(Topic ID: 308430)

RUSH Pinball Official Owners Club-“Straining the Limits of Machine and Man”

By mrossman5

2 years ago


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#7801 1 year ago
Quoted from Paddy-o:

Not sure why you think he/she works for Spooky. Didn't see anything on their profile, other than a play on that picture, that would give any impression that he/she works for Spooky. Unless you're trying to be funny, and I missed it.

I didn't care enough to even look but when I saw the user name, I thought the same. I just took it for face value that someone knew who it was. LOL! I bet it's all a crock of shit.

#7802 1 year ago
Quoted from SkyKing2301:

Anyone else getting to the point where you're driving in your car (or whatever other non-pinball setting), a particular Rush song comes on, and you automatically think about what shots you need to hit?
Tom Sawyer came on in my car yesterday and I immediately had a 'light blue' vibe and thought "ok shoot the orbits first" ...

Yup LOL

Quoted from Tuna_Delight:

Makes me feel that much better about dumping my Ultraman preorder and going with RUSH instead.
Can't speak firsthand re: UM's gameplay enjoyability, but I know I'm lovin' RUSH's!

2-3 Ultramans for re-sale locally and in stock at most distros

I don't think you are missing anything though I would like to try one someday!

#7803 1 year ago
Quoted from Paddy-o:

Not sure why you think he/she works for Spooky. Didn't see anything on their profile, other than a play on that picture, that would give any impression that he/she works for Spooky. Unless you're trying to be funny, and I missed it.

He works with Spooky. Lots of posts on Ultraman thread as such. Which is actually nice from an info standpoint as well as somewhat unique for a manufacturer rep (to post on Pinside).

#7804 1 year ago
Quoted from Paddy-o:

Not sure why you think he/she works for Spooky. Didn't see anything on their profile, other than a play on that picture, that would give any impression that he/she works for Spooky. Unless you're trying to be funny, and I missed it.

Yeah, that person doesn't appear to be associated with Spooky. Besides that, Spooky employees are still entitled to their own opinions on pinball machines.

#7805 1 year ago
Quoted from Animal:

I don't care, but the point is, it is not professional.

It's a Spooky employee, not Charlie (the founder). No big deal.

#7806 1 year ago
Quoted from Vino:

Spooky didn’t like Rush much.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but not sure doing it with consideration of peers in the same business is the best look.

Good grief people! What are you guys reading into that post? Overall the person was respectful. The poster made one comment about the "bit of a miss" on the art work. The rest of the points were neutral, could be taken as positive or positive.

#7807 1 year ago
Quoted from konjurer:

Good grief people! What are you guys reading into that post? Overall the person was respectful. The poster made one comment about the "bit of a miss" on the art work. The rest of the points were neutral, could be taken as positive or positive.

The one miss for me was the faces. But the rest of the playfield is beautiful. I have the LE I traded for and for me one of the best LE art packages. The side armor is amazing.

#7808 1 year ago
Quoted from konjurer:

Good grief people! What are you guys reading into that post? Overall the person was respectful. The poster made one comment about the "bit of a miss" on the art work. The rest of the points were neutral, could be taken as positive or positive.

I'll be the first to say it, the artwork is not very good IMO but with that said... It didn't stop me! Arrived today!!

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#7809 1 year ago
Quoted from snaroff:

It's a Spooky employee, not Charlie (the founder). No big deal.

The thing is, I don't see any indication that that person is even a Spooky employee.

#7810 1 year ago
Quoted from shaub:

The thing is, I don't see any indication that that person is even a Spooky employee.

lpeters82 is Luke Peters - a Spooky employee (not to be confused with "Spooky Luke" who has co-designed Halloween & Ultraman with Bug Emery)

Unless you follow the threads for those games, it's probably not evident.

#7811 1 year ago
Quoted from Tuna_Delight:

peters82 is Luke Peters - a Spooky employee (not to be confused with "Spooky Luke" who has co-designed Halloween & Ultraman with Bug Emery)

Unless you follow the threads for those games, it's probably not evident.

Oh fair enough. I went and looked at some of his post history and he really seemed like an outsider based on his posts.

14
#7812 1 year ago

This line of discussion is kinda ridiculous if you ask me. Someone posted an honest but mostly respectful game review. Who cares who they work for? Save your vitriol for the assholes who post a review like “this game is a turd, I walked away before playing my 3rd ball” and rate it a 3.4.

#7813 1 year ago

I really miss middle school......not.

#7814 1 year ago
Quoted from swampfire:

This line of discussion is kinda ridiculous if you ask me. Someone posted an honest but mostly respectful game review. Who cares who they work for? Save your vitriol for the assholes who post a review like “this game is a turd, I walked away before playing my 3rd ball” and rate it a 3.4.

Yup, I didn't mind his post at all, it seemed respectful to me.

