Several west coast shows were left out.
Is this Twipy thing an east coast club?

Lets not turn this into a Tupac v Biggie fight.

Every coast was allowed to pre-vote. The TWIPY committee did not vote on who should be in the list. If west coast shows were left off, then they simply did not receive as many votes from the community.

So... I have heard it said the Jeff does not want the Twipys to be something that will discourage podcasters from podcasting. Is there a plan in place this year for how they will silence or remove People that want to Heckle or Boo Award winners as they are accepting their award?

The system is don't vote for boo-worthy "winners." I can only think of one.

That's where the TWERPys come in, but they took a year off.

The system is vote for whoever is on the ballet. If people boo, then so be it. Others have the right to boo the booer.

However, I don't think anyone should be booing at a pinball award show - and I would hope that language would be what one would expect at a public event with a mixed age audience.

Thanks Zach! However I think you totally misunderstood what I was saying. If I was standing in front of you and we discussed this rather than talking over a forum you'd probably go oh I see what you're saying. In no way am I saying if people who donate their time are worthless unless they do something 110% correctly or the way I want it to be... no that isn't what I'm saying. But here is what I'm saying, it seems from listening to you, Kaneda, and others this awards means something. I think the award means something first and foremost to the people doing podcasts, please don't tell me you don't want to win it! LOL.

Anyway the point I was making was or is that someone said its all volunteer and I'm saying that doesn't have anything to do with it. Just because its volunteer doesn't mean you don't try and do something better. I'm not saying anything bad I think its great they did all this free, awesome, but that doesn't change wanting to make the show better right? That doesn't change wanting the awards to mean more to the people who win them right? You want this to really be the oscars of pinball so companies will work harder to win them. I personally think its AWESOME these people work for free I'm not saying thats bad because its great! I just want to use the award to make pinball companies work harder and want to win them. If these awards mean something, in other words if as its been described the oscars of pinball, then lets get the categories right every year to represent and promote pinball for today and into the future. If awards and more specifically this award means you've accomplished something, that's a good thing if it makes ANY pinball company work harder the following year, push the limits to promote pinball. Correct?

I'm not in anyway diminishing people's effort. A person, company, group whatever can and will go to extraordinary lengths to win an award. If that is the case everyone benefits because they did something that benefits all! Having categories that no one can honestly judge doesn't promote pinball! If you disagree explain!

There are probably 1000 plus places that have pinballs, hundreds who have leagues, and they're regional around the world. No way anyone can vote on that. That's like saying vote on the best Walmart location in America... how would I know do you honestly want me to visit ever Walmart to determine that? Someone just posted why isn't Gallop Ghost on the list. I visited that place pretty cool.

If you're saying you agreed, I didn't read that anywhere in your post. Your whole post started with something like I confuse you or something. So somehow I missed that point and I did read it. Again that is the problem with message boards.

Sorry in advance if that is what you're saying.

it is all opinion folks no one is right or wrong, but little disappointed some stuff did not get voted to be on the list. Most folks did not even know about the early vote.

I would BET that is Not what he would be thinking or saying lol. Just having fun Dr.... lol

I'll bet he would 110% he does... I'll do his podcast or meet with him in person. If he doesn't agree with my point, I'll donate $500 to project pinball!

How does that sound?

I think you and Zach are missing my broader point, an award show should really inspire the industry to do BETTER! To make an excuse and say well because they're all do this for free doesn't matter. I think its great they're putting in their time and effort keep it going!!! But lets make this really work to push people to greatness. Awards should be given for things that make the industry/hobby better, that everyone can actually vote on because they have experienced it.

Pirates from JJP was going for greatness, not sure why that never won game of the year because its game of the lifetime!!!! I doubt anyone will ever attempt something like that again! Too expensive. But why not demand it! If we as an industry are going to pay $9 10 or 15k for pinball game shouldn't we push the envelope and give awards to those who do?

The people who buy games should have a lot more influence over this industry we do by making these awards really matter. Who was the best pinball company this past decade? What company pushed every single door open to make a pinball game? I saw the voting on another thread... Wizard and Pirates from JJP are #1 and #2.

