That's something a confidence man would say.

They keep you on the line "just enough" so you think everything is ok. Saying there are more important things in life, etc.

There is no excuse for the poor communication.
There is no excuse for other games to be "made" and at the shows (new stuff being announced even) while Predator pre-order owners have no idea what is going on.

Now granted not everyone has paid the full money down, the question is who/what/when on the deposit list is everyone? If everyone has been kicked off they need to refund the $250 to people that did not pay based on the deadline or actually give news when each person's game is being build so the remaining $4500 or so can be sent.

Either way you guys sure do have a lot of trust in something that is taking way longer than it should be with poor communication. I thought this was being addressed?

Well, it's "my" money too. So let's get that 100% straight. I am not complaining for the sake of complaining here.

I do remember Wizard of Oz. I 100% firmly believe everyone got hosed on the greatest pinball painting in history. If I hear one more stupid comment about the "code" being so good on a very subpar game that had a nightmare preorder and plethora of issues I am going to scream.

The whole point here is their communication is subpar. If they have issues tell us. If things re delayed, keep us updated with progress bar. If there are issues personally, say something. It's not hard. People tend to disappear and yes, a lot of Pinsiders tend to attack attack attack but for the wrong reasons. I see nothing wrong with everyone trying to get some form of communication from a BUSINESS. (Who the heck came up with "boutique" as the go to word for newer pinball companies anyway)

Talk about lack of reading comprehension and twisting words. People always trying to start something on here for no reason with me. I never said anything about "him", it was a comparison/contrast to what someone like that would say. He isn't a part of Skit-B so whatever you are trying to do to get an attack on me is against forum rules.

Besides, the fact of the matter is there is no communication from SKit-B or proper updates about this. You have to be living in a fantasy business world to think that is ok so everything I posted is a valid complaint.

Actually this is what you should have been quoting:
"Seems like lots of people getting caught up in pinside and letting themselves get riled up by a handful of naysayers with no skin in the game.

Yeah the communication sucks, but we have seen enough to know things are progressing.
Settle down, enjoy the turkey holiday, and take a deep breath while you think about all the things you are thankful for in life (including the ability to even afford taking a risk and buy into a startup pinball manufacturers dream).

By all accounts a few games should be delivered soon and then you will likely get lots of info about those games. I will say it again, as soon as I get my personal game any and all Predator owners further back in the line are welcome to come see and evaluate. Fly in and we will make a weekend out of pinballin and drinking!"

All of that sounds like something a con man would say. I am not saying he is a con man, but basically this is precisely what a confidence man would say, so I thought it was pretty funny considering the situation; trying to make the situation humorous and change the subject, etc.

You quoted the incorrect text of what I was referring to. And I have a preorder, so I "can" be a naysayer. Heck, I went and played the game in Louisville last year. I drove up specifically to do it.

So yes, you do have it wrong. It's just funny hearing someone else say what he said, that was the entire point, which is why I pointed out the actual problems with the lack of communication from SKit-B vs just what someone else said about that, merely stating the humor of it.

I had a bunch of likes on that post, clearly everyone else understood that I wasn't meaning I was calling the other guy a con artist, how much sense would that make? lol

Depends on when you paid...45-90 days; I think Paypal boosted it recently to 180...but there is no way most people will get anything back if something happened. I am sure these will still come out but you know...communication.

Well you know what it is, everyone that complains is basically told to "be patient" and "this is a hobby", etc. I've heard that since KLOV arcade people sell stuff/repair stuff, etc.

If you are selling something, you have to stick to it. Especially if you advertise wares.

This is obviously a business. No communication = Customer Service issue #1.

I have people flip out on me sometimes at the arcade because we basically are no bullshitters, but we don't rip anyone off, we are helpful, and we will communicate with the customer and treat them professionally.

If people think "no" customer service is better than what we do then I am not sure what to think, lol

He sent an email awhile back which led us to believe he finally has someone TO answer these questions. Yet they are still not being answered.

Again. Zero excuse on that. I am sure the games are coming out "eventually" like with anything else. Heck a website with a blog on minimal progress would keep people from complaining. It's 2014 here and the excuses people have on here for why he is not communicating you would think it's 1955.

how's that email Kevin sent out sound to everyone?

I am glad this has not stinted any of my Ghostbusters pinball preorders for $8500 that will be available in 2019. That 2016 on the website had the 9 upside down.

As much as I wanted to see this game come out, I knew it would not happen in my heart. It's unfortunate but the risk of $250 deposit for the possibility was great but I warned everyone from when I played it in Louisville a year ago and saw how unfinished it was and how you could tell they were not going to be able to get this project on the road with the customer service stuff, people acted like I was a hater or something. I warned people about this. Everyone said how "respected" Kevin was and heck I get called out for asking someone to pay me with PayPal on these forums.

I just know that if it is too good to be true then it probably is but a lot of pinball collectors fall for stuff like this often it seems and people always are ok with handing their money over in droves.

