You didn't buy one to flip it, did you?

_{Post edited by sammiesguys : look for IM classic price check}

No way. The kickback and magnets are half of what makes the game fun...the game attacks you. IM Classic lacks that. Just cuz IM is selling for way too much (IMO), doesn't mean you should pay more for an IM Classic...what are you thinking? $4k? $5k? Holy sh*t, think of the AMAZING games you could buy for that price!!!!!

I'd rather have a BDK "classic" than IM classic. It has a real cabinet & rails (IM classic is a cheapified cabinet)...it has the crane toy which is the main thing that makes BDK fun. It removes stuff that no one really cared about anyway (Joker can, teeter bridge, gadget mini-pf)

I was kidding. I can't think of IM classic without being reminded of this:

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/price-check-iron-man-classic

I have played it and it is not a toy. But I just don't get into Iron Man. Do miss a coin door and pulling up a playfield just seems alien these days.

I get the argument of "how much more is it worth". I have an AC/DC pro and I love the reviews saying the pro may be better for certain reasons.

I think this version of a "home game" is a heck of a lot better than past game like Fireball Home and Brown Dirt Cowboys.

If you are giving IM Classic a second look I think you need to give other machines a second look

To me IM is overrated, overpriced & not worthy of its current tulipmania price.

It's a fun game but just buy a F'n ACDC Premium with that money instead.

What's another $300-$800

What? He said IM classic is going for around $3k. Yes I will take an AC/DC Premium for $3.3K. Where are they if not under water from a flood?

I'd love to play a BDK "classic". It's one of the few modern games I haven't played, and it seems to dump all the stuff I dislike about BDK pro.

Funny, I was thinking something similar. Saw the IM classic that was posted the other day for sale in the Market for sub $3k. Looked at it again to compare to the pro. As was mentioned, it lacks the 2 magnets, the WM kicker, and the whiplash figure. I know there are other differences too (playfield wood, coin door) but play wise, those are the differences. It still has the three spinners, has the very cool IM rising bash toy. Same ramps and targets. And same game modes. Another big plus of IM is it has great sounds, music, modes and theme integration. All of these are the same in IM classic. I completely agree that the magnets and kicker are awesome on the pro, but gameplay and theme integration on the classic are the same. In your face fast game, with simple but fun modes that progress to wizard modes.

Here is the modern day rub that came to me. IM classic is a stripped down pro. It lacks some neat features of the pro, but it has a great interactive toy that you actually hit. It rises up and down on the playfield. The game is pretty universally bashed here on pinside. BUT how is IM classic any worse that the new Star Trek pro? On ST pro, you have 1 toy, and its not even interactive! Sure it bobbles at times, but you don't hit it. No change in shots (as opposed to Iron Monger when it blocks key shots). Modes and gameplay may be fun on ST pro. Music and call outs may be great too. But both are also great on IM classic - same as IM pro. Why is IM classic seen as junk, but people are not making the same comments about ST pro. Seems like a very stripped down playfield as well with only 1 toy with limited interaction.

You realize this all applies quite directly to the current and recent Stern LE/Premium vs. Pro choices, right?

ssssshhhhhhh..... We don't want the Stern fanatics to realize they've fallen for the "Classic/Regular" angle with all of the recent "LE-Premium/Pro" stuff, just at higher price points!

My point isn't that IM classic is great or as good as IM pro. Its not. But IM pro is seen by many to be an awesome, kickass game with great theme integration. IM classic has 2 magnets, 1 kickback and 1 action figure removed. That's it play wise. And IM classic is dismissed as a turd. Buy comparison, ST pro does not have (took this info from a post on MAACA):

No Wireform ramps, plastic instead
No 2-Way Deflector Ball Eject/ VUK with Wireform Tube
Vengeance Ship shakes But does NOT crash onto the playfield
Only 7 colour changing LED inserts
No colour changing GI
No Warp Ramp LED Chase Lights
No Backbox Flashers Behind Backglass, tube instead
No Animated Playfield Laser Starfield Projector
No Warp Core Resonator Shaker Motor
No Kickback Kicker--Ball Save Feature on Left Drain
No Lit "USS Enterprise" Custom-Molded Model Mounted on Playfield
No Playfield-Mounted Custom-Molded Asteroids with LED Flashers

That is a huge difference. That is a stripped down game.

