Good article thanks for posting. Can't wait to see what Stern's dividers and masks will look like.
(Topic ID: 264119)
Wheaton, IL
Level 1 opening back up May 15!
https://www.facebook.com/level1arcade/photos/a.2325607854424112/2563613250623570/?type=3
Quoted from EJS:I had a similar thought too. Here's another example of where I hope you(we) you are wrong but I fear you might be right (or onto something).
I'm afraid laws could be passed where they (govt level at state, city, county, whatever) try to write off amusement devices all together because they have slowed down as a whole or they don't want to write a clause in while they are drafting something for slot machines. Since properties on reservations for slots have always been an exception thing I assume this will continue to be the case.
I could see something coming from an advocacy group where they try to focus on the use of home systems (PC, PS, XBOX) and promote that use instead. Or a news article saying "roughly 100 years ago pinball games were made illegal in some states....could this happen again in the 2020's?"
I hope all this doesn't come to be but it's good to have this thinking in mind so we can be proactive to help save as many locations as we can because I'm sure itching to get back out there and play some more pinball!
Will this kill the cherry masters in WI?
Quoted from Joe_Blasi:Will this kill the cherry masters in WI?
Time will tell. But I'd say they are at risk right now. I'm not a government or legal or gaming (gambling) expert so all I can do is speculate.
A couple things I could see happening.
Smaller banks of machines like cherry masters or games at gas stations, resorts etc may need to have an attendant to ensure cleaning after each use. This would be an exhausting role for anyone who is trying to play bartender, gas attendant or something else at the same time. It would be too much of a pain to keep track of. Other option is to be like a gym where you wipe down when you are done. But that's about as enforceable as someone washing their hands after using the restroom. I see places with coin op as an "accessory" not being able to survive. Touch Tunes is already completely wireless when you link your phone so those may be safe. (if I'm wrong on this please correctly as I've seen people control these via their phone already).
It looks like someone is already on top of the slot machine thing with the dividers. Another alternative would be a candle on the slot machine that would light in a certain pattern that would mention that it needs to be cleaned again before another player steps up. This would be easy on slow days and casinos already staff cleaning personnel already. On a Saturday night, good luck.
For smaller businesses with your cherry masters I fear this still falls under the category of being small time use. It would be seen as a pac man more than a slot machine in a casino.
Here in MN they say revenue for charitable gambling is WAY down. I'd expect it to be $0 where we are today. I could see things like pull tabs becoming more dominant in place of other items. Or virtual pull tabs and wipe those ipads down after each play via the person that sits behind the counter.
I still say it's too soon to draw any conclusions for the future. It's unfortunate for the businesses who have already opened. This will also make new businesses centered around coin op a little gun shy to open. I know there are some businesses already mentioned on Pinside that were slated to open just before all this hit the fan. All we can do now is hope for the best.
Quoted from EJS:Another alternative would be a candle on the slot machine that would light in a certain pattern that would mention that it needs to be cleaned again before another player steps up. This would be easy on slow days and casinos already staff cleaning personnel already. On a Saturday night, good luck.
I think establishments will wipe the games down more, Temp. scan maybe, hand sanitizer at the ready, masks for a while till numbers fade, and game on. let the player beware.
I mean, are they wiping off the gas pump at my local 7-11?, the door handles? Every grocery cart at the market? How about Red BOX? Is my Postal Carrier sanitizing my mailbox after he opens it? ATM? The list goes on....
There are tons of things in life that are shared to the touch in public, too many to pick and choose with some un-enforceable code.
The people that don't care will be the first to give it a go, and the rest of us can watch and see what happens. Then decide when we are OK with taking that "risk" ourselves. Each person has the right to play it how they like.
Quoted from EJS:Another alternative would be a candle on the slot machine that would light in a certain pattern that would mention that it needs to be cleaned again before another player steps up. This would be easy on slow days and casinos already staff cleaning personnel already. On a Saturday night, good luck.
