(Topic ID: 108377)

The Official Pinside Kevin Kulek Skit-B Predator Discussion


By Xerico

5 years ago



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  • 815 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 29 days ago by TheLaw
  • Topic is favorited by 193 Pinsiders

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86 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 20 (Show topic index)

There are 18301 posts in this topic. You are on page 70 of 367.
#3451 4 years ago
Quoted from Skins:

I respect your reply and respect your willingness to stand in here and own what you have. Not easy for sure. Thank you for a level headed response. What you are doing for pinball is exciting. It's a shame a friend put your reputation in harms way.
Having said that, what you said about fair use is telling and alarming. Fair use implies Kevin knew portions of what he was doing wasn't covered in his license and deemed them in the fair use domain. Startling and the closest we have got to the true crux of the issue.

That was just my assessment. That it sounded more like guidance on fair use. I did not mean to imply that Kevin was attempting to leverage fair use. Kevin has already stated things needed to get worked out more formally, so I don't need to get involved here.

Aaron
FAST Pinball

PS: I hope nobody thinks I am condoning the way Kevin has handled any of this. It's been a total shit-fiesta. There were so many mistakes and missteps, not uncommon to many first time entrepreneurs, just very public and with a whole lot of other people's money at stake. I just always try to use any engagement I have in situations like this towards something productive.

#3452 4 years ago

You sound like you are back stepping a bit. If all goes well who cares but if it's a bust you showed up here helping paint the picture that it's all good and that will carry some weight.

#3453 4 years ago
Quoted from fastpinball:

That was just my assessment. That it sounded more like guidance on fair use. I did not mean to imply that Kevin was attempting to leverage fair use. Kevin has already stated things needed to get worked out more formally, so I don't need to get involved here.
Aaron
FAST Pinball
PS: I hope nobody thinks I am condoning the way Kevin has handled any of this. It's been a total shit-fiesta. There were so many mistakes and missteps, not uncommon to many first time entrepreneurs, just very public and with a whole lot of other people's money at stake. I just always try to use any engagement I have in situations like this towards something productive.

Don't let Aurich use his heavyweight Pinsider advantage Aaron.

He's such a bully.

It's all cool til it isn't. Kevin starts on requested refunds from months ago, that'll buy him street cred.

I'm still rooting for the underdog, so I'll play this out hoping for the best but expecting the worst.

#3454 4 years ago
Quoted from fastpinball:

what came to light were what I considered guidelines for acceptable fair use, not what I would consider adequate for a commercial project.

This is probably the most illuminating explanation we've had yet with what the heck has been going on with the license (or lack of).

#3455 4 years ago
Quoted from Hwawonyu:

You sound like you are back stepping a bit. If all goes well who cares but if it's a bust you showed up here helping paint the picture that it's all good and that will carry some weight.

More like Aaron trying to calm the mob. I get it.

39
#3456 4 years ago
Quoted from Asylum:

Seems like a bit of abuse of power to me...
No offense but there are a bunch of us that have money in on this and have been quietly staying out of the current conversations. We come here to see what the latest is and its not been good. I also have been very quietly trying to get a refund for over a month with nothing but bullshit generalized email responses from Kevin. With all do respect... you should be more concerned about us fellow pinsiders who have been taken advantage of than worried about what people post regarding Kevin and what is free public information on the world wide web.

You should be ejected from this thread just for making this careless comment... people have been requesting refunds for months.
You ask to be a moderator and Robin decided you were worthy of this position. I will not second guess that decision... however with your position comes responsibility and that responsibility is to be objective to both sides of a situation/issue - your comments heavily favor Kevin. You fail to acknowledge the lack of detailed communication from Kevin to those of us who have invested substantial monies based on his promises/guarantees.

I can't believe an owner was ejected from this thread based on this post. He may have violated the forum rules for questioning a moderator, but considering what these guys are going through, I think more leeway is definitely in order here. I think a warning would be more than sufficient.

#3457 4 years ago

Everyone but Kevin who says things are going to be ok needs to stop. You're just supporting poor behavior and fueling this crazy fire. Kevin, and only Kevin, needs to respond on the status. I know some of you are trying to help but it's only hurting the situation.

#3458 4 years ago
Quoted from underlord:

Don't let Aurich use his heavyweight Pinsider advantage Aaron.

Damnit, there's no flexing smiley.

