(Topic ID: 109931)

The SprayMax 2K Auto Clear in a Can Club!

By Curbfeeler

7 years ago


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  • Latest reply 16 days ago by PinballBillinFL
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There are 1,498 posts in this topic. You are on page 30 of 30.
#1451 54 days ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

I thought so.
Are you pleased with the 2k?

Yeah, it was awesome. Met all my expectations.

Generally I would ship it off to be coated by a spray painter, but it’s cool to do it myself in my garden shed.

rd

#1452 54 days ago

How many coats does the manufacturer of 2K recommend?
Been following a very popular restorer who said that more than 2 coats is not only a waste of time but also not recommended as the chemical is not meant to bond to multiple layers, or in his own words, 'there is not a single 2K clear coat manufacturer that recommends more than 2 coats'. Not questioning his work, nor word as he is for me the best of the best in restoring but I will not mention his name to avoid starting a debate or forum drama.

With that said, I keep seeing people doing 3-4-6 layers of this stuff...

what does the manufacturer recommend?

#1453 54 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

How many coats does the manufacturer of 2K recommend?
Been following a very popular restorer who said that more than 2 coats is not only a waste of time but also not recommended as the chemical is not meant to bond to multiple layers, or in his own words, 'there is not a single 2K clear coat manufacturer that recommends more than 2 coats'. Not questioning his work, nor word as he is for me the best of the best in restoring but I will not mention his name to avoid starting a debate or forum drama.
With that said, I keep seeing people doing 3-4-6 layers of this stuff...
what does the manufacturer recommend?

I know this is another one you have seen in a HEP restoration thread. His methods work for him in his environment with his techniques and materials, but it is far from the only way or consensus way of doing things. You’ll see Kruzman and Neo doing more than 2 coats with flawless results, and I’m sure if you compare them, they don’t go about it the exact same way.

Manufacturers recommendations of 2-3 heavy wet coats are based on the intended purpose of a prepped automotive panel that is sanded, primed and has a color base coat already. It doesn’t cover being sanded between coats. Most of the use on here is on a playfield that likely will have some surface conditioning issues like sunken inserts or some planking so 2 coats on anything but a perfect playfield will never yield an acceptable result.

All that said, others on here have reached out to their local Spray2K reps to ensure that we are using it in accordance with manufacturers recommendations. I’m not sure where the idea that chemically it won’t bond comes from. It might get cloudy with too many coats.

#1454 54 days ago
Quoted from bigguybbr:I know this is another one you have seen in a HEP restoration thread. His methods work for him in his environment with his techniques and materials, but it is far from the only way or consensus way of doing things. You’ll see Kruzman and Neo doing more than 2 coats with flawless results, and I’m sure if you compare them, they don’t go about it the exact same way.
Manufacturers recommendations of 2-3 heavy wet coats are based on the intended purpose of a prepped automotive panel that is sanded, primed and has a color base coat already. It doesn’t cover being sanded between coats. Most of the use on here is on a playfield that likely will have some surface conditioning issues like sunken inserts or some planking so 2 coats on anything but a perfect playfield will never yield an acceptable result.
All that said, others on here have reached out to their local Spray2K reps to ensure that we are using it in accordance with manufacturers recommendations. I’m not sure where the idea that chemically it won’t bond comes from. It might get cloudy with too many coats.

I am not a coating expert but this sounds right to me. I am always skeptical of prescriptive advice without understanding the why (sometimes to my detriment). The Spray2k is almost exclusively used for autobody work and as such much of their recommendations are likely to be focused on getting good results in that application. I have a hard time believing that there would be any surface adhesion issues with multiple coats as long as you sanded and prepped properly between coats. There may be structural issues with built up stresses due to different curing periods but I don't think we see any evidence of this. Maybe it restricts off-gassing of the bottom layers?

Also, I think the key point is that on many older playfields 2-3 coats is simply not enough. I don't think anyone is recommending 6-7 coats just for the aesthetics but it may be necessary to get the playfield flat. I know on my last playfield I used probably 6 coats but there was a lot of sanding so I think the final product is maybe around 3 coats in total thickness. If I had started with a perfectly flat playfield I definitely would have stopped at 3 coats.

I would also say that I don't see any short term issues with using this many coats. The playfield looks great, there may be longer term issues but I am not sure what those would be. It is good to listen to experienced advice but you also have to follow your own experience and if something is working I personally would be hesitant to stop without understanding why. I suspect it boils down to the fact that what is best for cars may not be best for playfields.

I am just wonder if this is more of a philosophical problem than a practical one. Has anyone had issues with using more than 3 coats?

Just my opinion of course.

#1455 54 days ago
Quoted from killerrobots:

I am just wonder if this is more of a philosophical problem than a practical one. Has anyone had issues with using more than 3 coats?
Just my opinion of course.

