The area you highlighted would be a deal-killer for me. The moire/digital look
(for my taste) stands out like a sore thumb on a piece of artwork that isn't supposed to look mass produced.

Having worked in advertising and being familiar with print production, I'm really finnecky about these things and others might not be bothered or even notice.

Seems like for a grand investment and the work of a playfield swap, its reasonable to expect perfection.

I wonder what a playfield "restoration" would cost. Then it will still be an original playfield (color and mid-tones good), but fixed and cleared...

Would stink to have the thing out of commission for so long, and it was a lot just to tear into things that I did when I got the brass pieces re-plated (after waiting about 3.5-4 months). All of the notes, labeling, pictures, and videos still seemed to always have some piece that wasn't clear as to where it went.

I was avoiding the playfield restore in the past as I thought that being able to pull from one playfield, and within a reasonable amount of time reinstall on to the new one, that it would be a lot of work, but easier to recall everything. Now I am not sure that I would be happy with a $1000 flawed, but clean and slick, playfield.

Ugh.

UPDATE: As for the "purple" it looks like that coloration was what was called the "Sun Process" back when the TOM playfields were first made.

I snagged a couple of photos from HSA, so all credit goes to them. http://www.hsapinball.com/HSA_PINBALL/hsa072914tomdiff.html

Left is the Sun Process one, and the right is the TAG (Thomas A Grant) version. Both were licensed to make them for Williams/Bally so both are correct.

So now it comes down to that darn moire.

thumb2 (resized).jpg

thumb (resized).jpg

I'll be honest... I don't think you should do the playfield swap. I think you should either restore yours or have yours professionally restored. You could do a water slide decal over the A... I know we had this discussion before, getting a good scan was challenging. It's not insurmountable, though!

Yeah, I am leaning more and more that way. The funny thing is that I have the correct (recommended by other pinball restorers that use them) decal paper. Completely unopened pack of it. I was going to set up many different sheets of the "A" with ever so slightly different shades of blue, yellow, and orange/red color since I wouldn't know which one would match until Kinko's got them done, but like you said, I just can't seem to get a good, clean scan of the "A" from someone. I have some photos, and I have a scan from one person, but it isn't clear and the small dots that make up the image are all blurred together.

Does anyone know what a place like HSA would charge? I know, I should just email them.

After spending way too much time on researching this yesterday, the general consensus over the years is that the Sun Process playfields (like the reproduction is based off of) aren't as good as the TAG ones (marked TAG right next to the part number on the playfield's lower left corner where it is bare wood). The colors overall on the machine aren't "as nice" and the printed text isn't "as clear" as on the TAG version. Not my words, thus the reason I put them in quotes.

That actually doesn't bother me as much as the bad moire gradient right in the middle of the playfield. The dots should go evenly from big to small to give the idea that it is a "fade" effect. Moire is when things get a bit out of sync, for one of many reasons, and the dots get "clustered" looking, so instead of being an even blend of dots, there are little clumps of them that make almost a checkered effect out of the dots. That is the part that screams at me more than the purple. Even the less desirable Sun Process playfields didn't have this issue.

Again, might not be a huge issue for some people, but for $1000 it should be correct. If that big of a flaw (which was on the films that they used) was there from the start and made it to production, then what other, smaller issues are there that haven't been noticed yet?

Yup. I think that for me, and the time and hassle to do the swap (plus the cabinet restoration I just completed, and getting everything else in tip top shape), it would have to be around $500 to consider it at this point. That certainly won't happen as there is more in time/labor to produce the reproduction than that.

verses $2500 for a true clearcoted NOS thats not even perfect, just a TAG standard? If you could even get one.

Hearing that some of the repros are crap is disturbing....
My hope is that the new Mirco repros are of good quality, and that Mirco can get hold of a NOS TAG to copy.

I know they are capable, look at the JJP playfields they are gorgeous.

I would buy a couple.

Yeah, my comments are no slam on Mirco's quality of work, just that he has a "flawed" (moire issue) Sun Process version that isn't what most people want. I would have probably gone with it anyway if it didn't have the moire happening, but like you said, maybe he can get a TAG version now that I told him about the differences (it was actually kind of odd that he is making these things and had no idea that there were 2 versions, and that what he had for films was the less desirable one). a Mirco TAG repro without moire issues would be ideal.