Side note, how in hell are some of you getting such high scores? My best is still just 144 million I do get a lot of side drains though, so for those that seem to get crazy high scores are your outlane posts set like mine? I usually just leave stuff as it came from the factory figuring that's how it was intended, but crikey I can't get anywhere near the scores y'all are getting.

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#7815 1 year ago
Quoted from Reality_Studio:

are your outlane posts set like mine?

My Pro shipped with the post in the lowest (narrowest) position. But the lanes are still vicious drain monsters.

#7816 1 year ago
Quoted from konjurer:

My Pro shipped with the post in the lowest (narrowest) position. But the lanes are still vicious drain monsters.

Same here with my LE. Vicious. And I'd swear there was some sort of magnetic attraction to those outlanes, as well.

#7817 1 year ago
Quoted from Reality_Studio:

Yup, I didn't mind his post at all, it seemed respectful to me.
Side note, how in hell are some of you getting such high scores? My best is still just 144 million I do get a lot of side drains though, so for those that seem to get crazy high scores are your outlane posts set like mine? I usually just leave stuff as it came from the factory figuring that's how it was intended, but crikey I can't get anywhere near the scores y'all are getting.[quoted image]

I changed the outlane posts. There's 3 positions on the left side and two on the right. I set mine to the middle on the left and top on the right side. I also put the smaller 3/8" post rubbers on the posts as well. It definitely makes it tougher. I finally broke 1B+ just recently but it took me close to 800 plays in 4 months.

15
#7818 1 year ago
Quoted from Tuna_Delight:

Makes me feel that much better about dumping my Ultraman preorder and going with RUSH instead.
Can't speak firsthand re: UM's gameplay enjoyability, but I know I'm lovin' RUSH's!

Ha, I did the same. I learned an expensive lesson on that one.

Just setup my Rush Premium today. Super fun. So far no issues out of the box. I dialed the upper-flipper power down to 182, based on advice in this thread. Ramp is easily makable and I haven't I yet had any loop shots not register, but I haven't made many yet, so we'll see!

One thing that I love about Rush, is the fact that you can make 4 different shots from the upper flipper. So cool.

Rush is now sitting next to Metallica on the end of our Music Row in The Pinball Room.

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#7819 1 year ago
Quoted from DakotaMike:

Ha, I did the same. I learned an expensive lesson on that one.
Just setup my Rush Premium today. Super fun. So far no issues out of the box. I dialed the upper-flipper power down to 182, based on advice in this thread. Ramp is easily makable and I haven't I yet had any loop shots not register, but I haven't made many yet, so we'll see!
One thing that I love about Rusg, is the fact that you can make 4 different shots from the upper flipper. So cool.
Rush is now sitting next to Metallica on the end of our Music Row in The Pinball Room.
[quoted image]

Nice. What is also great about this game is not only the excellent geometry at play with the upper flipper shots but also the banking shots attainable via the the RUSH stand ups. Not sure if this was by design but banking off the targets to the side scoop is very doable and also sometimes the inner orbit. Similar to borgs TRON targets bank shot possibilities. Also same on all versions which us pro owners appreciate.

#7820 1 year ago
Quoted from Reality_Studio:

Yup, I didn't mind his post at all, it seemed respectful to me.
Side note, how in hell are some of you getting such high scores? My best is still just 144 million I do get a lot of side drains though, so for those that seem to get crazy high scores are your outlane posts set like mine? I usually just leave stuff as it came from the factory figuring that's how it was intended, but crikey I can't get anywhere near the scores y'all are getting.[quoted image]

My posts on both sides were set in the bottom holes from the factory.

#7821 1 year ago

It’s much more enjoyable for me with the outlane posts in the lower position. I’ve cracked 1B and reached Cygnus a few times since moving them, and I have no guilt about it at all.

#7822 1 year ago
Quoted from VisitorQ:

I'll be the first to say it, the artwork is not very good IMO but with that said... It didn't stop me! Arrived today!!
[quoted image]

Are you a RUSH fan? I can see that, if you had no idea what all the artwork pertains to. For most Rush fans, all the albums that are represented on the backglass and cabinet (LE) are simply amazing. Perfect for the lifelong RUSH fan, but not so much for the casual fan or someone who knows little about the band. I own an LE, and the art package is incredible.....from the Permanent Waves girl, to the dog/hydrant to the Hemispheres naked man and brain and the guitar coming out of the drum and time machine. The cabinet IMO is even better. 10 albums represented on the cabinet alone. Anyways I respect your opinion, just wondering if you are a fan?? I am not a huge fan of the PRO cabinet artwork. Not too crazy about the cartoonish nature of it. We all have our likes and dislikes so I get it. All 3 backglasses are epic.

