I wonder if illuminating the air filter on the air conditioners with UV light might kill any covid that got trapped in the filter?
(Topic ID: 264119)
Roanoke, VA
Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:I wonder if illuminating the air filter on the air conditioners with UV light might kill any covid that got trapped in the filter?
Generally only UVC lamps will do that, and only at the right intensity. Home units typically can't do this. Some also generate ozone which must be ventilated.
Too many variables and not enough data. We need proven products which are safe and widely available. Just not there yet.
For now, ventilate indoor air, filter the room with MERV13 filtration, mask up, and keep things clean. It'll knock down Covid dramatically as well as flu & other respiratory pathogens.
Saskatoon, SK
Quoted from zr11990:I have to ask, do you guys really believe all this shit is necessary that covid is that much of a threat or are you doing all of this to convince other people to come in or so they will let you be open for business.
Yes.
Quoted from zr11990:I have to ask, do you guys really believe all this shit is necessary that covid is that much of a threat or are you doing all of this to convince other people to come in or so they will let you be open for business.
Superspreader events are very real (google it), superspreader events only happen indoors, and the reason they happen indoors is that the air is stale and the virus lingers. So yes, this is more than just show or disinfection kabuki theater. What Lowe’s and Walmart are doing is just for show. But yes to many unfortunately the virus will continue to be a hoax, a non threat, overrated, whatever you want to call it, that is until someone they actually know gets sick and dies from it. Not enough people have died yet to reach that level of recognition that this isn’t a joke.
Quoted from zr11990:I have to ask, do you guys really believe all this shit is necessary that covid is that much of a threat
Yes.
I care about my customers.
LTG : )
Quoted from NicoVolta:Generally only UVC lamps will do that, and only at the right intensity. Home units typically can't do this. Some also generate ozone which must be ventilated.
Too many variables and not enough data. We need proven products which are safe and widely available. Just not there yet.
For now, ventilate indoor air, filter the room with MERV13 filtration, mask up, and keep things clean. It'll knock down Covid dramatically as well as flu & other respiratory pathogens.
50 of these 25 W Mercury Quartz UVC lamps help also, but they are a pain to deal with. If I hadn’t already bought them in order of helpfulness for preventing infection at ones business I think it would go: 1) correct mask wearing 2) bringing in outdoor air 3) filtering indoor air 4) UVC (not the LED kind only mercury quartz and one bulb ain’t gonna do it for the kind of square footage we have - we leave them on for 5 hours each night) 5) surface disinfection (hand sanitizer).
783E1DB3-4CB1-4DB1-964F-11769B7DF069 (resized).jpegQuoted from zr11990:Are you not concerned about the UV causing decals to fade?
Nope. They are going to fade. This is an arcade not a collectors showpiece. You should see what the alcohol disinfection is doing to the area around flipper buttons. I care most about what happens to people coming to visit, if the machines are casualties in some way then that’s fine by me.
Bit Bar Salem is suing MA Govenor Baker for not lifting the COVID ban on arcades. This place is awesome by the way. It has a decent size room of pinball games and the entire restaurant is lined with arcades
Quoted from Murphdom:Bit Bar Salem is suing MA Govenor Baker for not lifting the COVID ban on arcades. This place is awesome by the way. It has a decent size room of pinball games and the entire restaurant is lined with arcades
https://www.gloucestertimes.com/news/local_news/update-bit-bar-sues-baker-over-video-game-ban/article_c626459f-7ae1-5b44-a16d-1cdb51e928aa.html
They should and I hope they win. You can’t shut down businesses which are people’s bread and butter for a virus. Especially one with a 98% recovery rate.
Quoted from zr11990:They should and I hope they win. You can’t shut down businesses which are people’s bread and butter for a virus. Especially one with a 98% recovery rate.
We've already gone over this. Lung transplants are considered "recovered". As are people with long-term lingering conditions, lung scarring, heart damage, etc.
We don't have all of the data on this disease yet.
Broad brush "dead or not dead" statistics are not the kind of assurances most Americans want right now. But hey... we could use this opportunity to detour into the psychology of what makes state lotteries such financial cash cows despite the overwhelmingly negative odds.
Yet, people play by the millions anyway. We freedom-loving, high-hoping Americans just want what we want. Perhaps a bit too much.
Agreed though - I'd like to see more consistency in the way the restrictions have been imposed. We have enough scientific knowledge at this point to certify rooms for minimum levels of airflow and filtration at the very least. Don't shut down businesses which are legitimately keeping people safe and insisting upon mask use.
