(Topic ID: 290984)

Let’s Talk Pinball Pricing!

By wolverinetuner

3 years ago


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    #590 1 year ago
    Quoted from Luppin:

    I fell in live for Swords of Fury without ever playing or seeing it live. The music, the legend, the (relative) rarity, the theme, everything looked amazing to me. Took very long to find it and buy it. Once I got it I loved it for.... 10 plays. Then I tried desperatly to keep loving it, but the game is shit, its a turd. Sold it after a month, and I was and still am so glad to get rid of that dog. I also then had other honeymoons with other titles, but after the Sof lesson I realized that rare games are rare for a reason. And very rare games are very rare for the same reason: they are turds.

    Often this is true.. however there are way too many exceptions on both sides of the equation to make any sort of rule out of the statement.

    for example, look at the original production runs for MM, AFM, MB.. there is a reason that CGC has done well with remakes.

    Many of the classic Sterns of the day were relatively low production and seen as cheap garbage, but ask any solid player what they think of those titles now and they are coveted for gameplay and collectibility.

    And on EMs, I often scratch my head at the over 7k production run for Jubilee.

    2 months later
    #674 1 year ago
    Quoted from Kkoss24:

    So does CEs trading for baseball cards or someone selling a new pin for 3500 loss mean that bubble finally popped ? Only new games holding they’re value are cornerstones from team Elwin .Carry on
    [quoted image][quoted image]

    Historically (pre covid) nib was always a bit hit and miss with exceeding msrp. Typically you would expect to lose a bit over your final cost... As you should.

    Bump this thread when TZ / taf etc dip below 2018 pricing and we'll talk bubbles...

    #691 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Why are you talking about games that were made 20-30 years ago?
    In today's market, unlicensed themes don't sell.
    The remakes are an anomaly. They are old games. They'll continue to sell based on the goodwill, nostalgia, and reputation of decades past.
    Spooky's recent "Haunted House" game sold about 200 units and it took forever to clear them out. Today's buyers don't want unlicensed games, they want their "dream theme." The fact that this wasn't true decades ago has zero bearing upon today.

    I'd add as well, that a hot seller for CGC vs a hot seller from Stern are likely quite different numbers wise.

    #702 1 year ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    Medieval Madness is one of the most famous modern pins of all time. People who've never played physical pinball know it.
    New collectors would join the hobby and that would be the first game they wanted.
    It's perpetually living at the top of the silly Pinside Top 100, which might be pointless but is also undeniably a resource some people look at.
    I'm running a team with beginners in a local league, they all ask to play MM because they know it from playing it in an app on their phone.
    Collectors buy it because it's a known thing, and hyped up. Ops buy it because it's been a proven earner for decades.
    All of the things that a license brings to the table are there, and then some. How many licenses can you get that come with the CAD files, all the rules, and a built in market?

    "Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed. The ability to destroy a castle is insignificant next to the power of the Star Wars license."

    #714 1 year ago
    Quoted from MikeS:

    Save your money for Galactic Tank Force if you want an original theme. American Pinball games are built well and this one has Nordman as the designer. Hopefully it will be a good seller and open the door to other unlicensed games. If I were a betting man though I'd say that Spooky will sell more Scooby's than American will of Galactic Tank Force even without a big name designer or programmer. That's the power of a strong license.

    Yeah, as much as the hardcore pinball player community would like to think it is them that drives the market.. this does not seem to be the case.

    Same sort of case with operators.. we might love to think it is the hardcore players generating revenue.. but in most coin drop cases, it is casuals etc.

    ... and casuals are going to be excited about Stranger things much more than a title that might have a superior layout and sound package etc.

    #755 1 year ago
    Quoted from dpadam450:

    Always something new on the horizon. But we can't even talk about pinball machines if literally we don't even notice that pinball toppers themselves are the leanest, most easy produced cheap product, and Stern isn't willing to sell them for a decent price. If this is all we get is that toppers are dumb, overpriced and people that buy them are stupid, there isn't anywhere to go with the discussion.

    Some of the toppers definitely have some complexity... but even the most complex (SOR) from 2019 was $600MSRP IIRC., and people still freaked out...

    #764 1 year ago
    Quoted from gonzo73:

    I bought my first Pinball Machine on December 14, 2012..
    $2400...
    I thought that was going to be my limit...
    Oh the innocence of a Newbie....
    And yes.... I way over payed.
    A year later I went to my first live Captains Auction, the same Title in similar players plus condition sold for $700...uhhg !!
    I learned alot about the Hobby at that auction.