This is a product that has been in use for sometime, if there was a problem with many coats it would have shown itself by now.

This thread alone is 6 years old.

#1456 53 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

This is a product that has been in use for sometime, if there was a problem with many coats it would have shown itself by now.
This thread alone is 6 years old.

Good point.

#1457 53 days ago

I am not sure why you guys keep interjecting my process and knowledge in this thread but the thing you must know is that I don’t use spray max or rattle cans so the process and materials I use have no carryover here.
Anything you know or do with Spraymax is perfectly fine and correct as long as it works.
The materials I use are sprayed through a 1.4 fluid tip they are catalyzed high solids and build much quicker and heavier as a result.
Even then though there will be instances where I myself have to deviate from my own preferred two coat net. Net being the key word here. Doing that now on a SOF playfield but it’s out of need not a regular practice.
Hope that clears it up so you can do your thing with your materials and get the results you are looking for without debating it against something completely different.

#1458 53 days ago
Quoted from High_End_Pins:

I am not sure why you guys keep interjecting my process and knowledge in this thread but the thing you must know is that I don’t use spray max or rattle cans so the process and materials I use have no carryover here.
Anything you know or do with Spraymax is perfectly fine and correct as long as it works.
The materials I use are sprayed through a 1.4 fluid tip they are catalyzed high solids and build much quicker and heavier as a result.
Even then though there will be instances where I myself have to deviate from my own preferred two coat net. Net being the key word here. Doing that now on a SOF playfield but it’s out of need not a regular practice.
Hope that clears it up so you can do your thing with your materials and get the results you are looking for without debating it against something completely different.

thanks for that, sorry, I keep using you as example for things, it is just because you put out the best work that I have seen in this industry and that is what I am aiming for!

#1459 53 days ago

The number of coats mean nothing.

Remember a lot of clear is sanded off while leveling everything.

It's done when it's flat (if you want it to be), and it'll take as many coats as needed to achieve that.

2 mls thick, 10 mls thick, 30 mls thick?.... whatever it takes to get it where you want it.

-Paul

#1460 51 days ago

There is a project Earthshaker that I might buy for my next project. Anyone restored one? Are any parts unobtanium? Are cabinet decals readily available? Key mechs to check out? I guess the shaker motor works.

#1461 50 days ago
Quoted from killerrobots:

There is a project Earthshaker that I might buy for my next project. Anyone restored one? Are any parts unobtanium? Are cabinet decals readily available? Key mechs to check out? I guess the shaker motor works.

Yep, you can get everything.

rd

#1462 50 days ago

The technical data sheet for SprayMax 2K shows a dry film thickness of 40 μm from one can on about a playfield-sized area (how convenient!).

This is about 2 thousandths of an inch. A sheet of copy paper is about 100 μm thick.

Something to keep in mind if trying to level a playfield by spraying successive cans.

#1463 50 days ago
Quoted from rotordave:

Yep, you can get everything.
rd

Thanks

#1464 49 days ago
Quoted from dr_nybble:

The technical data sheet for SprayMax 2K shows a dry film thickness of 40 μm from one can on about a playfield-sized area (how convenient!).
This is about 2 thousandths of an inch. A sheet of copy paper is about 100 μm thick.
Something to keep in mind if trying to level a playfield by spraying successive cans.

Allow me to understand this better.
What total thickness are we aiming for after two-three coats (or when it is flat).

I have worked with paint, automotive paint that is and have extensive experience wet sanding and buffing off scratches off. All that to say, a thin film of clear can endure a lot of sanding -reasonably done- before you go through it. Technique is important.

Are you suggesting that sanding between coats must be done with care due to the thickness of this material?

#1465 49 days ago

I think it is more the surface is so uneven.
It is easy to burn thru the high spots like around sunken inserts.

#1466 49 days ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

I think it is more the surface is so uneven.
It is easy to burn thru the high spots like around sunken inserts.

Correct.

This playfield has a total of 3 cans, it needed extensive work with lost paint, sunk inserts and other assorted issues. It saw extensive block sanding and insert filling to get somewhat flat and to be honest could use one more if I wanted a perfectly flat surface. It's close enough compared to where it started.

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#1467 49 days ago

What I started with 60 days ago.

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#1468 49 days ago

Calling the Lost World finished.

Buffed up nice and flat. Nice and shiny!

Really good practice before I get stuck into some A title PFs down the track.

Just waiting for more 2k cans to arrive and then I’ll be doing Taxi.

rd

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#1469 49 days ago

Nice!

#1470 49 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

What I started with 60 days ago.
[quoted image]

Amazing work!

#1471 49 days ago
Quoted from PinJim:

Amazing work!

Would have been better but I'm trying to make pintastic.