Stern you want that award then do something special! JJP you want that award again, go further than before ever before!

Deep Root don't just be a corporate raider, buying talent, do something so special we're crawling all over ourselves to hand you the award of all awards.

I'm saying take this very serious and make these awards mean something to everyone who puts their foot in the sand... volunteer or not!

But I guess to Zach that is a bad thing I don't know! LOL

It actually shows real class not to boo any winner. Personally I think its classless to boo a winner. Someone wins because the majority not the minority voted for the winner.

I'm sure you're speaking of Kaneda, people take these podcasts way to serious. They don't influence ANYTHING! Clearly Kaneda doesn't like Stranger Things, I personally think Stranger Things is a disaster. But the next guy loves the game. Kaneda blasted JJP Pirates into the ground for months, I totally disagree with him and the proof is in the pudding. I like Kaneda personally I think he's an awesome person if you get to know him personally. However his opinion of Willy Wonka or POTC didn't influence me... I bought and own both! He can buy a Rick and Morty good for him, I can buy a Stranger Things LE if I want even though I think the game sucks. Did I buy one ... GULP! Yeah I did why? I have this haunted house and at the exit I have this massive game room gift store, and its filled with horror themed games. I think the game SUCKS... however 99% of people who play pinball don't care they just hit the balls. They will love it because they love the show. Do I think I will lose my ass on a Stranger Things LE if I decide to sell it to a fellow pinsider... YES! I think I will lose at least $2000 but here is the deal I AM NOT GOING TO SELL IT! I bought Munsters LE I hate the game, but it looks amazing some of the best art yet. I DON'T CARE if I lose money, I didn't buy it for that reason. The people who struggle to pay their bills shouldn't buy a Stranger Things LE because you will lose money! Just my opinion! The point is people do things for different reasons.

A Pirates game just sold the other day for $14,000.00 I think that is the only proof you need that Kaneda was DEAD WRONG about that game. The game is the best pinball game ever created, if not Wizard of Oz. No one has ever put so much effort into those two games. Wizard of Oz isn't ranked the number 1 game on pinside, and yet its by far the most collected game in history. Don't tell me Adams Family, that is a different time. WOZ was made when no one was buying pinball. People buy it they never sell it! Downvotes don't matter, upvotes don't matter, Kaneda opinion doesn't matter, Zach's podcast doesn't matter, twippy doesn't matter... there is only one thing that matters a checkbook! The rest of this stuff is for entertainment or information. The final decision rests in your checkbook.

Do you write a check or not!

Do you like something or not. Its your money, your time, your opinion nothing else matters. You live to make yourself happy, those around you, your family and friends. I buy something because I like it or need it! I bought a Dodge Challenger Redeye because I liked it, the guys who buy Vetts they like Vetts. Its okay!

And as I've heard around here many times... ITS JUST PINBALL CALM DOWN! LOL

Never saw pre-vote.
Didn't know that was a thing this year.

With this reasoning is why I disagree with you! Because you can't Buy a game your vote or opinion shouldn't matter? I do agree JJPPOTC is an Incredible game but as less then a thousand were made how can you Possibly expect it to earn the prestige or accolades as Best game ever if Few have/will even have the opportunity to play it? If truly a GOAT it would be competing with numbers like AF and rightfully Earn that title. For now its sadly just a game a few that got lucky finding one can enjoy. My vote (as many) goes to the titles that reached out to the Masses in homes and routes that all could enjoy by the hour or one quarter at a time. That would be the Peoples vote in my opinion.

Gotta love avatars. When I see bright green and a wall of text I can just keep scrolling.

I fully plan to boo Dennis if he wins for "Best Podcaster that Zach Wants to Make Into a Tiny Little Clone". That category is totally rigged.

List some ideas here so we can discuss how they would enhance and increase objectivity of the TWIPYs. We work diligently to improve upon them every year.

Look he said he wants to be on the show so have him guest please. I'll watch that one cover to cover!

I have to agree with you. Nobody In this hobby deserves to be berated in front of their pers. Choosing to Boo somebody that has won fair and square in a dark room Because you are somewhat anonymous is a low class cowardly move. Why not talk to them face to face in the hall afterwards in person if you feel you need to make your point. That way you also are not causing an interruption to the show that the volunteers have worked hard to present.

what is the deal with Deadflip being eliminate form some categories?