The IGT Slot Accounting System (Acres Gaming) has a new update that notifies an attendant to clean the machine as soon as someone finishes playing. Similar to a hand-pay or machine Tilt situation.
Configuration options include locking up the game as well as a unique candle flash pattern.
Avoiding "safety theater"... exactly. Should we duct tape all player 2 buttons & guns & joysticks? Turn off or remove half of the games?
I don't think so. It's an arcade. Unless the business model changes (which basically means any business where things are touched), it is what it is.
Fresh airflow, masks, and sanitizing hands in/out of the 'touch zone' will be the standard many businesses will end up following.
If that doesn't work, perhaps the business can't work. :/
Quoted from EJS:Time will tell. But I'd say they are at risk right now. I'm not a government or legal or gaming (gambling) expert so all I can do is speculate.
A couple things I could see happening.
Smaller banks of machines like cherry masters or games at gas stations, resorts etc may need to have an attendant to ensure cleaning after each use. This would be an exhausting role for anyone who is trying to play bartender, gas attendant or something else at the same time. It would be too much of a pain to keep track of. Other option is to be like a gym where you wipe down when you are done. But that's about as enforceable as someone washing their hands after using the restroom. I see places with coin op as an "accessory" not being able to survive. Touch Tunes is already completely wireless when you link your phone so those may be safe. (if I'm wrong on this please correctly as I've seen people control these via their phone already).
It looks like someone is already on top of the slot machine thing with the dividers. Another alternative would be a candle on the slot machine that would light in a certain pattern that would mention that it needs to be cleaned again before another player steps up. This would be easy on slow days and casinos already staff cleaning personnel already. On a Saturday night, good luck.
For smaller businesses with your cherry masters I fear this still falls under the category of being small time use. It would be seen as a pac man more than a slot machine in a casino.
Here in MN they say revenue for charitable gambling is WAY down. I'd expect it to be $0 where we are today. I could see things like pull tabs becoming more dominant in place of other items. Or virtual pull tabs and wipe those ipads down after each play via the person that sits behind the counter.
I still say it's too soon to draw any conclusions for the future. It's unfortunate for the businesses who have already opened. This will also make new businesses centered around coin op a little gun shy to open. I know there are some businesses already mentioned on Pinside that were slated to open just before all this hit the fan. All we can do now is hope for the best.
You mentioned Touchtunes. I am heavy on the jukeboxes on my route. I have a feeling here in MI all gaming will be off limits for a bit till things simmer down. It's just a feeling and I hope I am wrong. I already plan on putting signs up to tell customers jukebox will be phone app only. About 70% or more of juke play comes from the app already. I just hope my jukes do well enough to carry me for the next 6 months once the bars open.
Quoted from freeplay3:You mentioned Touchtunes. I am heavy on the jukeboxes on my route. I have a feeling here in MI all gaming will be off limits for a bit till things simmer down. It's just a feeling and I hope I am wrong. I already plan on putting signs up to tell customers jukebox will be phone app only. About 70% or more of juke play comes from the app already. I just hope my jukes do well enough to carry me for the next 6 months once the bars open.
The jukes with the phone apps are the best.
I'd walk down the street outside the bars and put Eddie Murphy's "Party All the Time" on.
Love that tune.
Quoted from BobSacamano:The jukes with the phone apps are the best.
I'd walk down the street outside the bars and put Eddie Murphy's "Party All the Time" on.
Love that tune.
People like you are the reason remotes have a skip button. 
I could tell so many stories about people bombing jukes with bad music. My favorite story is I have an owner who hates country music. He always worked the bar the same night every week. The regulars heard him bitch about a country song and from then on it was country music night every day he was behind the bar. The more they played the more he bitched. I ended up blocking all country on the box for that one night.
Looks like I can open at noon on Monday May 18th. Limit of ten people or less. And social distancing. So likely one or two pool tables with only one or two on each. And if pinball players can't adapt to a two game space between players. I'll have to disable games or move them or something. This will be a learning experience to try and keep my customers and me safe.
LTG : )
Quoted from NicoVolta:Will everyone be required to wear a mask?