#3459 4 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

I can't believe an owner was ejected from this thread based on this post. He may have violated the forum rules for questioning a moderator, but considering what these guys are going through, I think more leeway is definitely in order here. I think a warning would be more than sufficient.

I think someone said earlier it's only a bug right now. It's not an actual eject, it's just a warning (the message reads wrong.) Because we've seen the same message on other posts and those folks are still in the thread.

#3460 4 years ago

Beyond the license, there are so many things that were going wrong with the manufacturing. Kevin's plan to have his buds build machines at his mom's house was nuts, it would have fallen apart eventually. The money management seemed poor. Very poor business management. Obviously very poor customer service.

The license drama brought this all to a head but I don't know if this would have ended up well no matter what. The money probably would have ran out, and let's face it, title 2 was not exactly going to raise easy money to cover any shortfalls.

#3461 4 years ago
Quoted from PinChili:

This is SO different. You guys are crazy. We're not talking small claims here .. we're talking somewhere between 700K and 1.1 million! We're talking money transactions that not only crossed state lines but international lines (wire fraud). We're talking about clear and documented communication from him that can easily be proven as lies (and thus, fraud). Unless Fox comes out and says yep, we gave him a license to use and there was never a problem and we never asked him to take down the Predator content, then he was LYING. He intended to deceive. Fraud! And unless he can realistically account for how all of the money was spent ... more fraud. Has anyone ever watched American Greed??

Exactly.

That is why Barney Fife and the local cops won't touch this with my 20 foot pole.

#3462 4 years ago
Quoted from Hwawonyu:

You sound like you are back stepping a bit. If all goes well who cares but if it's a bust you showed up here helping paint the picture that it's all good and that will carry some weight.

Anything I say here I have said/would say to Kevin directly. I never intended for my message to be "hey gang! Just calm down and endure the same waiting game you have for years!" I have been brought all up to speed on the state of the Predator project and, with that, think there were a whole lot of mistakes made from a business standpoint.

Why does Kevin call me? I hope it's because he knows that no matter how hard or complicated things are, I am willing to discuss it logically.

I regret not engaging Kevin on the way Predator was going sooner, when more could have been done. We were focused on playing with new hardware for other projects. But at least I got semi-biweekly emails going.

Aaron
FAST Pinball

#3463 4 years ago
Quoted from PinChili:

I think someone said earlier it's only a bug right now. It's not an actual eject, it's just a warning (the message reads wrong.) Because we've seen the same message on other posts and those folks are still in the thread.

I've spoken to Asylum and he has been ejected from the thread.

#3464 4 years ago

Would it be worth someone starting a "Predator Refund" thread, where everyone who has requested a refund, post ONLY once, with their original refund request date -and then update the post if/when they get a refund?
I'm not in as a buyer so I won't start it -but I thought it might be interesting to see how many people post on there.

#3465 4 years ago

Holy....

#3466 4 years ago
Quoted from chessiv:

Everyone but Kevin who says things are going to be ok needs to stop. You're just supporting poor behavior and fueling this crazy fire. Kevin, and only Kevin, needs to respond on the status. I know some of you are trying to help but it's only hurting the situation.

Got It.
Everything is going to be fine.

43
#3467 4 years ago

Allow me to translate:

Quoted from fastpinball:

Kevin called me and we talked about how toxic things have become and where things will go from here.

Kevin chats with Aaron about how toxic pinside is.

Quoted from fastpinball:

the steps being taken are not a result of today's surge of threats

Kevin gives zero 'fudges' about what is happening on pinside, and hasn't changed what he's doing despite the shitstorm

Quoted from fastpinball:

Everyone needs to calm down while these remaining details are getting worked out.

Don't try to contact Kevin, he isn't going to talk to you anyway

Quoted from fastpinball:

While I was mislead on aspects of licensing, just as you were, I am still willing to advise him through these steps and decisions.

Since Kevin's my friend, I'm going to overlook his fraudulent activity and back him up

Quoted from fastpinball:

Kevin has all the data, all the options and all the outcome possibilities clearly laid out and he will be making a rational decision based on that.

Kevin hasn't decided whether to tell all you guys the truth or not. He also hasn't decided whether he will give anybody refunds.

Quoted from fastpinball:

In the meantime, let's all take a breather. Get off this thread for a few days.

Kevin sent me to pinside to tell you he isn't coming whether you like it or not and give you a big middle finger. Hopefully all you customers will go quiet for a few more weeks now.