#7823 1 year ago
Quoted from Calgedy:

Are you a RUSH fan? I can see that, if you had no idea what all the artwork pertains to. For most Rush fans, all the albums that are represented on the backglass and cabinet (LE) are simply amazing. Perfect for the lifelong RUSH fan, but not so much for the casual fan or someone who knows little about the band. I own an LE, and the art package is incredible.....from the Permanent Waves girl, to the dog/hydrant to the Hemispheres naked man and brain and the guitar coming out of the drum and time machine. The cabinet IMO is even better. 10 albums represented on the cabinet alone. Anyways I respect your opinion, just wondering if you are a fan?? I am not a huge fan of the PRO cabinet artwork. Not too crazy about the cartoonish nature of it. We all have our likes and dislikes so I get it. All 3 backglasses are epic.

I am not a Rush fan in fact I could only name one of their songs prior to playing the pin but they have since grown on me. I don't know ANYTHING about all the inside jokes and connections to the albums but I am a collector of artwork. I guess I just know what I like when it comes to art and the style of art represented I am just not a fan of it but I collect shit that is done in a completely different style. I guess it is more Dirty Donny like. shrug

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#7824 1 year ago

I LOVE that artwork you displayed! Money......and yes one can dislike the artwork even if they knew all the albums and inside stuff. Preference of taste......I just think it is easier to like it if you know what it all means.

#7825 1 year ago
Quoted from Freedom:

Can someone please let me know about the fix-mod to get the inner orbit switch registering ?
Love this game.

Shooting the inner loop on my Rush Premium was registering only about every third time I made the shot, and after researching the problem here and elsewhere, I was buying into the "airball" theory.

But after spending waaaaaayyyyyy too many hours thoroughly troubleshooting the issue both on the game and on my kitchen table with a multimeter, I learned that the switch doesn't register consistently for a combination of reasons (none of which are "airballs").

First, I ordered and installed the magnetic replacement switch from M&M Creations. No luck. In fact, that switch wouldn't register at all during a game. It would, however, register, in switch test mode, when I waved a screwdriver or other metal object over it... just not a pinball. I removed the M&M switch from the machine and broke out the multimeter. Turns out the M&M switch is a normally closed switch that opens if a metal object --other than a pinball-- moves over it. I tried chrome pinballs, carbon steel pinballs, cheap ball bearing pinballs, rusted pinballs, magnetized pinballs, demagnetized pinballs... no pinball will trigger the M&M Creations switch; has to be a screwdriver, pliers, or other metal object. Weird, but then, I'm not that well-versed in conductivity and magnetism - could be that I received a faulty switch from M&M Creations.

Next, I put the multimeter on the stock Stern (500-9935-04) switch that came out of the game. It checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator on the switch was pressed.

So I ordered two replacement 500-9935-04 switches from Pinball Life. Before installing, I put the multimeter on both of them... same issue... both checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator was pressed. After scratching my head for some time, I took a pair of needlenose pliers and bent the actuator blade slightly up off the actuator button on one of the new switches, and bingo! It became a normally open switch that closed when the actuator was pressed... now I was getting somewhere.

Or so I thought.

Once I wired the new 500-9935-04 switch in and secured it to the playfield, the switch was locked closed and wouldn't change states when the actuator was pressed. Turns out these microswitches are so delicate that just removing or installing one can alter the actuator and turn it into an "always closed" switch. The tolerance is practically microscopic, and the way it fits in when screwed into position can also lock it closed if the wire bend is touching the wood under the playfield.

Finally, the actuator arm doesn't protrude high enough out of its slot in the playfield when the switch is installed - I had to bend the wire part of the actuator arm (strategically, in several places) to get the switch to register consistently without ambiguity. Having gone through all of that, I now have the switch registering every time the ball rolls over it in gameplay, no matter how fast.

So... the problem isn't "airballs" flying over the switch and not tripping it; the problem is state ambiguity within the switch itself (the switches simply aren't reliable) and the tight tolerance within which it needs to be adjusted both above and below the playfield to avoid said state ambiguity. Bottom line: bad microswitch design, bad design on Stern's part in choosing this particular microswitch. And for what it's worth, some of the current "fixes" being offered ($$$) to address the issue simply won't work. Until a reliable solution comes along, the fix is going to be trial-and-error removal, bending, and refitting the stock switch until it works reliably and consistently. Quite a pain in the ass.

#7826 1 year ago

I take it VisiorQ that you weren't around for the Stern style guide photoshop days?

This art package is really nice, not too busy and is its own thing.