    What machine was it?

    Idk what about the lesson. If you have $ and there is something you want, and it is worth it to you for what the product brings, then I'd consider it reasonably spent.

    Possibly had you wanted the title.. You might have been bidding back and forth at captains up to what you paid anyway. Never know how many people are buying with their heart at auction.

    #766 1 year ago
    Quoted from gonzo73:

    One of the lessons was, don't buy the first game that pops up...
    You can eventually find any title.... well except a Atari Road Runner...
    In fact... two of the same title sold at the auction that day... both for $700... double Uuugg.
    I was excited to get my first pin, and didn't know anyone in the hobby...
    Two years later I had half a dozen pinball friends and realized there were other avenues to buy games, other than the Retail showroom I bought from.
    Live and learn.
    I've over paid for a third of my games' because I Had to have it...
    Paid marked price for a third
    And got real deals for the remainder.
    So I have done alright in the end.

    Nice. Yeah.. The retail market can be a hard lesson. Still for your first pin, id assume that the retail option gives a lot more piece of mind and having something fully working without too much mucking about.. Esp without knowing anyone in the pin world.

    #793 1 year ago
    Quoted from dpadam450:

    Well my apologies then, I'm just saying of anyone in the world right now. I'm literally pricing pieces of raw steel to shop to manufacture pinball games. I'm trying. May not work out, but damn I put in the time to know what I'm talking about. Not sure what Levi guys experience in life+work is. My track record already is every employee at EA + Take Two Interactive that trusts my work on billion dollar products sold every year. I mean, I'm a good dude, I like learning stuff and having convos with good people. I've only been in this whole pinball world for 4 years. Levi dude I guess I'm just better off to block him and forget, because he simply isn't offering anything that interests me. I've talked with 1000+ people at tradeshows, my email list is 500 people. I'm on pinside because I enjoy talking and engaging with pinball fans. For all anyone knows I'm 12, signed up for pinside because I like it. Enlighten people if you know something better. But yea, I mean not much else to talk about.

    For many of these posts, especially for longer time members, they've seen it ad nauseam over the years... You could shoehorn variables for the numbers etc.. but the concepts, and ratios, previous experience etc. are always the same... So if it seems like people are exasperated in their responses, I'd suggest giving the benefit of the doubt, that this is the case.

    #807 1 year ago

    $750CDN Cheetah off CL. 2017, Thankfully, it was not on the radar of many like it is now. Had a good pinball friend help me out with it.. Quite a few people passed on it,.. but the owner was dead firm on the price, that was what he paid for it 12 years earlier.. and by gum, that's what he was going to get.

    Wish I still had it, but traded a couple of years later for a really nice T3... which was my entry into DMD (DMDs were kind of beyond me at that time, I could not fathom spending so much on myself for a hobby.. lol). T3 later sold for $5400CDN, to help fund my BKSOR LE that a friend was selling, (bit of a price hike as well due to it coming with the topper [more on this later], which was already money at that stage)... . (By this point, there is no longer any mind barrier to spending higher sums of $ lol).... and by this point I have gone through 50 or 60 some odd machines, learning as I go, churning in and out, keeping what I really liked.

    I really loved that topper... but reading the crazy sales on it, reading about people needing to repair the intricate machinery of it, and particularly watching the head shake back and forth as people gave the machine hard nudges, really made me consider if I have pinballs for playing or for looking at. Sooo I went ahead and took the next crazy offer on my topper this time ($3800CDN).. and really have enjoyed not needing to worry about the liability of freaking bank sitting on the top of the machine while I'm trying to play.

    2 months later
    #826 1 year ago
    Quoted from NC_Pin:

    Prices have dipped a bit... maybe 10% YoY.... some games may not have changed or gone up a bit, while others have dropped a little more. As long as new games are pushing $10k it is hard to see games dropping too much more.
    so...
    The bubble has likely "popped" - but it didn't do much anyway. Much ado about... nuddin'

    That was the extra demand during the covid bubble. Part shortages and what not.

    2 weeks later
    #856 12 months ago
    Quoted from Karnevil9:

    Is it worth it? I’m a big collector of all things Star Trek and this would be my best get ever I think.
    [quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

    That's amazing. Price is quite good imo someone will snap it up with that kind of pedigree.

    3 years ago this was the price for another one with a good story.
    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/for-sale-star-trek-the-next-generation-142

    #857 12 months ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    He doesn't need monies, he needs less pinball machines he's never going to use.

