(Topic ID: 108377)

The Official Pinside Kevin Kulek Skit-B Predator Discussion


By Xerico

4 years ago



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#16551 2 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

brianna.owczarzak@wnem.com
Contact brianna if you were scammed by the Kulek family. Sounds like if enough people reach out to help then there will likely be a follow up piece done. There were 17 with civil cases. There were hundreds that had funds stolen.
A simple email on this holiday morning could do a ton of good. Think how important it is to ensure these scam artists are exposed in their own community!

Making sure this doesn't get missed.

#16552 2 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

brianna.owczarzak@wnem.com
Contact brianna if you were scammed by the Kulek family. Sounds like if enough people reach out to help then there will likely be a follow up piece done. There were 17 with civil cases. There were hundreds that had funds stolen.
A simple email on this holiday morning could do a ton of good. Think how important it is to ensure these scam artists are exposed in their own community!

Email sent!

-2
#16553 2 years ago

The State of Michigan has pretty stringent Harassment by Telecommunication Device Laws. Be very careful of posting harassing things on websites where the misfortunate are trying to get help to survive.

Even if you are not in Michigan, if the person you say stuff about could get a County Prosecutor to take action against you in their County and State.

21
#16554 2 years ago
Quoted from MrBally:

The State of Michigan has pretty stringent Harassment by Telecommunication Device Laws. Be very careful of posting harassing things on websites where the misfortunate are trying to get help to survive.
Even if you are not in Michigan, if the person you say stuff about could get a County Prosecutor to take action against you in their County and State.

Harassment is one thing, calling out blatant lies is not harassment.

-1
#16555 2 years ago

New comment on the news station web page. I was thinking all the Haters would like to better understand the flood victims' current plight:

http://www.wnem.com/story/35782528/family-loses-everything-in-historic-flood

"Haters-
Listen!!!!! I have known this family on a personal basis for MANY years. They are NOT, I repeat NOT the negative things you misinformed MOB claim they are. They are normal people who have normal lives. The case in which you cry about is a crock of sh!t!!!
The lawsuit that was almost THREE years ago is over a TTTTOOOOYYYYYYYYYY and damn TOY you insensitive mongers!
You are saying awful things- things that heartless people say. Is that what kind of human you are???? What the he!l is wrong with you!!!??? You should be ashamed of yourselves. YOU dont know this family in anyway shape or form. You are boo-hooing over a toy you lost???? You cant be serious!!!!
You need to STOP!!!! IMMEDIATELY.
This family is in dire need! You are out here complaining and bashing them while they are struggling through the hardest thing that has ever happened to them. They didnt deserve this! No one does! Not even you as you spew hatred!
I know it is a difficut concept to grasp but GROW UP!!!! Attempting to sabbotage this family and making them appear horrid over a lawsuit over a childs toy from 3 years ago only makes YOU look like an azzhat!!!!!
I plead that your hunt to hurt comes to an end! I pray that YOUR family or friends NEVER have to endure this SERIOUS situation and i KNOW that in the event they ever do.... THIS family would never be as cruel as you all are being. You truly should be ashamed of yourselves! Truly
Thank you, Melissa"

#16556 2 years ago

Sounds like Melissa hasn't listened to the audio... might change her opinion.

#16557 2 years ago

LMAO Mellissa is giving a glowing endorsement of the masterpiece of pinball greatness that G'ma said her son was planning to build.

-56
#16558 2 years ago

Have the vultures gotten their pound of flesh yet?

Seems some would only be happy to see this man die?

Write off your preorder gambling losses and get on with your lives.

#16559 2 years ago
Quoted from guyincognito:

Have the vultures gotten their pound of flesh yet?
Seems some would only be happy to see this man die?
Write off your preorder gambling losses and get on with your lives.

That is what the legal system is here for. If they lost the suit and were still bitching I could understand your post but while this is going on still and this terrible family (children excluded) ripped around a million dollars I think this is all very justified.

-13
#16560 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Harassment is one thing, calling out blatant lies is not harassment.

I would speak to a Criminal Attorney about that. Having a Warrant issued, an Appearance forced, attending a Trial, even if to plea and get it over with can cost a few dollars.

Again read the Michigan Law carefully. Harassment is defined quite well. A Jury could find some of the statements on the teevee station website as well as the short-lived fundraiser site harassing. That would lead to a Guilty Verdict and a nice criminal record.

31
#16561 2 years ago
Quoted from Superchicken:

The lawsuit that was almost THREE years ago is over a TTTTOOOOYYYYYYYYYY and damn TOY you insensitive mongers!

