(Topic ID: 108377)

The Official Pinside Kevin Kulek Skit-B Predator Discussion


By Xerico

4 years ago



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There are 18272 posts in this topic. You are on page 84 of 366.
#4151 4 years ago
Quoted from Stones:

Well....the Shockers beat KU.....

wichita-state-cheeleaders1.jpg
wichita-state-cheerleaders.jpg
101614madness_fs21.JPG (Click image to enlarge)

I must be getting old, because all I see in those pics are little girls. And I'm only 29.

#4152 4 years ago
Quoted from Sjsilver:

So is this a reasonable timeline everyone can agree on, giving Kevin the benefit of the doubt that he had good intentions to begin with? Feel free to fill in any blanks I am missing, or correct anything I have wrong (sources: Emails, PBN, Internet archive):
June 2011: Announced intention to build Predator after getting license approval, which apparently was fair use guidelines and not a commercial license.
March 2012: first whitewoods shown, pre-order list is established under the "No money required until production" promise. I got my number 112 5-10-2012.
November 2012: $250 deposites were requested from everyone He also announced many deals with contractors guaranteeing the low price, guaranteeing the final price wouldn't rise. Benefit of the doubt states that he just had no idea what an actual build would cost beyond the parts.
Feb 2013: I was told by Steven Woods, their "Build Manager", told me the code was 100% finished and tested. They later bailed on TPF because, as Kevin told me, "the game is just going through too many changes right now to get it back together in time".
April 2013: Game shows at MPE, art is revealed, Virtual pin announced as cab mfg. Also that month, incentives are announced to try to get people to pre-pay up to the full cost of the machine.
August 2013: I had moved from build spot 99 to 83, so 16 drop outs over the last year or so in the first 100, probably due to the $250 deposit.
October 2013: Disastrous showing at Expo. Duck hunt and sonic side projects were shown. Website was scrubbed of any mention of Predator. This disclaimer was added to their website:
"Absolutely none of the items featured on this site or any of its affiliates are for commercial sale or use unless explicitly stated otherwise.
...
All images and likenesses used on this site are and remain copyrights of their respective owners."
OBVIOUSLY this is the time the C&D was issued.
Nov. 2013: I asked for my refund, it took multiple emails, excuses about junk folders, and about a month to get my deposit back.
Dec. 2013: Aaron (klumpp) has been removed from the website.
Feb. 2014: Mission complete video, deadline set for first $3k payment.
June 2014: Deadline for full payment. Funhouse 2.0 announced.
July 2014: Game 2, EOD announced.
Dec. 2014: Announcement of bi-weekly emails, Also claimed License was fine.
March 2015: Email 1: Certain parties threaten my very existence, major issues need handling immediately.
Email 2: Project not imploding, Everything moving along despite certain nefarious parties.
Email 3: Apology for silence, I can't build them myself, unnamed experience manufacturer is being contacted, the License wasn't what I thought it was. contact me right away for refunds.
Email 4: sorry, overwhelmed with emails, responding in order we received, will get to your's soon.
Aaron (fast) also revealed that Kevin read to him what he presented as the terms of a license, which Aaron said sounded more like the terms of fair use, in the last 2 weeks.
To me it seems impossible that Kevin's license realization only came in the last 2 weeks.

Wow, I replaced you from the wait list. Always wondered who #112 originally was...

#4153 4 years ago

15
#4154 4 years ago

http://www.pinballnews.com/comment/predatorpinball.html

Kevin speaks (to pinball news apparently)

#4155 4 years ago

There it is!

This is going to be interesting to read to say the least......

"Unlike most of our articles, this one will be quite a long read and won’t include many pretty pictures. But the picture it paints is not a pretty one either."

Not a good start.

#4156 4 years ago

Reading now...

26
#4157 4 years ago

"In fact it now appears Fox had sent Skit-B a 'cease & desist' notification, requiring them to remove all Predator-related materials and stop promoting or producing the game.