Quoted from zr11990:Are you not concerned about the UV causing decals to fade?
Lol, someone's asking the *important* questions here. Deadly virus? Ehh, no big deal. Fading decals? Oh, the horror!!!!
Quoted from zr11990:Deleted post
Nothing, not near as bad as covid-19.
Quoted from zr11990:They should and I hope they win. You can’t shut down businesses which are people’s bread and butter for a virus. Especially one with a 98% recovery rate.
Do you want to be that 2%?
Quoted from zr11990:Deleted post
If you use your chimney regularly you should have it cleaned annually.
Quoted from pookycade:Nope. They are going to fade. This is an arcade not a collectors showpiece. You should see what the alcohol disinfection is doing to the area around flipper buttons. I care most about what happens to people coming to visit, if the machines are casualties in some way then that’s fine by me.
Look on the "bright" side, you can always be open at night now as a tanning salon + arcade. 
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:Look on the "bright" side, you can always be open at night now as a tanning salon + arcade.
Dibs on starting a grow house biz
Quoted from Clytor:If you use your chimney regularly you should have it cleaned annually.
*SPIT TAKE*
Quoted from zr11990:They should and I hope they win. You can’t shut down businesses which are people’s bread and butter for a virus. Especially one with a 98% recovery rate.
we have a whole other COVID thread you can go get ejected from.
on the "keeping venues alive" front, House of Targ is offering new swag online:
a brand new t-shirt by local tattoo artist Pat Buck: http://www.houseoftarg.com/targmart/targ-pat-buck-wizard-t
targ shirt (resized).jpg
and a hat http://www.houseoftarg.com/targmart/targ-lids
targ hat (resized).jpg
If you are concerned about air quality, this is a great option. We use it in our arcade and they work great. I think people appreciate it that we are making an extra effort to ensure the air is as clean as we can make it. Is it a full proof way of killing COVID no, but it does give some piece of mind that we are trying to do everything we can to make a safe environment.
Quoted from pins4life33:If you are concerned about air quality, this is a great option. We use it in our arcade and they work great. I think people appreciate it that we are making an extra effort to ensure the air is as clean as we can make it. Is it a full proof way of killing COVID no, but it does give some piece of mind that we are trying to do everything we can to make a safe environment.
https://uvairos.com/index.php/p900-gx-commercial/
Upvoted. Any COVID mitigation efforts should be applauded. I think our customers appreciate it and are recognizing it more.
I did actually look at such units but there still seems to be a lot of controversy about how effective UV light is within either an HVAC system or air purifier. I think the issues were about either 1) whether the air passing thru was exposed to enough UV to kill the virus - it seems like it could be but others said maybe not and 2) whether the UV light could penetrate enough into the HEPA filter to kill captured virus. Then again they did for sure show that it seems to disinfect N95 masks reasonably well. And heck, there is even controversy about how effective it is out in the open as we have done. As in after 15 minutes does it do Anything - hence our 15 minute disinfection breaks.
It is to say that a lot of us just have to try things out since the science on this I will fully state is not as good as it should be. My approach was do everything and hope the combo works. But if you were to ask me what the percentage breakdown each mitigation technique has I haven’t a clue nor does anyone else really.
Thanks for sharing
Quoted from cait001:on the "keeping venues alive" front, House of Targ is offering new swag online:
a brand new t-shirt by local tattoo artist Pat Buck: http://www.houseoftarg.com/targmart/targ-pat-buck-wizard-t
[quoted image]
and a hat http://www.houseoftarg.com/targmart/targ-lids
[quoted image]
Tried to order but looks like it’s Canada only
4” MERV13 filter bungee-corded to a box fan (and seal edges with tape) will do a lot of good for not much $$$.
Can deploy several indoors and still be well under $200.
Quoted from pookycade:Tried to order but looks like it’s Canada only
What you meant to say ....
Tried to order but looks like it’s Canada only, eh?
Adults with Covid-19 about 'twice as likely' to say they have dined at a restaurant, CDC study suggests
https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/10/health/restaurant-dining-covid-19-cdc-study-wellness/index.html
Well interesting, underpowered study but not entirely surprising. I have ventured into several restaurants to get takeout. The site of multiple tables 6 feet apart with lots of people eating inside no mask (obviously) just still seems crazy to me. We came up with this magic 6 foot rule when we thought aerosols of Covid were only in large droplets that only traveled a limited distance. With the better understanding that Covid is in fact in fine particle aerosols that can stay aloft as a cloud, 6 feet is probably just wishful thinking and this finding should not surprise anyone. Combine that with an HVAC system that just recirculates the air and it seems a perfect Covid incubator.