Right now I don't know. I'm sure the printed form will go into more detail past what the governor said.
LTG : )
We have a pinball room at our Escape Rooms. Right now we have 10 games almost all of them are LE very nice collection. Our focus is escape rooms so we simply have no plans to turn on the pinball games right now for multiple reasons.
To keep our lobby / waiting area with fewer people we're now only allowing 10 minute arrival prior to booking times. Before it was 45, hence they played arcades and pinball. Now with only 10 minutes prior to booking there is no time for pinball games. We also made all of our escape rooms PRIVATE meaning only groups that know each other are playing together. Our plan is simply to keep the pinball and arcades OFF until such a time all this settles down.
I do highly suggest EVERYONE who does open post WARNING SIGNS! See the examples I posted. Liability is an issue so post a lot of warning signs including on YOUR WEBSITE!
You might also consider waivers to play.
I would also suggest you buy a product called 'MICROBAN' and use this on your games, door knobs whatever.
You could also require all your guests to wash their hands prior to playing or requiring rubber gloves and face masks.
There is a lot of things you can do, just make sure warning signs are a part of it.
Lastly, and again for safety and liability you should consider buying a touchless temp you can snag these on amazon. If anyone has a fever above 100.4 refuse entry.
escape warning 2 (resized).jpgwarning sign 2 print (resized).jpgNot trying to nag... just raising awareness of the fact that the biggest COVID transmission risk is sharing breathing space without a mask.
Especially true in rooms without continuous fresh airflow from outdoors and/or without active filtration specifically rated for SARS/virus removal.
Which would be most everywhere right now. :/
It is a weakest link situation. One infected person in a room without a mask substantially increases the risk for everyone else... even if they have masks on. Unless they have a full-face respirator/N95 equipped which they most likely will not.
With the risk of asymptomatic transmission and delayed onset by up to two weeks... can anyone truly be safe if masks are not mandatory for everyone?
Quoted from LTG:Looks like I can open at noon on Monday May 18th. Limit of ten people or less. And social distancing. So likely one or two pool tables with only one or two on each. And if pinball players can't adapt to a two game space between players. I'll have to disable games or move them or something. This will be a learning experience to try and keep my customers and me safe.
LTG : )
The rules for reopening are up. Looks like June 1st for me. Sorry for jumping the gun with the earlier news that made it sound like Monday was it.
LTG : )
Quoted from NicoVolta:Not trying to nag... just raising awareness of the fact that the biggest COVID transmission risk is sharing breathing space without a mask.
Especially true in rooms without continuous fresh airflow from outdoors and/or without active filtration specifically rated for SARS/virus removal.
Which would be most everywhere right now. :/
It is a weakest link situation. One infected person in a room without a mask substantially increases the risk for everyone else... even if they have masks on. Unless they have a full-face respirator/N95 equipped which they most likely will not.
With the risk of asymptomatic transmission and delayed onset by up to two weeks... can anyone truly be safe if masks are not mandatory for everyone?
I am still not sure how long it will be before we open up our club. Unless things look much different from right now, masks are going to be a requirement for all of our members upon entry.
Another caveat: Masks and respirators with vents (exhaust ports) do nothing to filter exhaled air. Beware.
We won’t allow the use of vented masks or respirators.
“Unless everyone is wearing a mask, nobody is.”
Quoted from NicoVolta:Masks and respirators with vents (exhaust ports) do nothing to filter exhaled air.
While true, I’ve yet to see anyone wearing a mask with a seal good enough to filter exhaled air. Even a full-blown military issue gas mask doesn’t filter the exhaust.
Maybe an underserved market for an enterprising capitalist.
Quoted from NicoVolta:Will everyone be required to wear a mask?
You guys know that a mask does nothing right? The virus is so much smaller than the holes in the mask its like using a chain link fence as mosquito netting. 80% of the people that I see here are not wearing it and I have seen people leave stores that demand a mask.