Installed the GI OCD board in my TOM from HERG. Really like the idea of having the dimming effect back in the game with the LEDs! The board was very easy to install and the software is just as easy to load and use! Also, thanks to DREWBLOOD for the input on what LEDs to use (Comets).

Does anyone here have the trifecta of GIOCD, LEDOCD and Pinduino installed? Was the system able to handle all three boards?

meSz (or should we call you Pleepleus? lol)
Do you have info you could share about your LED conversion? ...Supplier, how many of each type, etc. I would like to convert my ToM to LED.
Thank you!

meSz Theatre of Magic

I have this combo in my Iron Man with zero issues. Have the same in my TOM (minus the pinduino) and it's fantastic... not sure why it wouldn't work but I'd reach out to lyonsden just to confirm!

Wondering if anybody else has experienced this trunk malfunction?
When I power up the machine, the trunk spins so the solid side of the trunk is facing the flippers. Then, when the start button is pushed, it spins again and stops with the trunk opening facing the flippers. It remains here throughout game play and never shows the magnet side.
Any ideas?
Thanks!

#theatre-of-magic

How does the trunk work in test?
Do all of the optos register and does the trunk rotate properly?

Also is the trunk disabled in the service menu?

Does the trunk eddy sensor see the ball in test? Or does the eddy board need adjustment?

No problem at all as I went off of what Drewblood419 did! He provided me with what he did to his! The only thing I did differently was I replace one of the 1SMDT10NWFT with a SLOW BLINKer in the upper most left socket. This is the LED that is behind the BALLY logo. I like that the BALLY logo flashed but would be better to have a FLEX LED as the light is a little low!

Anyhow, below is the order info I used for the backbox and a screenshot that DREWBLOOD419 provided so you can see where each were placed!

Capture (resized).PNG
ToM LEDs (resized).png

Thank you, meSz!! Did you replace the playfield lights?
pinballinreno THANK YOU! Adjusting the eddy did the trick!!

You're welcome!

I have since, replaced all of the eddy boards with automatic ones from pin-bits.
they are continuously out of stock on these:

http://www.pinbits.com/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&zenid=29b45755d2506d22524f8cdbf5e612b4&keyword=theatre+eddy

But you might contact them and get a replacements for all three.

Or maybe someone here on pinside has a spare trunk one they want to sell if it takes too long to get back in stock.

I think the new boards respond faster and you will never have to adjust one again.

FlippyD I've certainly had the OCD boards plus many other mods (including two RPi's pulling 5v, long story) for long periods. I haven't had a problem. That being said, your power driver board needs to be in good shape and many are marginal (as if there are problems on the 5v side it can cause resets).

If you're nervous, earlier in this topic I explained what I did to move some of that stuff off the board and into an external power supply. It's been working flawlessly, so it's an option if you are concerned.

I have all three installed on my TOM (over a year now) and I have had 0 issues....and the game looks amazing!

pinballinreno Great idea, I didn't know that part existed! Thanks again!

Gearing up to sell mine soon. How much extra should I tack on for the tiger saw mod, cointaker kit, NOS trunk and a clean flawless game?

Actually I have had LED in the pf for along time now! One of the main reason for purchasing the GI OCD board from HERG! I just matched the color of the inserts but I did this, as stated, a long time ago so I am now toying with the idea of buying new ones! I originally purchased the Cointaker LEDs and they just aren't the best looking ones!

Hello all- pretty new to pinball ownership. Got a TOM last week with a known magnet issue. Scanned this board a lot but didn't see my exact trunk problem.
Everything on the machine works perfectly except the trunk magnet won't turn on for multiball. Trunk turns around/triggers properly but the ball just rolls back down. I saw people with a fuse issue but my haunted basement works fine.
Replaced the magnet but no help.
Ideas?

Thanks!
Mike

Start simple. With a multimeter, check for DC voltage at the connector to the magnet when it should be energized.

