(Topic ID: 180201)

The other job.. AMA!

By Coyote

7 years ago


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  • Latest reply 5 years ago by Coyote
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17
#1 7 years ago

A few people on here that have seen a couple of my posts where I mention it, idly suggested I post here and show folks. I don't like talkin' about myself - hell, I'd rather play a game. But, enough people ask me strange and thoughtful questions, I figured this would be a fantastic place to share.

My second job - the one that takes me away from the computer - is a fun one. I'm a locomotive engineer for a small excursion railroad, and a signal maintainer. For a few hours every week, this (and other crossings like this) is my 'office':
ZwEd2lJ (resized).jpgZwEd2lJ (resized).jpg

While I don't do the detailed engineering drawings, I do go to the new crossings and determine what equipment goes where, what equipment to use and what equipment meets railroad, state, and federal specifications.

Many times I have to climb the gantries, verify lights, signage still meets regulations and works properly, or that a new installation matches what is required and what was asked for and agreed to by the state.

A lot more times, though, my place of work is inside the house -
mesA65h (resized).jpgmesA65h (resized).jpg
This is one wall, there are two more similar to this with other equipment on it. (For those geeks, the top item in the 19" rackmount is the train detection. Then on the rails under it is the lighting transformer and control relays. Then under that are the voltage/current adjusting resistors, then all the terminals and test nuts for outside wiring.)

Because I mostly deal with traffic control, my 'gameroom' and 'workroom' downstairs also serves as a 4-way, 8-phase intersection. If you excuse the mess here, when I took this I was rearranging the basement for the driving games I picked up last year, but, here are two intersection directions (4 phases, with ped movements) -
Au9hfOG (resized).jpgAu9hfOG (resized).jpg
I have a cabinet, and use this to test various setups that are possible, PLUS, when needed, to test railroad preemption settings (you know, to make sure a red light doesn't get someone stuck on the tracks when a train is coming..!)

Anyways, I'll be kinda surprised if that many folks care, but, hey. It's a slow night, figured I'd share.

Any questions about this stuff, ask away.

#5 7 years ago
Quoted from BillySastard:

As a locomotive engineer I have a lot of respect for the maintainers. Every crossing that has working gates means less riff raff that I need to worry about. 11 years strong without hitting a vehicle or person and all my near misses have been at crossings without gates. Keep up the good work.

Ah! I really wasn't expecting another railroader here. Awesome, man. If you're ever down this way, look me up.

Quoted from Pinballlew:

Very cool! Last year I acquired this for my gameroom setup and wired up a light for it. Looking to buy a RR crossing sign and a Stoplight too...I love industrial stuff.

Working with the signals, I have a lot of contractor friends that do intersection installations. They used to give me old lights that they take down, and I used to almost give them away to folks for their private gamerooms and restaurant owners, because every respectable restaurant has to have a traffic light hanging somewhere.

#9 7 years ago
Quoted from Miguel351:

That's really cool, Coyote. Very interesting stuff!
Here are a few questions for ya:
What were you first: an engineer or an electrician? How did the one lead to the other? Or did it?
Do you do the signal maintenance for the small railroad company or for the local county or state?
How far back on the tracks are those sensors placed? Are they placed at that spot based on average speed of the train for that area? Or what other factors?
What kind of engine do you drive? In other words, when you say it's a small excursion railroad, is it a place like this: Roaring Camp Railroad ?
Any railroad-related pet peeves?

I actually started out as a computer programmer. I still am, actually. (That's my full-time job.) When going to college, a local short-line needed weekend help and I applied and got hired as a freight conductor. (Hooking up trains, working with the engineer, dropping off loads, picking up empties..) One of the only reasons I stuck with it at the beginning was that it was a fantastic stress relief - getting to knuckle (bang) together 40k-ton freight cars, at even 5 mph, made a huge noise, and was fantastic for letting out some stress.

For all but a few very few exceptions, railroads handle their own maintenance. (They may contract out, but it's under charge of the railroad.) State, county, etc don't do maintenance. So, the crossings I maintain I do for my current railroad, and am on-call for emergency work at another.

The 'sensors' vary. There are several different types of train detection, none(*) of them use real 'sensors'. They use the rails as a 'circuit' - current is sent down one rail, and then picked back up by the other when a train 'shorts out' the rails, in short. Some more advanced systems watch inductance change between the rails, and can not only tell where the train is, but which direction it's going, and how fast - and time it so that the crossing activates with the right amount of time before the train arrives.
(*) - There are some very new train detection methods starting to become more widely used in the US, but have been used over the world for some time, commonly called 'Axle Counters'. In this case, there *are* inductance sensors (much like those squares/circles found in the pavement at a traffic intersection), and these little sensors count the direction and number of axles. In my pictures above, that crossing is the first public crossing to use this detection system in Maryland. In this case, the sensors are placed about 440' feet out, for train speed of 10mph, and warning time of about 25 seconds.