#7827 1 year ago
Quoted from texas_compadre:

Shooting the inner loop on my Rush Premium was registering only about every third time I made the shot, and after researching the problem here and elsewhere, I was buying into the "airball" theory.
But after spending waaaaaayyyyyy too many hours thoroughly troubleshooting the issue both on the game and on my kitchen table with a multimeter, I learned that the switch doesn't register consistently for a combination of reasons (none of which are "airballs").
First, I ordered and installed the magnetic replacement switch from M&M Creations. No luck. In fact, that switch wouldn't register at all during a game. It would, however, register, in switch test mode, when I waved a screwdriver or other metal object over it... just not a pinball. I removed the M&M switch from the machine and broke out the multimeter. Turns out the M&M switch is a normally closed switch that opens if a metal object --other than a pinball-- moves over it. I tried chrome pinballs, carbon steel pinballs, cheap ball bearing pinballs, rusted pinballs, magnetized pinballs, demagnetized pinballs... no pinball will trigger the M&M Creations switch; has to be a screwdriver, pliers, or other metal object. Weird, but then, I'm not that well-versed in conductivity and magnetism - could be that I received a faulty switch from M&M Creations.
Next, I put the multimeter on the stock Stern (500-9935-04) switch that came out of the game. It checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator on the switch was pressed.
So I ordered two replacement 500-9935-04 switches from Pinball Life. Before installing, I put the multimeter on both of them... same issue... both checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator was pressed. After scratching my head for some time, I took a pair of needlenose pliers and bent the actuator blade slightly up off the actuator button on one of the new switches, and bingo! It became a normally open switch that closed when the actuator was pressed... now I was getting somewhere.
Or so I thought.
Once I wired the new 500-9935-04 switch in and secured it to the playfield, the switch was locked closed and wouldn't change states when the actuator was pressed. Turns out these microswitches are so delicate that just removing or installing one can alter the actuator and turn it into an "always closed" switch. The tolerance is practically microscopic, and the way it fits in when screwed into position can also lock it closed if the wire bend is touching the wood under the playfield.
Finally, the actuator arm doesn't protrude high enough out of its slot in the playfield when the switch is installed - I had to bend the wire part of the actuator arm (strategically, in several places) to get the switch to register consistently without ambiguity. Having gone through all of that, I now have the switch registering every time the ball rolls over it in gameplay, no matter how fast.
So... the problem isn't "airballs" flying over the switch and not tripping it; the problem is state ambiguity within the switch itself (the switches simply aren't reliable) and the tight tolerance within which it needs to be adjusted both above and below the playfield to avoid said state ambiguity. Bottom line: bad microswitch design, bad design on Stern's part in choosing this particular microswitch. And for what it's worth, some of the current "fixes" being offered ($$$) to address the issue simply won't work. Until a reliable solution comes along, the fix is going to be trial-and-error removal, bending, and refitting the stock switch until it works reliably and consistently. Quite a pain in the ass.

Or... lower the upper flipper strength. Mine and a friends havent missed a single upper flipper switch since unboxing... just the lucky 2 that didn't get bum switches? Maybe but I doubt it.

#7828 1 year ago
Quoted from texas_compadre:

Shooting the inner loop on my Rush Premium was registering only about every third time I made the shot, and after researching the problem here and elsewhere, I was buying into the "airball" theory.
But after spending waaaaaayyyyyy too many hours thoroughly troubleshooting the issue both on the game and on my kitchen table with a multimeter, I learned that the switch doesn't register consistently for a combination of reasons (none of which are "airballs").
First, I ordered and installed the magnetic replacement switch from M&M Creations. No luck. In fact, that switch wouldn't register at all during a game. It would, however, register, in switch test mode, when I waved a screwdriver or other metal object over it... just not a pinball. I removed the M&M switch from the machine and broke out the multimeter. Turns out the M&M switch is a normally closed switch that opens if a metal object --other than a pinball-- moves over it. I tried chrome pinballs, carbon steel pinballs, cheap ball bearing pinballs, rusted pinballs, magnetized pinballs, demagnetized pinballs... no pinball will trigger the M&M Creations switch; has to be a screwdriver, pliers, or other metal object. Weird, but then, I'm not that well-versed in conductivity and magnetism - could be that I received a faulty switch from M&M Creations.
Next, I put the multimeter on the stock Stern (500-9935-04) switch that came out of the game. It checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator on the switch was pressed.
So I ordered two replacement 500-9935-04 switches from Pinball Life. Before installing, I put the multimeter on both of them... same issue... both checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator was pressed. After scratching my head for some time, I took a pair of needlenose pliers and bent the actuator blade slightly up off the actuator button on one of the new switches, and bingo! It became a normally open switch that closed when the actuator was pressed... now I was getting somewhere.
Or so I thought.
Once I wired the new 500-9935-04 switch in and secured it to the playfield, the switch was locked closed and wouldn't change states when the actuator was pressed. Turns out these microswitches are so delicate that just removing or installing one can alter the actuator and turn it into an "always closed" switch. The tolerance is practically microscopic, and the way it fits in when screwed into position can also lock it closed if the wire bend is touching the wood under the playfield.
Finally, the actuator arm doesn't protrude high enough out of its slot in the playfield when the switch is installed - I had to bend the wire part of the actuator arm (strategically, in several places) to get the switch to register consistently without ambiguity. Having gone through all of that, I now have the switch registering every time the ball rolls over it in gameplay, no matter how fast.
So... the problem isn't "airballs" flying over the switch and not tripping it; the problem is state ambiguity within the switch itself (the switches simply aren't reliable) and the tight tolerance within which it needs to be adjusted both above and below the playfield to avoid said state ambiguity. Bottom line: bad microswitch design, bad design on Stern's part in choosing this particular microswitch. And for what it's worth, some of the current "fixes" being offered ($$$) to address the issue simply won't work. Until a reliable solution comes along, the fix is going to be trial-and-error removal, bending, and refitting the stock switch until it works reliably and consistently. Quite a pain in the ass.