Anyway as to the question of what’s safer 1) an arcade with masks and circulating outdoor air or 2) an indoor restaurant with no masks and recirculated air, I think it’s pretty obvious this early result will likely hold up well in future larger studies.
Do want to add that there is a bit of confirmation bias here. So have to be a little careful to not over interpret. That awful awful study suggesting 250K infections out of Sturgis rally is just complete crap. See more here https://slate.com/technology/2020/09/sturgis-rally-covid19-explosion-paper.html
The study as I said is underpowered, but my suspicion is still that it points to the likely conclusion of much the same when they increase the number of patients included in the study
Quoted from pookycade:HVAC system that just recirculates the air
HVAC systems around here have filters. Those do the same thing a mask is supposed to do- filter out particulate from air that passes through it.
Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:HVAC systems around here have filters. Those do the same thing a mask is supposed to do- filter out particulate from air that passes through it.
Not exactly. Filter system has to be at least H13 to even have a chance at filtering out the virus. (Filters that block smaller particle sizes cause the system to work harder) Thus H13 filters are not used pretty much anywhere else but clean rooms and hospitals. So most HVAC systems do pretty much nothing for filtering out coronavirus. Second, air turnover rate matters. If all you do is keep blowing the same air around while trying to cool it thru condenser coils then it just recirculates the same air in the room and not very quickly. Most HVAC systems have no more than 20% fresh air brought into the system.
I know several places local that would make great Pinball Hideouts.
Rent is cheap, at an intersection.
It would have to be a Rebel Joint, operating on the edge.A smoky throwback to an earlier Era.
Invest in a good Coffee System.
Any Juke Joint back in the day skirted the laws.
The ventilation is key, Kudos to Nick Volta for really bringing it to the forefront with a practical solution.
Quoted from phil-lee:I know several places local that would make great Pinball Hideouts.
Rent is cheap, at an intersection.
It would have to be a Rebel Joint, operating on the edge.A smoky throwback to an earlier Era.
Invest in a good Coffee System.
Any Juke Joint back in the day skirted the laws.
The ventilation is key, Kudos to Nick Volta for really bringing it to the forefront with a practical solution.
in WI is that where they have events with cash pay outs?
Quoted from phil-lee:I know several places local that would make great Pinball Hideouts.
Rent is cheap, at an intersection.
It would have to be a Rebel Joint, operating on the edge.A smoky throwback to an earlier Era.
Invest in a good Coffee System.
Any Juke Joint back in the day skirted the laws.
The ventilation is key, Kudos to Nick Volta for really bringing it to the forefront with a practical solution.
I tell ya if I was in Colorado I would have been strongly tempted to open the arcade anyway, do everything we are doing now to prevent infections, and challenge unintelligent state government decisions to keep places closed. A nice soapbox to clearly demonstrate illogical hypocrisy run amok. Opening a rebel establishment with no masks, no ventilation and alcohol flowing freely is kinda cliche. Opening a rebel establishment that vastly exceeds state standards but isn’t allowed to officially be open, now that’s actually thumbing ones nose at idiotic bureaucracy.
Quoted from pookycade:I tell ya if I was in Colorado I would have been strongly tempted to open the arcade anyway, do everything we are doing now to prevent infections, and challenge unintelligent state government decisions to keep places closed. A nice soapbox to clearly demonstrate illogical hypocrisy run amok. Opening a rebel establishment with no masks, no ventilation and alcohol flowing freely is kinda cliche. Opening a rebel establishment that vastly exceeds state standards but isn’t allowed to officially be open, now that’s actually thumbing ones nose at idiotic bureaucracy.
and then some cop takes your games and later they show up at his house and then the case dropped.
Or the cops want to come in and get free play.
1 week later
Will admit that it won’t be the saddest day for me if these guys don’t make it. Never been a big fan of D+B
Quoted from pookycade:Never been a big fan of D+B
Me neither.
Back when I was getting back into pinball machines and looking for a place to play I was shocked when I looked at their games and seen they had no pins.
I have been to that place once, around 30 years ago. For a friends party.
I was drinking banana daiquiris (I was young and dumb), but I swear they mixed the husks or whatever in the drinks, and later I was very sick.