With IM classic, you can put a whiplash figure on the playfield, with lighted whips that tie into the flasher, lit arc reactor, replace war machine with lit cannon and arc reactor, put led's in the game, and it would look pretty killer.

That's what they sell for on RGP

JK man

You missed my point in regards to IM vs ACDC & Classic vs just find something else.

Being one of only two pinsiders who have the Iron Man Classic in their collection listed I feel I have a pretty good say if it is a good game or not. I think you need to own one, or actually play one numerous times to form an opinion. I will not guess on number out there, but I have seen one other pop up in last year and that is the one on market place. I would say they are very limited. I am an avid Marvel and comic guy from my childhood and I love Iron Man and the entire theme and history. I already owned the pro when I purchased the Classic and my initial intent was to trade it for another title at the pinball show and then when that did not work I tried to sell it. I have learned that most people are looking for the pro for added features much like people looking for an AC/DC Premium v.s Pro. because of lower PF,etc. The original MSRP is $3995 through Costco and Best Buy. When they launched with the idea from Stern it was not good timing with economy and not the right choice in vendor distribution. This combination resulted in very low sales. I really got the fever and thought IM Classic was worth over $4000 with the prices of Pro's going for over $6000. I thought the same thing with no magnets no kick back, etc. in terms of value difference. Since then I have determined what it is worth at least to me. I think it is worth between $2800-$3200 depending on condition. I have gotten offers below these figures and have decided just to hold onto it until I get a decent offer. I was thinking about putting it in my sons bedroom and doing a cool marvel theme. He is only 9 months old so he will not play for a few more years(; I guess I compare it to what else is available for the money and how fun it is to play. The Iron Man Classic is actually a great flowing game and the game plays considerably different than the Pro. The call-outs and software is slightly different and the only thing I notice is magnet in front of Monger when bashing Monger does not drain your ball as bad. I also use my IM Classic as a decoy-yes decoy. So all the kids that come over can bash on it all day, while I try and keep my pro cherry-LOL. All in all I say the one for sale on Market is a good price and good value. For a modern DMD, I cannot think of a better title for the money except WPT. It was designed for home use and actually is built pretty well for the home environment. I am in the process of modding mine out right now. I just got Whiplash figurine, Iron Man figurine, Nick Fury, and probably will get Black Widow as well. In terms of LED's-this was Stern's first full LED game from factory. I am going to start switching some out and customize. I am also going to see if I can add a shaker to it somehow. So my answer is yes-You should give IM a second look-especially if you can find one. My.02

Just for the record, my son started actively bugging me to play pinball at about one and a half, so you don't have a few more years.

Having said that, you always want what you don't have... my son doesn't get easy access to my machines, so if you have one in your son's room, it may just become another toy.

I think by comparison yeah it is 3K less fun. IM is fun but cannot imagine it being still fun all stripped down of some of the best features. I would still avoid one at all cost. Same analogy for fireball/classic/home...

There's a big difference between removing key gameplay elements like magnets and kickers, vs. removing a hammer or an outlane kickback. Taking the magnets out of IM is like taking the castle out of MM.

IIRC, either these games never sold for their MSRP or were heavily discount very very quickly. The economy and vendor distribution is not why this bombed. It bombed because it was a weaker version of an already weak game.

IM is popular around here and that's fine, but at the time, nobody will dispute that IM was a massive failure. A stripped down version of a huge failure wasn't going to do very well either.

Folks if you cant find an IM classic to play just pull a random fuse out of an IM Pro

Same thing

I modified your list to show ONLY the differences that affect gameplay. To me this is not "stripped down". Yes, there's some eye candy missing. But if you're a player and you'd rather see the ball than a Vegas show, the Pro is very nice indeed.