She doesn't get it! It's not about a TOOOOOYYYY! It's about stolen MOOOONNEEEYY! Nobody ever GOT the TOOOYYYY!
I'd like to see what she would do if $8k was stolen from her family...

#16562 2 years ago

Lol....I had to chuckle....last reply in the Facebook comments are from Wayne Gillard calling Amanda a liar and a thief....Wayne of all people.

10
#16563 2 years ago
Quoted from guyincognito:

Have the vultures gotten their pound of flesh yet?
Seems some would only be happy to see this man die?
Write off your preorder gambling losses and get on with your lives.

Clearly not, and rightfully so!

No one said anything about death, locked up in a cell for years would be great though. Or at the very least, have them actually admit to stealing money and spending it all, or hiding it.

Why should anyone right it off and move on? If you don't like it, don't read it. Moving on means they have gotten away with stealing a shit load of money and they will do it again.

30
#16564 2 years ago

There's been an alarming transition to this thread and its happened somewhat organically, but feel like it needs to be pointed out, because maybe some or maybe most of you may not realize it.

I have always believed Pinside to be a community of good people trying to help one another and create a haven of like minds and interests in that spans the globe. The Kuleks have taken advantage of that and harmed the community, and healing and getting past that requires some justice. I felt like that was the purpose of this thread and checked in from time to time to see if we'd gotten that, for the community, so we could move past it. Hard lessons in hand and closure enough to focus on creating things again.

Recently though this has become less and less about pinball and a pinball community problem into something quite different. Its become a platform to coordinate a seemly vengeful attack on these people.

I want to be clear, what Kuleks have done and are doing now isn't morally right, and those working to try to call that out beyond the realm of this forum and the predator issue, have every right to do what they are doing and seems like legal actions. I just wonder if Pinside is the place to coordinate that and celebrate its results.

I'm not suggesting if you feel like there's moral injustice in seeing what you believe to be a new Kulek scam shouldn't be left idol, and referencing the predator problem is part of that, but it isn't pinball, and I'm not convinced it makes pinball or pinside a better place.

The attention that's coming will bring to this forum new people, many of which are NOT interested in pinball, and more importantly those that do come with good or curious intent, won't see a positive side of pinball, and that isn't good for pinball either. Other too might come only to attack those taking action from this platform. That is also harmful to the hobby and this sanctuary we call our forum.

This seems to have grown organically from a lot of emotion from sincere places, but think its taken on it's own darker form that's no longer about justice for a pinball community problem.

I'm hoping bringing this up puts enough lens on it that we bring it back to pinball and the pinball communities issue. I'm asking for myself as someone who cares about this forum. I'm suggesting that pinside is not the place for derogatory and vindictive action and to take it someplace else, so that the damage and seeds of that negative action can sew its reward someplace else.

If it doesn't then we won't heal, and will be poisoned by these people's dealing beyond the initial incident. What good is that?

#16565 2 years ago

I do wonder where the line is.

I'm not personally out on Predator so I'm not one of the affected, but I did lose to jpop, and more than any 1 person lost on a Predator, and it's been much better for the peace in my life to just accept it as a life lesson.

I suspect it will save me from a much more expensive lesson down the road and learn to properly vet the people and things I put my money into.

#16566 2 years ago

Do you want to blow off steam or do you want to win?

24
#16567 2 years ago
Quoted from VacFink:

I'm suggesting that pinside is not the place for derogatory and vindictive action and to take it someplace else, so that the damage and seeds of that negative action can sew its reward someplace else.

Well Pinside is the forum in which Predator was marketed and promoted. I think there is clearly a reason for the "angry mob with pitch forks."

#16568 2 years ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

Do you want to blow off steam or do you want to win?

What is a win at this point do you think? A simple judgement in favor? I cant see anything ( cash ) coming back at this point.

14
#16569 2 years ago

The pros:

History
Education

There are no cons except for the criminals and friends there of being embarrassed, being held accountable, etc..

Easy to drain if you do not like seeing folks getting enjoyment out of some justice being served.

If everyone just chalked it up to life lesson learned, and turned the other cheek, the crooks just keep doing what they are good at.

Look at MAD amusements and international orders. I am embarrassed for the entire country that it keeps happening.

-32
#16570 2 years ago

Getting ripped off sure brings out the worst of some people...

