(Topic ID: 108377)

The Official Pinside Kevin Kulek Skit-B Predator Discussion


By Xerico

4 years ago



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#12501 2 years ago

Has Kevin ever told his "side of the story?" I know JPOP sort of did, but I don't really remember hearing directly from KK. Maybe it got lost in the thread somewhere. Or did he ever give an interview about all this?

#12504 2 years ago

Thanks for the links. I think I had seen those way back then, but I had forgotten.

So...what's the rest of the story, from his perspective? People are almost always the good guy in their own version of the story. I'm curious how he would justify his actions at this point. Has anyone heard anything from him?

#12505 2 years ago

enaud my mistake then!

I've only been on Pinside for a year, so that must have been before my time in this thread!

Driving to Mich for personal jurisdiction was a noble quest even if the treasure chest was empty after you defeated the dragon!

#12506 2 years ago

I like the "I'm not out blowing money or getting any benefit" bullshit. Especially when the pictures of trailer full of games and huge pull trailer are posted.

#12507 2 years ago

Not to mention buying an embezzlement house.

#12508 2 years ago

And buying mom a trailer.

#12510 2 years ago

It's Jan 2, 2017 and kevin kulek is still a douchebag.

#12511 2 years ago

And Pirate costumes

#12512 2 years ago

And he's still not in custody of the feds.

#12513 2 years ago

...and the photography buisness.

#12514 2 years ago

And wearing a stupid beanie

36
#12515 2 years ago

Interesting new developments on Pacer.

In document 35, Keith is looking to recover the 32 foot trailer or $25,000.

35_relevant (resized).jpg

In document 37, Keith is looking to recover the Predator and Experts of Dangerous machines sold to Tim Fife.

37_relevant (resized).jpg

In document 39, Keith is looking to recover the CNC machine, or $25,000, from Virtuapin. He is also looking to recover $105,625 from Virtuapin.

39_relevant (resized).jpg

#12516 2 years ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

In document 37, Keith is looking to recover the Predator and Experts of Dangerous machines sold to Tim Fife.

Wow.

So Tim paid Kevin for the games, so shouldn't Kevin be on the hook for what was paid for them, rather than Tim?

Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

In document 39, Keith is looking to recover the CNC machine, or $25,000, from Virtuapin. He is also looking to recover $105,625 from Virtuapin. I guess the guy from Virtuapin was right when he said my $113k number was wrong. I was 8k off

I'm not sure I understand this either. If Virtuapin bought a CNC machine for the purposes of manufacturing the game cabinets, why would virtuapin be on the hook for this? Or is virtuapin the one trying to recover the cost of having to purchase the CNC machine for the purpose of fulfilling Kevin's cabinet order?

#12517 2 years ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

Interesting new developments on Pacer.
In document 35, Keith is looking to recover the 32 foot trailer or $25,000.

In document 37, Keith is looking to recover the Predator and Experts of Dangerous machines sold to Tim Fife.

In document 39, Keith is looking to recover the CNC machine, or $25,000, from Virtuapin. He is also looking to recover $105,625 from Virtuapin. I guess the guy from Virtuapin was right when he said my $113k number was wrong. I was 8k off.

*needs picture of the yellow dude's jaw hitting the floor*

I'm curious on the cabinet side of things. Is there a point where the market value of services rendered (like making cabs and PFs) is deducted from the ~105k? That number sounds huge anyway, was that 'prepayment' for the full run of cabs? Basically I'm wondering if Kevin went to any old wood shop, asked for a quote for 250 cabs, was quoted $400 each, and then paid them, how hosed would that shop be? They would of course actually deliver the 250 cabs.

#12518 2 years ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

He is also looking to recover $105,625 from Virtuapin.

Holy crap!!! That was for only ten cabinets? Or were they providing more than the cabinets or did they deliver more than ten cabinets? I'm confused.

#12519 2 years ago
Quoted from TigerLaw:

Holy crap!!! That was for only ten cabinets? Or were they providing more than the cabinets or did they deliver more than ten cabinets? I'm confused.

