I don’t think it is actually a big expense and may even be a savings for them in the long run. The system was already developed and proven in Hobbit, then was being used in DI... since they were re-upping and continuing WOZ production it doesn’t make sense to keep two seperate system types on the floor as doing so increases line worker confusion and training costs plus you have to two sets of all the supporting components where you could have just one.

It just makes sense to update to your current technology when continuing production.

As far as why change the tech at all? Would we rather have them sit still and not innovate? I think thats a lot of what we are paying for and supporting with the expense of their games... innovation in pinball... so yea.. they better be.

All I can say is 5 volt boards version 1.3 buffered don't resolve the issue only had small boards go out so far but at a cost of 25 when buying in bulk and the cost of the big boards that are said to be a matter of time I am in on a kit. And will install the day the last replacement I have fails. Some machines appear to be more susceptible then others.

I will also say I am not angry about the expense because Jack held to his price at 6.5 for early buyers despite likely going in the red - so I gambeled and lost well sort of I purchased and then sold then repurchased knowing about the light just happy I can fix it

Just avoid games with the original 5v light boards. All of those games should have exhibited the issue by now. Around September of 2013 JJP switched to 7.5v unbuffered boards, then to 7.5 buffered boards, and then finally to 2.0.

There are tons of WOZ's out there with 7.5v boards that don't exhibit any issues. I've had my WOZ ECLE for just over 4 years, it has 7.5v boards, and I haven't had one board issue (knock on wood apron, lol).

Not sure if matters but I've had my WOZ, and all my pins, hooked up to APC surge protectors that are then plugged into an APC voltage regulator. Also, I use Wizards Mist and Shine spray on my playfield which is recommended by JJP to prevent static build up on playfields. Static buildup can cause light board issues in very dry environments. Its cheap insurance.

What's nice about the ECLE model if you can find one is it's the ultimate WOZ model. It's the only model of the game that features the beautiful wood apron and direct print cabinet.

The chips need to make the original boards were discontinued by the manufacturer.

Never had an issue like that with the monkey on the one I maintain. Sometimes it dropped the ball too close to the edge at the castle and the ball dropped out, but that was an easy one-time fix.

Drop dead foam works perfect for the castle edge, never had one single ball drop off the edge after that. Took about 30 seconds to cut and put it down.

There was an issue with it binding on the rod too, fixed with some grease

For starters, the chips used on those boards are no longer manufactured. JJP bought all the rest, though, and according to their engineer, they have more than enough to service boards that do fail. You can call up Butch and talk to him directly about. I talked to him and he was very forthcoming.

Besides, it would be foolish for a company not continue innovating and pushing forward as new technologies become available. It happens across electronics in nearly every consumer segment. That doesn't mean, however, that every older iteration is dog meat. This notion that buyers should ONLY consider 2.0 games is silly... and it certainly spreads a false impression of non 2.0 games.

Message to the OP is pretty much what others have echoed: if you find 7.5 or 7.5 buffered, you're going to be good to go. And there is absolutely zero guarantee that a 2.0 manufactured game is going to be problem free.

Once I adjusted the monkey so it went a little higher before dropping, it solved the problem.

Graphite dry lube is a better idea. Grease and WD40 will gunk up and cause problems later.

thats what she said (resized).jpg

I wouldn't worry about parts if the game is an earlier version.
I picked up an early ECLE version last month and had some light board issues but a quick call to the JJp guys and they shipped the parts quick (and gave a discount on the returned old ones). Even better, I had an opto board go out and they shipped me a new one, only paid shipping costs (once I returned the old one).

It's probably just gummed up threads at the back. Mine was running rough when I got it, then I cleaned both rods at the back. Running just fine now.

Yes! Forgive me, that was the recommended fix. Non grease!

eh, not a fan...You could do better; if looking for a JJP, play Dialed In; it's fantastic.

Nevertheless, for an 8k pin; make sure to play WOZ before you buy it; it's a gorgeous pin, a work of art; but just not that fun to play unfortunately.

Utter bullshit. It’s very fun to play.

Not sure why the down voting here... My LE playfield chipped by the winkie guard and had multiple board issues.

i didn't downvote that comment, but i think the dissenters point was that only some of the Emerald City LE playfields were bad, and it's not hard to figure out which ones: the ones made by Mirco are fine, and the ones made by Balder have problems.

the light board issues are legit, though. i would avoid the original boards. the later revisions are better -- not great, but usually fine for home use. the 2.0 boards (which i think began production at the beginning of this year?) are best.

You get WOZ in a home setting... learn the rules, get comfortable with its challenging shots, and it opens up like no other game I've ever owned. I've had it for over 3 years and its a massive rush to play. JJP absolutely nailed this one.

