I have an open pinball house for vacationers to the outer banks and AFM is the pin I steer newcomers to as it's pretty much "shoot the middle" and I like it so it's not going anywhere.
Iron Maiden I've added "Midnight Maniac" by Krocus, some AC/DC, and Deep Purple. It rocked before but really rocks now...well it's more to my liking
Rush I'm leaving the music stock as it's really good already.

Hah! Well, I know AFM is a well-loved, popular machine, but one of the reasons I have Medieval Madness is that it plays a lot like AFM, but isn't so cruel about always sending the ball straight back down the middle after hitting the central target. Still happens once in a while of course, but when I played AFM in the arcade back in the day, seems like every center shot came right back and drained.

So forgive me if I find it ironic that someone is steering newcomers to the machine, and worse, telling them to just shoot the middle. In my experience, that was AFM at its worst.

Good tip, thank you

Ah nice! easy.

Mine doesn't seem to drain that way
I just want to keep it simple for first timers. Once they destroy their first ship then they are pretty much hooked. Then I go one to explain going for the multiball and other targets. People seem overwhelmed if you start them off on a GZ or IM.

You're probably better playing than I am.

I just want to keep it simple for first timers. Once they destroy their first ship then they are pretty much hooked. Then I go one to explain going for the multiball and other targets. People seem overwhelmed if you start them off on a GZ or IM.

For sure. These new pins seem a lot more complicated to me. Rush is the first machine I've added to my collection in over 20 years. I've been out of the loop for a while, and I was a little shocked to see how complex the games have gotten.

Fortunately, the mechanics remain the same, and the games still adhere to the "just shoot at anything that's flashing and you're good". It's certainly more fun to know what's going on, and that's harder to do with the newer games IMHO, but friends playing Rush seem to be okay with it in spite of the complexity.

But yeah, they definitely appreciate the simpler games for sure. And the older games play slower too (well, most of them...I can definitely think of even older games that are pretty fast, but it's less common I think), which beginners appreciate more. I have at least one visitor who after trying out all the machines, settled on sticking with High Speed, the slowest of the bunch.

Considering joining the club. Has stern fixed the scoop issue from the factory? I know they added the blue bumpers on both sides but I haven’t kept up with the developments. Considering a pro model. Thanks!

Always find it funny when players complain about deep code. It's all optional! There's plenty of low-hanging fruit for players who don't care to learn the details. Nobody is forcing anyone to get to 2112 or saying you can only play Working Man after all 6 orange records are locked in.

Much like our beloved Rush, where you can just chill to the grooves or really dive in with lyrics and song meanings, good art (and I consider pins to be an artform) is both approchable and deep at the same time. The users can experience it either way, as they desire.

Not sure who you think is "complaining about deep code". I don't see any of that going on.

That said, IMHO you should have more empathy for inexperienced players. The fact is, a game -- any game, not just pinball -- is more fun to play when you know all the rules. I still remember what it was like, many decades ago, to not understand pinball at all, and thus to gravitate toward video games. Pong and Space Invaders were trivial to learn. I can easily relate to players who feel overwhelmed by complexity.

I agree that "users can experience it either way, as they desire", but what if their desire is in fact to understand the rules, and the game's complexity makes it hard for them to reach that desired level of comprehension? Yes, the game can be played without that comprehension, but that doesn't mean every player is satisfied with that.

Frankly, I think pinball could take some cues from video games, which tend to be better about "leveling up" the player gradually. For example, Rush could have had some intermediate stages where you could get to a "Cygnus X-1 light" mode by finishing one Time Machine multiball and Far Cry (IMHO the easiest of the two non-Time Machine multiballs to get to), or by finishing Working Man and Limelight, and making those the only two song modes available initially.

From a beginner player's point of view, having access to the other song modes just increases the likelihood that they will get into a mode where they can't accomplish anything, can't make any progress in the mode.

Using the video game paradigm, pinball machines tend to have a very "flat", "open world" rule set. Contrast this to video games that more often use challenges of increasing difficulty and "leveling-up" mechanics to only introduce new game mechanics to players when they've reached some basic mastery of simpler mechanics. As the games have gotten more complicated, the flat rule set becomes more and more problematic for beginner players.