Sounds like there were ample write in votes but they were not allowed?

e.g. youtube content

I just happened to luckily see it one Saturday morning while I was drinking coffee and then never saw it again. 1000 votes is really not that much for something like this. That is a very small percentage of folks who are in the hobby. I can say without a doubt you did not advertise the pre-vote well enough. It stayed buried in all the other topics. I will be completely honest, the twipys have had a slimy feeling to it since the beginning.

For the love of God NOOOOO

If you know how statistics and sample sizes work, it's more than enough.

Ouch. That statement alone compromises all of the hard work by Lloyd Olsen, Steve Bowden, Joel Reeves, William Oetting, Jeff Patterson, Greg Bone, and myself. That’s one hell of a rational, thoughtful, and objective group that I will always back.

I’m a perceptive guy. Your use of the word ‘slimy’ is likely based on my, at times, loud and boisterous idea of entertainment. Albeit unwarranted, put that on me. Not on those guys.

We will continue working passionately on this project as we did last year, and as will do for years to come in the name of your enjoyment. There’s plenty of truly slimy things in the community/industry we should focus on. This isn’t one of them.

Always open to ideas and discussion. Thank you to all of the TWIPY supporters that are as excited as we are for TPF 2020!

See we would disagree here. It doesn't matter how many are sold to vote on something as best ever or best of a decade. Everyone on this site visits places that have pinball to play. Some people on this site don't own a single game, but have played them all. I have a friend who's one of the best players in the World he doesn't own anything. You play the games to decide and everyone who votes will vote for the games they played. There is a lot of people who want to own a POTC but can't afford it, or just can't find one for sale. That doesn't mean they can't vote on that game? Lastly, you can't compare Adams Family back when pinball went into every single bowling or skating rink to today. That is a different era.

In pinball its a totally mixed bag some of the highest priced games are the rarest right, while others like Adams Family are totally not rare.

Circus Voltaire. POTC, Cactus Canyon, TBL, Aliens, Big Bang Bar, and others and others are worth the most right... doesn't mean people haven't played them.

Even a SUPER RARE game like Krull was played. I heard that game is worth 40k or something. It was at Chicago so people can technically vote on it because they played it.

Even we're going to talk about what game is the most successful from the point of view of sales... well you have modern and 90's and back. You'd have to get Stern to release sales numbers which they would never do so that is out of the question.

Zach,

Can you explain a bit better what you mean. Again this is the problem with forums people can take things totally different than typed. Because I again want to tell you THANK YOU for helping put something like that together. I'm only wanting to see these awards push everyone in the industry to achieve greatness which in that case all win!

But I am honestly not sure exactly what you mean when you say 'list some ideas'.

What specifically?

BTW I think you guys have more passion for pinball than anyone and its shows. So all the respect however just because two people don't exactly agree doesn't mean its a cheap shot. Hopefully you can differentiate.

BTW I'll pay $500 to project pinball if you go on Kaneda show as a guest. That would be interesting and some real entertainment! I'd grab the popcorn to listen to that show! Just because you two come from a different perspective doesn't mean you can agree to disagree. I love Kaneda but I do NOT agree with everything he says and I've told him that. I like him because he talks honest and shares his own opinion even if I don't agree with it I respect it.

^^ This guy needs to stop. The best thing about the twipy award this year. Was they emailed me the results of my votes. So when time comes I can view who I voted for. And what category. I won't remember by the time the award show come around.

The slimy analogy was not directed at anyone. The first couple years it felt like the selections and winners where in your tight nit group. I did not feel it was a good representation of the entire pinball community but based more on your followers. I am not referring to ALL the categories, but many.

I actually do, studied it in college and some real world experience. A good sample size is 10% of the entire pinball community. So, lets say there are 100,000 pinball machine owners and hobbyist in the world (which there are probably more) that would be 10,000 sample size. They got 1000, so they are way off.

The advertising for the pre-vote just did not reach enough people.

