If skill-based gambling equipment becomes licensed for casinos, don't count Bally or WMS out from getting back into pinball development for that market. Kind of funny that when Anchor Games developed and operated on a revenue sharing basis three types of pinball based slots, they used IGT slant top slots and the top box pinball playfield was made by Williams. There were boxes of playfields with Williams logo stacked high inside the Pilot Road factory in Las Vegas.
IGT eventually bought out Anchor.
I was listing to the radio or a podcast (I think it was Planet Money) where they were talking the gambling industry is having a hard time attracting young gamblers and the industry is looking to adopt skill based gambling as the solution. If that happens perhaps we will see a true pinball resurgence.
Pinball being labeled a gambling device almost killed it, and has caused it to still be illegal in some places, which pinheads are trying to reverse
This is the last thing pinball needs as it's trying a make comeback as a wholesome family activity
The key for advantage play is how good is the pinball physics engine ? If all flipper control moves (dead bounce, alley pass, live catch, and drop catch), aiming consistency and nudging skills closely simulate reality, then there is potential. Obviously, the game would have to be tried to make any definite conclusions, but this is welcome news as an initial impression.
Those machines probably wouldn't fly around here. Most of our local casinos are filled with older Asian women who seem somewhat bothered by any ruckus around them (they'll move away from you if you start winning and your machine is making noise - giving you the stink eye as they leave). They just want to push the little button, rub the screen for luck, and repeat.
If you had a group of younger gamblers standing around a machine getting involved in the game, the older consistent cash cows would probably not be happy. And you don't want to upset those players. They drop hundreds an hour into those machines.
Quoted from SolarRide:The key for advantage play is how good is the pinball physics engine ? If all flipper control moves (dead bounce, alley pass, live catch, and drop catch), aiming consistency and nudging skills closely simulate reality, then there is potential. Obviously, the game would have to be tried to make any definite conclusions, but this is welcome news as an initial impression.
Flipper strength will be varied randomly to add an element of chance.
Mr. Bally, thanks for the information. It will save me some time and money knowing this, should this product make it onto casino floors. If I want random flipper strength variability, I can play an unmodified LOTR and not lose my shirt doing so.
Quoted from SolarRide:The key for advantage play is how good is the pinball physics engine ? If all flipper control moves (dead bounce, alley pass, live catch, and drop catch), aiming consistency and nudging skills closely simulate reality, then there is potential. Obviously, the game would have to be tried to make any definite conclusions, but this is welcome news as an initial impression.
Quoted from MrBally:Flipper strength will be varied randomly to add an element of chance.
http://www.igamingbusiness.com/news/nevada-approves-skill-based-slot-games-bill
Quoted from MrBally:If skill-based gambling equipment becomes licensed for casinos, don't count Bally or WMS out from getting back into pinball development for that market. Kind of funny that when Anchor Games developed and operated on a revenue sharing basis three types of pinball based slots, they used IGT slant top slots and the top box pinball playfield was made by Williams. There were boxes of playfields with Williams logo stacked high inside the Pilot Road factory in Las Vegas.
IGT eventually bought out Anchor.
Quoted from SolarRide:If I want random flipper strength variability, I can play an unmodified LOTR and not lose my shirt doing so.
This is how "Skill" Cranes work. Every so many plays the current supplied to the electromagnet is raised to a level that will allow a prize to be picked up. Statistically, that will be the time the player is not lined up to get the claw over the prize.
Some states do not allow this "element of chance" and require an altered program keeping claw strength CONstant.
I'll look for the link - there is a video explaining the technology they are using. There is no variable flipper strength. In fact, they are using a technology to highly diminish flipper latency from button push to flip to make the game more realistic. The player in the video is able to control the ball much easier than I have seen before in a video pin.
The game uses a combination of pinball skill to heighten the odds of winning and luck to win or lose.
The odds are set by the player and their bet when you begin play. The odds get better with good game play. When the ball exits, a roulette-like wheel appears in the center of the playfield. It displays the current odds in slices of red (good) and black (bad). The wheels spins and where it stops determines a win or loss. So, you can have an incredibly good ball and still lose your bet (or bad ball and win).
A skilled pinball player may have a better chance of winning than a non-player, but the odds are still in favor of the house.
What's to stop a player from cradling the ball for a few hours, while reading their favorite book ?
Quoted from FrankJ:I'll look for the link - there is a video explaining the technology they are using. There is no variable flipper strength. In fact, they are using a technology to highly diminish flipper latency from button push to flip to make the game more realistic. The player in the video is able to control the ball much easier than I have seen before in a video pin.
The game uses a combination of pinball skill to heighten the odds of winning and luck to win or lose.
The odds are set by the player and their bet when you begin play. The odds get better with good game play. When the ball exits, a roulette-like wheel appears in the center of the playfield. It displays the current odds in slices of red (good) and black (bad). The wheels spins and where it stops determines a win or loss. So, you can have an incredibly good ball and still lose your bet (or bad ball and win).
A skilled pinball player may have a better chance of winning than a non-player, but the odds are still in favor of the house.
Quoted from MrBally:If skill-based gambling equipment ....
It's digital, so I can assure you it's not skilled based.
Game will be programed just like a slot to provide a certain % of payouts
Just thinking out loud... what happens if there's a glitch in the physics. I've had balls fall thru geometry and even flippers on almost all digital pinball games among other hiccups - can this gameplay truly be bullet proof enough?
Balls hopping stuff physically in a real machine is one thing - balls violating the physics model of a computer simulation bug or glitch is another.
Quoted from Purpledrilmonkey:Just thinking out loud... what happens if there's a glitch in the physics. I've had balls fall thru geometry and even flippers on almost all digital pinball games among other hiccups - can this gameplay truly be bullet proof enough?
Balls hopping stuff physically in a real machine is one thing - balls violating the physics model of a computer simulation bug or glitch is another.
All gaming machines are software based, and thus fallible. Considering this is a high-roller, semi skill based machine that needs gaming control board approval, I imagine the code is going to be scrutinized much harder than Farsights TPA tables that are churned out once a month onto 8 different platforms I imagine every casino has some kind of reimbursement policy for machine malfunction.
Then you lose your $100 minimum bet
Quoted from Purpledrilmonkey:Just thinking out loud... what happens if there's a glitch in the physics.
I guess my point is, who detects a malfunction with a game like this?
With the average slot machine, if there's a glitch it basically boils down to a payout happening or not happening correctly based on the onscreen result, and the game can be (will be) opened up and plugged into to validate an error or complaint.
With this game, the player is controlling actions in real time with complicated physics and geometry coming into play, so if I see something I think is against the "rules" of the game engine during the game, how is that error handled? Is the gameplay recorded so that one could make a complaint that could be watched back to void a win/loss? And who determines if it really is a glitch/exploit, or just part of the game - is it just my opinion vs the casino's? One man's glitch or exploit is another man's feature. I'm not saying it's impossible to handle, I'm just curious how this works logistically if something goes wrong.
Quoted from DefaultGen:I imagine the code is going to be scrutinized much harder than Farsights TPA tables
Agreed, but even the physical game of pinball has issues in tournament play that can cost players thousands of dollars, and those games have no physics calcs running in the background.
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