(Topic ID: 43909)

Theatre of Magic Club

By Nilroc

11 years ago


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You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider dumbass.
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#890 8 years ago
Quoted from jsa:

He really wants to make one for the trap door and trunk as well. Unfortunately, he hasn't had access to a playfield to model the cliffy off of! If you can take an accurate scan with a portable scanner, he's said that might be enough to get started. I was planning on doing this myself as soon as I tear down my playfield for playfield restoration, but I'm having too much fun playing the game to take the risk on my first teardown! If someone else wants to step up here, let me know.

I just finished a complete tear down and rebuild (re-assembled about 3 months ago). The playfield was clear coated. It was touched up, repaired and scanned at the time. The trap door area was not perfect but in good condition. The trunk was pretty much perfect. I don't have the scan but I can easily get it from the person who scanned it. I'm not sure about how scale and measurements factor into this. Should I just contact Cliffy directly?

tom_pf_(resized).jpgtom_pf_(resized).jpg

2 months later
#958 7 years ago

Ingo is out there. He does not have a lot of boards at the moment. He will soon receive an order of more boards to start fulfilling orders. I was looking for boards as well. The last contact I had was 15 days ago. Be patient. I'm sure he's not like a lot of people here who constantly refresh their browser.

5 months later
#1378 7 years ago
Quoted from nickbuol:

I have always wondered what the below connector was intended for. It hasn't been connected since I got my TOM back in 1998.
Everything seems to work, but it is just odd that everything wouldn't have a place to plug in.

That looks like the connector for J604. It connects power to the DMD display board from the DMD controller board. I'm going to assume you either have a color DMD or a low voltage DMD display. I don't think you would see any display dots otherwise.

#1382 7 years ago
Quoted from Robl45:

they always seemed to be working.

It's the flashers in the backbox (insert flashlamps). Page 3-27 of the manual.

1 month later
#1499 7 years ago
Quoted from FlippyD:

The game should just have a call out for when "You didn't have the magic!"

Have you ever had Tales of the Arabian Nights fail to trap a ball in the shooting stars?

If I recall she says "A thousand pardons" or something like that. The game then proceeds to return the ball to you.

1 month later
#1627 7 years ago
Quoted from nickbuol:

Yes it is. I don't know if off the top of my head, but you should be able to search for parts for TOM and they will show up on one of the pages of parts that they carry.

http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/24-8805
http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=1226

1 month later
#1755 7 years ago
Quoted from jsa:

Also, I find it really interesting that the targets that sit on either side of the center ramp have no decals/stickers on them. I always wondered if they came that way.

Those "target armor" decals are definitely NOT factory. Most games don't have them. Only a very few that I know of. A large percentage of people seem to like them (and modify their machines by putting them on). I'm much more of a stock look person so I don't like them.

#1758 7 years ago
Quoted from jsa:

I've seen MANY ToMs with green LEDs beneath the Melpomene and Thalia masks by the jets (tragedy and comedy faces).
It was curious to me, because clearly they are yellow inserts, so why do people make them green?
Then it occurred to me, perhaps the original incandescents were colored (or had colored plastic on them), and now we've lost record of that original coloring.

I purchased (restored then sold) a TOM from a container. It was clear that the lighting was not modified. Those two inserts above the jet bumper area were green condom covered regular bulbs. Just like the bulb in the trunk.

2 weeks later
#1787 6 years ago
Quoted from forensicd:

Does anyone know the exact number for the part number of the magnet

Page #2 of the manual (the PDF) or page #3-5 of the manual.

Part number is 20-10179.

3 months later
#1954 6 years ago

The WPC schematic shows F104 connects to J107-2. F104 is labeled as "LO POWER PULSE" in the schematic but J107-2 corresponds to "High Power" in the tech table.

I don't have Theatre of Magic nearby to verify but I've learned to trust manuals and documentation but not trust them 100%. The definitive answer is in the wiring on your actual machine.