This was the defining moment where whatever notion of implied consent Skit-B may have thought they had was shattered. If they ever thought they had an agreement, this cease & desist proved they did not. And without an agreement from the IP rights holder, the game could never go into production.

And yet the Predator project rolled on regardless. "

That's all I need to know.

The guy is a crook.

11
#4158 4 years ago

That means Martin had knowledge of this at a time when many including myself could have charged back the paypal payment. F*ckin journalists eh? Always in it for the glory of the story.

Y'know I even asked that guy for help? Sure does feel like a kick in the face right now.

#4159 4 years ago

Wow... Interesting read.

Can't believe Kevin still wouldn't address direct questions from Pinball News.

#4160 4 years ago

Kevin, refund OUR MONEY partially if you have to, it will reduce your jail time

#4161 4 years ago
Quoted from PismoArcade:

Can't believe Kevin still wouldn't address direct questions from Pinball News.

That's the proper way, if you're a punk rock style company.

#4162 4 years ago

What a piece of shit

18
#4164 4 years ago

Heighway shouldn't touch this...

#4165 4 years ago
Quoted from nephasth:

Heighway shouldn't touch this...

Heighway will get the license without Kevin and do a complete redesign. Let the witch hunt begin. I wouldn't want to be this Kevin guy for a million bucks.

20
#4166 4 years ago

Holy shit. The crook took money AFTER he was issued a cease and desist. Wow. Just wow. Someone needs jail time to think about their actions.

This thread may implode by the time I get up in the morning.

#4167 4 years ago

How is there no inquiry as to how much money is left?

#4168 4 years ago

Just read the story....I cannot believe the level of stupidity of this guy. I rank Kevin right up there with Vonnie D.

#4169 4 years ago

Skit-B really is the Ram Controls of Pinside...

#4170 4 years ago

So glad I declined moving off the wait list. Cannot imagine how frustrated those that stayed in are at this point. My sympathy to you guys.

#4171 4 years ago

Ok mind implosion over. Its time we organised ourselves or we will most certainly be ignored indefinitely.

18
#4172 4 years ago
Quoted from thedarkknight77:

Heighway will get the license without Kevin and do a complete redesign. Let the witch hunt begin. I wouldn't want to be this Kevin guy for a million bucks.

Exactly.

No way should Andrew even consider touching this with Kevin involved. And that means that he can't touch any of that money that was paid to Kevin. Forget about it. That would be a nightmare situation from a business standpoint and makes no sense whatsoever.

Heighway already has a relationship with Fox. They can get the license themselves and like you say, design the game from the ground up.

Zero reason to touch this current situation with a 10 foot pole.

#4173 4 years ago

To all those that had/have money in this, my feels go out to you.

#4174 4 years ago

"Soon after, Kevin told Pinball News that all efforts to negotiate a deal with Fox had been exhausted and he could see no way forward."

Holy sh!t.

#4175 4 years ago
Quoted from Nibbles:

How is there no inquiry as to how much money is left?

How could there be? Kevin is the only who knows the answer to that question. If he gave an answer, would it mean anything at this point?

#4176 4 years ago

Absolute crazy. Never had a license. Ignored a cease and desist. Finally shut down by Fox. Sorry, but it's absolutely criminal. He clearly understood what the cease and desist was and he knowingly ignored it anyway. That doesn't make you a "bad business man". That makes you a criminal!!!

Sorry to everyone with money in. This project is absolutely dead. As noted, those 10 games worth of parts are worthless because Fox would never approve the artwork. All artwork would have to be completely re-done and approved (playfield, cabinet, and translate.) There is no way people will trust Kevin ever again and who in their right mind would not want a refund right now?? Game over sadly.

I hope you guys get a good percentage of your money back. Good luck.