That one time I was there also ticked me off that little kids were walking in, but they carded me at the door.
I was like what is up with that, 6 year olds are walking in here and you are going to card me?
Yeah, it will not hurt my feelings if that place goes away.
https://www.replaymag.com/laser-quest-closing-down-over-100-arenas-to-shutter/
Another chain bites the dust.
Quoted from JohnnyPinball007:I was drinking banana daiquiris (I was young and dumb), but I swear they mixed the husks or whatever in the drinks, and later I was very sick.
Yeah, it was the banana peels that made you sick.. lol. 
Quoted from JohnnyPinball007:That one time I was there also ticked me off that little kids were walking in, but they carded me at the door.
I was like what is up with that, 6 year olds are walking in here and you are going to card me?
Yeah, it will not hurt my feelings if that place goes away.
Reminds of a time when I was like 17 and some friends and I tried to go to this family pizza place called "Moose Mequire's" where they had a restriction that anyone younger than 18 couldn't in without a parent. So here we are a group of 17 year olds being carded and turned away at the door by a 14-year old dressed in a Canadian Mountie uniform. Humiliating. 
Quoted from pookycade:https://www.restaurantbusinessonline.com/financing/dave-busters-watchers-wonder-if-chain-will-declare-bankruptcy
Will admit that it won’t be the saddest day for me if these guys don’t make it. Never been a big fan of D+B
Yeah, D&B is really not a place for me but I worry more about the coin-op ecosystem. That's a big chain that buys Raw Thrills, I.C.E., Embed, etc products.
Quoted from Clytor:Yeah, D&B is really not a place for me but I worry more about the coin-op ecosystem. That's a big chain that buys Raw Thrills, I.C.E., Embed, etc products.
I remember Josh posting on here once that a day at Raw Thrills with sales to D&B and Chuck E Cheese were a great day for the company.
Update: September is typically a weak month, but it -really- sucked this month. Nevertheless pushing ahead with tourneys and party promos and the usual fixin's.
We are now in the business of selling machines, fixing client-owned machines, rebuilding them, and giving them a warranty. Roanoke Pinball Museum, Repair, and Factory Outlet.
BTW D&B was incredible in the 80's. Waitstaff bar service & ashtrays at each game. This was before the ticket-redemption craze. Was like a VIP room in Vegas.
Hi all just thought I would weigh in on the UV debate. I was the one that supplied bcrage's UV air purifier. UV does kill covid but not all UV units are created equal. You will want to research before you buy one off the shelves of places like costco as there are hundreds of different products out there trying to cash in on the pandemic. We use Sanuvox products as they have a proven track record and have been in the UV business for 25 years.
UVC wavelengths are used to break down viruses and bacteria like Covid-19 the light from the UV lamp will actually break down the DNA strands of the virus causing it to loose its function to replicate in our bodies.
The Lamps we use in our products are in the shape of a J which allows it it increase the time that the air will contact the UV light. Our lamps are also positioned parallel to airflow which will increase the time that the light is making contact with the air.
Other UV manufacturers uses "stick lamps" and will position them perpendicular to the airflow which will greatly reduce the contact time and effectiveness.
Check out our website for more information on the UV process and the different products we offer. The units borage uses at Arkadium are the p900 model which may be ideal for most operators as it provides visibility to the customers. Optics are very important ease peoples apprehension about going into public places.
there is now a gofundme to help save Cabin Fever in Toronto if anyone can spare some cash. I've been there before and it's an incredible place.
just check the sign, who doesn't love PINBALL BEER VINYL???
https://www.gofundme.com/f/save-cabin-fever
EDIT:
there's also this thread https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/save-cabin-fever-save-location-pinball-in-toronto
Thanks Cait! I came in here to post the link but you beat me to it!
Honestly there’s nothing quite like Cabin anywhere else. There’s bigger arcades for sure but the feel and atmosphere of the place is unique. It’s like a home away from home for pinball people.
As everyone knows it has been uniquely difficult for arcade bars and recently the government made it even harder by lowering last call. Cabin is hanging in but they had to return their rental dishwasher this week, that’s how borderline it is.
Anyway, a couple of bucks would go a long way to helping them get through the winter. The owner Robyn would never run a fundraiser for herself but I have no shame and it’s more important that it stay open.
It’s about 1/3rd of the way to the goal so I really think it’s doable.
Reply
Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.
Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!
Donate to PinsideGreat to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!