I can only hope people have learned from this and appreciate the fact that as much as "Stern" is hated they at least have the game ready to go.

It is beating a dead horse at this point. Most people were warned about it and I myself paid $250 at the chance of it. Would I like a refund, of course. Legally there is not too much that can be done about it at this rate. He said he is going to try and get refunds together for everyone, but it's a big mess as we all know.

I stated when this was going on there is no way I will ever give full amounts on pre-orders to anyone ever. The pinball community had not experienced this type of stuff which is prevalent in other gaming areas. It's too prone to scams and people believing unfortunately. $250 is nothing to sneeze at but there was no way I was paying another $3000...

My biggest gripe is the people defending the guy like he would not do anything were stating "because he is a good pinball player and nice, etc." I mean really....I am sure he did not "mean" anything by it, but it's beyond scam point at this with no communication and all the stuff that happened. Can't drink the Kool-Aid and listen to any more excuses.

I had people think I was scamming someone because I asked for PayPal on this very forum, and I have not ripped anyone off and the seller had never sold one item, but placed a "donation" and had a heart next to his name and I was seriously called out for that.

The only reason I bring that up is because just like with the new posters trying to sell $2000 Addams Families on here, people defend the wrong people and continuously aren't aware of possible scams at work.

I hope I get my money back too, but it's been a year and a half already.

I just want to make sure I am understanding this correctly....

There are people on here that are just NOW finding out about this PayPal situation but were plenty fine to give money away to someone based on them being a "cool guy and good pinball player" knowing full well they may not get their game in a year or two but most people on here when doing deals with others are "adamantly against PayPal" because of the scam possibilities of buying another pinball?

There is a thread about how "not to get scammed" on here and everyone talks about it all the time, but for pre-orders no one realized this? Again, I knew going into it my risk was $250, that's it. I am still out $250 but everyone on here is scared to trust others with PayPal but this was ok?

I am just not understanding, this was highly risky to begin with if you paid your whole pre-order.

Yeah I don't see the point of living "lavish", I would rather have a house paid off and better luxuries than the "most house I can can afford" because at that rate if you lose your job and finances you are screwed.

I said it years ago and to anyone that would listen....all the bitching about Stern: they won't steal your money. Pinball "pre-order" loopholes is this biggest way to get people to open their wallets and not realize they are going to be taken easily. I have not and will not put all of my money down on things like this. It's asking for trouble and reeks of scam.

By the way, still open for pre-orders on Ghostbusters pinball for 2017. Not one person ever messaged ME though. Shrug.

The ring won't gain as much monetary value as a pinball machine most likely.

Honestly I'd question having to get a girl to "show how much you love them" by the size of the ring. That would not equal the girl for me, that's for sure.

If you know anything about Nintendo games let me say I got my engagement ring and a Stadium Events NTSC box for $2000 many years ago. I don't have to tell you what is worth more from that dual buy if you know what I am talking about.

I won a $5000 judgment from someone in a car crash, he was supposed to make payments. Never happened, so yeah, good luck. As I said ages ago I feel bad for everyone involved. I only lost $250, and knew going into it that was probably not going to materialize but I would have never put that much money down in the thousands on a pin. I had many arguments with pinball people as to why I never trusted this. It's new to pinball but not new to me, always a scam.

I am not sure when debts are still valid on something like this but I know with credit card companies they only have 2 years to "sue" someone and take them to court. Collection agencies can try and call and mail stuff but after a certain number of years (and this debt is 14 years now for him) I don't think it matters.

Let me put it to you this way, I don't have any records anymore, the city of Los Angeles can't even return my calls about this (which was years ago) so rather than waste my time I gave up. It was an auto accident and he owed me money for damages to my car.

So guys, when am I getting my Predator pinball? I am getting excited!

Glad to see Predator is still on its way! (HERE COME THE DOWNVOTES NOT REALIZING I TOO PUT A DOWNPAYMENT ON THIS)

Maybe I actually will see my $250 deposit refund? Still shaking my head over everyone defending this guy in the beginning because he is "a good pinball player."

Exactly this.

I still want to point out how many people defended this clown because he was a "good pinball player", therefore he can be trusted. You have to be kidding me. Sometimes it takes some tough love to get to people on here but pinball collectors have been "scammed" for over a decade all the way down to Mr. Pinball Classifieds. All of the boutique pins and paying with PayPal were basically asking for trouble.

I remember a pinhead from Portland a few years coming into my arcade trying to tell me that Kevin was the real deal and Predator was coming out. The leap of faith people have from "cool pinball players" drives me nuts.

I may get some downvotes for this, but I stayed in only on the initial deposit myself. Never sent in another dime. I am out $250 on this. Lesson learned myself but it was worth the chance "if" the game somehow made it out, licensed or not.

In with the obligatory never got my $250 deposit back and epic lol to the people that defended this guy as "being a good pinball player so we can trust him" nonsense by people years ago. That was fun. Oh memory lane.