26
#4177 4 years ago

"Mr. X" just emailed me. He said that since Pinball News had gone live, so would he. Included this link in his email. I am working at the moment in a night club and have not had time to read.

http://predatorpinball.wordpress.com/

#4178 4 years ago
Quoted from nephasth:

Heighway shouldn't touch this...

Agree 100% the Predator project is dead, it would taint them by association. I just spoke with Andrew, he's apparently walked away from negotiations with Kevin. No good can come from Predator now, it's over.

Kevin simply has to refund pro rata any money that is left, take whatever legal action comes and serve his inevitable jail time.

#4179 4 years ago

One thing I did not notice in the article is the subject of what status Kevin has for Skit-B. Is it a non-profit, is he acting as an individual without a company, or is it an LLC or something similar?
Also, does Kevin and/or Skit-B have tax filing issues related to the income from the sales?

What a mess.

10
#4180 4 years ago

wow.
no license. ever. = lies to customers. lies to community.
my heart goes out to everyone impacted. i wouldn't wish this on anyone, especially my friends here.

19
#4181 4 years ago

"And although it wasn't widely discussed at the time, it was clear to anyone following the story that there were licensing problems. But nobody seemed willing to delve too deeply into them for fear of derailing the project or being branded a 'hater'. "

Sorry, but this needs to be highlighted. Too much truth here.

#4182 4 years ago

I personally will buy a skull to help raise money for the buyers!

#4183 4 years ago

Horrible....

So many disturbing rumors now reinforced as fact.

But this comment floored me:

Kevin told us, “ So here we go, as loud and clear as I can: I am not a manufacturer, I am a pinball designer. I am not a business man, I am a life-long pinhead and over-dedicated arcade rat. I don't need to get this done in the conventional way, I just need to make sure it gets done.”

What that sounds like is absolutely zero self-awareness of how f*^%*^- up this is- more like he's some pinball rebel defiantly continuing forward without regret.

#4184 4 years ago

"we've always had something of a ‘punk rock’ approach to pinball which has inadvertently defined us from the beginning. We never meant to be the ‘punk rockers’ of pinball, it just sort of happened that way because we were always just simple pinball guys at fun pinball gatherings. In hindsight, we should have just kept that going and worked with it through the end. So here we go, as loud and clear as I can: I am not a manufacturer, I am a pinball designer. I am not a business man, I am a life-long pinhead and over-dedicated arcade rat."

I feel awful for those who have money invested in this fool. I'm pretty sure he had it in his head to try and grind these games out and that Fox would just ignore it.

#4185 4 years ago

Ted, is your pitchfork sharp enough yet?

#4186 4 years ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

One thing I did not notice in the article is the subject of what status Kevin has for Skit-B. Is it a non-profit, is he acting as an individual without a company, or is it an LLC or something similar?
Also, does Kevin and/or Skit-B have tax filing issues related to the income from the sales?
What a mess.

That's an excellent point!! I wish Pinball News had tried to get that answer out of him because as I've repeatedly noted I cannot find any company registered in Michigan by Kevin!

20
#4187 4 years ago

So, Whysnow vehemently defended a criminal while simultaneously vilifying the people trying to reveal the whole mess to the people who paid. More disturbing is everyone who is out money on this deal. What a bummer. Here's hoping that they at least get a portion of their money back.

#4188 4 years ago
Quoted from Jared:

"Mr. X" just emailed me. He said that since Pinball News had gone live, so would he. Included this link in his email. I am working at the moment in a night club and have not had time to read.
http://predatorpinball.wordpress.com/

Ha! There's a whole paragraph for Whysnow. LOL

#4189 4 years ago

The heighway "save the project" bit just sounds like spin to justify the delay in informing the victims. Save tge project my ass.....