Well, mine was registering less than 75% I'd say from factory. I put in the felt fix and improved dramatically. Then added m&m, and I'd say it's 99% now. So they do work, not sure why yours isn't. Hope you figure it out, much better scoring when it's functional

#7829 1 year ago
Quoted from Hayfarmer:

Well, mine was registering less than 75% I'd say from factory. I put in the felt fix and improved dramatically. Then added m&m, and I'd say it's 99% now. So they do work, not sure why yours isn't. Hope you figure it out, much better scoring when it's functional

Same here, M&M on the inner loop and skill shot switches, both function perfectly.

-4
#7830 1 year ago
Quoted from Hayfarmer:

Well, mine was registering less than 75% I'd say from factory. I put in the felt fix and improved dramatically. Then added m&m, and I'd say it's 99% now. So they do work, not sure why yours isn't. Hope you figure it out, much better scoring when it's functional

Mine is registering 100% of the time with the stock switch now that I have the switch working as it should and interfaced properly with the game. I hope everyone finds a fix that works for them - I just wanted to make the point that the "airball" theory is incorrect - that's not what's causing the problem.

#7831 1 year ago
Quoted from texas_compadre:

Shooting the inner loop on my Rush Premium was registering only about every third time I made the shot, and after researching the problem here and elsewhere, I was buying into the "airball" theory.
But after spending waaaaaayyyyyy too many hours thoroughly troubleshooting the issue both on the game and on my kitchen table with a multimeter, I learned that the switch doesn't register consistently for a combination of reasons (none of which are "airballs").
First, I ordered and installed the magnetic replacement switch from M&M Creations. No luck. In fact, that switch wouldn't register at all during a game. It would, however, register, in switch test mode, when I waved a screwdriver or other metal object over it... just not a pinball. I removed the M&M switch from the machine and broke out the multimeter. Turns out the M&M switch is a normally closed switch that opens if a metal object --other than a pinball-- moves over it. I tried chrome pinballs, carbon steel pinballs, cheap ball bearing pinballs, rusted pinballs, magnetized pinballs, demagnetized pinballs... no pinball will trigger the M&M Creations switch; has to be a screwdriver, pliers, or other metal object. Weird, but then, I'm not that well-versed in conductivity and magnetism - could be that I received a faulty switch from M&M Creations.
Next, I put the multimeter on the stock Stern (500-9935-04) switch that came out of the game. It checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator on the switch was pressed.
So I ordered two replacement 500-9935-04 switches from Pinball Life. Before installing, I put the multimeter on both of them... same issue... both checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator was pressed. After scratching my head for some time, I took a pair of needlenose pliers and bent the actuator blade slightly up off the actuator button on one of the new switches, and bingo! It became a normally open switch that closed when the actuator was pressed... now I was getting somewhere.
Or so I thought.
Once I wired the new 500-9935-04 switch in and secured it to the playfield, the switch was locked closed and wouldn't change states when the actuator was pressed. Turns out these microswitches are so delicate that just removing or installing one can alter the actuator and turn it into an "always closed" switch. The tolerance is practically microscopic, and the way it fits in when screwed into position can also lock it closed if the wire bend is touching the wood under the playfield.
Finally, the actuator arm doesn't protrude high enough out of its slot in the playfield when the switch is installed - I had to bend the wire part of the actuator arm (strategically, in several places) to get the switch to register consistently without ambiguity. Having gone through all of that, I now have the switch registering every time the ball rolls over it in gameplay, no matter how fast.
So... the problem isn't "airballs" flying over the switch and not tripping it; the problem is state ambiguity within the switch itself (the switches simply aren't reliable) and the tight tolerance within which it needs to be adjusted both above and below the playfield to avoid said state ambiguity. Bottom line: bad microswitch design, bad design on Stern's part in choosing this particular microswitch. And for what it's worth, some of the current "fixes" being offered ($$$) to address the issue simply won't work. Until a reliable solution comes along, the fix is going to be trial-and-error removal, bending, and refitting the stock switch until it works reliably and consistently. Quite a pain in the ass.

See post 5836, I detailed this earlier. Bending that switch has been a 100% fix for me with no ball traps. Like you said, there is a little trial and error, but at least the switch is easy to access. It was a 5 minute fix. Btw, this is the same issue and fix for the hairpin turn on mando.

