There's one more Wizard Blocks


By Compy

1 year ago


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There are 285 posts in topic. You are on page 5 of 6.
#201 5 months ago

I wonder how many of us would need to be on board before PPS would greenlight this project?

#202 5 months ago

For a full P2K, cabinet and all? At least 500, if not more. They'll use MMR as their guide for numbers and interest levels, as well as parts and production costs. There are parts in a P2K that are not only not made anymore, but are so outdated getting those parts made would be ridiculous. In particular, the CRT would have to be changed to an LCD, hardly any of which are 4:3 anymore. Then there's the designing and programming of the graphics, which is usually fairly expensive. For such a specialized/more of a novelty game as WB is, I just don't see Rick spending the money upfront on what would most likely be a gamble for him.

With MMR, he knew he'd be able to sell a crap-ton and make money in the long run due to the title's popularity and long standing legend as being one of the best pins ever made. Lots of people have made great memories around a MM. People who now have money later in life and are willing to buy a brand new one to relive them. Or, pinheads that have always wanted an MM but were always priced out of the market due to the game's rarity. Plus, there were plenty of operators who bought one to put on route. I don't see that same breadth of market viability with WB. Sure there might be as many as 100 that would want a full fleshed-out WB, but the preproduction costs alone, just to even complete the game, wouldn't make it worthwhile from a business standpoint.

Nevermind the fact that you'll inevitably have a number of people that look at it and say, "Oh that's just a copy of Dialed In. Meh." Sad but true.

The best situation is to do it somewhat like was done with the Buffy the Vampire Slayer pin. While they only made three(for the three guys who built it, did the code, and the graphics), what they did can be used as a model. Develop a whole kit for a changeover. It's what the P2K system was designed for anyway, right? Then, negotiate a number that can be made under a temporary, but open-ended license from Rick and PPS. I say "open-ended" because if you do 100 and sell out quickly, you want to have the option in 2-3 years time to make another run of 50 or more. A kit would be what: a fully populated playfield, software, and artwork? Seems quite doable to me.

CPR might be a better option than CGC for playfields since it seems they're better set up for shorter runs. Also because CGC might not do runs under a certain number. Then, once you find a source for making those WB-specific parts(like the spinning flasher), most of the other stuff is pretty straight-forward B/W pinball parts inventory. In truth, I don't know what all the costs might add up to, but given everything that'd need to be done, I can see the kit costing from about $3000 to $4000.

TL;DR:

It'd be amazing to see it happen, but I don't think it's feasible. I'd love to be wrong, though!

#203 5 months ago

I was imagining a kit for those of us which already have Pin2K machines. Probably not feasible either without wholesale hardware replacement.

#204 5 months ago
Quoted from alveolus:

I was imagining a kit for those of which already have Pin2K machines. Probably not feasible either without wholesale hardware replacement.

A kit would be the most economically viable thing, but you'd have to do a full-on computer replacement in order to support the new software. While I love designing software in challenging environments, the MediaGX, 2D graphics, DCS2-ROM, 74mb of ROM and 256mb of RAM might be a stretch.

The number of units sold would have to be up there I imagine. We've had the conversation on the phone before quite briefly, but neither of us were interested in looking much into it at the time. My goal here is just a one-off. If at some point in the future someone wants to reproduce the game, I might be the logical choice to discuss software with, but other people can surely do a better job.

#205 5 months ago
Quoted from Miguel351:

Nevermind the fact that you'll inevitably have a number of people that look at it and say, "Oh that's just a copy of Dialed In. Meh." Sad but true.

Having played neither game, I don't know for sure. But I've heard that Dialed In was at least somewhat based on Wizard Blocks.

I sure as hell wouldn't say "meh" to either game!

#206 5 months ago
Quoted from Miguel351:

Nevermind the fact that you'll inevitably have a number of people that look at it and say, "Oh that's just a copy of Dialed In. Meh." Sad but true.

I slightly disagree with this. To me, the only commonality to Wizard Blocks that Dialed In has is the "X" pattern of inserts. I'd love to hear other commonalities that you've observed though!

#207 5 months ago

I was thinking this afternoon a fun project would be to make a new P2K cabinet design. Something that is built specifically for todays flat panel monitors.

