They did say Sorcerer is coming out this month, the 20th, according to the newsletter.

SPA on the Switch is also getting portrait and touchscreen modes.

SPA now has the portrait mode working. I know it's not as good as having the real machine, but it is pretty slick playing it on a rotated tv. Just wondering if they are going to keep up with code updates like with Ghostbusters when they start working on that machine IRL.

They should take a page from the Rocksmith guys, they also do a weekly stream including at least one of the devs and they demo the latest DLC with good production. It's an actual talk show.

I wonder what those guys actually do at Farsight, they're definitely not developers. Hopefully not QA.

I would guess that they probably clown around and screw off all day. They wouldn’t even make giid janitors because they’re too immature.

Screenshot (resized).png

Goodnight, sweet prince.

I consider them at least partially responsible for the resurgence in pinball in the last decade, so it will be interesting to see if this has any flow-on effect on the prices of used WMS/Bally machines.

Wonder who the licensor is they're dealing with... Scientific Games, or Planetary?

I think Scientific Games still at least still owns some of the rights.

Wow, well I guess that explains why no new Williams or Bally pinballs have been released recently...

We just had Banzai Run like a month or two ago.

I caught myself just after I posted that, but i guess not before you started to quote me.

Here is some info from a forum website:

Williams/Bally Table Announcement FAQ

1. Why has the license not been renewed? Whose decision was it?
The company that controls the WMS IP chose not to renew our agreement.

2. When will the Williams/Bally tables stop being sold?
June 30th

3. Will there be discounts on the tables before the contract expires? If not, why?
No, our agreement with WMS prohibits there being any sales on their tables before we have to take them off the market.

4. Will there be any updates/bug fixes for the tables before/after the contract expires?
Yes, we will continue to support all of the tables in Pinball Arcade.

5. What will happen to the tables that are already owned (or unlocked, as with the Kickstarter rewards) once the contract expires?
Everyone who owns a WMS table will still own it, and have full access to it. We will modify the game via updates before June 30th on each platform so that players can no longer buy WMS tables if they haven’t already. In most cases, if you don’t own a WMS you won’t be able to see that table in the game at all.

6. Would future hardware (iPhones/iPads, Android devices) be updated to allow the Williams/Bally tables to work correctly, or will there be a time when these are completely unplayable?
We will continue to support all of the tables in Pinball Arcade for customers who bought them. This includes support for users who need to re-download tables they’ve already bought.

7. With the loss of the Williams/Bally tables, what's the future of the app? Will we see it continued with new non-Williams/Bally tables?
Our “Season 8” release will include all of the Stern tables that we’ve done to date for SPA plus a couple more. We will continue to develop and release non-WMS tables. Once the WMS tables are removed from sale, the remaining tables for sale in the game (Stern, Gottlieb, and Alvin G) will be restructured into different packs based primarily on the table manufacture.

8. What's happening with the staff at FarSight? Will there be layoffs?
There are no plans to lay off any FarSight staff.

9. Is FarSight working on other projects?
Yes, in addition to developing many more digital versions of Stern tables, more Gottlieb tables, possibly more tables from other manufactures, and an awesome 2D pinball experience for mobile, we’re working on a couple new cross-platform games that are yet to be officially announced – primarily for console.

10. This sucks, right?
We are very disappointed by the WMS license holder’s decision – so it’s not great. But we’ll be working to enhance the players’ enjoyment of all of the tables in Pinball Arcade for years to come.

No more Bally & Williams? They aren't gonna stay in business with Gottleib & Premier games. Even porting newer Stern games isn't(IMO) gonna bring in the cash.

I thought not being able to publish on the 360 for the longest time was the company's biggest setback.

I'm betting the vpforums curmudgeons are doing a victory lap.

How long does PPS have the B/W licence? Bit of a worry

WTF Rick?!

If they released more of Sterns modern titles like MET, TWD, GOT, IM, SM, Tron, BM66, I think there would be a lot of interest.