Marc

I wonder if there's a schematic of the pf that shows which led's (type/color) go where?
I have some samples but, there must be 15 different types of led.

These are a must with this game. the stock eddy boards constantly need to be recalibrated. Ordered the opto trunk board from german pinball - ingo, hoping it will help with the occasional issue where the trunk stops functioning all the sudden in game. He said he is out of stock but he ordered another 100 so he should have them soon.

I've only done Led's on 4 games now and TOM was the biggest pain in the ass. Everytime we thought we were almost done we found another 10. I got all my LED's from either coin taker or pinball life. Don't know why I got so many yellow and oranges, The only time I've ever used those is if the insert is really small or if it's an area I don't really want lit very bright. It kind of resembles regular incandescent bulbs as far as brightness. Finally got the GI and LED OCD for my TOM, just to lazy to install right now.

got mine back

did a quick stream on twitch to test

16422913_1203172973130798_8591167742047384590_o (resized).jpg

Gorgeousness

It's a rgb slow fade color changer bulb it just happened to be cyan when I snapped the picture lol

Looks amazing NeilMcRae I really like the color dot matrix display which, I have never seen. Can you tell me about it?

ColorDMD.com

I've got one too, and it really goes well with a TOM that has LEDs.

I would go LEDs first (if you haven't already) and then a ColorDMD. The brighter and more vibrant colors of the LEDs make the ColorDMD really look like a great match.

Thanks nickbuol LED's are high on my list to do very soon.
However, I see lots of different brands, colors and types of LED's, is there a source that most people like? ...or a good guide? And, is the LED OCD add-on board a requirement?

I know, lots of newbie questions!
Thanks!

Anyone looking to sell and leave the club that has a real nice condition machine, please let me know and shoot me a PM.

Thanks

A number of people order from Comet. I got a kit from PinballBulbs.com under a Black Friday sale in 2015. Love it and the extras that you get.

MajorHavoc LED OCD is not really necessary on ToM but the G.I. OCD is if you are going to install LED's in order to keep the G.I. Dimming effect functioning properly and as intended by the designer. LEDs consume a lot less power than incandescent. therefore in relation to the dimming effect the G.I. is supposed to go progressively darker with incandescent bulbs installed all the way down to full off visually but they maintain a small amount of current to keep the filament warmed up but with LEDs installed that smallest amount of current is enough to keep the LED lit and causes it to flicker. With the G.I. OCD you can adjust the ramp curve of the LED and finish with a true zero in the programming so you will actually have the effect work as intended and go darker step by step instead of the strobing/flickering it really is quite a significant difference. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions about it I've had mine installed on my Tom for a long time and understand it pretty well

Drewblood419 is spot on. After many (many) times of people trying to describe to me what the G.I. OCD was actually doing (because I didn't notice a difference), a video was posted in here somewhat recently showing a side by side and the dimming. It is pretty distinct as to what is "missing" without the G.I. OCD.

That being said, I have a Pinduino installed on my TOM and it really masks the dimming flicker that happens without the G.I. OCD, so I may still skip adding it. It IS there still (the flicker) but just very much not very noticeable unless looking for it. Maybe someday if I have $150 burning a hole in my pocket, but the bang-to-buck ratio is a lot less now that I have the Pinduino.

Thanks Drewblood419 Does the G.I. OCD come pre-programmed? If not, how difficult is programming? And, what's the install like? Any soldering?
As far as LED's, I see pinballBulbs.com has one LED with different domes "depending on the look you want". Seems to be a "one size fits all" which, usually doesn't. And, they have about 6 different kits for ToM. Any thoughts on these kits?

Comet seems to just sell the LED's bulk. Is there a list somewhere of the different color/brightness/dome/etc and where they go on the machine? I can imagine getting a giant bag full of a dozen different types of LED's and I'll surely put them in the wrong places! lol
Thanks again for the help!