Sounds like the OP already has made up his mind to purchase a WOZ - just needed to know
which one(s) to maybe avoid. I appreciate all the info here...as I, too, may purchase one some day.
Imo, WOZ also seems to be a "chick" magnet game. Both my wife
and sister-in-law love playing it (even though they had minimal ideas of what to shoot at/for)
M

It's downright evil. Don't judge a book by its cover

YES. Please listen to this post. It will save you a lot of aggravation in the future. I'm sure you can buy the other one but If the people had the option back then they would have chosen the new board system. It is referred to as light system 2.0 and they have upgraded the computer and IO board as well. Late model WOZ will have this new system. I own a 2.0 system WOZRR so I can tell you my experience and experiences of others that have had the earlier set up.

Bottom Line WOZ is a great Game Very deep and beautiful game. Congrats!

there are actually at least 4 versions of the boards. saying only the 2.0 version is aggravation-free is reductive and not entirely accurate.

The 2.0 light system is the one Im familiar with and has given me and people I know very little if any problems at all. Sure there are others out there but I can't remember the names. Ask 2.0 If yes you are better then the first generation. When all else fails get serial number and call JJP ask for any one of there techs and they will tell you about the game. They are honest and fair.

Then maybe don't insist there are problems with systems you're not familiar with.

Seriously, spreading misinformation or half-informed impressions doesn't help anyone. It just reinforcements inaccurate claims. You're making statements and you aren't even familiar with the other systems?

Come on, dude.

Im not going to yell at you for these statements, that has already been done. What I will say is that as JJP Distributor who has been on board since before woz was being shipped I can tell you that yes, there were some issues. That being said, my personal ecwozle was built in 11/13 and I have never had an issue. As the old saying goes "a happy customer will tell 10 people, and unhappy will tell 100." We hace heard from those with issues, but i would be willing to bet that there are many, many more happy customers that we dont hear from. My game has gone to countless shows, tournaments, in house parties, etc. It has 1000's of plays. No issues at all with light boards, monkey, playfield, anything really.

For the op, if you are worried about a game not working, buy a new one with a warranty, otherwise it's pinball. It is going to break at some point. Find a local distibutor (or not a local one, but one you trust) to work with to help you if there are issues. Most of the bugs have been worked out of the orginal light boards. The 7.5 boards are not nearly has prone to failure as the earlier versions.

If you (op, or anyone else reading this) would like to talk more specifics then send me a message.

Fine Buy whatever you want WOZ is great never a problem. Guys not everyone in this forum is a tech. You are supposed to speak from your personal experiences. I have many with early WOZ. I'm not hear to bash JJP. I love there games and own all 3 with the 4th on the way. I own an amusement company with 300+ locations and have many technicians that work for my company. I was merely telling someone less problems with the newer boards. You cant argue with that! I said not all had problems but there have been some horror stories. Again you guys cant leave shit alone and love to play King. Great awesome job. You guys rock. I know a lot about games and I have extensive technical background but I'm not going to go into detail on this forum. JJP is great and all of there techs are awesome. I know most of them. Call JJP direct and ask questions so you feel more comfortable before you buy. Everyone else find something else to do.

The problem is you writing an emphatic paragraph with declarations of fact about light boards you later admitted you knew nothing about (all the buffered and 7.5v variations).

That’s the opposite of helpful.

I collect old slots as well and a WOZ is a whole different animal. If you are not proficient in repairing pinball machines then stay away. There is a whole lot of new technology in there that is not obvious. This is not a good first or second machine unless you have a friend who is an experienced pin guy to help you out, or you are prepared to do a lot of learning.

I'm well aware of the systems used in WOZ. I do not have to come across as an expert to state an opinion. I will leave that to you. Lighten up. You are a very odd person. You stated the same thing I did. Buy the newer style WOZ if you want a lesser probability for problems. But I guess I just did not say it with a schmuck attitude like you do all the time.

take it to PM fellas, don't ruin this guys thread

Agreed. Pinside is here to help people and these comments do not achieve this goal.
All the best with the OP and others buying a WOZ. It is a great game.

I just picked up the 75th with the new boards, my family couldnt be happier. Either way woz is in another league.

I have the only spare direct print cabinet in the country. I probably will throw it up on eBay soon.

My wife hates it. It is my favorite game. She likes MMr and LotR. Just because the main protagonist, villain and good witch are all female does not mean it is a "chick" game. It is an awesome game for all ages and sexes. Get over your misogyny and realize the awesomeness.

Just an FYI, my Ruby Red was built 9/29/16 and was one of the first 2.0 boards. Great game.