When I engineer (not to often, because crossings take up a lot of my time), I operate a GE 44 ton. (Similar to: http://www.trainspotted.com/photos/3840dcaed53860047ad7ba7a17cd65b0/Port-Stanley-Terminal-Rail-Winnie-diesel-locomotive-44-ton.jpg .. But ours doesn't look nearly as pretty..Heh.) By 'little', I meant that we only have about 8 miles of track, and don't haul freight - yet. (We're looking at a few freight customers..) It's an excursion railroad, which is a 'step down' from working freight back when I was in school - however, after moving and having to give up my old railroad job, I needed to stay in the industry - I liked it too much, and with computers and electronics in my background, signals and train control always drew me.

Pet Peeves? Huh. I'd have to think of that one, actually.. Nothing really comes to mind. EXCEPT maybe coworker that like to chat on the radio far, far, FAR too much.

Quoted from Richthofen:

How is the railroad industry holding up? I know the industry got a boost due to the oil trains as the US is producing more domestic petroleum, but I'd love to know whether you think the industry is on the upswing or downswing. I've always thought that the US would benefit from more rail investment.
Are pinball machines ever moved by rail? Dunno what is moved by intermodal transportation these days... but I always thought it was crazy that so much goes by truck when we have passenger and freight trains crisscrossing the USA every day.

Right now, the industry is pretty level. Last I checked, 2016 was slightly down on # of carloads transferred over 2015, and I think I heard a report just earlier that Jan 2017 was up maybe 3%. So, I think the fall of coal hurt a lot of the smaller railroads out here in the east (like in WV, and central PA) but the oil is booming the midwest guys. (Though, I'm not sure how the new pipelones will affect that..!) Also, at least up until our current President, there was new rail loading facilities down in Mexico that was allowing more good to be imported/exported. Don't know how the current administration will change that. Excursion railroads - like my current one - are doing really well, for the most part.

The only way pins would be shipped by rail would be if shippers (Stern, JJP, etc) didn't use LTL, and had whole trucks. Then they would use intermodal containers and send 25 out west, for example. (It's *possible* some LTL carriers have their trailers shipped by rail, but the likelihood of that would be a lot less..) Intermodal is just about anything - as long as it's a full container. USUALLY, it's shipments coming from ports - i.e. Boats from China. (China loads one container, destined for Chicago. It arrives on the west coast, is offloaded form the boat on to a train, train takes it to Chicago where it's unloaded an put onto a truck to get to Walmart's warehouse. Autos, Intermodal, and oil trains are biggest consists right now, in North America.. Grain is close, in the start of the harvest season.

#11 7 years ago
Quoted from BlueIrocGuy:

Cool side job, Coyote! I follow the railroad industry as well and like to watch for trains when we take road trips. On one of my workbenches is a couple of winter projects, a crossing signal bell and a Wabco signal unit from a us&s searchlight. Basically trying to get the bell to work right again and then to figure out the electrical terminals to switch between the 3 light colors on the other! Not a lot of schematics for some of these things yet on the web.... I plan to pour a couple of concrete pads in the backyard this summer and set up a couple of the crossing signals and train aspect lights that I have. If nothing else, they should make great lightning attractors at 15'+ tall!

Nice.
The crossing pictured above actually has an electronic bell, which I severely dislike. One of the other railroad employees has an old US&S Teardrop bell that's going to go up there and back into service.

Drop me a PM - I can fill you on on the H2 connections there.

#14 7 years ago
Quoted from dsuperbee:

Sweet job. Always wanted to be an engineer and still do.

It's a fun job, and if you go with a class I railroad, it pays really well. (Commuter lines to as well..)

Quoted from Pinballlew:

Think I am going to buy this today

Oddly, i can tell that's a California signal.

#17 7 years ago
Quoted from Pinballlew:

Alright I bought it...had to fix the green light...resolder broken wire at ground connection. Here is what is on the back of the signal. Need to get a sequencer.

Looks good! Different bulbs can make the lenses look different, depending on your tastes.

Quoted from Frax:

Why would anyone ever want to own a Rock n' Bowl at home... LOL

I got the game, in good shape and working for $50. My ex-wife wanted a ticket game of her own after I got the Nudge-It, and used to play it *a lot*. Now that we're seperated it doesn't get plays as much - HOWEVER, she's put more quarters into it than I put into my other games combined. (Yes, my games are pay-to-play where possible.) I kinda like it - it's addictive trying to get the higher rated payouts. Rolling squarters down a play-field-like surface is harder than it sounds.

