(Topic ID: 109931)

The SprayMax 2K Auto Clear in a Can Club!

By Curbfeeler

8 years ago


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  • 1,771 posts
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  • Latest reply 18 hours ago by radium
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There are 1,771 posts in this topic. You are on page 35 of 36.
#1701 69 days ago
Quoted from slochar:

It just means that the edge of the insert wasn't sealed, so the clear is wicking down into the sides. It will be ok in home use (all wax will do is get jammed in there, though).
It depends on your goal on the PF if you want it "perfect" or "good enough". I usually go for good enough myself.

On Seawitch I ended up using DiamondClear with a dropper to buildup the insert areas, was a good learning experience.

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#1702 69 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

On Seawitch I ended up using DiamondClear with a dropper to buildup the insert areas, was a good learning experience.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Looks great! Unfortunately not sold anywhere near me. We are all limited by what's available for purchase. Did you 2K over that or just use the diamondclear?

#1703 69 days ago
Quoted from Chrimeg:

Looks great! Unfortunately not sold anywhere near me. We are all limited by what's available for purchase. Did you 2K over that or just use the diamondclear?

1) Purchased through Amazon.

amazon.com link »

Enough to do several hundred game inserts.

2) 2K was final, just used for leveling the inserts.

I do have a test title I'l like to spray with DiamondCoat and see how it comes out.

#1704 66 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

1) Purchased through Amazon.
amazon.com link »
Enough to do several hundred game inserts.
2) 2K was final, just used for leveling the inserts.
I do have a test title I'l like to spray with DiamondCoat and see how it comes out.

What is this diamond coat?
Looks like a brush on type product

#1705 66 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

What is this diamond coat?
Looks like a brush on type product

See Amazon link above.

Its a single stage clear product which can be brushed, sprayed or rolled. A few people have done complete playfields with a roller which is where it first caught my attention. I'm using it to level inserts but will spray at least one playfield to see how it works.

#1706 66 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

See Amazon link above.
Its a single stage clear product which can be brushed, sprayed or rolled. A few people have done complete playfields with a roller which is where it first caught my attention. I'm using it to level inserts but will spray at least one playfield to see how it works.

very interesting, I am curious on the compatibility of this under a 2k clear.

#1707 66 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

very interesting, I am curious on the compatibility of this under a 2k clear.

There you go, its exactly what I did.

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#1708 66 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

There you go, its exactly what I did.
[quoted image]

looks great, I had seen them. I am not an expert by any means but would these 2 bond to each other or is there a change that the 1k and 2K might eventually ghost ?

#1709 66 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

looks great, I had seen them. I am not an expert by any means but would these 2 bond to each other or is there a change that the 1k and 2K might eventually ghost ?

Been like that for a year with no delamination and has several hundred plays on it. Manufacturer states can be used under automotive clears.

#1710 65 days ago

Got some bubbles and fish eyes on my latest coats of Spraymax. Sigh. Now i will have to sand down to remove them, will probably take off a little paint too. Next time I'm doing the Rapid Prep that pinballinreno talks about often. I think the last thing i used before spraying was a tack cloth, it probably had oils and paint from previous wipings. This stuff is sensitive to the most minute things.

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#1711 64 days ago
Quoted from Flipper_McGavin:

Got some bubbles and fish eyes on my latest coats of Spraymax. Sigh. Now i will have to sand down to remove them, will probably take off a little paint too. Next time I'm doing the Rapid Prep that pinballinreno talks about often. I think the last thing i used before spraying was a tack cloth, it probably had oils and paint from previous wipings. This stuff is sensitive to the most minute things.
[quoted image][quoted image]

Clear coat sometimes has to be surgically clean.

Wear nitrile gloves at all times other than sanding and rinsing. Never touch the surface before getting ready to clean and spray.

I use fresh blue tack cloths for each session. I suit up to keep hair and crap from falling onto the surface.

I also use kirkland paper towels. They dont appear to have any dyes or perfumes.

I wipe down with rapid prep outside the booth, blow it off with air, then do a final wipe with clean paper towel and naptha inside the booth.

Just before spraying I wipe down with a tack cloth. I dont rub too hard.

I dont clean the booth between sessions. The clear makes everything sticky and deadens the air.

I have simple hepa type filtration for in and out with a cheap box fan.