My Flash Gordon been working on for a few months, getting into the end stages now. Going to do all the insert keylines with stencils made with Cameo Silhouette 4 cutter.

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#1472 48 days ago

I’m about to clear and touch up a Volley em playfield. I’ve cleared a newly painted playfield before but haven’t tried “restoring” one. I have a few questions for you knowledgeable folks out there:

1. How light is the first SprayMax lock down coat? Just one quick pass?
2. I am thinking of doing my touch ups after that first lock down coat. Will that coat be smooth enough to paint over or should I do another coat before touch ups?

#1473 47 days ago

Others may do it differently.

If i light up a can, i empty it.
If you have cleaned as much as you dare to, then lay the lockdown coat on.

You can sand it after and go ahead and touch up.

#1474 47 days ago

Spraymax sprayed on Saturday.

20211018_192425 (resized).jpg

#1475 47 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

Spraymax sprayed on Saturday.
[quoted image]

That’s looking sexy

#1476 43 days ago

Looks awesome!

Populating so soon?

#1477 43 days ago
Quoted from Barr993:

Looks awesome!
Populating so soon?

Stand ups don’t matter. They don’t sit on the surface

#1478 43 days ago

I thought that was a post screwed down in the background but now realize it's just standing there. It's so shiny the deep reflection got me!

#1479 40 days ago

Hey folks,

This is an awesome thread! I started reading the first few pages, but there are 30 pages in all so far. I have a Cyclone playfield that I want to clear with a couple of cans of Spraymax 2k that I purchased about 2-3 years go. They have never been used.

Does anyone know if there is a step by step set of instructions that someone with experience with this stuff may have put together and is on one of the thread pages?

Thank you.

#1480 40 days ago
Quoted from rdrapeau3171:

Hey folks,
This is an awesome thread! I started reading the first few pages, but there are 30 pages in all so far. I have a Cyclone playfield that I want to clear with a couple of cans of Spraymax 2k that I purchased about 2-3 years go. They have never been used.
Does anyone know if there is a step by step set of instructions that someone with experience with this stuff may have put together and is on one of the thread pages?
Thank you.

They are in the vids giude for playfield restoration:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-ultimate-playfield-restoration

Dont be lazy, read up on it.

#1481 40 days ago
Quoted from Barr993:

I thought that was a post screwed down in the background but now realize it's just standing there. It's so shiny the deep reflection got me!

It will be at Pintastic if you want to give it a play.

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#1482 39 days ago
Quoted from rdrapeau3171:

of Spraymax 2k that I purchased about 2-3 years go. They have never been used.

it only has a 1 year shelf life.

#1483 39 days ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

it only has a 1 year shelf life.

Well, I may be safe. I ordered two cans back on May 21, 2020. I had found one of the cans started leaking about 2 months ago on the bottom so I tossed it. I am going to write to the manufacturer with the code to make sure per what they recommend below...

Here is what I found on the manufacturer's website...guess I'll be sending them the codes to my cans:

How can you tell if the can can still be used?
By the weight of the can and the audible mixing balls in conjunction with the production date that is stated in a code on the base of the can, on the knurled edge of the can or in the can dome. The shelf life of a 1K aerosol can is 5 years, the shelf life of a 2K aerosol can is 3 years. Please send us the product designation and, if possible, the item number and code so we can establish this.

#1484 39 days ago
Quoted from rdrapeau3171:

Well, I may be safe. I ordered two cans back on May 21, 2020. I had found one of the cans started leaking about 2 months ago on the bottom so I tossed it. I am going to write to the manufacturer with the code to make sure per what they recommend below...
Here is what I found on the manufacturer's website...guess I'll be sending them the codes to my cans:
How can you tell if the can can still be used?
By the weight of the can and the audible mixing balls in conjunction with the production date that is stated in a code on the base of the can, on the knurled edge of the can or in the can dome. The shelf life of a 1K aerosol can is 5 years, the shelf life of a 2K aerosol can is 3 years. Please send us the product designation and, if possible, the item number and code so we can establish this.

thanks for sharing this.

#1485 37 days ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

They are in the vids giude for playfield restoration:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-ultimate-playfield-restoration
Dont be lazy, read up on it.

I've reviewed most of Vid's thread on playfield restoration in the past. I went back to it and there are now 154 pages to this thread, which is really great and incredible, but that is a lot of information to read through and to try to digest and get to the meat of what one needs. Hence, the reason I was asking if any one may have put together a more condensed step by step set of instructions that would cover how to prep the playfield prior to using Spraymax 2k, and then how to apply Spraymax 2k clearcoat to the playfield?

Thanks.

#1486 34 days ago

Last playfield item is done!

20211031_171853 (resized).jpg
#1487 34 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

Last playfield item is done!
[quoted image]

Looks beautiful!