It made her happy, which means I could get other games, like the RtR racing games. Hell, I even paid about $400 for customized redemption tickets! I also like the artwork on the backglass, so.. after we split up, I kept it.

#21 7 years ago
Quoted from dmbjunky:

Will a penny on the track derail a train? We used to tell each other that when we were kids.

Quoted from Miguel351:

Not at all.
But it does make a great souvenir for kids!

Yeah, you're safe there. Just don't stand too close, unless the coin gets flung out from under the wheel.

For a neater trick, get a penny and a dime, slightly overlay them on the rail.

#24 7 years ago
Quoted from mswhat:

Awesome! I was just at Berea Station today watching for awhile. Where I often have breakfast is right next to the Cuyahoga Valley Scenic Railroad. The maintenance depot for that railroad is 5 min from my parents house. I love watching the Century 424 start in cold weather. Good stuff! Somebody on Pinside is a member of NARCOA though I can't recall who.

I'd be curious as well, actually. I'm a NARCOA member as well, even though my motorcar has been 'in pieces' for the last few years.

#27 7 years ago
Quoted from dmbjunky:

Are there still hobos? What did they used to call the guys in charge at the train stops? Yard bosses? I always thought that was a mean sounding name.

No, not really. I mean, nothing like the amount of them in the past. Railroad police, security at yards, and the fact that trains do a lot more stopping in between major cities or towns than they do in the past.. .they're not at ALL common. There will still be homeless living along the ROW (in tents, makeshift shelters, etc), but none that 'ride the rails'.

Yard Master would be the guy in charge of the switching yard. Station Agents were the employees posted at passenger stations for
tickets, schedules, etc. There's the Road Master for a maintenance-of-way operation.

#29 7 years ago

Fantastic story! Thanks for sharing! True - in my shortline experience, I rarely see them at all. I AM pretty sure that since the 60's and 70's, the amount of them have dropped off.

Question for you - over the last 10 years (maybe less) I've noticed a lot LESS mid-train dist power trains when driving through the midwest and upper plains. Wondering if there was a reason behind that, or it was just happenstance noticing that..

#31 7 years ago
Quoted from BillySastard:

IThat I don't know. We just started running DP within the past couple of years and mid-train is pretty rare. To me, DP trains run the same whether the engine is mid-train or at the rear, so may as well put it at the rear.

True..! I remember back in the late 90's when I was living out in Colorado (before I got into railroading), I would see a lot of coal trains heading out of Denver (north- or south-bound) that would have DP at front, middle, and rear. Since then, whenever I head out to see family, I never seem to see that again, so was curious. (The only time we would EVER have something CLOSE to DP would be if we lost our head-end power. )

#42 7 years ago
Quoted from mbaumle:

I've got a question, Coyote;
How exactly does a railroad crossing know that a train is coming, and to then flip on (or off) the lights/bells and lower the "arms?" Is there a sensor on the track, or does the conductor press a button in the cabin that turns it all on? I've ALWAYS wondered, because I feel like there's a lot of variables, as in the length of the train, its speed, and weather (like needing more warning times for fog and rain).
Max

See here -
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/the-other-job-ama#post-3576817
Starting on the 3rd paragraph.

To expand on that, there are three main types of track-circuit detection - Type C, Motion Sensor, and Predictive Warning (or Constant Warning, depending on where you worked..) Here's a simplified summary -

For ALL of them, there will be at LEAST one "approach" circuit, and one "island" circuit. (Two approaches, if rail traffic in bi-directional. Approaches are the section of track starting near the roadway edge up the track a set distance. The island circuit is the short piece of track that goes from the edge of the approach across the road. ALL of the roadway crossing much be in the island circuit.

Type C is the simplest type, and cheapest. It's also the most susceptible to track and equipment variations. The two or three track segments are electrically isolated from each other using insulated joints. The controller sends a set voltage/current down one rail. The second rail - not being connected - causes current to flow through the XR (crossing relay), keeping the crossing deactivated. When a train rolls over the far insulated joints, it's wheelsets creates a circuit for the current to flow through the wheelset, bypassing the XR. This will cause the relay to drop and activate the crossing. The island will also keep the XR down, keeping the crossing activated. The train can stop, and reverse, or just stay in the approach, and the crossing will continue forever, until the train leaves the approach (and island..) Depending on how long the approach is, and the speed of the train, this can give greatly varying warning times, of course.

Motion Sensor is the next step up. It has the same general layout - approach, island, approach - but no insulated joints. A frequency is fed from either edge of the island. The controller listens on the other rail for that frequency. When the train shorts out the rails, the frequency is then picked up by the controller. Because of the doppler effect, the controller can tell which direction the train is moving, but not the speed. The only real benefit to this system is in locations that have a station or switching is done - once the train stops, the controller will notice the frequency changing rate has stopped, and will deactivate the crossing. (UNLESS a train is in the island..)