My concern would be that TPA couldn't handle it. GB runs fine in SPA, but stutters in TPA on my hardcore gaming PC, which does not bode well for the average TPA player.

What kind of boneheaded business sense would you have to not at least allow a deal to keep selling the existing titles?

The tables have been converted and cost literally nothing to the licensor while providing (granted, I am sure diminishing) income stream. This is just outright stupid.

I sure as hell hope its not some stupid Zen pinball deal, so they can have exclusive B/W into Pinball FX. I don't want Zen's Zero-G physics on my B/W tables.

Visual pinball + pinmame came first and like many others paid emulators the free ones do more. Also like other paid ones they used part work load that was done for free to help them with there own app.

If they're not gonna be allowed to sell anymore tables after June 30th, and if you buy them you can keep them forever, I'm guessing that if they've got anyone with any brains in the building, those prices will be slashed sooner to the date to make sure they don't leave any money on the table.

3. Will there be discounts on the tables before the contract expires? If not, why?
No, our agreement with WMS prohibits there being any sales on their tables before we have to take them off the market.

Which is complete BS unless the contract states specifically that tables can't go on sale if their licensee is not renewed (doubtful). I have all but one full season and I've yet to pay full price for a single one. They always put them on sale.

Guessing you play on Steam lol

Looks like no VR support ever for Bally/Williams games. It was probably a long shot anyway, but I had a tiny bit of hope that it would happen. Anyway, kind of a sad about this. Oh well, at least all the Stern games will be merged with the main version of TPA now -- I couldn't stand the Stern version of TPA. The UI and loading times were ridiculous.

This was probably about money. Rick wanted more money and TPA didn't have more money to pay.

I don't think anyone in the vp community really cares because they all know the VPX equivalent of any pinball arcade table is by far superior.

From what Farsight is claiming, WMS decided to take their ball and go home.

Nope, play on my I-PAD.

Ahh, must be nice, no sales in a long time on PS4.

It is Scientific Games (formerly WMS) decision. TPA alluded to this on Facebook. They might just develop the titles themselves.

Oct 2020

I believe that the WMS licenses have two parts and that mechanical pinball and digital are different. Does anyone know for sure that PPS holds both?

When I saw this this morning, my first thought was that this is just a ploy to sell more. They may not be lying, but they may not be telling the full truth either. By making everyone think that this is the last time they'll ever be able to buy the tables, everyone is going to buy them all up.

But what I think they're leaving out is that renegotiations are in the works and the way things are going, the final deal won't be ready until after the deadline. Then boom! Games back on sale with a "We're Back. 40% sale!" Then everyone who were on the fence about buying before will be buy these up.

Just like how MoviePass announced that the "movie everyday plan" may never be back. Then a week later, it was, because they didn't want to discredit the current promotion.

#SalesTactic

Its possible but unlikely in my opinion. They know they have been under performing and burning their audience would be bad for business. More likely, IMO, is a another company has negotiated exclusive rights, maybe not even for a game. Worst case is a foreign speculative investor buying up US brands, thinking it will flip for more value, not recognizing that these brands have a very limited audience and valuation.

Keep in mind too, that the license may be worth less to Farsight as they may feel they have exhausted the rich part of the catalog in the titles already sold and sold most of what they will sell overall, so the returns to the holder may not be enough to support renewal.

Just a guess. Not likely we'll ever know.

I'm sure FS will stick around and give us lots of fabulous Gottlieb/Premier tables......

Decided to play devil's advocate here for a second... I love Pinball Arcade however they have been leveraging their B/W license and the nostalgia those titles have rather than innovating with new features and technologies - or heck even a decent UI.

So maybe Rick thought the B/W virtual pins needed a re-think, a modern update. A new license holder might give us VR Medieval Madness and actually have balls that respond like real pinballs; hitting the glass and bouncing over plastics. They also might give us a better online or competitive system. How about split-flip play with a friend across the state?