The rumor is that Kevin paid that money to Virtuapin for a bunch of powder coated stuff, or other goods, that in the end never got delivered to Skit-B.

-4
#12521 2 years ago

Interesting this was filed today? Aren't all government entities (including the courts) on holiday today? And who the heck is working today anyway, lol. Keith?

Sounds like a lengthy list of big, big wishes. Like VirtuaPin isn't going to fight this tooth and nail? How many hours does Keith get for fighting that battle in the courts with them? That is not some quick decision from the court and not just a couple of hours of Keith's time.

#12522 2 years ago

Still waiting for my empty VirtuaPins cabinet...

17
#12523 2 years ago
Quoted from Brickshot:

Interesting this was filed today? Aren't all government entities (including the courts) on holiday today? And who the heck is working today anyway, lol. Keith?
Sounds like a lengthy list of big, big wishes. Like VirtuaPin isn't going to fight this tooth and nail? How many hours does Keith get for fighting that battle in the courts with them? That is not some quick decision from the court and not just a couple of hours of Keith's time.

"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."
-Abraham Lincoln

#12524 2 years ago

boom

#12525 2 years ago
Quoted from jayhawkai:

"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."
-Abraham Lincoln

What part am I being a fool about exactly? VirtuaPin will not fight this? It won't be expensive? Or It won't be a lengthy court battle?

Who's the fool here?

30
#12526 2 years ago

To Keith.....We dont know each other, Im not on your list.

But personally, Thank you!

Your work has been astute and generous.

Pinheads should be glad that they retained you!

-13
#12527 2 years ago

Those who "retained" him are paying quite a bit for these prayers for Judgments. There can be no assurance that they will be entered (I know, in cases like these they usually are) and, if entered, no assurance of payback to those seeking recourse.

#12528 2 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

Wow.
So Tim paid Kevin for the games, so shouldn't Kevin be on the hook for what was paid for them, rather than Tim?

I'm not sure I understand this either. If Virtuapin bought a CNC machine for the purposes of manufacturing the game cabinets, why would virtuapin be on the hook for this? Or is virtuapin the one trying to recover the cost of having to purchase the CNC machine for completing Kevin's cabinet order?

The cite here is the trustee (whom Keith is working on behalf of) can go back two full years and avoid a transfer of property/interest if "made such transfer or incurred such obligation with actual intent to hinder, delay, or defraud any entity to which the debtor was or became, on or after the date that such transfer was made or such obligation was incurred, indebted"

Basically he's calling out Kevin as intending to defraud people.. and as such, he can go back two full years and recover any asset transferred away from Kevin. Adding fuel to the fire, if the transaction didn't result in a tangible asset of fair value back to Kevin... I'm sure they say it looks like constructive fraud (Kevin hiding money instead of just transacting normal business)

VirtuaPin or others can get screwed here even if they were acting in good faith because of 'preferential' treatment in the order of getting paid vs other debtitors. For instance, paying off a loan before the bankruptcy could mean one debtor getting 'preferential treatment' vs others.. and the court may want to rebalance that. I guess at that point, they too become debitors to Kevin? I'm not sure how that works.

But its interesting overall now.. that Keith is entering the 'intent to defraud' people angle. I'm sure that gets a lot hairy to argue.

#12529 2 years ago
Quoted from MrBally:

Those who "retained" him are paying quite a bit for these prayers for Judgments. There can be no assurance that they will be entered (I know, in cases like these they usually are) and, if entered, no assurance of payback to those seeking recourse.

This work should be paid by the trustee... from the assets that will be recovered in the bankruptcy. Keith isn't working for the individual creditors here, he's working on behalf of the trustee to shake the tree and find all the assets that the filer actually has.

In some ways you can say this is 'burning up the money that could be recovered' - but what it really means more of is... Kevin won't get away from the obligations nor will people benefit from his actions. Maybe people have less left at the end.. but Kevin certainly will have LESS. And that is probably the best outcome people can hope for.

#12530 2 years ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

Interesting new developments on Pacer.
In document 35, Keith is looking to recover the 32 foot trailer or $25,000.