The victims of the Predator "scam" where they lost a nice chunk of change (that, face it, for the most part they could afford to lose and were hoping for a BBBesque return on their "investment", but it did not ruin their lives) actually have so little empathy that they imagine that somehow deliberately getting flooded out, uprooting a family of eight who barely had a pot to piss in in the first place, is another "scam" to garner public sympathy and relief (aka handouts)? Unbelievable.

For two seconds, can you try to see it from others' point of view? How can you think we all don't come across looking like a bunch of rich assholes? It can't possibly reflect well on our community.

I've lost more money over the years from deadbeats at the daycare center I own, who run up huge bills promising to get authorized for state assistance and then never do and disappear, than all of you put together did on Predator. $45K so far this year alone. No sense in even suing them, it'd be uncollectable. Should I start stalking their Facebooks? Or should I wait until they have a fire or something?

"Karma" (as if) goes both ways...

#16571 2 years ago

From pinball to pedophilia? That's a stretch.

LIES4 (resized).jpg

21
#16572 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

Getting ripped off sure brings out the worst of some people...
The victims of the Predator "scam" where they lost a nice chunk of change (that, face it, for the most part they could afford to lose and were hoping for a BBBesque return on their "investment", but it did not ruin their lives) actually have so little empathy that they imagine that somehow deliberately getting flooded out, uprooting a family of eight who barely had a pot to piss in in the first place, is another "scam" to garner public sympathy and relief (aka handouts)? Unbelievable.
For two seconds, can you try to see it from others' point of view? How can you think we all don't come across looking like a bunch of rich assholes? It can't possibly reflect well on our community.
I've lost more money over the years from deadbeats at the daycare center I own, who run up huge bills promising to get authorized for state assistance and then never do and disappear, than all of you put together did on Predator. $45K so far this year alone. No sense in even suing them, it'd be uncollectable. Should I start stalking their Facebooks? Or should I wait until they have a fire or something?
"Karma" (as if) goes both ways...

This doesnt even make sense. "you are all so rich you can afford to lose $4500 and learn from it"

If you are foolish enough to let people take advantage of you, that's on you. Seems like your ok with it. LOL

My wife runs a day home, you don't pay, she doesn't open the door. Yes, people do try it, its unbelievable really.

#16573 2 years ago

Calm down everyone, Dan has lost more money than all of the scammed victims... Clearly a non-issue for us.

I can't tell if it's virtue signaling or just straight up cucked with some of you

30
#16574 2 years ago
Quoted from VacFink:

There's been an alarming transition to this thread and its happened somewhat organically, but feel like it needs to be pointed out, because maybe some or maybe most of you may not realize it.
I have always believed Pinside to be a community of good people trying to help one another and create a haven of like minds and interests in that spans the globe. The Kuleks have taken advantage of that and harmed the community, and healing and getting past that requires some justice. I felt like that was the purpose of this thread and checked in from time to time to see if we'd gotten that, for the community, so we could move past it. Hard lessons in hand and closure enough to focus on creating things again.
Recently though this has become less and less about pinball and a pinball community problem into something quite different. Its become a platform to coordinate a seemly vengeful attack on these people.
I want to be clear, what Kuleks have done and are doing now isn't morally right, and those working to try to call that out beyond the realm of this forum and the predator issue, have every right to do what they are doing and seems like legal actions. I just wonder if Pinside is the place to coordinate that and celebrate its results.
I'm not suggesting if you feel like there's moral injustice in seeing what you believe to be a new Kulek scam shouldn't be left idol, and referencing the predator problem is part of that, but it isn't pinball, and I'm not convinced it makes pinball or pinside a better place.
The attention that's coming will bring to this forum new people, many of which are NOT interested in pinball, and more importantly those that do come with good or curious intent, won't see a positive side of pinball, and that isn't good for pinball either. Other too might come only to attack those taking action from this platform. That is also harmful to the hobby and this sanctuary we call our forum.
This seems to have grown organically from a lot of emotion from sincere places, but think its taken on it's own darker form that's no longer about justice for a pinball community problem.
I'm hoping bringing this up puts enough lens on it that we bring it back to pinball and the pinball communities issue. I'm asking for myself as someone who cares about this forum. I'm suggesting that pinside is not the place for derogatory and vindictive action and to take it someplace else, so that the damage and seeds of that negative action can sew its reward someplace else.
If it doesn't then we won't heal, and will be poisoned by these people's dealing beyond the initial incident. What good is that?

These people thought they could just walk away from this.. they thought they could just ignore it. Literally, they just tried to hide from it all. It's their own behavior in how they responded to the whole situation which helped breed this kind of discontent and energy to pursue them. If they were the normal types that would have faced the issues and tried to settle it up in court, then people would be angry, but ultimately find they can only be angry and things would fade with time.