#208 5 months ago

While it is not very sexy, the sheetmetal module of CAD programs is very important. You design in 3D and then switch to the flat pattern for the version that gets sent to the waterjet.

14
#209 5 months ago

Minor progress update:

» YouTube video

I've got all the lamps, motors and playfield switches wired in. Now its time to wire up the coils and then transition onto the cabinet switches. We should be flipping the game soon!

#210 5 months ago

Hi was wondering if this might make it to SFGE this year? Couldn't make it last year but looks like we will make it this year.

#211 5 months ago

Looking good!

#212 5 months ago

Can't wait to see this at TPF! Really looking great.

#213 5 months ago

OMG i wish you were coming to Pinfest. Im so jealous of those that get to see this in person!!!

#214 5 months ago
Quoted from Compy:

I slightly disagree with this. To me, the only commonality to Wizard Blocks that Dialed In has is the "X" pattern of inserts. I'd love to hear other commonalities that you've observed though!

I'm just making a comment about those that are seriously shortsighted and quick to judge that will only look at something for 3 seconds, and judge it as if they know the whole storyline of the game and they've played it for an hour or so. They are the same types of people who saw Dialed In and called it a cell phone game. The "cell phone" takes up about 4 sq/in of the playfield…..there's TONS more to the game, but in their head(and on this forum) it's a cell phone game and they don't want it. There are more than a few of those types on Pinside and tons of them out in the wild.

Just to be clear, too, I'm not just here in this thread to bring negativity, I've been following this build since you started this thread. I absolutely love what you're doing and your ingenuity for recreating what the game was supposed to have. I also really like the idea that when you're done with it, you'll truly have something special. There's not a lot of us out there that can do the work you're doing and can say that they have a 1-of-3 game, essentially. Keep up the great work!

#215 5 months ago

In all fairness, the JJP presentation did focused a lot on the phone and the version of software they had on had the phone nearly constantly ringing so it's no wonder that impression was out there. Regardless, probably buying it once I've had a chance to play... they hype is really building for it, even after people have had hands on which says a lot.

I agree though, can't judge by looks alone. Considering nobody out there has yet to play this incarnation of Wizard Blocks its just silly to say its anything like DI.

I just hope I get an opportunity to play it someday and totally thankful that 86 is bringing it to life.

#216 5 months ago
Quoted from merccat:

I just hope I get an opportunity to play it someday and totally thankful that 86 is bringing it to life

me too!

#217 5 months ago
Quoted from Miguel351:

I'm just making a comment about those that are seriously shortsighted and quick to judge that will only look at something for 3 seconds, and judge it as if they know the whole storyline of the game and they've played it for an hour or so. They are the same types of people who saw Dialed In and called it a cell phone game. The "cell phone" takes up about 4 sq/in of the playfield…..there's TONS more to the game, but in their head(and on this forum) it's a cell phone game and they don't want it. There are more than a few of those types on Pinside and tons of them out in the wild.
Just to be clear, too, I'm not just here in this thread to bring negativity, I've been following this build since you started this thread. I absolutely love what you're doing and your ingenuity for recreating what the game was supposed to have. I also really like the idea that when you're done with it, you'll truly have something special. There's not a lot of us out there that can do the work you're doing and can say that they have a 1-of-3 game, essentially. Keep up the great work!

Oh, please note that I never took anything you said as you coming in here just wanting to be negative. I was genuinely curious Sure, I suppose someone that glances at the game might say that, oh, the insert pattern is the same, they must be the same game. I suppose they'd say the same thing about games with a fan layout. I appreciate the kind words and insight! I always love talking about this, so feel free to keep things like this coming

Quoted from merccat:

I just hope I get an opportunity to play it someday and totally thankful that 86 is bringing it to life.

Well, it has been a slow process over the last 3.5 years working on this project off and on. However, I'm also glad that its really starting to look like a pinball machine, and I look forward to others being able to play it at shows like TPF. It really IS the greatest pinball 2000 layout that WMS would have come up with since it focuses on pinball shots more than the video.

#218 5 months ago

Minor update:

The awesome Scott Danesi sent in a PCB he designed for filtering the high power line for the coils on the game. This makes sure that we don't take too much of a dip with all 4 flippers and such going off. Its backed by a Mean Well SE-600-48.