Zach, just for reference to you and the others, I am not a player, not much of a collector, and really try not to spend a whole lot of time in the hobby. I don't watch any streams, and only listen to podcasts now and again anymore, and even I knew about, and participated in, the early voting. So I am pretty sure you made it known well enough.

There is nothing "slimy" about this process, you guys do a great job putting something together that a lot of people forget is mainly a personal project that doesn't make you anything. You have free run to do with the TWIPY awards as you see fit. others are welcome to do their own awards shows if they want, and let's see how far they get without everyone second-guessing your intentions. It's kind of like the new restaurant we went to last Saturday night....the building had sat vacant for years, and everyone agreed it was a great place for a restaurant, but no one was stepping up. A local guy finally bit the bullet and opened a beautiful restaurant, and is doing a great business....however, he told us he was thinking about changing his name to "you know what you ought to do?", because that was how everyone that walked in the door was greeting him. If they had all of the answers to a successful location, they should have opened one up themselves.

I was at the awards show last year, and I thought it was great. I don't know if I will be there this year, but I am sure it will be even more fun. I understand listening to valid suggestions on how to make the show better, but don't buy into the trolling from people that want to criticize. Consumers will dictate what they want to see, so just keep doing what you do....it's all in fun, it's all for free, and it's only pinball for gods' sake.

That's weird that you would think that.

exactly, it was not directed at Zach or anyone. It was about some particular categories and winners the first couple years.

Go back to school. No pollster on earth gets 10% of the population he's trying to represent.

1k is the average sample size in a national political poll of ~200 million registered voters. I think it'll do for pinball.

LOL, and the national political polls have been dead on in recent years???? Haha!! I now see why the national political polls have all been wrong.

sorry but if your using political/union poll methods you will never get a accurate measure, just ask Hillary Clinton.

Relax, it's only pinball.

A thousand is plenty for an opinion poll. The rule of thumb is you want at least 100 respondents, you want 10% of the population up to about 1,000 respondents, and after that it doesn't really help much to go higher. Some discussion of why this is for the curious:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/howcan-a-poll-of-only-100/
http://www.tools4dev.org/resources/how-to-choose-a-sample-size/

But ultimately it really isn't applicable to this scenario. Those sort of sample opinion polls all rely on the respondents being a randomized pool. TWIPY write-ins aren't randomized; the respondents are self-selecting. The write-in phase wasn't a statistically designed opinion poll, it was a voting process by the engaged and willing. If we somehow randomly sampled pinheads and got 1,000 to respond I think you'd see a very different list of options for some of the categories (for obvious reasons: people could campaign to get write-ins under this voting model whereas that would be impossible if the respondents had all been selected randomly to participate), but that's not how voting works.

I agree with Dennis - voting sucks!

There are lots of better ways in my opinion of highlighting and honouring folks in the pinball community without resorting to a "winner takes all" award format. For most of the categories that cannot be properly represented in a voting format due to being heavily location dependent such as leagues, locations, etc. this format doesn't really work at all.

But I get that this is for entertainment and I suppose it is fun to watch it all unfold. Just think the format for a lot of the categories should move to a "recognition" of many vs. a single award and awareness for a few.

I think it's fun to be even listed. Hopefully some more people found out about some great homebrew games through the voting options.

If you are a TWIP reader, chances are you saw the nominations form (that's how I saw it). And since these are the TWIPYS, it makes sense that it's a poll of TWIP readers and not the entire pinball hobby. Some of you might be taking this too seriously?

No Colorado Pinball Collective in the Best Twitch Stream Category?

Most of my votes went to Wonka and JP2. A few for BK3.

If everybody thinks like me this will be a year where a few winners take almost all.

We will see!

Made me sad as well I love that stream

Zach, you never said. WHat happened with Deadflip being wiped from some categories even through he was top for write in voting (sounds like Youtube content was an example of where that happened)

Wait, who said he was top for write-in voting? Regarding voting, Jeff would be the best to ask, because Greg and I stay out of that as much as we can since we are potential category nominees.

[email protected]

Just like every year.

@twip want to help out on this one

Agreed, my lady friend and I can't believe they weren't on the list. We also completely missed the pre-vote.