I actually tried this just to see what an IM Classic would play like. It sucks!

Ding! What he said.

An ACDC low play pro just went for $3600, so IM Classic is $2400, maybe? There is one in my area for $2850 for sale. Maybe you could trick a newbie into thinking they are getting a Pro type model with the classic? But, that wouldn't be right.

That's more or less true of every Stern pinball machine since, well, forever. Isn't MSRP for a new Pro like $5499? Basically, no one ever pays that.

Not really. IM was already a bare bare barebones game from their supreme costcutting days...despite itself, it ended up being a super fun game - and part of that fun was the way it attacked you and kept you on your toes. Those features are gone - what's the point. Most of the Pros these days, while stripping features from the Prem/LEs - still retain most of the essential fun gameplay features. Tron's still got the disc that whips the ball back at you. Metallica's still got 2 magnets, Sparky, drop targets, scoops. AC/DC um...has it's rules. Avengers has Hulk & the Tesseract. Today's Premiums are games with lots of stuff & Pros have less stuff. IM already had almost NO stuff lol...including rules! The Classic just went too far and ruined the game. Its value shouldn't be proportionally related to the regular edition in the way today's Pro/Prem/LE value shifts.

This is very true. Austin Powers is basically Iron Man LE, and it was regarded as that by just about everyone when it came out.

So, are you admitting the $3,600 on eBay was a shill bid?

Bid on Ebay was from fellow pinsider who I will not mention, but was wishy washy and trying to sell other pinball machines to cover pay-pal for machine. After weeks I got tired and cancelled transaction.

If you like it and want to keep it that's all that matters.

Yea but I only have so much room. I am about to take over another room in the basement. I would not mind trading towards a WPT,BBH, or some other under rated title

Personally, I'd kill it with fire!!!

That thread contained the most thumbs downs I have ever witnessed.

I'd probably like the classic because the pro kicks my ass to much and it play fast so maybe the classic missing all the stuff plays better.

what is the code like on ironman lite? finished? are updates available? it seems like it was introduce prior to the recent code debacles that have hurt stern. I would still take one for $2000 as mentioned in the other ironman classic thread.

True, but this case was different as the game was being sold in retail stores. I was under the impression MSRP was more closely related to retail prices.

IM classic is a fun game not for the msrp of 3995, but for the "going rate" of 1.5k-3k window. only reason going rate is in quotes is because very few of them around so not much to go off of. yes the machine is "stripped" of 2 magnets and a kicker (these are the only things that effect gameplay) comes stock with leds in the inserts and plays very nicely. war machine is actually harder to hit on the classic because it has no opto and just registers hits based on a stand up target that is much further back. Whiplash is harder as well because the magnet doesn't catch the ball or even slow it down to change direction or anything, those targets are drain monsters. the monger is slightly easier sans magnet though lol..... i'm owner #2 of the classic on pinside so i know firsthand.

I think it's funny rereading the old thread and hearing the "enjoy your IM!", and he was so confindent he could sell it (pinmister). Now he is still the owner.... just funny is alll.

I think that Stern's folly with the Classics and now with The Pin (did they ever make the Avengers version?) puts paid to the idea of building a pinball machine to a price point. The Street Level Gottliebs didn't do well, either, AFAIK.

This just underscores a few points about this hobby to me.

1) People who buy the machines outright are going to complain about the prices
2) People aren't going to accept a machine built to the price point they think machines should be at
3) Prices are probably not going to go down, even with increased competition, because supply is always going to be short for new full-featured machines. (LEs and boutiques)

Took the words right out of my mouth. The magnets and the kick-back are the freaking DNA of Iron Man. They ARE Iron Man. Take them away and you're not playing IM. So why in the world would you pay any kind of Premium at all for the classic? Unless the game completely stands on its own as a very solid game...$3k is absurd. The Pin has more cool features and toys. And $3k is absurd for the Pin.

Funny and utterly predictable.