2 weeks later
#2001 6 years ago
Quoted from Damien:

Would anyone be able to tell me the correct positioning for each wire on the 11 pin JI21 connector, or point me in the right direction. Can't seem to find it in the manual.
Thanks so much!

Page 3-27 of the manual. Page 149/158 if you're looking at the PDF available online.

#2017 6 years ago
Quoted from Damien:

Quick question... I'm replacing the coil that raises and lowers the pin in the subway. The manual calls for AE27-1200, but the one in my machine is a AN26-1200 with a diode on it.
Can anyone comment on this. Wondering what the correct coil is, and if it needs the diode.
Thanks

Quoted from Damien:

I'd greatly appreciate if you can send a pic. If you can also get the lugs in the photo so I can see the wire orientation, that would be awesome.

You should use AE27-1200 lke the manual says. You don't need a diode. Remove it from the coil lugs. This will prevent you from mis-wiring the coil. Without the diode it does not matter what the wire orientation is.

3 years later
#3294 2 years ago
Quoted from AAAV8R:

So…………it looks like C30 or BR5 the likely suspects?

Yes. BR5 is the bridge rectifier for the unregulated 12V circuit.

Quoted from AAAV8R:

I’m going to take a stab at repairing this board, but if I can’t git r done I’m going to have to turn to professional help (which is pretty much anyone other than myself).

If you want to tackle the repair yourself the safest thing to do is to cut the old component out. BR5 is raised off the board so you should be able to get a cutting tool and cut each leg. Cut the leg as close as possible to the body so that you can grab each of the legs that will still be attached to the board. Heat up the pad and use needle nose pliers to extract the legs. Then clean out the hole. If you don't have a hand solder sucker or a vacuum solder sucker than heat the solder and quickly "shake" the board. The solder will come out of the hole. If it isn't clean put some fresh solder in the hole and repeat. Try not to expose the pad to too much heat for a long period of time.

Avoid replacing C30 unless you have evidence that it needs to be replaced. The risk of removing the through hole with the radial snap-in capacitor is not zero. Once you have the bridge rectifier replaced then re-test the DC voltage to see if it returns to the expected level. Also measure the AC voltage to see what the AC ripple is. If you have non-zero AC ripple then consider replacing C30. If the AC ripple is zero I would leave it alone. An exception to this is if the capacitor shows physical signs of failure (such as a bulging top). "If it ain't broke don't fix it".

If you choose to repair the board then ...

Quoted from pinballinreno:

I would send them to Chris Hibler.

Repair is almost always cheaper than replace.

5 months later
#3413 2 years ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Get all 3 replacments from the Australians, they are really the best:
https://www.tanglestech.com/TPP-1023

Quoted from Robl45:

They out of stock.

https://www.tanglestech.com/TPP-1039

3 months later
#3540 2 years ago
Quoted from EStroh:

Resets on a WPC system are EXTREMELY common and a well-known issue. Most will tell you that the right way to fix this is to replace the caps so you get good 5V power. However you are right, you can install a Kahr daughterboard and it will fix the condition. I've done this on at least a half dozen machines.

A differing opinion to some of these statements.

  • WPC resets are common and well known.
  • In my experience the most common cause is the header and connector. Re-seat the connector to see if that changes the situation. If the problem goes away (potentially for a while before coming back) then you have header and connector problem. You may still have an electrical problem on your power board but until you replace the header and connector that conclusion is not definitive. The one way to make a definitive conclusion is to measure the DC voltage and AC ripple. Ideally under load. If you don't measure then you don't know.
  • The daughter board will NOT fix the condition. It will simply shift your power draw to a different location. Eventually that location may fail and now you will have two failure points. This board masks the problem. It does not fix it.

Anyone is welcome to disagree with the above opinions (especially coming from a "DumbAss").

2 months later
#3587 1 year ago
Quoted from Frogroar:

I took a look at connectors J120 and J121 on the power board. I have the impression that doesn't look right, but that's pretty much how far my technical experience with pinball machines goes. Anybody noticing anything odd?