#1712 64 days ago
Quoted from Flipper_McGavin:

Got some bubbles and fish eyes on my latest coats of Spraymax. Sigh. Now i will have to sand down to remove them, will probably take off a little paint too. Next time I'm doing the Rapid Prep that pinballinreno talks about often. I think the last thing i used before spraying was a tack cloth, it probably had oils and paint from previous wipings. This stuff is sensitive to the most minute things.
[quoted image][quoted image]

I think you can sand out and drill out (by spinning a new exacto knife tip) those bubbles.

I use a gray 800 automotive sanding scrub pad with 1/2 teaspoon of dawn and 1qt filtered water. I spray off with rapid prep and dry out with naptha. On prior cleared playfields.

Carefully clean it all up so no white dust remains.

Dropper into the holes and do a light coat then a medium coat.

I think its very salvageable without aggressive sanding thru the paint.

A couple coats and sanding later the pits and bubbles will disappear.

#1713 64 days ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

I think you can sand out and drill out (by spinning a new exacto knife tip) those bubbles.

That's a good idea. Some of them are submerged bubbles where I can just dig a tiny crater. I might not even have to worry about spot-dripping clear if I can dig a small enough diameter hole and Spraymax enough coats where it should flow enough into and level off enough to just block sand afterwards.

#1714 64 days ago
Quoted from Flipper_McGavin:

Got some bubbles and fish eyes on my latest coats of Spraymax. Sigh. Now i will have to sand down to remove them, will probably take off a little paint too. Next time I'm doing the Rapid Prep that pinballinreno talks about often. I think the last thing i used before spraying was a tack cloth, it probably had oils and paint from previous wipings. This stuff is sensitive to the most minute things.
[quoted image][quoted image]

A blow torch is your friend, use it and you will never get bubbles.

#1715 64 days ago
Quoted from wolffcub:

A blow torch is your friend, use it and you will never get bubbles.

Can you explain the blow torch process for us rookies?

#1716 64 days ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

I have simple hepa type filtration for in and out with a cheap box fan.

Ever worry about sparks from the fan motor? Considering an explosion proof fan to ventilate my paint booth.

#1717 64 days ago
Quoted from A_Bord:

Ever worry about sparks from the fan motor? Considering an explosion proof fan to ventilate my paint booth.

Not too worried as the concentrations from a 3-4 min spray are diluted greatly with fresh air intake.

The airborn paint is already catalyzed and solvents are super low.

Mostly it just protects my garage from overspray.

#1718 64 days ago
Quoted from DanMarino:

Can you explain the blow torch process for us rookies?

After you spray you use a torch and just work your way over the surface. Just like how they use it when doing epoxy work.

Video as an example.

#1719 64 days ago
Quoted from wolffcub:

After you spray you use a torch and just work your way over the surface. Just like how they use it when doing epoxy work.
Video as an example.

Isnt urethane reducer extremely flammable?

Im intrigued to say the least.

I would like to see a vid of you doing this on a $1600 playfield

Automotive clear isnt the same as Art Resin or epoxy. Automotive P2K can be sanded in 1 hour if conditions are good.

I have had it "kick" in 10 mins in a hot garage.

#1720 64 days ago

I do it to all of the playfields I clear.

#1721 63 days ago
Quoted from wolffcub:

I do it to all of the playfields I clear.

Thanks for posting that video. I’ll definitely give it a try next time.

#1722 63 days ago
Quoted from wolffcub:

I do it to all of the playfields I clear.

Wow, sounds like I want to try it!

Are you using spray max?

#1723 63 days ago

I am surprised some of you did not know about the torch trick, it goes to show how a lot of these skills are transferable from other hobbies...

I got 'roasted' in another thread by a couple pinsidesr when I mentioned that I use both skills from the 'auto bodywork' and 'woodworking' and they started a witch hunt against me as to how I was going to cause people to 'damage' their games... I know how to work paint and have use some woodworking skills to workaround other issues as well...
The torch trick I learned when I built a table for our house and had to use epoxy to fill some holes.

I see a lot of wive tales in this hobby, for example, people continuing to use a plastic polishing compound to 'clean' playfields, and when challenged with facts they just react negatively because 'this is how is had been done for 20 years' . Then you wonder why a 10 year old PF is covered in scratches and looks very cloudy....

Anyway, rant over! the torch does work!

#1724 63 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

I am surprised some of you did not know about the torch trick, it goes to show how a lot of these skills are transferable from other hobbies...
I got 'roasted' in another thread by a couple pinsidesr when I mentioned that I use both skills from the 'auto bodywork' and 'woodworking' and they started a witch hunt against me as to how I was going to cause people to 'damage' their games... I know how to work paint and have use some woodworking skills to workaround other issues as well...
The torch trick I learned when I built a table for our house and had to use epoxy to fill some holes.
I see a lot of wive tales in this hobby, for example, people continuing to use a plastic polishing compound to 'clean' playfields, and when challenged with facts they just react negatively because 'this is how is had been done for 20 years' . Then you wonder why a 10 year old PF is covered in scratches and looks very cloudy....
Anyway, rant over! the torch does work!