Thanks Aaron, thought i'd help you out as I am educated in bullshitting 101.

#3468 4 years ago
Quoted from fastpinball:

I regret not engaging Kevin on the way Predator was going sooner, when more could have been done. We were focused on playing with new hardware for other projects.

So your saying things are not looking so good.

#3469 4 years ago

pred-1.jpg

#3470 4 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

I can't believe an owner was ejected from this thread based on this post. He may have violated the forum rules for questioning a moderator, but considering what these guys are going through, I think more leeway is definitely in order here. I think a warning would be more than sufficient.

It was temporary.

As stated above in my last post...question us all you want, just please do it in the Moderator Feedback forum.

Pete

#3471 4 years ago

Well now we know what's going on with the Predator license:

I bet at the very least NRS has a window in their deal which wouls make it impossible for something like a predator pin to be released in the next ~18 months.

#3472 4 years ago
Quoted from pmWolf:

It was temporary.
As stated above in my last post...question us all you want, just please do it in the Moderator Feedback forum.
Pete

You're never gonna be a Demi God if you keep all this human being shit up man. Just sayin...

I like our mod squad.

image.jpg

11
#3473 4 years ago
Quoted from YKpinballer:

Allow me to translate:

Kevin chats with Aaron about how toxic pinside is.

Kevin gives zero 'fudges' about what is happening on pinside, and hasn't changed what he's doing despite the shitstorm

Don't try to contact Kevin, he isn't going to talk to you anyway

Since Kevin's my friend, I'm going to overlook his fraudulent activity and back him up

Kevin hasn't decided whether to tell all you guys the truth or not. He also hasn't decided whether he will give anybody refunds.

Kevin sent me to pinside to tell you he isn't coming whether you like it or not and give you a big middle finger. Hopefully all you customers will go quiet for a few more weeks now.
Thanks Aaron, thought i'd help you out as I am educated in bullshitting 101.

Well...that's pretty much one of the most epic posts in this entire thread.

AND THAT'S SAYING SOMETHING!!!

#3474 4 years ago

Can we get details on the license? Did you actually read it, Aaron?

#3475 4 years ago
Quoted from fastpinball:

all the options and all the outcome possibilities clearly laid out and he will be making a rational decision based on that.

That's just great, especially when you look at where his rational decision making has gotten everyone that is now handcuffed to this project.

I've tried to be a patient as possible with him and the project, but it's reaching critical mass with how f'ing ridiculous this crap has become, and only compounded by the fact that he refuses to refund people that no longer want to be in on the build for obvious reasons of being lied to and completely misled... The result of every decision is literally this:
homer2.jpg

#3476 4 years ago

If the pre-pay/pre-order model survives after this, it will be nothing short of a miracle.

10
#3477 4 years ago
Quoted from pmWolf:

Thanks for understanding,
Pete

Its all good Pete... emotions are high for all of us that have invested monies. I should have directed my comments regarding your posts in the moderator forum as the rules state.

Thank you for your direct "clarifying" replies in this forum and PM's between us.

No matter what ultimately happens with this subject, I will at least always be thankful for the support we all truly have for each other in this hobby we all love so much.

#3478 4 years ago
Quoted from NPO:

If the pre-pay/pre-order model survives after this, it will be nothing short of a miracle.

I was thinking earlier about what JJP leadership must be thinking about this and the impact it will have to their business model and future releases.

#3479 4 years ago
Quoted from GGBGROUP:

I was thinking earlier about what JJP leadership must be thinking about this and the impact it will have to their business model and future releases.

you mean after they finish laughing over beers ?

#3480 4 years ago

I agree people should chill out, and I hope the people who still want the darn pins eventually get them and the people who,want refunds get them.

I would not give Kevin another cent personally. I think he's worse than John (did I just say that?)

Anyway chill out and watch this video around ten times.

12
#3481 4 years ago
Quoted from labnip:

you mean after they finish laughing over beers ?

I doubt anyone is laughing, it's basically a shitty thing for everyone that this went south.

Don't forget about the poor guy who won a free Experts of Disingenuous machine at CAX!

#3482 4 years ago
Quoted from labnip:

you mean after they finish laughing over beers ?

Rotflmao! Labnip! Your one liners man!! OMG!

#3483 4 years ago
Quoted from YKpinballer:

Allow me to translate:

Kevin chats with Aaron about how toxic pinside is.