Your image has been annotated.

gi.jpggi.jpg

Where does that wire go?

Quoted from Frogroar:

So that did it, everything seemed to work until I noticed that GI string 5 was off. I tried switching fuses F106 (GI string 5) and F107 (GI string 4), which resulted in the two strings being off... I have new fuses coming in next week, but I don't think that's the problem now.

GI String 5 is the VIO/WHT-VIO wires. Nothing looks out of the ordinary that I can see in the image. The VIO/WHT-VIO string also supplies the coin door at J119 and is not easily visible in your images. Be sure to check J115 (transformer secondary) or you can post an image of that connector and wires.

1 week later
#3593 1 year ago
Quoted from RobbyIRL5:

Trunk magnet not grabbing all of a sudden. Other than checking the connectors and possible a fuse, any thoughts to get me started?

Two things MUST be working for this feature:

  • The eddy sensor must register the ball. Use T1 (switch edges) to verify.
  • The magnet must have power and a (software) controlled path to ground. Use T4 (solenoid test) to verify. Make sure the coin door is closed.
#3595 1 year ago
Quoted from Frogroar:

The black wire is part of a "duo of wires" sticked together. The first one goes to 4 (additional?) GI lamps on the left side right above the flipper... which is actually GI string 4 territory, right? I'm starting to think that this might be the problem... although I have no idea how this technically conflicts with the flashers in the backboard and GI string 5 being off.

Can't see where those red and black wires originate and where they go to. You will need to follow them from where they travel under the playfield from the sling. Without detailed images (from multiple angles) I can't follow their path.

Quoted from Frogroar:

The other one goes to... well, I honestly don't know what that thing is. Grounding perhaps?

I would disconnect the ring connector from the ground screw and isolate it. That is not factory. One side of the GI is grounded but it is grounded at J115 not J120 or J121.

Quoted from Frogroar:

I also made pictures of J119 and J115. Can you see anything strange on them?

These look fine. Nothing obviously wrong with them.

2 months later
#3685 1 year ago
Quoted from Robl45:

Plus I understand NVRAM messes with midnight madness.

NVRAM will not affect Midnight Madness as a feature of Theatre of Magic. This is based on advancing the clock in the game by shooting the right orbit and not related to the RTC (real time clock).

Midnight Madness in any other game is a feature of Dwight Sullivan games. Not all Dwight Sullivan games but a good number of them. This is based on the RTC and interrupts the game being played to enter this special mode.

The RTC is also used by Twilight Zone to display time on the clock while in attract mode as well as record the date/time stamp of things like Rule the Universe in Attack from Mars.

2 months later
#3780 1 year ago
Quoted from nickbuol:

The switches aren't registering being hit for any of them whether physically responsive or in the switch test...

Exclude the problem being on the CPU board by:

  • Disconnect J207 and J209.
  • Enter diagnostic switch edges (T.1).
  • Short (jump) J207-6 to any pin on J209.

If all the switches register correctly in switch edge test then you still have a problem in the playfield wiring. If no switch registers then the problem is on the CPU board. If you are not comfortable with board diagnosis then send the board out for repair. There are several reputable repair technicians that others will be only too happy to recommend.

1 week later
#3796 1 year ago
Quoted from dq13:

Found this lil bugger under my ToM, that sits next to a Pinbot. Not sure how it would have gotten under the machine, or if it even belongs to ToM or Pinbot. Doesn't look familiar. Any ideas?

Could it be a "coin reject" spring? They are short, conical springs.

#3818 1 year ago
Quoted from Goalie:

In single lamp, when I test one lamp, one or two others will light up as well but a bit dimmer. So if I test the first “T” both of the “Special” lights will light up. If I light the middle trunk hit bulb, the Hat Magic will also turn on. It happens with quite a few lights.

Here's three pieces of friendly advice for you when asking for help like this.