Instead this family continued the deceit and then tried to play themselves the victims. That instead further fuels people against them due to the lack of accountability and audacity of them.

#16575 2 years ago

Barely a pot to piss in? At $2 a pot they could have 1/2 a million pots.

#16576 2 years ago

I love how they're now clinging to the kids as their shield now. Before it was "I'm not my husband... I don't know anything". But now they want to use the kids as shields as to why you should leave them alone...

The interpretation of the judge in those comments should tell you everything you need to know about the kulek reality distortion field

#16577 2 years ago

I am torn on this . I am going to say that I firmly believe that there is no malice here on this flooding issue. There is no way the Kulek's are making a scam out of the flood here, they really did lose everything. I am not saying anyone here on Pinside should offer to lift a finger for these people. As for the community in Michigan, they can speak for themselves if they wish to help out these people.

The bottom line here is there needs to be some humanity here. They have 5 kids that had no choice in this whole fiasco. If they have no home, no vehicles, no income, the only thing the courts and trustees are going to get out of these people is blood or time served. We give murderers on death row a bed, a roof, clothes, and 3 meals a day. As much as I hate to say it, they deserve to eat, have clothes on their backs, and maybe a roof over their heads. I think the witch hunt has gone too far. Call the floods justice if you will, but fuck, life suffrage is not worth $4500. I have been burned for way more that $4500 on a car deal. I wish the person who caused my loss all the shit luck in the world and hope they get back exactly what they sowed. I think the Kulek's losing everything they paid for with the Predator money is poetic justice. If any one of us lost everything we had in the next 24 hours, no matter how we accumulated it, the next few days in your life might just change you forever. It just hits too much at home to not allow a fellow human basic necessities of life.

25
#16578 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Call the floods justice if you will, but fuck, life suffrage is not worth $4500.

How about $500,000+? And that's being conservative. I get a lot of people on here are extremely afraid of confrontation and actively go out of their way to avoid it, but overlooking the total amount here and trying to boil it down to $4500 is a level of metal gymnastics that is amazing.

#16579 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

time served.

...probably wishful thinking on my part...

-1
#16580 2 years ago
Quoted from Nibbles:

I get a lot of people on here are extremely afraid of confrontation and actively go out of their way to avoid it, but overlooking the total amount here and trying to boil it down to $4500 is a level of metal gymnastics that is amazing.

Amazingly obtuse.

16
#16581 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

We give murderers on death row a bed, a roof, clothes, and 3 meals a day. As much as I hate to say it, they deserve to eat,

If Kevin will live in the cell in my basement, I'll feed him.

#16582 2 years ago

Maybe the courts would allow the pauper to be publicly flogged by the debtors?

1 lashing for every 5 Pintasia credits owed.

#16583 2 years ago
Quoted from Nibbles:

How about $500,000+? And that's being conservative. I get a lot of people on here are extremely afraid of confrontation and actively go out of their way to avoid it, but overlooking the total amount here and trying to boil it down to $4500 is a level of metal gymnastics that is amazing.

Afraid of confrontation? Me? NO! Have your read some of my posts?

I figure I would take heat for my post....and that's fine.

But there has to come a point where.........where what? And that's where I am torn.

Just being honest.

None the less, still firmly believe Kevin, at minimum, needs to call an 6' x 10' cell home for a while.

#16584 2 years ago

Does losing everything actually make it more likely kulek ends up serving time? Like if there is a financial judgment against him that he has no ability to pay does have to go to prison instead?

#16585 2 years ago
Quoted from Nibbles:

How about $500,000+? And that's being conservative

Honest question: why is 500k the conservstive number right now? I don't think I've seen an accounting anywhere that is generally accepted.. with some paid in full, some only deposit, some got out before it went South, few got out after.. nobody really knows right? Or did I miss the post where we had a clear accounting.. it is at least possible that between house(flooded), trailer(flooded), laptops(lost?), A few arcade games, the money spent on vendors(this seems the bulk) that there is nothing or little left.

#16586 2 years ago

I have had mixed feelings about weighing in on this, but I haven't seen anyone argue that just being Kevin Kulek is probably punishment enough at this point.

Just think you take in hundreds of thousands of dollars, and buy.... a house that floods every year? Now seriously that is your master criminal plan? He comes off as just being incapable of making a good decision, and here is a prime example.