I think stern maybe should have used an opto here instead of a mechanical switch

#7832 1 year ago

I installed the NinjaCamp inner loop fix and all has been well since.

Easy peasy lemon squeezy. End of story.

#7833 1 year ago
Quoted from texas_compadre:

Shooting the inner loop on my Rush Premium was registering only about every third time I made the shot, and after researching the problem here and elsewhere, I was buying into the "airball" theory.
But after spending waaaaaayyyyyy too many hours thoroughly troubleshooting the issue both on the game and on my kitchen table with a multimeter, I learned that the switch doesn't register consistently for a combination of reasons (none of which are "airballs").
First, I ordered and installed the magnetic replacement switch from M&M Creations. No luck. In fact, that switch wouldn't register at all during a game. It would, however, register, in switch test mode, when I waved a screwdriver or other metal object over it... just not a pinball. I removed the M&M switch from the machine and broke out the multimeter. Turns out the M&M switch is a normally closed switch that opens if a metal object --other than a pinball-- moves over it. I tried chrome pinballs, carbon steel pinballs, cheap ball bearing pinballs, rusted pinballs, magnetized pinballs, demagnetized pinballs... no pinball will trigger the M&M Creations switch; has to be a screwdriver, pliers, or other metal object. Weird, but then, I'm not that well-versed in conductivity and magnetism - could be that I received a faulty switch from M&M Creations.
Next, I put the multimeter on the stock Stern (500-9935-04) switch that came out of the game. It checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator on the switch was pressed.
So I ordered two replacement 500-9935-04 switches from Pinball Life. Before installing, I put the multimeter on both of them... same issue... both checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator was pressed. After scratching my head for some time, I took a pair of needlenose pliers and bent the actuator blade slightly up off the actuator button on one of the new switches, and bingo! It became a normally open switch that closed when the actuator was pressed... now I was getting somewhere.
Or so I thought.
Once I wired the new 500-9935-04 switch in and secured it to the playfield, the switch was locked closed and wouldn't change states when the actuator was pressed. Turns out these microswitches are so delicate that just removing or installing one can alter the actuator and turn it into an "always closed" switch. The tolerance is practically microscopic, and the way it fits in when screwed into position can also lock it closed if the wire bend is touching the wood under the playfield.
Finally, the actuator arm doesn't protrude high enough out of its slot in the playfield when the switch is installed - I had to bend the wire part of the actuator arm (strategically, in several places) to get the switch to register consistently without ambiguity. Having gone through all of that, I now have the switch registering every time the ball rolls over it in gameplay, no matter how fast.
So... the problem isn't "airballs" flying over the switch and not tripping it; the problem is state ambiguity within the switch itself (the switches simply aren't reliable) and the tight tolerance within which it needs to be adjusted both above and below the playfield to avoid said state ambiguity. Bottom line: bad microswitch design, bad design on Stern's part in choosing this particular microswitch. And for what it's worth, some of the current "fixes" being offered ($$$) to address the issue simply won't work. Until a reliable solution comes along, the fix is going to be trial-and-error removal, bending, and refitting the stock switch until it works reliably and consistently. Quite a pain in the ass.

Wow - what a long and confusing (and misleading!) post.

A stuck switch is not an “always closed” switch - you simply had a stuck switch due to your actuator. How you had that with the switch just in hand… no idea. You spent a crazy amount of time on simple on/off questions.

Your solution of adjusting the blade up more is needed because, yes the problem is actually “airballs”… or more accurately the ball rides up the rail as the turn is too tight. Moving the blade up helps gets the actuator more deflection from the ball.

Problem is you will end up with slow moving balls will roll back and get stuck on the switch because you’ve made it too proud.

The problem IS the ball’s location- not the switch adjustment.

#7834 1 year ago
Quoted from Lermods:

See post 5836, I detailed this earlier. Bending that switch has been a 100% fix for me with no ball traps. Like you said, there is a little trial and error, but at least the switch is easy to access. It was a 5 minute fix. Btw, this is the same issue and fix for the hairpin turn on mando.
I think stern maybe should have used an opto here instead of a mechanical switch

You will get hangups when the switch is made too proud.

The ball is in fact riding up the rail - which is why pushing the ball back down has an impact in the first place!

Trying to find the magic sweet spot where the switch triggers for a ball at multiple heights without hangups is like chasing your tail. A simple pad on the rail makes the hunt unnecessary.

#7835 1 year ago
Quoted from wtatumjr:

Look what just showed up! Dog approved!
[quoted image]

why does it appear that the [right] dog approves, but the [left] dog is angry? is [left] dog more of a zeppelin or gnr fan?

#7836 1 year ago

Amazingly my January build pro seems to have no issues with inner loop. I have not noticed any misses.