Quoted from zr11990:a mask does nothing right? The virus is so much smaller than the holes in the mask
You misunderstand the purpose of the mask. It's to filter DROPLETS that may contain the virus.
Here is a scientific study from 2013 that suggests even simple surgical masks are helpful.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3591312/
Quoted from zr11990:80% of the people that I see here are not wearing it and I have seen people leave stores that demand a mask.
I was wondering if this chart had any street-level corroboration. Guess so. :/
69851C6B-ABB5-49AF-85C8-7FA0BBAC8A08 (resized).jpegThat’s not total cases is it? Because # of total cases should never dip, ever. At 0 new instances of infection, the curve is horizontal and it cannot decrease without negative new cases. I know for a fact Texas had no days with negative new cases. Now if it was a curve of active cases, then yes, it fits correctly.
Sounds pretty thorough and thought out. Better than I could come up with. One thing though, I know globally everyone loves temperature checks, especially forehead, but they don’t really buy you much other than a feeling of safety (as opposed to actual safety).
1) forehead temp checks are not accurate
2) this virus is readily transmittable by people whether they have a temperature or not.
3) many other things cause elevated temperatures.
It’s testing something, anything, just so you can say to yourself (or a court) “hey at least I tried”. From a safety standpoint it isn’t much better than measuring people’s shoe size.
True. Temperature guns aren’t a catch-all... but at least they flag that variable at the door.
Goal: Make it nigh-impossible to catch COVID using every reasonable means possible.
Quoted from drfrightner:We have a pinball room at our Escape Rooms. Right now we have 10 games almost all of them are LE very nice collection. Our focus is escape rooms so we simply have no plans to turn on the pinball games right now for multiple reasons.
To keep our lobby / waiting area with fewer people we're now only allowing 10 minute arrival prior to booking times. Before it was 45, hence they played arcades and pinball. Now with only 10 minutes prior to booking there is no time for pinball games. We also made all of our escape rooms PRIVATE meaning only groups that know each other are playing together. Our plan is simply to keep the pinball and arcades OFF until such a time all this settles down.
I do highly suggest EVERYONE who does open post WARNING SIGNS! See the examples I posted. Liability is an issue so post a lot of warning signs including on YOUR WEBSITE!
You might also consider waivers to play.
I would also suggest you buy a product called 'MICROBAN' and use this on your games, door knobs whatever.
You could also require all your guests to wash their hands prior to playing or requiring rubber gloves and face masks.
There is a lot of things you can do, just make sure warning signs are a part of it.
Lastly, and again for safety and liability you should consider buying a touchless temp you can snag these on amazon. If anyone has a fever above 100.4 refuse entry. [quoted image][quoted image]
Thank you for posting those. They will serve as inspiration for our own signage
Quoted from Oaken:Sounds pretty thorough and thought out. Better than I could come up with. One thing though, I know globally everyone loves temperature checks, especially forehead, but they don’t really buy you much other than a feeling of safety (as opposed to actual safety).
1) forehead temp checks are not accurate
2) this virus is readily transmittable by people whether they have a temperature or not.
3) many other things cause elevated temperatures.
It’s testing something, anything, just so you can say to yourself (or a court) “hey at least I tried”. From a safety standpoint it isn’t much better than measuring people’s shoe size.
First, you are 100% correct on everything you write here. I fully agree and they are all good points.
1) Masks - half my patients are wearing them upside down anyway, so minimal effectiveness
2) Forehead temperature - inaccurate, and if we could screen for every COVID+ patient with this we would not have a pandemic.
3) Social distancing in an enclosed space - an oxymoron if there ever was one
4) Disinfect surfaces - mostly done incorrectly, and usually just smears stuff around
5) Airflow - go visit the middle of the woods if we really want to make sure we don't want to inhale corona
6) Limited gatherings - a party of 1 person is best.
7) Gloves - what Nic said
8) Plexiglass barriers - barriers to what ? - good for salad, probably not so much for COVID
9) Hand sanitizer - good until I pull down my mask to wipe my nose and then play another pin.
