sunlight white on T2 replaced with warm whites - I just prefer the more yellow/orange haze over a sharp white
Sorry for the long rant but I hope it helps. In the end, it comes down to preference... a lot of people like the dark blue and purple LED look - myself, I hate it - order a few handfuls of bulbs and find out what you like - then order 2x more than you think you need so you can try out all kinds of options.
Recently got back into the hobby after I took a long brake since 2007. Way back then I hated LED's. Couldn't even think about spending hundreds to change out lights that already work. My games were mostly classic SS, some system 11's and a few early DMD's. To this day I have never put a LED in a game or even as much as looked at what LEDs are available. Recently bought a really nice Xenon and Met pro (first run) Both had full LEDs installed and WOW!!! They look great. I've come to the point of acceptance of them and when you look at the bonuses it's really hard to say no. Less power, no heat, longer lasting, availability of colors and cleaner/brighter lighting. Still haven't put any in but plan to in the future. The only downside I can say about them are to many people making their game look like rainbow unicorn barf.
I adore matching bulbs to insert colors, there is a wow factor in there for me. Blue led on blue inserts look so cool!
Most striking example I've seen was at SFGE 2016 - one row had an early MET pro with incandescents next to a T2 with tasteful, full LEDs. MET looked so dated in comparison. No question, for me leds win big-time
Literally just LED'd my JD this weekend - such a huge improvement it isn't even funny. Halfway through the swap with most inserts swapped, the difference between those not yet led'd was ridiculous. Huge, huge upgrade. Went with Comet natural white frosted in all GI, color matched red/green/whites in inserts, warm white under yellow/orange inserts. Mostly warm white flat tops in the back box.
I'm going to order some flex head bulbs for a couple specific inserts and flashers that could use some improvement, but it is already a night and day difference. Thoroughly modernized.
Maybe on a true classic i could see keeping incandescents, but even then I think tasteful Leds win... Most SS games and certainly DMD-era games are screaming for it.
The key for me is very minimal extra color - a bunch of random pink and purple gi and a dozen extra colored spots, etc, added, is just not nice...
With the Orginal bulbs 44/47/555 it always seems the first to go was in hardest place to complete a bulb change... LED pretty much makes this a non issue
Quoted from calprog:Before and after TZ. I also added side and back blades, a few mods and color dmd. I really like the led look. A more modern look!
That is a huge difference and look a million times better than before. Is the blue lighting in the back and front by the flippers done with LED strips?
I went from "LEDs are the best", to trying to keep it original. I recently got a Spy Hunter and a Check Point and I think I am about to shift back over to the LED path! Check Point especially looks like it needs some LED love!
I like to do a mix of both LED and incandescent as usually it is the way to go.
Quoted from MikeS:I used to be against LEDs.
Me, too. Then I bought Mustang Boss premium in 2014 and had to put it in a corner by itself because it came with LEDs and it was so much brighter than all my other games. But now I've changed everything except SW:E1 over to LEDs, by using warm white frosteds in backboxes, selecting a mix of LEDs under playfields (including double-flex-heads for larger inserts), adding LED-OCD and GI-OCD boards where needed (absolutely cannot put LEDs in BBB without it), and never color-bombing a game. The only times I have used colored LEDs under inserts is when I've had to correct for missing colors, such as red and green LEDs in my proto ToM (to match where regular production ToM games have red and green inserts). I'd like to change SW:E1 over to LEDs, too, but I won't do it unless an LED-OCD board is made for P2K games in the future.
Quoted from northerndude:I adore matching bulbs to insert colors, there is a wow factor in there for me. Blue led on blue inserts look so cool!
I generally hate that look. Blue inserts are a nice light sky blue, and a cool white bulb really brings that out brilliantly. I don't like seeing the deep "Smurf blue" on all blue inserts.
Quoted from calprog:Before and after TZ. I also added side and back blades, a few mods and color dmd. I really like the led look. A more modern look!
I don't want to be rude, but this is exactly what I don't like about LEDs.
The look of the game is completely changed.
It's lit so bright that the playfield and translite art is washed out.
Why is the "twilight zone" logo bright blue?
Twilight Zone was a 1950s black and white show, that had a macabre or mysterious theme.
Your lighting scheme is more like an recent science fiction fiber optic look. Like that Tron Legacy movie.
Again, I'm not trying to be rude, just being honest. Every time someone posts pictures of a game, it gets praise. I'd rather get constructive criticism.
If I was doing the LEDs in a game, I would try to mildly enhance the original look of the game
To each his own, I guess.
At least these bulbs are not a permanent modification.
Quoted from irobot:I don't want to be rude, but this is exactly what I don't like about LEDs.