I'm not touching a thing - if it works don't fiddle with it!

#7837 1 year ago
Quoted from texas_compadre:

Mine is registering 100% of the time with the stock switch now that I have the switch working as it should and interfaced properly with the game. I hope everyone finds a fix that works for them - I just wanted to make the point that the "airball" theory is incorrect - that's not what's causing the problem.

My stock switch registers fine with some shots, not others. I ordered the MRM, same thing. About 50% of the shots would register. Installed the Orbit Retention Plastic and 100% of the shots register. Others have reported that reducing the upper flipper power or the NinjaCamp solution or the felt strip solution have solved it for them. So clearly air balls are the problem for most.

Sounds like you have a bad MRM. I assure you when working properly, the MRM will register a ball moving over it. Why would they sell them if they didn’t?

You had problems with your stock switch. You are not the first person to have defective or maladjusted parts in a new game. Just because it happened to you doesn’t mean all of us have the same problem. These are complex machines with many ways to fail.

Thank you for sharing your solution, maybe it will work for some others in the group.

#7838 1 year ago

I installed a Shaker Motor Kit last night and I'm not sure if it's just this pin or the shaker but it doesn't seem as active as it is on most of my pins I've used them on. Or I should say it's not as rumbling or force full as my other pins where with shakers in them. For instance on my Mando Pro I had to turn it down to moderate use and not the highest setting as it was extremely powerful in that pin. I noticed in the settings for Rush the highest setting is called long which is different then the setting my Godzilla. Am I missing anything? I buy my shakers from Pinball Life and it's the Rev C kit for Spike and Spike 2 system games.

#7839 1 year ago
Quoted from Deyanks98:

I installed a Shaker Motor Kit last night and I'm not sure if it's just this pin or the shaker but it doesn't seem as active as it is on most of my pins I've used them on. Or I should say it's not as rumbling or force full as my other pins where with shakers in them. For instance on my Mando Pro I had to turn it down to moderate use and not the highest setting as it was extremely powerful in that pin. I noticed in the settings for Rush the highest setting is called long which is different then the setting my Godzilla. Am I missing anything? I buy my shakers from Pinball Life and it's the Rev C kit for Spike and Spike 2 system games.

Factory shaker in mine, I think its integrated very well. In " long " setting

#7840 1 year ago
Quoted from texas_compadre:

Mine is registering 100% of the time with the stock switch now that I have the switch working as it should and interfaced properly with the game. I hope everyone finds a fix that works for them - I just wanted to make the point that the "airball" theory is incorrect - that's not what's causing the problem.

It’s not a theory, it’s a fact. I sympathize with you for having to adjust a switch on a NIB game, but that’s nothing new - I’ve come to expect it. Yes, the tolerances can be kind of fiddly. No, there’s nothing wrong with Stern’s microswitches.

#7841 1 year ago
Quoted from Calgedy:

I LOVE that artwork you displayed! Money......and yes one can dislike the artwork even if they knew all the albums and inside stuff. Preference of taste......I just think it is easier to like it if you know what it all means.

Thank You.

Yes. Understood...

Quoted from John1210:

I take it VisiorQ that you weren't around for the Stern style guide photoshop days?
This art package is really nice, not too busy and is its own thing.

hahahahaha

I was! I guess I forgot about those days and for good reason.

Art is very subjective. I am not saying the art in the game is terrible, it's just drawn in a different style than what I truly enjoy. Maybe after owning the pin it will start to grow on me? However you slice it, it's a great game none the less!

#7842 1 year ago
Quoted from VisitorQ:

Thank You.
Yes. Understood...

hahahahaha
I was! I guess I forgot about those days and for good reason.
Art is very subjective. I am not saying the art in the game is terrible, it's just drawn in a different style than what I truly enjoy. Maybe after owning the pin it will start to grow on me? However you slice it, it's a great game none the less!

I never thought twice about the faces on the playfield, to me it just looked like ‘70s van airbrush art… which seemed appropriate

#7843 1 year ago
Quoted from mstang01:

I never thought twice about the faces on the playfield, to me it just looked like ‘70s van airbrush art… which seemed appropriate

Hmmmm... Yes, van airbrushed art.

#7844 1 year ago
Quoted from j_m_:

why does it appear that the [right] dog approves, but the [left] dog is angry? is [left] dog more of a zeppelin or gnr fan?

No, Phoebe just farted and Lexie got wind of it.

PXL_20220706_185032766 (resized).jpgPXL_20220706_185032766 (resized).jpg
#7845 1 year ago

Actually, Lexie farted first. Here's the before shot

PXL_20220706_185026732 (resized).jpgPXL_20220706_185026732 (resized).jpg
#7846 1 year ago

I like that the dogs brought a cameras so they would not miss any of the excitement.

Who's a good boy?

#7847 1 year ago
Quoted from Tuna_Delight:

I installed the NinjaCamp inner loop fix and all has been well since.
Easy peasy lemon squeezy. End of story.