The bottom line is this: short of us all staying in our houses for 14 days straight with no contact with anyone, this isn't going away. We could have done better, we could have had actual government leadership, but we didn't, and we won't unfortunately.
Despite all this, go drive by the parking lot of Costco or Walmart or Target or Kroger. Go walk in and see what we allow in an "essential" business. Enuf said. Are they doing pretty much any of this ? Some....maybe..... but its an incomplete effort at best.
I don't really view any of this as "hey at least I tried". That's glass half empty thinking there. I view it more as "I am doing more than most AND the combination is still way better than zero".
This isn't binary 1 or 0, its analog. Say I reduce with everything above the likelihood of someone getting COVID from my arcade by 50%. Am I gonna feel bad that someone got it from the arcade - and in any social gathering this is a given it WILL happen - yes I am. Am I just going to cower in a hole and say close the business now, I'll reopen in 3 years when everyone is vaccinated - not practical on any level one looks at. Understand people got sick at my arcade for sure before (flu, cold, bacterial infection, whatnot) it just wasn't as in your face as corona and before this, nobody really thought about the risks of going to a football game.
When I counsel patients I go thru a long list of risks/benefits. There is a benefit to watching Netflix by oneself for 3 years and staying indoors (probably also a risk to going crazy too), there is a clear risk to venturing back out into the world. There is no step I can take that fully eliminates risk or 100% assures benefit. The best I can do is mitigate risk, try and keep as much benefit as possible, and let people decide how to stratify their tolerance for risk. That's all any of us can do.
We are taking all 9 of those measures above, with best practices that are achievable with each. But I'll admit since I can't truly quantify risk except in the abstract, I can't even tell you how much I've mitigated risk with those measures, and since benefit (maybe mental health) is entirely personal, I can't tell you if its enough. I only go forward because thats the only direction one can move in life. The only way to make sure one never gets this is to go life on a desert island for 5 years (or a padded cell). I don't think any of us plan on doing that.
Quoted from NicoVolta:When indoors, establishing negative air pressure is more important than everyone wearing a mask.
Do you have the data on that Nic? You're the only person I've heard mention it.
Quoted from zr11990:Deleted post
I’ll add to your count, but only because you should take this trolling argument to the covid thread and stay out of this one. This is constructive talk about opening arcades.
Not a mask effectiveness thread.
Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:Do you have the data on that Nic? You're the only person I've heard mention it.
Only anecdotal evidence from cases of proven transmission, but in every case stagnant shared air was the culprit.
The Chinese restaurant, the two choir groups, the sports arenas... what did they have in common? Lots of rebreathing.
It doesn’t seem like rocket science to draw this conclusion. Especially with the skepticism of mask usage riding so high. Truth be told, common masks don’t filter virus particles and only slow the spread of COVID... not stop it.
Fresh airflow is the big broom. We should use it.
I hate operating in the dark. Our administration and media should be doing a lot more to help us with mitigation strategies instead of pointing out casualties and wishful thinking about going back to normal.
I expect in the near-ish future we may even see green stickers on business windows... “USDAC Certified 5x Airflow” (a new Department of Air Circulation?)
Quoted from DNO:I’ll add to your count, but only because you should take this trolling argument to the covid thread and stay out of this one. This is constructive talk about opening arcades.
Not a mask effectiveness thread.
Everyone that doesn’t think they should hide inside and close everything down got kicked out of the covid thread. I just made a point. The masks do little if any good even if worn correctly. Covid is like the common cold. It’s here along with the flue. You can’t stop the world and make everyone go broke and lose their jobs over a virus with a 98% survival rate. But, that is exactly what seems to be happening.
Quoted from zr11990:Everyone that doesn’t think they should hide inside and close everything down got kicked out of the covid thread.
So you come here to argue? I don’t want this thread closed.
Not here to argue about f’n masks.
Unless it is to discuss if it will be more/less likely to encourage people to get back into a re-opened arcade. I think it would make most people more likely to go. Possibly you would lose some customers too, but I think the positives of it would be bigger if they were encouraged or required to be used, at least in the initial opening phases.