Constant Warning controllers watch the changing inductance of the rails. Using this method, the controller knows the speed, direction, and distance of the train. So, no matter what the speed, the detector will (try) to activate the crossing at it's programmed time.

The downside to ALL of these is rail and ballast conditions. Rust on the rails can weaken the current flowing through the wheelset. Wet ballast has a different resistance and inductance than dry ballast.

If you've ever been on your way home from work in the spring, and a huge rainstorm came through, pouring buckets of water on the ground, you may have seen crossings activated for no reason. THis is because the controller got 'used' to dry ballast, and when the rain fell, the values changed and the controller things the track is occupied, activating the crossing. (Or, lightning hit a rail, and sent high voltage into the controller or an arrestor.

Anyways, sorry for rambling. I'm interested in this passenger rail discussion - funny enough, I've ONLY been on Amtrak once, between DC and Philly.

#45 7 years ago
Quoted from Pinballlew:

Very cool! Last year I acquired this for my gameroom setup and wired up a light for it. Looking to buy a RR crossing sign and a Stoplight too...I love industrial stuff.

Forgot to mention - nice light! Personally, I really prefer incandescent lights over LEDs. However, as far as batteries are concerned, LEDs are the way to go.

Quoted from dmbjunky:

Is there a national speed limit for different areas like towns or just state limits?

Speeds are regulated by the condition of the track. For example, the lowest sped is 10mph, and that's 'Class 1' track. Classes go up, with regulated speed limits. Now, that aside, a railroad may have class 4 track, but still have a maximum speed of 30mph based on other things - yard, switching tracks, rural/urban, etc.

#47 7 years ago
Quoted from Miguel351:

The tech involved with the train sensors for crossing signals these days is great and all, but what I'm really curious about is: How did they do it 50 years ago? Or 75 years ago? Or even 100 years ago?

Up until maybe the mid-1970's, everything was a Type-C circuit. There's nothing 'high-tech' about it. In fact, there are still MANY installations today using the same method - just newer relays, larger signal houses (instead of having the batteries at one end and relay at the other, they're both kept in the house now..)

Old relay:
Very-Rare-Vintage-Railroad-Union-Switch (resized).jpgVery-Rare-Vintage-Railroad-Union-Switch (resized).jpg
New relay:
s-l500 (resized).jpgs-l500 (resized).jpg

Neither picture is actually mine, disclaimer. But the newer relays are plug-in style, a lot easier to switch out when one goes bad. A lot smaller and lighter as well.

So, what DCP said, about making an EM pinball with railroad style relays - if you used the earlier shelve-type, you'd be looking at a wall full of them. Plus, their action time isn't as quick as a pin relay, so it may not even work. (True, we're talking about amounts of milliseconds, but.. add that up, and you could have a problem..)

1 month later
#49 7 years ago
Quoted from vaevictis:

Cool thread. I'm a bit late to the game, but his is why I think that Pinside is so awesome. We come from all over and have such diverse hobbies and interests, including pinball! Anyhow, I was hoping someone could let me know a little more about this CNR lantern we've had forever. It appears to be manufactured by Hiram L. Piper of Montreal and is oil with glass lenses. (one red, three blue/green) My parents got it +40 years ago when they lived up in Canada-either in Halifax or Ontario (I'll have to ask) and it's currently in my possession. Yeah, it's old tech, but you guys seem to know your stuff and I wonder what stories this lantern could tell. What was it's purpose/function, any information or places to start researching would be appreciated. Thanks!

I don't know that much about lanterns, but what I can tell you is this -
That's a marker lamp / lantern. You can tell because of the arm sticking out of the side of it. Each leading car (engine, if not steam) and trailing car (caboose) would have two little mounts that that arm slid into. The lanterns were lit, and marked the front/end of the train. Since yours has three green and red, I am guessing yours came from the head of the train.

Other lanterns were either hand-held trainman lanterns (usually had a solid clear/colored globe) and then switch lanterns (like yours above, with 4 lenses, but no mounting arm; instead, it had a socket in the bottom of it to mount on switch post.)

I'm heading up to the crossing today to do a quarterly inspection, I'll stop by our engine house and grab a pic showing you how they would be set up.

1 year later
#51 5 years ago
Quoted from JeffZee:

Bump... Just found this thread. Great read! I too am a hobbyist locomotive engineer at the Wanamaker, Kempton & Southern in Pennsylvania. I've been hanging out at this railroad all my life and have been a volunteer for nearly 30 years. I've spent about 15 years collecting an online archive about the railroad...
http://www.jeff-z.com/wks/wks.html
[quoted image]

Awesome! Will have to come up and bug you!

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