I have done automotive restoration since I was 18 and prop building for the last 15 years and its amazing how much transfers over.

#1725 58 days ago

For you cabinet restorers; Amazon has a deal. 12 cans of matte spray max for $70. That’s like $6 a can.

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#1726 58 days ago

What a deal. Just had to pay $30 for a single can, but it was for the Clear Glamour. Likely going the HVLP route from here on out. Not only for the cost savings, but I have been getting inconsistent quality control with Spraymax also; hiccups during spraying and inconsistent spray pattern. 1 of every 3 cans seemed to spray good this year.

#1727 58 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

I have done automotive restoration since I was 18 and prop building for the last 15 years and it's amazing how much transfers over.

I want to clear a cabinet for the first time soon. Is the Matte normally preferred for cabinets?

#1728 58 days ago
Quoted from jazc4:

I want to clear a cabinet for the first time soon. Is the Matte normally preferred for cabinets?

It was just my personal choice, I can't say I have ever come across a glossy finish game from the factory. Anything gloss will show cab imperfections like crazy.

#1729 57 days ago

I've done a gloss finish cabinet. Never again. Not because it looks bad, but it looks wrong. Matte or semi gloss on a machine looks much better, and I like how they contrast with gloss decals.

#1730 57 days ago
Quoted from jazc4:

I want to clear a cabinet for the first time soon. Is the Matte normally preferred for cabinets?

I think my cabinet would look better in matte. However the poster above made a good point. I cannot polish out imperfections with matte. If I get a bad spray pattern it may come out bad. We shall see.

#1731 57 days ago

So what finish do you use for a pf? Matte or glamour?

#1732 57 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

So what finish do you use for a pf? Matte or glamour?

I use Glamour

#1733 57 days ago
Quoted from Flipper_McGavin:

What a deal. Just had to pay $30 for a single can, but it was for the Clear Glamour. Likely going the HVLP route from here on out. Not only for the cost savings, but I have been getting inconsistent quality control with Spraymax also; hiccups during spraying and inconsistent spray pattern. 1 of every 3 cans seemed to spray good this year.

I switched to HVLP this week and am not going back. Much easier to get good results and an easier timeline to work under.

#1734 57 days ago
Quoted from A_Bord:

I switched to HVLP this week and am not going back. Much easier to get good results and an easier timeline to work under.

I typically do hlvp as well. It just takes so much time to set up and tear down the tools and stations.

Since I’m in a mad dash with the weather to get this cabinet complete before winter (and I’m out of my 2k quart can) I’m using spray max.

#1735 57 days ago

Langless28 l don't see the 6 for $70 deal, do you have a link?

#1736 57 days ago
Quoted from Barr993:

Langless28 l don't see the 6 for $70 deal, do you have a link?

Seems to be gone. It was from the store “detail max”. It’s now showing up as $250.

Hopefully some of you got the deal. There like “16 left” left when I got my deal.

1 week later
#1737 47 days ago

Hey club. I’m about to use this soon. What are the temps recommended to spray? It’s getting cold in Michigan and wondering if it’ll cure in these temps

#1738 47 days ago
Quoted from Bax1:

Hey club. I’m about to use this soon. What are the temps recommended to spray? It’s getting cold in Michigan and wondering if it’ll cure in these temps

https://download.kwasny.com/datasheets/TMB-3680061_(US)EN.pdf

1 month later
#1740 8 days ago

Well waited another few months and sanded the clearcoat again hoping to rid some of the dieback. Seemed successful enough that I feel I won't need to spray another layer on it.

Just finished Novus 2 and till some really fine scratches if I direct the light different ways but nothing I'm overly concerned about.

I sanded and repainted the rails then Krylon clear spray over them. Rails are back in place and in the process now of cleaning the playfield before waxing. Bought some Chemical Guys 3X Hardcore Carnauba paste wax. Never used wax before so see how that goes...

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#1741 8 days ago

A question about your side rails. Does the ball ever thump into them anywhere on the playfield? On my Eight Ball I did something similar to you for the side rails using regular spray paint. It does not hold up to ball contact at all well. I found using a topcoat of spray Varathane made all the difference in durability. In your case you can just use more SprayMax which be even better.