No, I didn’t come here to argue. I am adding a logical point to the conversation. I think if you opened the damn thing people will come. People are sick and fucking tired of the the this whole fucking thing. They want to get back to their lives and their jobs and forget this shit ever happened. That is what one seeing. I tried to go fishing off a pier last night and have been going anywhere that is open to get out of the house They can only allow 25% capacity on the pier so there is a 4-5 hour wait to get on the pier. No one wears a mask no one gives a shit. Open it and they will come. If they are afraid they will stay home. And from what I see the only reason businesses are doing any of this BS is because they are forever to do it by the damn government to be able to open at 25% capacity. Again it is a virus with a 98% recovery rate. But I have argued this before. I’m done. I will not post here again. You people can close your business, hide in the house, fear for your lives and listen to whatever your corrupt politicians tell you, the ones who told people to put CV patients in old folks homes. Come on with the downvoted
Quoted from zr11990:I’m done. I will not post here again.
Upvoted!
Quoted from NicoVolta:Only anecdotal evidence from cases of proven transmission, but in every case stagnant shared air was the culprit.
The Chinese restaurant, the two choir groups, the sports arenas... what did they have in common? Lots of rebreathing.
It doesn’t seem like rocket science to draw this conclusion. Especially with the skepticism of mask usage riding so high. Truth be told, common masks don’t filter virus particles and only slow the spread of COVID... not stop it.
Fresh airflow is the big broom. We should use it.
I hate operating in the dark. Our administration and media should be doing a lot more to help us with mitigation strategies instead of pointing out casualties and wishful thinking about going back to normal.
Did they give a time frame on opening in VA? Been hoping to make a trip to see my son in Norfolk (military) but hoped to wait until some signs of clearance were open.
Quoted from Yelobird:Did they give a time frame on opening in VA? Been hoping to make a trip to see my son in Norfolk (military) but hoped to wait until some signs of clearance were open.
I’m anticipating we will be included in Phase II. Dates haven’t been established yet, but I’m staying tuned. Will update our website when the time comes.
Quoted from NicoVolta:Only anecdotal evidence from cases of proven transmission, but in every case stagnant shared air was the culprit.
The Chinese restaurant, the two choir groups, the sports arenas... what did they have in common? Lots of rebreathing.
It doesn’t seem like rocket science to draw this conclusion. Especially with the skepticism of mask usage riding so high. Truth be told, common masks don’t filter virus particles and only slow the spread of COVID... not stop it.
Fresh airflow is the big broom. We should use it.
I hate operating in the dark. Our administration and media should be doing a lot more to help us with mitigation strategies instead of pointing out casualties and wishful thinking about going back to normal.
Recent NY Times article seems to support your idea. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/15/us/coronavirus-what-to-do-outside.html
Public perception will be key. How best to convince people it's safe to come out again. List of precautions your establishment has taken posted at the entrance maybe? Multi-pronged marketing campaign utilizing press releases, local TV reporting at various locations, politicians describing local guidelines?
I’m working on an amusing safety video w/a touch of Ren & Stimpy humor.
Laughter is still the best medicine.
Quoted from NicoVolta:I expect in the near-ish future we may even see green stickers on business windows... “USDAC Certified 5x Airflow” (a new Department of Air Circulation?)
This wouldn't surprise me. Would also create a lot of jobs can't go wrong there.
I would think a select number of businesses have already done this after becoming famous for making the news due to their HVAC system causing Legionnaires outbreak.
CONTENT WARNING: Its possible you may find the following information to be offensive ... if so, you should stop reading now as YOU may be part of the problem.
What the hell ever happened to personal responsibility?
How about we just let the government notify us of certain risks and then make our own personal decisions to accept the risks or heed the warnings? How about if we make poor life decisions ... we accept personal responsibility for these decisions along with the consequences of those decisions without expecting aid from anyone to alleviate the pain of those decisions?
How about we just become a FREE society? We were once...unfortunately this was lost someplace.
Now get the hell off my lawn!
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