I admit, there is value to each approach. Experienced players are going to get bored having to play through the basics each game, so you need some mechanism for letting them skip that (e.g. Tempest's starting-level choice when the player starts a game), and that adds complexity. And if your primary market is the experienced players -- which I suppose might be the case today, as pinball transitions more to a collector/aficionado-based industry rather than a casual gaming/arcade industry -- maybe it doesn't make sense to invest time and effort to cater to the beginners.

But that doesn't mean there's not value in at least looking at it from the beginner's point of view and not denigrating their own perspective as invalid when the beginners express a preference for a game that has a simpler ruleset.

HAH! Those are the 3 machines that I own!

Ever since I received my Rush Prem I get intermittent phantom Time Machine hits registered. It's gotten so bad now it's to the point where frequently I can just spam the flippers and register hits to start multiballs. My distributor asked me to verify all of the cables were snug as that can cause phantom hits; I made sure every connector near the bottom of the Time Machine was snug but I was uncertain where the sensor registering the hits even is? Has anyone else had this issue or troubleshot something similar?

Sounds like the optos in the ramp are dirty, cutting out, or misaligned. With the Prem/LE models, the ramp goes up and down and the wires can take some abuse over time. I had to fix a friend's where the wires to the Opto had just snapped within their plastic jackets an inch or two away from where it attached to the opto board. I had to cut out a couple inches of the wire to one half of the opto (can't remember if it was the emitter or receiver, but I think it was the emitter) and solder in patch wires. If either side is cutting out due to a failing wire, this could register as random hits (since a "hit" is when the receiver can't see the infrared light from the emitter because a ball is in the way, aka a "normally closed" switch). Likewise if either side is dirty, it can register random hits, and a quick cleaning with alcohol and a q tip will resolve that. Finally, if they're misaligned (least likely, IMHO) they may not consistently connect, again registering random hits, and you would have to adjust their alignment until they're looking straight at each other. The switch test menu may help you to pin down what's going on. Hope that gives you something to work with.

Yes they fixed the scoop issue...they went from blue side scoop rubbers to black!

/sarcasm off/

They’ve provided their fix, people have stayed with that, or went with NinjaCamp’s protector. Had my NC protector since May, and loving it.

Either way, it’s not a show stopper, there’s things available to address the scoop issue.

Thank you! I’m trading my mando pro for a spider man vault. I wasn’t sure if i want to buy a NIB mando or Rush to fill in the collection.

Had my best Rush planet mode run ever today, +320% mode shot boost with a Far Cry MB in the middle of it.

Now I know what an 80-hour work week squashed into about 8 minutes feels like...

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I've gotten tired of the Stern scoop fix...it does what it is supposed to do and doesn't look bad but I feel like it gets in the way of play. Mine keeps loosening up which "deadens" the ball and it drains down the middle. Maybe if I was better with my shots I wouldn't have an issue! Anyway, I plan on trying the NC fix.

Other than that completely love the machine! I have the Pro and don't regret the decision. When I play the premium out some place, the only thing I envy a little is the VUK back to the flipper.

I'm with you on the V3 protector! My dealer sent me one and the first impression I had was that it was klugey and likely to impact game play negatively. There is no way an off-center shot could enter the scoop, and I envisioned those massive rubber bumpers causing even more SDTMs than I already have! I'm still living with the V2 "fix" that was there when I took my machine out of the box. I also have the NC device ready to go for when I decide to make the switch. At the same time I will install the beefed-up bottom scoop mechanical switch I also received...

I've said it before, but I guess to balance out all the negative comments, I'll mention it again: yes, the lower scoop protector probably does reduce the number of stray balls that get into that scoop. But I've found that it also increases the number of stray balls that get into the upper scoop or bounce over to the Far Cry lock targets or RUSH targets. For me, it's a wash.

As far as the loosening up goes, I'm not having that problem. It was installed by the factory, so maybe they tighten things down more than at-home service does, or maybe they used some Loctite or something like that.

I'd say for someone who already has a third-party protector installed, I wouldn't bother switching back to the OEM part. But likewise, I wouldn't personally bother switching from the OEM part that's already installed. I doubt it really has a significant difference on the overall game one way or the other.

Thank you! I’ve been wondering what that purple light was for. Nice update.