» YouTube video

So far the board seems to be great! I was also sure to tape all the caps together to prevent excessive vibration from cracking the solder joints on the leads due to the tremendous weight. Thanks Scott!

Also, testing out the coordination between the spinning flashers and lamp shows on the playfield.
» YouTube video

#219 5 months ago

Hey Jimmy
Really enjoy the updates! Brilliant work. Wish that I would be able to see it at TPF. Can't make it this year.
Wally

#220 5 months ago

one step closer!

#221 5 months ago

Jesus those spinning lamps are LOUD.

#222 5 months ago
Quoted from jwilson:

Jesus those spinning lamps are LOUD.

Indeed they are. Probably comparable to the TZ clock in terms of loudness.

Quoted from wallybgood:

Hey Jimmy
Really enjoy the updates! Brilliant work. Wish that I would be able to see it at TPF. Can't make it this year.
Wally

Thank you so much Wally. Thats a true compliment coming from you. Too bad you won't be at TPF, but I can't wait to catch you at the next show! Keep up YOUR awesome work.

Quoted from lurch:

one step closer!

... and a jillion more to go!

14
#223 5 months ago

Saturday night update:

We've got some moving ramp assemblies now! Had to test a new servo linkage-based design rather than the traditional dual coil/pivot crank arm assemblies used to raise/lower ramps. So far so good, just have to re-align things to prevent mechanical binding during the upward movement.

» YouTube video

#224 5 months ago

Lovin' the updates, so exciting!

#225 5 months ago

Beautiful playfield/lights/etc! Definitely Lawlor, with those under-ramp trap doors

#226 5 months ago

Can't wait to see LCD graphics with that nasty play field working together!!!!

#227 5 months ago

Wow, great work on the drop ramps! Such an interesting design and looking more interesting at each video segment. Artwork and lighting look so professional and those ramps look laser cut. Amazing.

#228 4 months ago

Very cool...thank you for the video!

1 week later
#229 4 months ago

Did you made some progress in software developing?

Want to see the evil wizard in game: » YouTube video

1 week later
#230 4 months ago

Hey guys,

Minor weekend update here. Been working on some of the lower level code. The game is finally back into the cabinet and is flipping. The game is pretty much mechanically complete with the minor exception of working out some ball hangups.

» YouTube video

Now to spend the next few days getting the graphics portion talking to some of the mechanical code I've got in place. I will see if I can bribe my wife to take some video of me flipping the game. For a Lawlor game, this one is FAST! The loop action you can get off the upper left flipper is very very Ritchie-esque.

More coming! Ask any questions you like!

#231 4 months ago

This is currently the greatest thread on Pinside!!

#232 4 months ago
Quoted from thedarkknight77:

This is currently the greatest thread on Pinside!!

Hahah, I'm glad someone thinks so

#233 4 months ago

So pissed I won't be in Texas to play this. Really the main reason I wanted to go

#234 4 months ago

Screw mmr afmr mbr... this should be done.. retro game that was never made but brand new for us to buy... pipe dream down the road I know... keep it coming, love this thread

#235 4 months ago

Brief flipping from the players perspective:

» YouTube video

#236 4 months ago

I WANT YOUR TALENT!! dude, this is so cool! please come to Expo this fall!!

#237 4 months ago
Quoted from seshpilot:

I WANT YOUR TALENT!! dude, this is so cool! please come to Expo this fall!!

Oh this has only taken me about four years (With a couple one year hiatuses somewhere in there). I was at expo in October. Not sure if I'll be back as it was fairly underwhelming. If I am, I will be sure to wear a name tag! I plan to be at TPF this week, so if you happen to be there, reach out and say hello!

#238 4 months ago

Looking great! Can't wait to see this this week at TPF

#239 4 months ago

Compy,
Remind me at TPF to bring you some of the Translucent Pop Bodies for when you tear down PF after TPF. I think they'd look bitchin instead of the white bases you have. Let me know which color you want?

#240 4 months ago

Hi Jimmy,

your first shots look great! I need those beacon flasher too it makes a hughe difference instead normal flashers.

I wonder how you start your multiball. Don't you have the auto combi shooter?