Basically I'm saying Farsight has brought us all a wonderful product but maybe it's time to pass the license on to some new blood. They've had years and years to innovate and improve things but they've simply stuck with their multi-platform money printing formula.

I’m hella pissed I missed out on the switch version with all the tables. Anyone want to sell me their Nintendo account w/ it enabled shoot me a PM.

Lag kills that idea

They do not. PPS has nothing to do with the TPA licensing or any virtual/digital licensing. TPA licensed the tables directly from Scientific Games (which is what WMS is now as Scientific bought the company 5 years ago). Visit sgdigital.com for more info on the company.

I confirmed this with Rick. He (and PPS) isn't involved with The Pinball Arcade.

This makes sense. I bought two remakes in large part because I had so much fun playing the games on TPA. I figured they would be even better in real life, and indeed they are. TPA was a boon for PPS, so it makes sense that someone else controls the digital license and isn’t renewing it.

TPA would need to release a ton of Gottlieb and Stern pins for the company to have any future. Maybe they could now make Gottlieb EM's their niche, if done correctly.

I mean, if this means we're going to get loads and loads of lovely Gottlieb EMs I'm, like, not really complaining, but I feel like that's not on the docket.

I see that AC/DC, Mustang, and Star Trek have all moved over to Pinball Arcade, unfortunately they will not let me start a game!?!

Yeah I can't get them to start either. Ghostbusters probably still works but it's a choppy mess.

There are bugs galore. On iOS right now, I can't start a game on Sorcerer and I've tried two different devices. It just stays in the camera panning mode even after you push the start button.

I've never tried to contact Farsight about any of these problems, does anyone know the best route to take?

What I'm not happy about, more than anything, is that all of the Gottlieb packs are two-thirds games I already have, and they only offer the entire pack for sale.

I wouldn't mind getting Big Hurt and Gladiators, but I was hoping not to have to pay $10+ to have any one of them. The rest of the pack was in the first three seasons I have in entirety. I have the first-season PS4 disc.

Sorcerer apparently wouldn't start up after the update that dropped the WMS assets. I was going to buy Paragon a la carte on the last day but it wouldn't allow me to, and I didn't feel like springing for another full season after buying 2 and 3 (apparently you still got Paragon with Season 7). And I was particularly wary of buying these more recently released tables that have not had as much finetuning. I thought better of getting Banzai Run in particular for this exact reason. Not sure how much attention the WMS tables are getting in terms of bugfixing going forward, after they stopped being able to sell them.

Some of the first-season games have been tuned nicely. I played BoP this morning for the first time in a couple updates and it feels better than it ever did. The ball even comes out of the jets in a different way each time (like the real thing) when it used to have this very "scripted" feel about it.

Did you download the newest update? That fixed Sorcerer for me. Just played a game on it, worked fine on my iPad.

If you are having trouble playing a table, uninstall the game and all assets. World Cup Soccer wouldn't play for me, and usually if something is widespread the reviews will say it. No one had problem. A completely fresh install of the game, and was able to play it again.

I thought I had but sure enough, there was another update waiting. Problem solved, thank you.

TZ still has black over the shooter rod "power meter" so doing the skill shot isn't easy. FarSight jacked up the plunger on TZ several updates ago and it's been weird for months now. But the overall machine behaves a little more lifelike. The slot machine kickout has a little more randomness to it. I used to let it dead bounce to the left flipper and rip the lock shot like clockwork. Then a ball out of the kicker went further left to the edge of the flipper and slid down the drain instead. Something I'd expect the real thing to do.

One game I got with Season 3 right before the deadline, and have started to get into, is Lights...Camera...Action. The playfield art may be some of the worst I ever saw, but the game itself is fun enough that I'd pump a token or two into a good location example if I ever found one. It's got that left side flipper shot like TAF or Road Show, but LCA was made before either one and it's a more rewarding shot when it's lit.