Two biggest things with Stern’s version, the v1(and possibly v2) was also causing some damage to the playfield, as the protector got beaten up more and more. Not sure about the v3, as I haven’t seen anybody checking on it after install. People may have, but not seeing any reports either way regarding further playfield damage.

The NC protector hasn’t been causing any playfield wear, so that’s a bonus or peace of mind, for those that want it.

My assumption is the only protection worth discussing at this point is the v3 vs third-party. But yes, I guess I should clarify that's the one I'm talking about. The first two attempts are widely understood to be insufficient.

As for whether wear could still be happening with v3, I don't see how it could be, since the bumpers are directly over the area of the playfield that would have been getting wear. The ball can't fit in the space between the bumpers and the scoop edges that were getting chewed up.

It's an inelegant solution to be sure, but it should be completely effective from a protection point of view. So the main question is how it affects gameplay and how it looks. Personally, I don't find that I care that much how it looks, but surely others have different opinions about that and can choose alternative solutions to suit their vision of what the playfield should look like.

My only point was that from the gameplay perspective, I feel it's a wash. It changes the gameplay, but neither for the better nor for the worse.

Thanks for the replys! I just joined the club and added a nib pro to the line up. It has a January 2022 build date without any protection. Given this situation, what would you guys do? Contact stern for a V3 protector or go with an aftermarket protector? And which one if you recommend the aftermarket fix? Would you wait to play the game until the fix is in place?

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I'm biased on which route you should go, so I won't wade into that. What I will say is that with that v1 Stern protector you could develop clearcoat/art damage to the area around the scoop that extends beyond any protectors out there, and it can happen surprisingly fast. If it was mine, I wouldn't be playing it very much (tens of games should be okay, but I wouldn't push into the 100s) until one of the solutions out there is in place, mylar at least.

TBH, I think it's a toss-up. Given that you're going to have to do something, and given that all the various options do address the basic issue, it's going to come down to what you personally would prefer.

If it were me, I'd start with Stern and get them to send the v3 protector. If I recall correctly, they are sending those out to owners free. Not sure what if anything they're doing about installation for owners who don't want to/can't do the work themselves, but if they're willing to send your local distributor or a tech out to do the install, even better. Let them take care of it. But even if you have to do the install yourself, you're no worse off than if you'd gotten an aftermarket option, and it's what the latest revision of the game design has.

Some people love to modify their games, to personalize it or whatever. Other people don't. Which kind of person are you? That will have a lot to do with which option you choose.

Even if you don't plan to install the v3 protector, get Stern to send it to you anyway. Then if/when you resell the game, it's right there with the spare parts for the game in case the new owner prefers that.

Between the two aftermarket fixes, I also think it's a toss-up. The metal version has the advantage of looking more "stock". It's just a beefier version of the regular metal protectors, if I understand correctly. But that does mean that theoretically it could start to deform like the actual original stock part did, just taking a lot longer to succumb. I gather than the seller of the metal version has a great track record in the community and is known for standing behind their products.

On the other hand, the NinjaCamp option gives you the opportunity to pick your color, and there are several different color options that seem to go really nicely with the game playfield art. They don't look stock, but they do look really nice. In theory, the material they make the protectors out of (3D-printed thermoplastic polyurethane) should last for a long time, maybe forever, and should never itself damage the playfield. But only time will tell if these parts actually hold up as advertised. That said, I have the impression that the sellers will respond right away if you have any trouble at all with them, so it's a pretty risk-free way to go in that respect.

As far as whether to keep playing the game for now, I think you should be fine, but keep an eye on the current metal around the scoops. If you see it starting to deform at all, give the game a rest. You've got plenty of other games to play there anyway .

Wow! Thank you for the great reply and thoughtful advice. I really appreciate the time you took to write all of that. I’ll get with stern and maybe explore some other options too. It looks like my game isn’t detecting the WiFi dongle and the IC scanner so I’m going to manually update the software, and if it’s not fixed, I’ll contact stern about that too.

Cheers!

since it's NIB - contact your distributor that sold the game to get on the list for the kit.

I have a January build pro also.

Distro sent fix but I decided on Ninjacamp protectors. Pretty easy install on the Pro and game plays as it should IMO.

Finally got it set up. Fantastic layout. Borg on fire here. Very fast.