#1488 34 days ago
Quoted from Barr993:

I thought that was a post screwed down in the background but now realize it's just standing there. It's so shiny the deep reflection got me!

It does look great. I get jealous of the dryer cooler weather just for how it allows that to flow out and dry nicely. The heat and humidity down here in FL makes it set up quickly so there is some orange peel that needs to get sanded and buffed out before it looks nice.

Quoted from gdonovan:

Last playfield item is done!
[quoted image]

That playfield has come a long long way from where you started with it. Great job!

#1489 34 days ago
Quoted from bigguybbr:

That playfield has come a long long way from where you started with it. Great job!

Thank you, better than I thought it would frankly!

#1490 33 days ago
Quoted from rdrapeau3171:

I've reviewed most of Vid's thread on playfield restoration in the past. I went back to it and there are now 154 pages to this thread, which is really great and incredible, but that is a lot of information to read through and to try to digest and get to the meat of what one needs. Hence, the reason I was asking if any one may have put together a more condensed step by step set of instructions that would cover how to prep the playfield prior to using Spraymax 2k, and then how to apply Spraymax 2k clearcoat to the playfield?
Thanks.

If you have an old junked playfield to practice on, that would be the best place to start.

pinballinreno posted a summary of his method a few months back https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/the-spraymax-2k-auto-clear-in-a-can-club/page/27#post-6355972

#1 priority is good surface prep and getting the playfield as clean as possible before you start. If you slack on that, the final result is terrible. Use isopropyl alcohol and a magic eraser to remove ball swirls, naptha to remove other crud. Remove mylar and the adhesive left behind with whatever method works for you. Use either rapid tac or Mother's CMX to remove any remaining wax or silicone residues remaining, especially around shrunken inserts and planked playfields that have been waxed a lot. Anything left over will cause fish eyes in your clearcoat.

Down here in Florida, our added struggle is with the heat and humidity causing it to set up too quickly, so our process won't be the same as everyone else's. I find that I spend more time sanding flat orange peel texture because of rapid set up times not allowing it to flow out nicely. I even add an extra coat to get sufficient build up to fill small surface imperfections since it requires more sanding.

All that said, this week is perfect for this with the weather in the 70's F. I've been painting a cabinet the last few days, and it is amazing how much better it is turning out with less fuss than my usual.

1 week later
#1491 22 days ago

I’m about to clear my Volley playfield and am thinking of spraying a light lockdown coat and then do touch ups.

How soon after spraying the lockdown coat can I start painting? I’ll be using Createx paint by brush because the touch ups are quite minor.

#1492 22 days ago

I would say next day.

#1493 18 days ago

I am seriously thinking of getting one of these. I don't know about you but I don't have the patience to shake for 5 minutes.

#1494 17 days ago

1) Adam is looking old.
2) wouldnt the paint simply equalize on the outside of the can and ride around like a teenager on the tilt-a-whirl at a carnival?
Some mixing would occur but the agitator ball would stay in one place.
Just my opinion.

#1495 17 days ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

1) Adam is looking old.
2) wouldnt the paint simply equalize on the outside of the can and ride around like a teenager on the tilt-a-whirl at a carnival?
Some mixing would occur but the agitator ball would stay in one place.
Just my opinion.

The shank is offset from the center of the can holder, so the vibration prevents that from happening. Looks like a very neat tool.

#1496 17 days ago

While looking for this tool, I came across this DIY version you can make from some 3" plastic pipe and a test plug:

https://m.roadkillcustoms.com/diy-drill-powered-spray-paint-can-shaker/

While the shank (actually the bolt from the test plug) is centered, it seems to do a good job; perhaps due to not being able to exactly center the can in the pipe. (he uses an old piece of T-shirt to hold the can somewhat in place)

#1497 16 days ago
Quoted from PinballBillinFL:

While looking for this tool, I came across this DIY version you can make from some 3" plastic pipe and a test plug:
https://m.roadkillcustoms.com/diy-drill-powered-spray-paint-can-shaker/
While the shank (actually the bolt from the test plug) is centered, it seems to do a good job; perhaps due to not being able to exactly center the can in the pipe. (he uses an old piece of T-shirt to hold the can somewhat in place)

That one looks pretty straight forward. I actually couldn't find the one Adam used on Amazon (and his did break while filming). Say this one for $12 which I will try out. Obviously it is not a complicated piece of technology.

amazon.com link »

#1498 16 days ago
Quoted from killerrobots:

That one looks pretty straight forward. I actually couldn't find the one Adam used on Amazon (and his did break while filming). Say this one for $12 which I will try out. Obviously it is not a complicated piece of technology.
amazon.com link »

Nice find, and NO assembly required! LOL Good price too, unless you happen to have the parts lying around. Think I'll try one too!

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