Could we start referring to all this as "Predatorgate" please? It'll be easier to type. I'll take credit for coining the term. Thanks, that is all.
(Topic ID: 108377)
Linked Games
Duck Hunt
Skit-B Pinball, 2013-
Experts of Dangerous
Skit-B Pinball, 2014
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Predator
Skit-B Pinball, 2013
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Sonic: The Hedgehog
Skit-B Pinball, 2013
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Starfox
Skit-B Pinball, 2013
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Been thinking this about a few games, anyone else feel like I do, that Pinside shouldn't have games that really don't exist yet in the Archive?
Quoted from sd_tom:The games in archive are also tagged to threads and indexable by forum. For that purpose it is very helpful to have project games in the archive as it helps find threads.. Helpful even now finding the refund activity threads:
https://pinside.com/pinball/archive/predator/forum
Absolutely understood. But if you look at the Predator splash page for example it says "2013, & 250 produced." Maybe there should be a separate designation for games in production... Oh wait
Quoted from NoahFentz:I have spoken with various individuals today, and Kevin still contends he has/had a license to produce these machines
But you already knew that because you vetted him, and you've seen it, right...? 
You never saw it before you made the cabinets. What was it that convinced you to use FOX's IP on Kevin's behalf without seeing permission on paper then? I bet it was cash.
Quoted from NoahFentz:I sure did, and for that, I sincerely apologize. I was given every reason to believe it was fully licensed, as was every pre-owner and other vendor.
Kevin even let me stick my neck out there, just to get it cut off knowingly. For that, he will never be forgiven.
I'm just as pissed as every here, as I have a lot to lose over this fiasco, too.
Please list "every reason."
Quoted from Aurich:I'm sure you learned a lesson from it all the hard way
On the contrary, if he gets to keep enough of the $$, it could be encouragement!
Quoted from nintendo:Right, and Webster continues to say that "A scam is a a dishonest way to make money by deceiving people".
How did Kevin make money if he's refunding everyone?
NO SCAM....End of drama.
No doubt! Hopefully the court uses the dictionary instead of the law! 
Quoted from nintendo:Right, so now you're going to come up with some conspiracy theory saying that I'm Kevin right? Lol
Yup, I like making things up on my spare time.
No, no, it's not that. Maybe it's just you've never been to court. Webster won't be there.
webster.jpg 1 year later
2 weeks later
If this is true
Quoted from HappyDayz:No, I'm not Kevin. No, I don't know Kevin personally
how do you know this:
Quoted from HappyDayz:He has apparently been trying to sell everything he has
Quoted from rosh:maybe it would be better if you just left this thread for good
I agree with this. Gtfo under your shill account, whoever you are.
Quoted from HappyDayz:I'm certainly not supporting or defending Kevin that's for sure
Quoted from TigerLaw:He needs to say what he spent for the cabinets
Paul could tell us this... Hey Noah, how much did Kevin give you?
And what did you spend it all on that you couldn't give it back?
Quoted from NoahFentz:I was 100% convinced he was legit
Yeah I've heard you say this before. From what I understand you thought he was "legit" because of no other reason except that he told you he was, no? VirtuaPin used to seem "legit" to me too until I found out you went ahead and took money for a project you didn't know was above board or not.
So I'll ask you again: What paperwork or online proof, or magic trick did you see that made you this "100%" convinced? You do know what "100%" means, don't you? 
Quoted from NoahFentz:By your logic, there's more than a half dozen companies that are no longer legit
No, my logic only singles out the ones who blatantly used Fox's Predator I.P. without seeing a shred of proof of a licensing agreement like you did. We saw a picture of the run of cabinets you were making, and that lent a legitimacy to the project at that time because up until then, to me at least, your company seemed above that kind of thing.
And by the same logic, imo this analogy doesn't apply as there's no violation of copyright/licensing on a blank memory chip:
Quoted from vid1900:Toshiba sells memory chips that end up in bootleg Iphones
On thing's for sure, whether Noah is lying or not, Kevin is obviously one hell of a storyteller!
Quoted from NoahFentz:that we were the only company
Quoted from TheZohan:my logic only singles out the ones
By "ones," I mean more than "one."
Quoted from vid1900:Does CCC ask for a Marvel IP License every time Stern orders cabinets
I get that Vid but to me that's another skewed analogy because Stern is more apt to have that kind of license than a kid in the basement.
Quoted from Crashnburn:other cabinet companies just sends blank cabinets
Well, ok, if this is the way it went in this case I stand corrected-- This whole time I've thought Noah's company made and applied the artwork too. If they didn't, my apologies.
Quoted from LadySlingshot:If that mob didn't bang on foxes door, everyone would have their pin. Not the right way, but they'd have something for their money. Those guys suck too
Quoted from NoahFentz:made the choice to quit his profession for Skit-B
Wow. Part of me has feels for that but part of me thinks that sounds like an extremely poorly thought out decision to quit a "profession" for a longshot pinball project that he would likely, at least at first, have known wasn't legit. Hopefully he went back, that is, somewhere where he didn't burn bridges
My apologies if this is an "off-topic" post. Posting this here because this thread is saturated with annoying posts from the following user:
Quoted from LadySlingshot:I wonder if there is anyone on Pinside who "doesn't" think RobT is anonymous.
I thought that 'kaneda' guy was banned? Or is he just banned under his other account? How is this not blatantly obvious?
Quoted from MrBally:The rules are different for some......
Clearly:
Quoted from ForceFlow:Now, since the subject of Ladyslingshot is not related to this particular thread, it doesn't really have a place here.
Quoted from NoahFentz:We took a deposit on cabinets. That part's true. It's not even close to the amount I've seen people post here, though
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:great way for vendors to clear their name would be to be open about what Kevin paid you for and what you delivered back to him
Well here you go Noah, your chance to clear it all up for us...
Quoted from Nibbles:Virtua took in an easy six figures
Wow. Wonder what he spent it all on... I personally think he's still sitting on a bunch of it. He's had plenty of opportunity to come clean on how much it was and though he comes on here and says this kind of thing:
Quoted from NoahFentz:We took a deposit on cabinets. That part's true. It's not even close to the amount I've seen people post here, though. We were contracted to do a job, and Kevin defaulted on our agreement. He did drop a deposit, and that deposit was lost as soon as he defaulted. He did receive a number of cabinets and many, MANY hours of our services in the R&D and prototyping stages, so I'm not sitting on a pile of money, as I've read in some posts here. It wasn't $200K or some ridiculous figure. It was in line with the job.
...he refuses to post how much it was... 
Pretty obvious imo that that makes his claims of it being small potatoes total and utter bullshit.
Quoted from NoahFentz:many, MANY hours of our services in the R&D and prototyping stages
This one makes me laugh too. He was already tooled up to cut and skin cabinets. So what took so "many, MANY" hours? There's no R&D to do on that job.
I call bs on that one too.
Quoted from NoahFentz:It's not even close to the amount I've seen people post here, though
Quoted from Whysnow:How much money were you paid Paul?
How much money were you paid, Paul?
1 week later
3 weeks later
Quoted from Rarehero:I'm just amazed that you can buy a house for $30k.
Because Michigan
1 week later
Quoted from benheck:him living in Pinconning
Unbelievable. Maybe the name of his town gave him the inspiration
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