I went with the "Ultimate" kit from PinballBulbs. It was, again, a Black Friday special which made it really affordable. They include actual flashers (for the playfield, they explain why they don't for the backbox, but I put them in anyway), frosted domes, unfrosted, flexi, plus some LED strips. One for the top of the playfield, and one for where the ball goes down into the trough at the bottom. They really help to brighten up the darker spots of the playfield. It also includes spotlights which work wonders for the main center part of the playfield (the M-A-G-I-C and T-H-E-A-T-R-E parts, basically everything in the middle of the game which ends up pretty dark if you don't have lights on in your room). MIne also happened to come with an LED strip for the Theatre Entrance Ramp. All of this stuff adds up if you bought it all separately even from other places. They through in some extra bulbs too, and you really do get a massively complete LED kit with the Ultimate.

If you don't want the LED strips or spotlights, then you are at about $190. You would buy the Inserts Kit, GI Kit, Backbox Kit, and Flashers Kit. Basically the 4 cheaper kits. Then you could add the "extras" kit later, but it will cost you $120 and you would then basically have the Ultimate (for $40 more than if you just bought the Ultimate kit from the start).

So yeah, they have 6 kits. 4 of those are what I would consider "normal" and just cover different parts of the playfield or backbox (so that you could build as you go if you wanted) then there is the above mentioned "Extras" kit with the LED strips and spotlights, and if you bought all 5 of those kits you have what amounts to the 6th kit which is the Ultimate. Not too complicated actually.

If you wanted to do it a bit at a time, get the Inserts first, then the Backbox, then the GI, then the extras, and then the flashers. The flashers are about the least impactful when installed vs. regular incandescent bulbs. Again, these kits include flexi-LEDs where needed, frosted domes where needed, ones without domes (or clear domes), etc. It is really quite complete and well thought out and NOT super purple like their photo suggests.

Or buy from comet and piece together your own stuff.

Thanks nickbuol and Robl45 good info. Sounds like the kit is the way for me. Do they provide some sort of map that shows where each type of LED goes?

It does come pre-programed BUT you can install the software onto a laptop (very easy to do) and go in and program the brightness you want! No soldering involved. All you do is take the board and install it on the inside of the back cabinet on the left side (3-4 screws). Then you take the connectors that go to the lamp board and plug them into the GIOCD. Obviously the plugs go in a certain way and you hook up to power but again its east and HERG provides instructions!

You'll want to use a laptop for two reasons. First, it allows you to adjust the brightness for each level the machine wants for the GI. You set the lowest level to the lowest level of brightness without flicker. Then do the same for the brightest. You can test each string individually, and determine what looks best, send and save the settings, and you're golden.

Just a piece of advice, I bought a long USB extension cord so I could back up somewhat away from the machine to do the testing.

With ToM you will have to program the GIOCD. The stock set up won't work right. Fortunately you will only have to change 2 things. First the factory settings on the GIOCD is set to utilize 3 GI strings ToM uses 5 GI strings so change the setting in the software to 5 or else those missing strings will not dim at all and look really strange lol. It took me a minute to figure that out initially. Also you want to set the lowest number of dimming curve to zero not 1. Zero will be the full off you are looking to achieve anything above zero with LEDs will remain lit (small amount of power required for LEDs s to light) so for the effect to work right set that to 0 and the rest of the curve will set itself hope this helps feel free to PM with questions I don't mind to walk anyone through the setup if needed

With the kit, yes, without the kit, you would need to get a "map" from someone else or go through with a copy of a regular bulb map (to try to account for all of the bulbs) and pick what color and style you want for that location as you mark it off of the list. Just be aware that some people have different tastes and some of their own layouts for LEDs make their TOM turn into what has been called "Fruity Pebbles" (all sorts of pockets or crazy different colors around the playfield)... Some like it, most don't.

FYI I just did a quick search and 10 days ago was a post about their current codes that are available for people...
"Use code 'pinside' on our website http://www.pinballbulbs.com and you won't have to pay full price! or '15off' to get an additional 15% off your order. "
(The 'pinside' codes gets 10% off, the '15off' code has some minimum purchase the is some number more than even the ultimate kit. So use 'pinside' and the big kit goes from $269.99 down to $242.99.)

There may be other codes, this is just from a quick search of recent posts here at Pinside. Coment may have something too.