It reminds me of "the trial" from Red Dwarf where Kryten's Defense of Rimmer is "his only Crime is that of being Arnold J. Rimmer. It is also his punishment."

I feel bad for his kids and honestly anyone who has to associate with him. Its a life sentence just being him.

#t=0

#16587 2 years ago
Quoted from Nibbles:

How about $500,000+? And that's being conservative. I get a lot of people on here are extremely afraid of confrontation and actively go out of their way to avoid it, but overlooking the total amount here and trying to boil it down to $4500 is a level of metal gymnastics that is amazing.

OK, are you out more than $4500? Nope. So no mental gymnastics needed.

250 games at $4500. If 100% collected thats 1.125 Million.

Was NEVER 100% collected.

How many actual refunds?

How many were just $250 deposits?

We know he bought the house, the trailer, computers, camera equipment. OK $50 grand? The trailer was never $25K, sorry.

He bought art for 250 machines
he bought parts for 250 machines
he paid for machinery and equipment for 250 cabinets
He paid for being at Expo's and other various shows

The only part that was a scam from the word go was the license. It turned into a complete scam when the no license was revealed. But for those of you think that you are going to ever recover anything more than a few pennies on the dollar are daydreamers.

How much do you really think he had left over to play with? Some of these numbers are really outrageous.

Does not excuse anything or any one of the characters in this Predator Pinball charade.

But any individual who is out $4500 is 100% not entitled to $500K worth of flesh.

#16588 2 years ago

2.7 million dollars, minimum

#16589 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

He bought art for 250 machines
he bought parts for 250 machines
he paid for machinery and equipment for 250 cabinets

Negative, other than the skulls and spines he didn't buy hardly any parts

#16590 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

He bought art for 250 machines
he bought parts for 250 machines
he paid for machinery and equipment for 250 cabinets
He paid for being at Expo's and other various shows

Are you basing that off of a guess? Or do you know more than people that have talked with Keith? Hell, read the legal docs and you'd know half of that is false. It starts to fall apart when you have actual facts, which are not fully shared on Pinside, and are not just arguing for the sake of making yourself feel important.

15
#16591 2 years ago

Screenshot for posterity

s1.jpg
s2.jpg
s3.jpg

#16592 2 years ago
Quoted from Nibbles:

Hell, read the legal docs and you'd know half of that is false.

Is that the gun slinging lawyer, the countless yard stalkers or the adult website your speaking of?

#16593 2 years ago
Quoted from CNKay:

Is that the gun slinging lawyer, the countless yard stalkers or the adult website your speaking of?

The rain dance variety of lawyer

#16594 2 years ago

I love the "enough already!" Legal argument that appears to be popular in the area.

#16595 2 years ago
Quoted from Pdxmonkey:

Negative, other than the skulls and spines he didn't buy hardly any parts

I think he did buy more than skulls and spines

22
#16596 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

I am going to say that I firmly believe that there is no malice here on this flooding issue. There is no way the Kulek's are making a scam out of the flood here, they really did lose everything

Just want to say that once the wife goes on camera and asks to have a good Samaritan help take care of them, then I have issue and feel the need to help to warn the local community. This is not about the pound of flesh for me, this is about helping to protect others when there is clear and admitted ongoing intent to defraud from a known entity that has done so already. It happens all the time when people undergo a hardship and then take advantage of handouts beyond just repairing and getting back to square one for the misfortune mother nature gave to them.

Toss on top that at minimum this family took in 300k with the Predator and still has zero accountability, then sorry but I have no problems and support anyone that was taken by them to put forth the effort to appropriately and legally warn others.

I told Kevin way back in the day that if he had just said truthfully where the money went and to refund pennies on the dollar that the community would be hurt but would eventually forgive and forget. I am 100% that if he had done the correct thing years ago that I would be championing the opposite side and rallying to get the family back on their feet. In this case they are getting what they sow.

#16597 2 years ago
Quoted from PinRob:

I think he did buy more than skulls and spines

Yeah apparently he bought ten cabs to make 100K plus disappear.

#16598 2 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I told Kevin way back in the day that if he had just said truthfully where the money went and to refund pennies on the dollar that the community would be hurt but would eventually forgive and forget. I am 100% that if he had done the correct thing years ago that I would be championing the opposite side and rallying to get the family back on their feet. In this case they are getting what they sow.

#16599 2 years ago
Quoted from Nibbles:

The rain dance variety of lawyer

Not nice but kinda funny!

23
#16600 2 years ago

It's interesting how the kulek defenders despair one family's losses while so casually dismissing the losses of hundreds of others.

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