I installed it also. I put the piece that goes on the wire form in hot water for a few seconds. Went right on like a dream after i tried it without putting it in hot water. Would not go on.

Highly recommend Ninjacamp over felt, looks factory and clean.

#7848 1 year ago
Quoted from mstang01:

I never thought twice about the faces on the playfield, to me it just looked like ‘70s van airbrush art… which seemed appropriate

51 years old and have seen many of van airbrush art, I agree

#7849 1 year ago
Quoted from Deyanks98:

I installed a Shaker Motor Kit last night and I'm not sure if it's just this pin or the shaker but it doesn't seem as active as it is on most of my pins I've used them on. Or I should say it's not as rumbling or force full as my other pins where with shakers in them. For instance on my Mando Pro I had to turn it down to moderate use and not the highest setting as it was extremely powerful in that pin. I noticed in the settings for Rush the highest setting is called long which is different then the setting my Godzilla. Am I missing anything? I buy my shakers from Pinball Life and it's the Rev C kit for Spike and Spike 2 system games.

At the highest level, I thought there was plenty of shaking going on (though I have little to compare it to). Having said that, the shaking started to get annoying so I currently have my shaker turned off...

#7850 1 year ago
Quoted from texas_compadre:

Shooting the inner loop on my Rush Premium was registering only about every third time I made the shot, and after researching the problem here and elsewhere, I was buying into the "airball" theory.
But after spending waaaaaayyyyyy too many hours thoroughly troubleshooting the issue both on the game and on my kitchen table with a multimeter, I learned that the switch doesn't register consistently for a combination of reasons (none of which are "airballs").
First, I ordered and installed the magnetic replacement switch from M&M Creations. No luck. In fact, that switch wouldn't register at all during a game. It would, however, register, in switch test mode, when I waved a screwdriver or other metal object over it... just not a pinball. I removed the M&M switch from the machine and broke out the multimeter. Turns out the M&M switch is a normally closed switch that opens if a metal object --other than a pinball-- moves over it. I tried chrome pinballs, carbon steel pinballs, cheap ball bearing pinballs, rusted pinballs, magnetized pinballs, demagnetized pinballs... no pinball will trigger the M&M Creations switch; has to be a screwdriver, pliers, or other metal object. Weird, but then, I'm not that well-versed in conductivity and magnetism - could be that I received a faulty switch from M&M Creations.
Next, I put the multimeter on the stock Stern (500-9935-04) switch that came out of the game. It checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator on the switch was pressed.
So I ordered two replacement 500-9935-04 switches from Pinball Life. Before installing, I put the multimeter on both of them... same issue... both checked out as closed, whether or not the actuator was pressed. After scratching my head for some time, I took a pair of needlenose pliers and bent the actuator blade slightly up off the actuator button on one of the new switches, and bingo! It became a normally open switch that closed when the actuator was pressed... now I was getting somewhere.
Or so I thought.
Once I wired the new 500-9935-04 switch in and secured it to the playfield, the switch was locked closed and wouldn't change states when the actuator was pressed. Turns out these microswitches are so delicate that just removing or installing one can alter the actuator and turn it into an "always closed" switch. The tolerance is practically microscopic, and the way it fits in when screwed into position can also lock it closed if the wire bend is touching the wood under the playfield.
Finally, the actuator arm doesn't protrude high enough out of its slot in the playfield when the switch is installed - I had to bend the wire part of the actuator arm (strategically, in several places) to get the switch to register consistently without ambiguity. Having gone through all of that, I now have the switch registering every time the ball rolls over it in gameplay, no matter how fast.
So... the problem isn't "airballs" flying over the switch and not tripping it; the problem is state ambiguity within the switch itself (the switches simply aren't reliable) and the tight tolerance within which it needs to be adjusted both above and below the playfield to avoid said state ambiguity. Bottom line: bad microswitch design, bad design on Stern's part in choosing this particular microswitch. And for what it's worth, some of the current "fixes" being offered ($$$) to address the issue simply won't work. Until a reliable solution comes along, the fix is going to be trial-and-error removal, bending, and refitting the stock switch until it works reliably and consistently. Quite a pain in the ass.

Since this thread covers so many Radom variations of cause/effect of the inner loop scoring, I think this is a good detailed write up, for those who encounter a similar situation. But not all machines are the same, not all leveled/angled the same, not all set the same(flipper power, ect...). It would be nice to have a one and done fix for all, just haven’t seen it yet.

On my Premium, leveled and set at 6.7 pitch: upper flipper set at 182, and have the NinjaCamp v2 assist set(two piece) installed. Inner loop registers every hit.

Slightly lowering the upper flipper power, has helped make the inner loop, left ramp, and side scoop shots very smooth, not so jaggety. But again, that’s on my machine, may be different for others.

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Your shop name here
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