    Hard to say.. he kept it for a long time.

    In other news, Alien Day pinball sale huh? change is def. in the air.

    #860 12 months ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Not really, he does quite a lot of directing work these days.
    Seems to be hitting the market at the peak after the Final Picard season.

    Interesting.. yeah, close the chapter in the show, sell the nostalgia that is in the way.

    Be curious how many of the other cast members still have their machines.

    #863 12 months ago
    Quoted from Karnevil9:

    I was just told it’s in mint condition because it’s been in storage all these years and it only has about 50 plays on it. Michael Dorn sold his for $12,500 four years ago.

    That one must have been very handsome.

    #867 12 months ago
    Quoted from JediPimp:

    The real question is, what ROM does he have? This game had a bunch of “secret” ROMs that went out to select machines.

    Where is the reference for that? I'm guessing just the "silly" sound roms?

    3 weeks later
    #882 11 months ago
    Quoted from Karnevil9:

    You called it, man. I’m already replacing the rubbers and a bunch of lights. I wiped it clean ( a LOT of dust and grime). The batteries were severely corroded (but easily replaced and I cleaned the heck out of the battery holder with a wire brush). I cleaned and waxed the playfield, added new balls. It’s actually playable right now, although the flippers are pretty weak and sluggish. The left flipper sticks a little. I’ve been playing it, but I can’t wait to rebuild those flippers. With all working lights and new flippers it’s gonna be pretty sweet.
    [quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

    Thank you for sharing where this beauty ended up!

    Congratulations!

    I would recommend still full removal of the battery holder. There is a leeching process where it will continue to corrode the circuit. Needs to be completely removed and neutralize anything from that point and you'll hopefully save the mpu.

    1 week later
    #905 10 months ago

    minus the 13.5% final value fee from eBay and the sellers are practically giving them away... topper sold separately...

    3 months later
    #968 7 months ago
    Quoted from TylerTheTired:

    Good question. If I can sell off some extra stuff from another hobby, probably $500ish for now... .

    Bruh...

    Seriously tho, I'd look to get to know a local club, it's possible that someone might have a less desirable but honest playing well condition machine they will let go in that range.... At minimum, you'll hopefully make friends / contacts who may help you out with your first pick up.

    I think it's important that the first machine at least plays well.. or it won't be a fun hobby...

    #975 7 months ago
    Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:

    Games still move when listed for a good price. I had deposit in hand for my swords of fury within 2 hours of listing pending delivery to a pinball show I'm already going to. I sold it for $350 less than I bought it a couple of months ago, but it still sold quickly. Pins will still sell quickly if you list them at/below market prices.
    Will be interesting to see how many pins move and at what prices at the show though.

    Absolutely.

    While I think NiB price increases have given many buyers some pause.. Desirable used games such as SoF do seem to get snapped up quickly.

    #977 7 months ago
    Quoted from Break8ers:

    What is happening now in the pinball world is really no different than what has happened over the years to a lot of other hobbies.

    While there are some comparables to be made, there are key differences as well.

    Pinball being a depression era invention, if the home market dies, it has a potential to survive on location
    At the same time, if locations go down, it has proven to survive in homes
    Each machine has its own unique features, so there is a appeal for owners to have several, and for people to travel to others
    Machines span many eras, so there is an incredible depth to learn about
    Emulation is not as direct as for example video arcades, so there is more rationale to play or own the real thing
    It's an inclusive amusement device for *all*, and in many locations and at homes, it is a social activity
    Affordable for the average person to either own a machine, or be able to play it at location

    I could not think of any hobbies that could check all of the above boxes.

    Quoted from Break8ers:

    Should be an interesting next few years--everything goes in cycles.

    Definitely cycles, difficult to predict this one... I'm fortunate enough to have some active local groups, and have observed the 'kids' grow up into bigger pinball fanatics than their parents.

    1 month later
    #1031 5 months ago

    Is the conclusion that things still seem priced high? I typically think about the initial MSRP for the game, not the current MSRP. MSRP has gone up so much since many of these were first launched. Also, for LE buyers, I presume routed condition would impact these more than the pro market.

    I'm not seeing any priced less than a Stern Pro? perhaps those are sold already?

    #1035 5 months ago
    Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:

    I'm calling it now. We will see the first used Godzilla Premium sell for less than the MSRP price of a NIB stern Pro by Christmas 2024.
    Not complaining.

    A good price baseline candidate. Seems like it must be a very high production prem, as opposed to other recent titles.

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