If you are not in to fixing pinball this is the best option . 2.0 system with upgraded board chip and upgraded power supply upgraded monitor . WOZ 75th 2.0 contact Frank at JJP he will give you all the facts as I grilled him for 30 minutes about buying a non- 2.0 WOZ and explained that I found a HOU beauty for $ 7.800.00 but it was not the 2.0 . Frank told me that since I did not like working on my personal collection as my tech skills are limited and it was out of warrantee that I should purchase " Dialed In" I told Frank I want a WOZ 75th . He flat out said do not buy it with out the 2.0 system it is a flaw in the chip and technical talk that went over my head. I am not taking the chance on paying the same price for an older WOZ that is flawed in design at the same price point as a WOZ 2.0 HUO . Frank told me that the wiring harness fix is not ready for non- 2.0 WOZ . For me it would be a unwise move to buy WOZ that is not a 2.0 upgrade . @ OilGuy When you want to sell or trade your WOZ 75th RR let me know . I will send you a PM .

So what did you decide to do with all the feedback provided from this thread ? Regards

WOZ was my second pinball machine, and it did have some initial issues, but JJP is THE BEST at customer support, and I must say, with all the help they provided me, I learned SOOOOO MUCH about pinball 'under the hood' from fixing some of the things that needed work on my WOZ. It's a solidly built game, and I haven't had a single problem with it now, for almost 1000 games. They stand behind their products and that's why I am a repeat customer who recently purchased a DILE.

(Pimp77) you always down vote any post I make regarding being mindful of purchasing a older WOZ . But you never are specific or explain why you down vote. I have done my research on everything WOZ . I am just posting what I have learned and why I personally want an updated 2.0 WOZ . Older WOZ machine can not even run the new 6.5 code. It causes lockup my friend owns a 2013 and he has to run an older version of code . Will we ever get to install a lockup-free version of WoZ 6.xx on the original run machines that have problems with the newer Linux kernel introduced in all 6.xx versions (5.xx and below were fine)? .

There's not a lot of concrete information out there, but I *think* it's not ALL the ECLE's, but only the earliest WoZ machines from the first year or so have the lockup issue with the new Linux kernel used in 6.xx and above. It would be nice to get the root cause figured out so everyone with a WoZ can move to 6.xx trouble-free, but JJP doesn't seem motivated to get it fixed. I've asked many times as our routed WoZ is stuck on 5.05 until there's a solution.

I know 3 people with ECLE WOZs (4 counting myself) and none of us have light board issues. All of us are running the latest code with no lockups or issues. The only issue I’ve had with the game is a bad LED strip under the wizard head and that was a 5 minute replacement. The downvote means I disagree with your statement to avoid the “early” games. Later run ECLEWOZs are solid. There were many RRWOZs made before mine in fact. I know because it pissed me off at the time. JJP had issues with their direct print cabinet maker that delayed a big chunk of ECLEs, so they cranked out Ruby Reds instead. In any case, maybe the REALLY early ones have some issues (Bader pfs, lower rez monitors, light boards, apparently issues loading the latest rev software(?), etc) but not that many I’d venture to guess. How early is your game?

I had an extensive conversation with Butch (the electrical engineer) and he said nothing of the sort. Perhaps you misinterpreted why Frank was telling you to buy the 2.0. Look at it from his perspective: (1) He's got a customer calling saying that he doesn't like working on games. (2) He's got a customer calling saying that his tech skills are limited. Answer: buy a game that's under warranty... buy a game NIB from us. He told you exactly what you wanted to hear.

This notion that all non-2.0 games are tainted ticking time bombs is wrong... and for anyone that encounters any issues, JJP has plenty of chips on hand to repair boards.

That all goes without saying that you won't buy a brand new WOZ (or any game for that matter) only to run into tech issues. There's a guy local to me that bought a newer run RR and he's running into some tech issues. It's pinball. You're going to run into problems!

I've played it a good bit in the wild and, honestly, it's one of my favorite pins to post up on. I'd love to pick one up one day.

I am in the market for a WoZ and am talking to a guy with a ECLE right now. What is a fair price on a ECLE w and w/o the 7.5 buffered boards?

Maybe I should talk to Butch about the very real lockup problems with early run WoZ ECLE machines and any flavor of 6.xx software that JJP doesn't seem interested in fixing or even trying to narrow down.

I think you should. Email Jack, he'll put you in touch with him. The guy is very personable.

I talked to Jack about it at PAGG in May. No movement since then in figuring out why it's happening only to a relatively small segment of machines (as far as I can tell), all of which are ECLE machines. I will ask for Bruce, though. I've been up for being a guinea pig to figure this out since the first upgrade to 6.04 (?) locked up, and for every 6.xx revision after that did the same thing. I personally know of 4 owners with this issue, none of which were told to downgrade to 5.05 to fix it - they thought their machine had gone bad, not the software.

Send me a PM and I’ll give you Butch’s email