Kevin gives zero 'fudges' about what is happening on pinside, and hasn't changed what he's doing despite the shitstorm

Don't try to contact Kevin, he isn't going to talk to you anyway

Since Kevin's my friend, I'm going to overlook his fraudulent activity and back him up

Kevin hasn't decided whether to tell all you guys the truth or not. He also hasn't decided whether he will give anybody refunds.

Kevin sent me to pinside to tell you he isn't coming whether you like it or not and give you a big middle finger. Hopefully all you customers will go quiet for a few more weeks now.
Thanks Aaron, thought i'd help you out as I am educated in bullshitting 101.

Read the rest of my comments today. Inject whatever meaning you want to. If you are going to do a breakdown for one, ya gotta do them all.

But seriously, while you were working on that elaborate madlib of my comments, I attempted to clarify myself in others posts. If you want me to stop trying to help Kevin work through this towards the best possible outcome, you just tell me. I'll let you decide for everyone involved.

Aaron
FAST Pinball

Aurich... now I know why you said to stay out!

#3484 4 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

I've spoken to Asylum and he has been ejected from the thread.

I am with you on this Rob.

Pathetic that Asylum was ejected for voicing an opinion in a professional manner, but a moderator can reply on this thread, breaking the public forum rules when it should have been posted in a moderator feedback thread.

#3486 4 years ago
Quoted from fastpinball:

Aurich... now I know why you said to stay out!

Slow learner, are ya?

#3487 4 years ago

sad thing is... i really-really-really want this game
and Aliens too

I'm curious how many openings there are now in the pre-order line.
and is there anyone left on that original wait list?

mr-burns-1.gif

#3488 4 years ago
Quoted from loren3233:

I am with you on this Rob.
Pathetic that Asylum was ejected for voicing an opinion in a professional manner, but a moderator can reply on this thread, breaking the public forum rules when it should have been posted in a moderator feedback thread.

Let's drop this discussion as 1) it's been resolved and Asylum's eject has been reversed (or it was temporary) 2) further discussions about moderator actions are not for public discussion and violate forum rules... I don't want you (or me) to be ejected either.

Again, it was resolved.

#3489 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Don't forget about the poor guy who won a free Experts of Disingenuous machine at CAX!

He should feel blessed. Quite likely that he won't have that eyesore taking up space in his gameroom at the rate things are going.

#3490 4 years ago
Quoted from labnip:

i really-really-really want(ed) this game

Me too

#3491 4 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

Slow learner, are ya?

Hehe. Sure seems like it! Here I thought I could answer tons of emails, PMs, Facebook messages and texts all in one place. Whoops!

Aaron
FAST Pinball

#3492 4 years ago
Quoted from fastpinball:

Hehe. Sure seems like it! Here I thought I could answer tons of emails, PMs, Facebook messages and texts all in one place. Whoops!
Aaron
FAST Pinball

Your heart was in the right place, but no good deed goes unpunished in threads like this.

#3493 4 years ago

Same here. PRED next to Aliens? Hello??!?! How cool is that??

#3494 4 years ago
Quoted from NPO:

If the pre-pay/pre-order model survives after this, it will be nothing short of a miracle.

The only reason it hasn't got as toxic with Jpop, probably less people invested with Jpop, and John is a nice guy (or seems to be) and john seems to be legit, he still acts like he's trying to build pins. Kevin doesn't have John's credibility and doesn't care a lick for the people who trusted him. And throws his friends like Aaron and Ted under the bus.

#3495 4 years ago
Quoted from underlord:

Same here. PRED next to Aliens? Hello??!?! How cool is that??

it's the dream team line-up, without a doubt

#3496 4 years ago

I have no dog in this race but I just wanted to say that I hope you guys get your money or your game. Good luck to all involved here.

#3497 4 years ago

Can't wait 'till we see Kevin at the next pinball expo...

#3498 4 years ago
Quoted from labnip:

it's the dream team line-up, without a doubt

I'm just saying, Heighway has a relationship with Fox now. If Alien sells well maybe they can step in and get the Predator license and we can still see a game.

11
#3499 4 years ago

I've spent a whole lot of time talking to Aaron about Jpop mostly and he is a GREAT dude and if he is willing to help Kevin and Kevin is smart enough to listen, Aaron will be nothing but a HUGE asset to everybody trying to get something resolved with Predator.

That's a fact, a straight shooter, passionate guy and I don't think he would even know how to BS someone.

#3500 4 years ago

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