#4190 4 years ago

The meat of the supplemental from the "anonymous group":

LIES:
Kevin had a license that was “small” and/or “inexpensive”.
Kevin had license limitations that limited or prevented promotion.
Kevin had a license that expired.
Kevin had a license that ended up incomplete, weak, or had “issues”
Kevin dug out his “license” and discovered he “didn’t have what he thought”
Kevin had “issues with his license” that are “being addressed”.

TRUTH:
Kevin NEVER had an actual license for ANYTHING on Predator.
At any time. From day one.
Of any scale, scope, or cost. Not a cent paid to anyone.
Of course, yes: Before he took investor money.
Knowingly. Planned that way. Simply skipped the entire process. Period.
His plan was to attempt to build 250 Predators, license-less for all IP used.
Save/keep the license money. No approval processes, complete freedom.
Play the extremely good odds that Fox (and others) will simply never find out.
Completely hide the project after selling it, to eliminate risk of ever getting caught.

Please let that sink in. Read it again if necessary. The utter worst-case scenario assumed under the “License-Gate” controversy, was actually the true case. No problems or issues… no licenses AT ALL… and to Kevin’s dismay, he DID get caught.

People assumed there would be no way possible that any pinball creator or business, especially a bro as “nice” as Kevin Kulek, would have the brass balls and/or stupidity to risk a million dollars of other peoples’ money on actually building 250 licensed-themed pinball machines, without a license, hide it all for safety, and simply PRETEND to have complete unincumbered rights to it all…

But yes. Yes. Yes, it IS possible. It just happened.

13
#4191 4 years ago

It's really, really shitty that we all could've had a much easier out with PayPal if this super secret information was shared with us months ago.

#4192 4 years ago
Quoted from Perspex:

It's really, really shitty that we all could've had a much easier out with PayPal if this super secret information was shared with us months ago.

Not many people on Pinside will put up with the truth!

#4193 4 years ago

Wow. Just wow. Worse than I imagined. I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he was naive. But asking for everyone to pay AFTER he received the C&D is outrageous.

Heighway should not touch this.

#4194 4 years ago

Heighway has washed his hands of this (can't blame him) so any bullsh*t email from Kevin better have the words 'Here is your refund' in them.

#4195 4 years ago

i wonder if Kevin's wife paid cash for that new house of hers ?
financial protection through "Primary Residence" safety.

#4196 4 years ago

Dear "Anonymous Group": Please investigate if Kevin skipped the whole process for even registering a corporation of any type!! I cannot find one which means this absolutely opens Kevin up to being sued personally which I think people would want to do to try and recover more of their money back.

#4197 4 years ago

My heart goes out to all who are invested in this project....what a mess. Earlier in this thread, it was debated if this dude was a crook or just ignorant. After reading all of this - seems like it's both.

#4198 4 years ago
Quoted from Jared:

"Mr. X" just emailed me. He said that since Pinball News had gone live, so would he. Included this link in his email. I am working at the moment in a night club and have not had time to read.
http://predatorpinball.wordpress.com/

Yup after reading this my hunch is right. He was planning on building almost a million dollars worth of machines and hope to that FOX would never catch on.

Sorry guys, I'm sick and I have no "skin" involved. I'm used to these sort of things coming from the online poker world. I've seen scams and misdealings in the past four years go on for millions, and sadly most people don't get their money back and the scammer gets very little punishment. Hopefully the community uses this as a lesson about investing in start up. The preorder model from a boutique is pretty much dead.

Hope there is a way for a name to come along and salvage this project and get back some of your money.

20
#4199 4 years ago

Great, just great.

(typed a whole lot of venom and then just hit DELETE). Kevin, you have one chance to make this even partially right - GIVE BACK THE MONEY; all of it, not partially. Sell you car, your house, your boat whatever you have to make this right. You willingly stole money from people.

I hope this is the magic bullet that kills pre-order once and for all. I know it does for me.

#4200 4 years ago
Quoted from Perspex:

It's really, really shitty that we all could've had a much easier out with PayPal if this super secret information was shared with us months ago.

Fucking this.

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