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(Topic ID: 46753)

Theatre of Magic: add extra post to avoid breaking post near trunk


By nosro

7 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 24 posts
  • 14 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by Skarv
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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#1 7 years ago

UPDATE: POSSIBLY BAD IDEA. READ THREAD.

I have noticed a few people say that the post to the right of the trunk breaks often due to a ball getting wedged between the post and the trunk as it is rotating. Certainly, my machine exhibited that problem: the post was pushed out, stripping the playfield threads in the process.

This modification adds an extra post to help prevent a ball from lodging between the trunk and the existing post. This mod is reversible.

First: fix the post. This post ( http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=1435 ) is a bolted version to replace the wood screw version that originally came with the machine. Drill through the playfield and bolt this on:

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Second: add another post. Take out this bolt, which screws into a tee nut on the playfield:

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Replace the bolt with an 8-32 1.5" bolt and screw it through the tee nut all the way through the top of the playfield, creating an extra playfield post:

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#2 7 years ago

Dress up with your choice of rubbers to conceal the screw threads. Perhaps someone can find a better dress-up than the multiple rings that I used. I was not able to find a sleeve that was sufficiently slim.

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#3 7 years ago

This extra post fills in a gap that exists between the existing post and the trunk when the trunk is rotated 45 degrees from a normal position.

#4 7 years ago

I'd say a few sleeves of heat-shrink tubing would look better to cover the threads.

#5 7 years ago

...there is no post at that location from the factory, as it helps any loose balls "drain" from that right side of the trunk. Else a jam occurs (ball-trunk) and *strips* out you gear train in the motor or shaft collar. Jpop

#6 7 years ago

Jpop - thanks for sharing your knowledge/wisdom! (at one point, I thought I should add a post to that spot as well - you've confirmed what I thought I had heard before).

#7 7 years ago

Hmm... Interesting. I added this to mine too and haven't had that problem yet. Before the post was there, I'd have balls get stuck in between the trunk and the ramp every once in a while. The ball locate feature that the game does is never successful in freeing the ball. Better off leaving the post off and just pulling the glass if one gets stuck? Stripping the gear train isn't sounding good...

#8 7 years ago

...trust me we went thru dozens of ideas with those posts.....all arrangements...when it jams you RUN to turn off the games main rocker switch....Jpop

#9 7 years ago
Quoted from jpop:

...there is no post at that location from the factory, as it helps any loose balls "drain" from that right side of the trunk. Else a jam occurs (ball-trunk) and *strips* out you gear train in the motor or shaft collar. Jpop

How does the ball typically get stuck at that location in the first place? Is it that the ball is near the trunk while the trunk is rotating counter-clockwise (when viewed from top)?

If so, I can see this mod being a bad idea.

However, this mod would seem to help if the trunk were rotating clockwise.

#10 7 years ago
Quoted from jpop:

...trust me we went thru dozens of ideas with those posts.....all arrangements...when it jams you RUN to turn off the games main rocker switch....Jpop

Is this an argument for removing the existing post to the right of the trunk? The ball could get stuck behind the stand-up, but at least parts would not break.

#11 7 years ago

...trust me we went thru dozens of ideas with those posts.....all arrangements...when it jams you RUN to turn off the games main rocker switch....Jpop

What about a metal piece at a slight angle behind the target attached with a round headed screw in the post hole?
I have removed the rubber from that post on my game and the program seems to clear the trap.

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#12 7 years ago

sounds like a job for cliffy to solve fo everyone

#13 7 years ago
Quoted from zerbam:

sounds like a job for cliffy to solve fo everyone

That is what I was thinking, I have been looking at that ramp protector and may make one that wraps behind the target and anchors to the existing post hole.

#14 7 years ago

The ball only gets stuck there when the trunk is rotating and is ~45 degrees off normal position, so a ball shot there will get stuck as the trunk rotates back to square position - at that point, it can't escape as it is stuck between the trunk and the ramp.

#15 7 years ago

What about a metal piece at a slight angle behind the target attached with a round headed screw in the post hole?...

Can you sketch or better describe what you mean?

Although this gave me an idea - what about putting a rubber ring around the existing post and this "mod" post? (Red line could be a proposed rubber ring.)

I guess I'm still having trouble visualizing how a ball gets stuck with a double-post.

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#16 7 years ago

Good info.

#17 7 years ago

Is this an argument for removing the existing post to the right of the trunk? The ball could get stuck behind the stand-up, but at least parts would not break.

Jpop is right.
I just purchased a TOM that had that mod done on it.
During gameplay the ball got caught behind that pin mod and the trunk bent the pin.
Do yourself a favor and leave it be!

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#18 7 years ago
Quoted from nosro:

Can you sketch or better describe what you mean?

I will go up to the shop and see if I have the material to make a proto, I will post a pic later if I do.

#19 7 years ago

So far this works good and now there is clearance so it eliminates the post trap.
Between ramp and trunk the program takes care of that.
Brings the ball down to the left flip and changes the play by the trunk a little.

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#20 7 years ago

I am very familiar with this. Adding that second post into the T-nut is a bad idea, if the ball gets wedged there it can strip out the gears. I have found the T-nut is mainly responsible for the ball getting trapped there. It sort of has the golf T effect, if the ball is rolling around slow in that area it can stop on top of the T nut. I have found that a piece of foam tape works well. I mean the thick stuff that's used as a beer seal under the lockdown bar. I cut a small piece and adhered it to the side of that ramp. It does a few things, it acts as a spacer so the ball no longer sits on top of where the T nut is, and the ball doesn't get stuck there any more. IF the ball did happen to get stuck there for any reason (which it never did for me again) when the trunk rotates to clear it, at least the foam prevents the gearbox from stripping.

6 months later
#21 7 years ago

I know this thread is a little old, but I saw this service bulletin and thought I would post it. It looks related.
http://www.planetarypinball.com/mm5/Williams/tech/sb82.html

#22 7 years ago

Great info. Been looking for a solution to this since I got the game.

1 year later
#23 5 years ago

I have had this problem for years. The T-nut was teeing up the ball, so I tried to adjust the screw length with washers to eliminate the divot. I think foam is the right fix. The ball only goes there when the trunk is turning. The foam keeps it high enough so when it goes into ball seach it is released and stays out of that dead zone.

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3 months later
#24 5 years ago

Hello... brief introduction. I'm troubleshooting a TOM that I just bought and rebuilt. Back in the hobby after about a 4 year hiatus... caused by a TZ that just created bad karma. Definitely a machine from the Twilight Zone.

Anyway, This TOM had so many issues as I bought it from someone that way way oversold it. I mean "Excellent condition" meant PF worn through to the wood in some spots... and hardware flaking rust off. Looked like it was very nice when they put it in their basement, and then let the moisture do its thing. Everything rusted, and then they decided to play it... which ground the crud into the PF. Enough sob story, the guy adjusted the price quite quickly when I complained. He was lucky it was someone the liked the rebuilding process as I didn't hammer him since I was willing and able to fix. But someone who had to pay a tech would have found the thing worth less than zero.

Anyway... onto the post. This area was thrashed so I had to touch up the pf and rebuild it with some epoxy anyway so I decided to countersink the T nut... deep. And then inlay a dime under the clear. When I finish sanded the whole thing, that area is smooth, and the balls just roll out effortlessly. If they do get caught in that very rare case, the clear cycle kicks them out almost immediately.

And I thought the coin fit with the theme of coin tricks and card tricks etc. Certainly better than a T nut.

Just another tack

Ps. if you do this, you have to be very careful to find a short bolt to mount your trunk from the underside, or you will just push the dime out through the surface of your new clear.

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