  1. Remove all 3rd party add-ons (such as LED OCD and GI OCD) when reporting issues. This eliminates one variable. If the problem goes away when you remove these 3rd party add-ons you know that they are the cause and you should follow up with the manufacturer of the product.
  2. Consult the manual. It contains a lot of very useful information - including the matrix tables.
  3. Use the names (bonus points for using the numbers) of the bulbs in the matrix tables.

Translation of your post:

Quoted from Goalie:

So if I test the first “T” both of the “Special” lights will light up.

When the single lamp test is on "(T)HEATRE" (lamp 11) the "SPECIAL" (lamp 81) is also dimly illuminated.

Quoted from Goalie:

If I light the middle trunk hit bulb, the Hat Magic will also turn on.

When the single lamp test is on "TRUNK HIT 2" (lamp 51) the "HAT MAGIC" (lamp 71) is also dimly illuminated.

You should do this systematically as pinballinreno suggests. Take your time. Consult the table. Look at the numbers.

My opinion:

  • Exclude the OCD boards by removing them. I don't think you have a diode problem.
  • Use incandescent or non-ghosting LED bulbs to exclude LED ghosting as the cause.
  • If you do all that and you still have simultaneously erroneous dimly illuminated bulbs then you have an issue.
  • Exclude the driver board by using a lamp matrix tester.
#3820 1 year ago
Quoted from Goalie:

If i chase the Red Brown wire from j133 on the driver board, i should find a diode at one of the sockets that controls the whole row, or should all the sockets have a diode?

This is from an old WPC-89 manual. It shows how the matrix is wired. You can also look at the top right of the matrix table (that you posted) where it will show how each lamp is wired and where the diode is placed.

wpc89_lamp_matrix_wiring.jpgwpc89_lamp_matrix_wiring.jpg

2 months later
#3928 1 year ago
Quoted from rmf-pinball:

Can someone take a quick picture of their spinner switch wiring?

Quoted from rmf-pinball:

But, would appreciate a picture of how folks have it wired just to double check my wiring.

Perhaps, you could post a picture of what you have? You're asking someone to go to their machine, whip out their phone/camera, take a picture and upload that picture as a post. It's much easier for people to see what you have than for someone to do the previous.

In the time between your first request and your second request, you could have had an answer if you posted an image with your first request.

5 months later
#4132 9 months ago
Quoted from FlippyD:

If they are the original eddy boards than it's a good idea to update them to auto-eddy boards: https://www.tanglestech.com/TPP-1023 Is the only spot that seems to have stock right now.

See https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/dumbass-test-and-reproduction-pcbs/page/27#post-7581890 for a domestic US alternative.

Quoted from FlippyD:

Also if it's the original trunk opto board, this replacement is far better: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/tom-trunk-error-leons-fix-anyone-done-this

See https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/dumbass-test-and-reproduction-pcbs/page/27#post-7634936 for an alternative (but does not include the Leon fix) that uses 5mm (instead of 3mm) slotted optos.

3 months later
#4188 5 months ago
Quoted from AlexRogan84:

What do you think?

The posts above are a DIY solution. There are other DIY solutions posted on this forum. Search and you should be able to find them. Some of them are constructed using relay boards that can be obtained from small merchants (such as eBay or Amazon).

You have (at least) three choices. All of them are based on the same principle of the RC circuit.

  1. The above DIY solutions
  2. A ready-made solution from PMC (https://pinballmods.co/pop-eliminator-v2 or https://pinside.com/pinball/market/shops/1202-pinball-mod-co/08263-the-pop-eliminator-v2-bally-williams - same products)
  3. I also have a solution available. Message if interested

There may be other solutions that you can find that will probably fall into the DIY category.

3 weeks later
#4210 5 months ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Your diode is on the opposite leg from the picture and is likely backwards.

A socket is NOT polarized. There is no such thing as a "right" or "wrong" leg. One tab of the socket connects to the bulb. The other tab connects to the bulb. If the bulb is incandescent then there is a filament of wire that glows when current flows through it. If the bulb is LED and it's a bulb made for a pinball machine then it won't care which direction the current is flowing.