The look of the game is completely changed.
That is not because of LEDs, it is just what the owner chose for the type and color. There are lots of LED options to keep the lighting faithful to original if one wishes.
Quoted from irobot:I don't want to be rude, but this is exactly what I don't like about LEDs.
The look of the game is completely changed.
It's lit so bright that the playfield and translate art is washed out.
Why is the "twilight zone" logo bright blue?
Twilight Zone was a 1950s black and white show, that had a macabre or mysterious theme.
Your lighting scheme is more like an recent science fiction fiber optic look. Like that Tron Legacy movie.
Again, I'm not trying to be rude, just being honest. Every time someone posts pictures of a game, it gets praise. I'd rather get constructive criticism.
If I was doing the LEDs in a game, I would try to mildly enhance the original look of the game
To each his own, I guess.
At least these bulbs are not a permanent modification.
I'll somewhat agree with you on that game. Some of the colors are a little too bright. But think if toned down a little it would look nicer then an original.
What I really hate are the GI and backglass color bombs I've seen. And when they are on a classic game it's really worse.
Quoted from No_Skill:I saw this on flea-bay. I have no words...
No words needed!
Absolutely LED. Even if you want the classic look, you can go with the warm white bulbs and save a bundle on energy costs and probably not have to change out a bulb for the life of the pin. On the other hand, you can also greatly customize the look of your pin and bring a lot of life to it. My one recommendation is not to buy a pre-bundled kit, but do it yourself. It will be much less expensive, and you are open to customize however you like.
My personal preference is Comet Pinball, but I know there are other good sources out there. Also, I went with all non-ghosting bulbs. Many will tell you this is not necessary in GI and other spots, but I didn't want to risk it, wanted a consistent brightness with all my bulbs, and wanted to keep a sampling of various bulb colors I could use anywhere I wanted to play around with different effects. Flashers can be a little tricky, but I went with ones that are pretty bright as I like the effect.
I put some LEDs in my Black Knight too and love the look. I am still getting the right mix of LEDs & incandescents. For me no LEDs on the back glass, I think the blue inlays look great with the cool whites. Experimenting to get the right mix is part of the fun. I should note that I cleaned all my plastic inlays underneath, some, especially the bigger ones, were really dirty possibly from cigarette smoke back in the day.
Quoted from TheLaw:Yeah I don;t know aboot "a bundle."
Okay "bundle" is hyperbole in this case. Mainly from my perspective you draw less power with LEDs, which allows for additional light modding if you want while also putting less draw on your power supply. Not to mention they really liven up a pin. All the benefits at a lower operating cost is a win however you look at it from my perspective.
Quoted from kevmad:In the end it is just a personal preference. Just like my home lighting is halogen (which looks looks just like the no longer available incandescents bulbs), I would never use LED lighting for the home.
Man, I tried LED's in a couple lights in my house and now have every light changed over. I'm using the daylight LED's best thing I could have done. But 1. I hate the warm white color . I like bright rooms and 2> I have two daughters 12 & 17. They keep lights on all the time!!!! So saving on electric every month now.
Quoted from hawknole:I put some LEDs in my Black Knight too and love the look. I am still getting the right mix of LEDs & incandescents. For me no LEDs on the back glass,
I was of the same opinion on the Backglass also. Then I tried the Comet Warm White Frosted flat top Led's and no more Incandescents for me. They look just like the incandescents except they are better looking. No hot spots and you keep the nice colors from the "yellow" warm light.
Try a few and see what you think. 
Quoted from hailrazer:I was of the same opinion on the Backglass also. Then I tried the Comet Warm White Frosted flat top Led's and no more Incandescents for me. They look just like the incandescents except they are better looking. No hot spots and you keep the nice colors from the "yellow" warm light.
Try a few and see what you think.
https://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/led.htm
Yep, I ordered some warm white leds today to try. Thanks.
Can anyone recommend a bulb that is a warm white that is as close to an incandescent as possible? In terms of hue and brightness?
Quoted from sublime90803:Can anyone recommend a bulb that is a warm white that is as close to an incandescent as possible? In terms of hue and brightness?
Not Possible.
maybe 80% is as close as it gets, and then you get 15 different answers.....
Quoted from sublime90803:This is why LED's get a bad reputation...
People without any artistic talent see a green cabinet and they think the entire game should be one color.
My eyes! My precious antique eyes!! Oh, look what you've done to 'em!
Seriously, though... good lord. That might be the worst LED job I've ever seen. And I've seem some real shit. We lost a lot of good pins back there.
Lighting a game in a way that brings out the existing artwork, while enhancing the overall vibe of the game is an art. That's more of a shart.
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