#241 4 months ago
Quoted from Wizboy:

Hi Jimmy,
your first shots look great! I need those beacon flasher too it makes a hughe difference instead normal flashers.
I wonder how you start your multiball. Don't you have the auto combi shooter?

Thanks man! Well, what I might do if I were in your situation is control a relay that energizes 3.3 or 5VDC to supply to a microprocessor that turns on a series of servo motors that spin the flashers, then shunt the relay using the high power output drive with the appropriate regulator. The mounting points are all standardized and there's tons of code out there to handle the processing aspects. Otherwise, you could skip the microprocessor and use some lower voltage DC motors.

The multiball starts by holding the balls in two physical ball locks under the ramps. A third ball is then auto plunged onto the playfield from the trough using the combo shooter/autoplunger. It works really really well.

Quoted from Zitt:

Compy,
Remind me at TPF to bring you some of the Translucent Pop Bodies for when you tear down PF after TPF. I think they'd look bitchin instead of the white bases you have. Let me know which color you want?

Hey Zitt, I think those would look wild! I never knew you had them. Would also do wonders for light distribution back there.

#242 4 months ago

I really love this project Compy!! Its a huge mountain to tackle. I see two areas you may or may not wish to address. The rotating beacons seem to have some light bleed-over through the translucent top area and it seems to wash out the rotating effect some. On the the original WB the beacon tops appear to be dark and the light pattern is a bit more prominent. Also the beacons at the top of the playfield on the original rotate in opposite direction of the lower beacons. Just an observation...not sure how close to the original you desire to duplicate. Great job and cant wait to see more progress

#243 4 months ago
Quoted from Compy:

Hey Zitt, I think those would look wild! I never knew you had them. Would also do wonders for light distribution back there.

New product I imported from Germany this month. I've only had them instock for a couple of weeks.
Let me know if you think of a specific color.

#244 4 months ago

Great work! Looking forward to seeing your progress.

Chris

#245 4 months ago

Jimmy, are you bringing this to SFGE this year or not? We miss you in GA and well, just that! Hope to see you, and the game too (but if you bring yourself, that'll be cool enough). It's all looking fantastic by the way.

mark

#246 4 months ago
Quoted from Zitt:

New product I imported from Germany this month. I've only had them instock for a couple of weeks.
Let me know if you think of a specific color.

I'm torn between purple and clear. I think they'd both look good.

Quoted from rgb635:

I really love this project Compy!! Its a huge mountain to tackle. I see two areas you may or may not wish to address. The rotating beacons seem to have some light bleed-over through the translucent top area and it seems to wash out the rotating effect some. On the the original WB the beacon tops appear to be dark and the light pattern is a bit more prominent. Also the beacons at the top of the playfield on the original rotate in opposite direction of the lower beacons. Just an observation...not sure how close to the original you desire to duplicate. Great job and cant wait to see more progress

Thanks for the feedback! It is greatly appreciated. You are correct about the light bleed, the slots in the shadow boxes are too wide in the ones I'm currently using. I can also add about 1/8" of height to the shadow box to cut the top bleed down. I can probably fix this in a couple weeks pretty easily.

Regarding the rotational direction, I'll make sure to tweak that in code! Great catch.

I am trying to recreate the original vision for the game for the most part, but I will not hesitate to make changes that I feel are in the best interests of the game or development cycle.

Quoted from shimoda:

Jimmy, are you bringing this to SFGE this year or not? We miss you in GA and well, just that! Hope to see you, and the game too (but if you bring yourself, that'll be cool enough). It's all looking fantastic by the way.
mark

Thanks Mark! That means a lot I miss the people out there, but I must say that Austin is a much better tech city. No plans just yet to be at SFGE, let alone with the game. If that changes, you'll be among the first to know! You guys always put on a great show out there, and I really miss it.

Quoted from SilverUnicorn:

Great work! Looking forward to seeing your progress.
Chris

Thank you! Stay tuned here for updates! Its been a really fun project so far.

#247 4 months ago

Did the game make it to Texas show?

#248 4 months ago

Thanks for the thread. Amazing work I hope to see this someday. Will this ever make it to pin a go go or California extreme?

#249 4 months ago
Quoted from lllvjr:

Did the game make it to Texas show?

Yep;

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