Quoted from gizmo33:

However, if the diode is upside down, I think the LED would not light up.

Make sure the wiring follows the wiring diagram (which is the same for all lamps in the lamp matrix). You are correct that if the diode is functioning correctly but installed "upside down" or "backwards" the lamp will not illuminate.

lamp_matrix_wiring_diagram.jpglamp_matrix_wiring_diagram.jpg

#4213 5 months ago
Quoted from gizmo33:

Based on everything I've read here, I'm only left with three possibilities:

You have something that is not factory in that image you provided. Since it is not factory, I would start there. The other obvious thing to ask is, was it always like this or did you change something recently?

Quoted from gizmo33:

Besides, I have an unplugged outlet nearby (6 pins), but it seems to me that it's normal, can you confirm?

That looks like a bunch of red wires only. Not really relevant. I think that's factory. It looks it.

#4215 5 months ago
Quoted from tlon:

I shopped my ToM and added several mods last year - I’ve been running into a small issue ever since: during gameplay I will get an extra ball added into launch position.

Statement: it was working properly before you "shopped" your machine but after the work, it is no longer working properly.

Quoted from tlon:

Also, perhaps related, perhaps not, occasionally I will get a situation where hitting the posts on either side of the middle ramp (the ones with the masks) will cause the midnight clock to advance. I’m not aware of any game state the causes the midnight clock to advance by hitting the posts.

They are called stand-up or stationary targets not posts. Posts are usually metal and covered with a (usually) rubber (but can be something else) sleeve.

Quoted from tlon:

Any gurus out there have suggestions?

I am not a guru but I have some suggestions. There are a few forum members with "guru" in their name. You should consult them if you want a guru. See https://pinside.com/pinball/search?q=guru#pinsiders for search results.

Based on the initial statement (it was working before you "shopped" your machine but is no longer working after you "shopped" your machine), you should go back over the work that you performed on the machine since it seems likely that you caused the problem. What wiring did you change? Did you not put something back where it was when you disconnected it or it broke off?

FWIW: I think the stand-up targets are reversed (left is where right should be and right is where left should be). I think the decals should match the artwork at the back (where the mirror is). Electrically, it shouldn't matter since they are both the same SW#82 (Center Ramp Targets).

The other thing to do is to run the switch edge (T.1) test, verify that the correct switches register and there is only one switch that registers with a single switch closure.

#4220 4 months ago
Quoted from tlon:

I rewired the trunk back to factory - it had been "customized" sometime in the past with field repairs.

Double and triple check this work is correct. If it was working before you touched things and you do a change like this then this is highly suspicious. This is not directed at you, personally, but most people don't suspect their own work. I have no clue why because when something goes wrong, the first thing I suspect is the work that I did. Particularly when it was working before I changed something.

Quoted from tlon:

I will check through this for sure - given it is intermittent, I wish I could find a way to trigger the error consistently. In addition to the strange behavior where these stationary targets increment the midnight clock, I occasionally get an extra ball added to the launcher - I suspect these two these two things are related.

<facetious>Instead of marveling at the bizarre behavior</facetious>, put the game in test mode. First use switch edges and hit the stand-up targets. See what switches register. Then make a note of the active switches by using switch levels. This can help you narrow down switches that may be potentially wired incorrectly. Remember: if you touched it in your "shopping of the machine" - no matter insignificant you may think what you did was - it should be suspected.

It is unrelated to your issue but I went to look at someone's IJ quite some time ago. There was no report of bizarre behavior but when I did a final play test before leaving I noticed some interesting behavior (multiple "phantom" switch closures) with the PoA. It only happened in multiball. What I eventually found was that someone (definitely not me since I didn't touch that switch) had wired the shooter lane (yes, the shooter lane - completely unrelated) incorrectly. Always suspect any work recently done if it was working before you touched it.

If you don't know how to interpret the switch edge and switch levels tests then make a video and post it. Be sure to show the display in the video since seeing the response is important.

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