#1742 7 days ago

BJM-Maxx I think the only place the ball may touch is the side drain lanes (the 10,000 bonus red area). There is another spot up in the green area with roll over holes that has a metal protector there.

I used Kylon clear to help protect the paint on the rails. Only be a home machine for scattered play so wear shouldn't be bad. I'm debating Mylar around the pop bumpers though. Think just leaving clear and wax won't do much to protect from divots or chipping during ball jumps.

#1743 6 days ago

I was surprised how quickly damage showed up in my case, the outlanes are the same as yours. You could put mylar on the vertical surface in that area as an alternative.

#1744 5 days ago
Quoted from Chrimeg:

Well waited another few months and sanded the clearcoat again hoping to rid some of the dieback. Seemed successful enough that I feel I won't need to spray another layer on it.
Just finished Novus 2 and till some really fine scratches if I direct the light different ways but nothing I'm overly concerned about.
I sanded and repainted the rails then Krylon clear spray over them. Rails are back in place and in the process now of cleaning the playfield before waxing. Bought some Chemical Guys 3X Hardcore Carnauba paste wax. Never used wax before so see how that goes...
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

I respectfully want to ask the following, since we are in a painting thread:

Why do you polish clearcoat with a polish designed for plastic?
I think personally is a very poor choice, to get clear coat to shine properly you can do better and achieve better results if you use compounds formulated in compound or polish form or something even better: like optimum spray polish that grinds down to finer grit as you polish.

You will get a much better shine than using novus which is really not formulated to cut clear coat.

I dont polish the clear coat of my vehicle with novus, why would I polish the same clear on my pinball with novus.

I personally think novus is just a wives tale that has been passed down over yhe years ans people dont know better and xontinue using it. It is very gritty and therefore cleans due to its abrasiveness, wipe a cloth with it on your Cc by hand and with thr same flashlight you are using now shine a light on your pf and get ready for “swirl galore”. Trust me.
I dont polish anything that needs clarity (like clearcoat does) by hand. Not even Mr Miyagui can achive q swirl free surface by hand because it would take centuries, we get tired and apply too much pressure, results: more awirls, more clear coat is lost and poor results.
Enter the polisher machine: it is capable of polishing anything, faster, removing less materi than by hand and more clarity even when using the wrong chemical (novus)

If I am wrong please educate me in the art of doing anything pinball with novus, people seem to like this plastic polish compound.
That said, I have hundreds of hours fixing clear coat and for the same reason we dont use tooth paste (also a polisher) we would not use novus.
In other works, toothpaste would also work but it is not formulated to cut clearcoat just like novus is not either.

Here is a much better alternative, your beautiful PF and hours of hard work deserve it:

https://optimumcarcare.com/product/optimum-hyper-polish

#1745 4 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

I respectfully want to ask the following, since we are in a painting thread:
Why do you polish clearcoat with a polish designed for plastic?
I think personally is a very poor choice, to get clear coat to shine properly you can do better and achieve better results if you use compounds formulated in compound or polish form or something even better: like optimum spray polish that grinds down to finer grit as you polish.
You will get a much better shine than using novus which is really not formulated to cut clear coat.
I dont polish the clear coat of my vehicle with novus, why would I polish the same clear on my pinball with novus.
I personally think novus is just a wives tale that has been passed down over yhe years ans people dont know better and xontinue using it. It is very gritty and therefore cleans due to its abrasiveness, wipe a cloth with it on your Cc by hand and with thr same flashlight you are using now shine a light on your pf and get ready for “swirl galore”. Trust me.
I dont polish anything that needs clarity (like clearcoat does) by hand. Not even Mr Miyagui can achive q swirl free surface by hand because it would take centuries, we get tired and apply too much pressure, results: more awirls, more clear coat is lost and poor results.
Enter the polisher machine: it is capable of polishing anything, faster, removing less materi than by hand and more clarity even when using the wrong chemical (novus)

If I am wrong please educate me in the art of doing anything pinball with novus, people seem to like this plastic polish compound.
That said, I have hundreds of hours fixing clear coat and for the same reason we dont use tooth paste (also a polisher) we would not use novus.
In other works, toothpaste would also work but it is not formulated to cut clearcoat just like novus is not either.
Here is a much better alternative, your beautiful PF and hours of hard work deserve it:
https://optimumcarcare.com/product/optimum-hyper-polish

Couldn’t agree more with all of this.

Yes - Novus works. Because it’s abrasive. But as you say, it’s designed for plastics. Like a lot of things in this hobby, it just became “a thing”.