Have no idea what I’m doing code wise but I’m intrigued so far, and that’s always a good start.

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Anyone with the crap menu buttons inside the coin door get a free replacement from their distro?

And the Rush standup target sound is super annoying. Hope they change it.

The few people I’ve seen mention it for Stern games in the past few years, just take it apart and clean it. Most cases that has seemed to work, as debris has gotten in there(probably from factory), causing issues with buttons making good contact.

Funny, I actually enjoy it: Makes me chuckle as I watch the ball return to the flippers. To each his/her own I guess...

My buttons did not work properly. My distributor (Cointaker) had Stern send a new no charge replacement in a few days!

Please post a photo of the v3 protector so I can determine if my April 2022 Premium already has it or not. So far I'm ok with the scoop set up I have but don't want to overlook this if I run the risk of premature pf wear. I recently installed a full Cliffy set (except for the scoops since they still looked good/performed well) and if I have the v3 already I'd feel better waiting longer to complete the full installation. Thanks!

V3

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Also note, that final shipping version is black. So really there is a V3 fix and a V3revA fix. Stern switched to black nubs at some point.

drummermike and DakotaMike - Thank you both (Mike's) for your super fast response. Now I have no excuse to go play, I mean, inspect my RUSH game!

Cleaning out closets and found this beauty...from the previous century. First Rush concert and it's still intact. They just don't make tshirts that way anymore. I actually think this is my older brother's and he may have had to dig deep for the $9 it cost. I bought a knockoff in the parking lot. It looked super cool and literally fell apart the first time it was washed
Hard to believe I was this size.

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Contact OutpostKodelia ( Ninjacamp ) and see if they would do a protector with an extended playfield covering in that part. I'm sure they did something early on to address this on other units that had suffered damage.

Based on your purchase date, it looks like you got our v1 protector. We offered free upgrades for those folks to the v2 protector, which fixed a breakage issue (I'm going to guess yours broke on the back right side of the lower scoop, right next to the scoop's metal arc... if so, that's exactly what v2 addresses). Anyways, that offer still stands. We'll happily upgrade you to the new version if you're interested in that. For what it's worth, we also make a version we call the "fat lip", where the lip edge extends a couple mm further out to cover up playfield damage. We could send that one if you like. PM me and let me know how you want to proceed.

Now that’s service.

That’s why some of these 3rd party vendors, get lots of praise from us. Not only product, but also because of their great customer service.

The same thing happened to mine. The corner between the two scoops is hanging by a thread. I had put mylar down prior so luckily no damage. I would be very interested in the V2 version.

Put some more time on Rush today. This layout is something special. Need to get past honeymoon to really judge, but I think this one will continue to impress for a long time

My game came installed with the latest Stern boofy rubber protector (black), and I’m actually surprised it doesn’t look as bad as I thought it would. And works well also. I’ve got the Ninja one coming also, so will definitely give that a go, but I’d be happy with just the Stern one if I didn’t know otherwise..

Just one question- my right ramp occasionally won’t register. Anyone else had to adjust the optos behind the backboard? What did you do?

Hey! You’re saying Boofy like it’s a bad thing.

Back with Rush after a few month absence. I purchased a Pro back in April, and loved it. Loved it so much, I traded it off for another pin, with the intention of getting a Prem/LE. With the prices of LEs coming down, I finally managed another trade for LE #757. Spent the weekend setting it up, including installation of Precision Flip Gold flippers. Wow! This game is even better than I remember.

I was surprised how differently the LE plays compared to the Pro. Especially during multiballs, with the ramp and ball holds behind the instruments. The expression lighting is everything others have said as well, it really adds to the overall experience. I continue to highly-recommend John Simone's flipper system. The upper left ramp was always dicey on the Pro; with Precision Flip, I hit that shot far-more reliably now. In just my second game on the LE after upgrades, I set a new personal-best album record, collecting 7 of the 10. Now, to unlock Cygnus X1 and X2...

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This game is full of surprises - nearly 500 games in and this is definitely a first!

SOMEHOW I bounced a ball from the left flipper, off of something related to the right sling, and right onto the wireform. It wedged against the glass, even!

With coin-door ball save enabled it's a non-issue, just made me laugh

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