I only use car stuff on my playfields. And sparingly too. 3M cutting products for buffing when rebuilding … then the very very occasional spray with spray wax.

KISS principles apply.

When I read newbies posting they’re “cleaning the playfield with Novus 2 after 100 games” I cry a little inside …

rd

#1746 4 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

I respectfully want to ask the following, since we are in a painting thread:
Why do you polish clearcoat with a polish designed for plastic?
I think personally is a very poor choice, to get clear coat to shine properly you can do better and achieve better results if you use compounds formulated in compound or polish form or something even better: like optimum spray polish that grinds down to finer grit as you polish.
You will get a much better shine than using novus which is really not formulated to cut clear coat.
I dont polish the clear coat of my vehicle with novus, why would I polish the same clear on my pinball with novus.
I personally think novus is just a wives tale that has been passed down over yhe years ans people dont know better and xontinue using it. It is very gritty and therefore cleans due to its abrasiveness, wipe a cloth with it on your Cc by hand and with thr same flashlight you are using now shine a light on your pf and get ready for “swirl galore”. Trust me.
I dont polish anything that needs clarity (like clearcoat does) by hand. Not even Mr Miyagui can achive q swirl free surface by hand because it would take centuries, we get tired and apply too much pressure, results: more awirls, more clear coat is lost and poor results.
Enter the polisher machine: it is capable of polishing anything, faster, removing less materi than by hand and more clarity even when using the wrong chemical (novus)

If I am wrong please educate me in the art of doing anything pinball with novus, people seem to like this plastic polish compound.
That said, I have hundreds of hours fixing clear coat and for the same reason we dont use tooth paste (also a polisher) we would not use novus.
In other works, toothpaste would also work but it is not formulated to cut clearcoat just like novus is not either.
Here is a much better alternative, your beautiful PF and hours of hard work deserve it:
https://optimumcarcare.com/product/optimum-hyper-polish

Ignorance mostly. I’ve had a hard time learning about polishing in general and I’m still not great at it. If you make us a YouTube video I will watch it! Never heard of optimum hyper, good tip.

#1747 4 days ago
Quoted from radium:

Ignorance mostly. I’ve had a hard time learning about polishing in general and I’m still not great at it. If you make us a YouTube video I will watch it! Never heard of optimum hyper, good tip.

I will when I clear coat the lw3 pf I will be working on. But it will be a while.

I will write something here in thr meantime ans can probably just help you by learning a little of what your current process is like.

But always, the principle is thr least aggressive pad for the surface.

More to it later, but tell me a little of what chems and machine you are using and I can guide you.

#1748 4 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

I will when I clear coat the lw3 pf I will be working on. But it will be a while.
I will write something here in thr meantime ans can probably just help you by learning a little of what your current process is like.
But always, the principle is thr least aggressive pad for the surface.
More to it later, but tell me a little of what chems and machine you are using and I can guide you.

I have a RS playfield I cleared, sanded up to 3000, and has been sitting for 4 months. I'd love details on proper cut and polish. Thanks!

#1749 4 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

I will when I clear coat the lw3 pf I will be working on. But it will be a while.
I will write something here in thr meantime ans can probably just help you by learning a little of what your current process is like.
But always, the principle is thr least aggressive pad for the surface.
More to it later, but tell me a little of what chems and machine you are using and I can guide you.

That would be great.

I have a Flex XC3401 polisher (that you recommended me a while back thanks). Then 3M wool compounding pad, 3M rubbing compound 05954. Also have the 3M blue sponge polish pad and ultrafine polish 39062 (got this for polishing speaker panels).

I haven’t done a playfield yet, since I got the Flex. I’m building a new spray booth now though, so soon.

#1750 3 days ago

Pin_Fandango yes I'm always open to trying something new.

I don't use novus 2 as a cleaner. Its used more to help reduce some of the fine scratches left behind by sanding etc. After I've sanded with 3k grit I used Novus 2 and it does help with some of the finder scratches. I don't know if there is a way to remove all scratches truthfully as everything we use has some sort of abrasives that just get finer.

You are absolutely right though. I'm certain there are alternatives we could all be using. In most cases people can only use what available in their area to purchase and what they can afford. Dolphine Glaze is perfect example of that. Great for filling holes on the playfield. However, not available in my area and if I were to buy it online. Its well over $150+ .... so bondo it is. Bondo works but may not be as good as the glaze but its what I can get at a reasonable price in my location.

I think everyone in this community is open to alternatives. Nothing is set stone and some stick with what has proven to work. That's what this community for...helping each other in the hobby trying to keep the older machines going.

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