In document 37, Keith is looking to recover the Predator and Experts of Dangerous machines sold to Tim Fife.

In document 39, Keith is looking to recover the CNC machine, or $25,000, from Virtuapin. He is also looking to recover $105,625 from Virtuapin.

Just curious but was there any mention of Back Alley at all in this new document? Wasn't Back Alley paid in full for like a hundred sets of the playfield skull and spine and the bloody hanging guy? And also paid for several dozen sets of the topper skulls and spine? I would think Keith got an answer as to whether or not those parts were delivered in full and if they were, is there an attempt to recover those too? If they weren't delivered in full then wouldn't Back Alley be in a similar situation to VirtuaPin?

#12531 2 years ago

Welp, Keith is now my hero. Awesome.

#12532 2 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

This work should be paid by the trustee... from the assets that will be recovered in the bankruptcy. Keith isn't working for the individual creditors here, he's working on behalf of the trustee to shake the tree and find all the assets that the filer actually has.

But that's equally the point, right? The money recovered here IS all of these folk's money. I would think some of these items have significant more chance of being recovered than others. But it's all gravy for Keith because even defending the unlikely recoveries means more hours and more dollars in his pocket.

Isn't he billing this at $350 an hour or something crazy like that? Do the folks on this case have a rough idea on the number of hours Keith has logged to date?

#12533 2 years ago

stop worrying about whom is paid what.

Be happy that things are proceeding in the right direction.

thanks for all your hard work Keith!

#12534 2 years ago

If my laymansn understanding is right, once Keith is successful at arguing fraud and intent to hide assets from the bankruptcy court, not only can he go back as flynn pointed out but he can refer it to authorities for criminal prosecution as bankruptcy fraud (assuming they pick it up... which if handed on a silver platter they just might) where they could go for a max sentence of 5 years.

Not something I would ever want to gamble against.

17
#12535 2 years ago
Quoted from Brickshot:

But that's equally the point, right? The money recovered here IS all of these folk's money. I would think some of these items have significant more chance of being recovered than others. But it's all gravy for Keith because even defending the unlikely recoveries means more hours and more dollars in his pocket.

The whole point here is to ensure Kevin doesn't get away with it... not 'get your money back'. So if the trustee consumes more of Kevin's assets is no real loss to any one... they never wouldn't have really gotten much anyway. This is about punishing and ensuring Kevin has a burden to bear... not about ROI.

#12536 2 years ago
Quoted from Brickshot:

Just curious but was there any mention of Back Alley at all in this new document? Wasn't Back Alley paid in full for like a hundred sets of the playfield skull and spine and the bloody hanging guy? And also paid for several dozen sets of the topper skulls and spine? I would think Keith got an answer as to whether or not those parts were delivered in full and if they were, is there an attempt to recover those too? If they weren't delivered in full then wouldn't Back Alley be in a similar situation to VirtuaPin?

You know as much as I do. The full documents are available to read online for free.

Quoted from Brickshot:

But that's equally the point, right? The money recovered here IS all of these folk's money. I would think some of these items have significant more chance of being recovered than others. But it's all gravy for Keith because even defending the unlikely recoveries means more hours and more dollars in his pocket.
Isn't he billing this at $350 an hour or something crazy like that? Do the folks on this case have a rough idea on the number of hours Keith has logged to date?

I don't understand the point of the questions about Keith. He is doing a great job for his clients. If you think his motivation for this is to get rich off the litigation, you are barking up the wrong tree.

-17
#12537 2 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

The whole point here is to ensure Kevin doesn't get away with it... not 'get your money back'. So if the trustee consumes more of Kevin's assets is no real loss to any one... they never wouldn't have really gotten much anyway. This is about punishing and ensuring Kevin has a burden to bear... not about ROI.

How is getting money back from VirtuaPin going to ensure "Kevin doesn't get away with it"?? Especially considering Keith is going to get fully paid before everyone else. Just saying.

If you want to focus on hurting Kevin then focus on his blatant disregard for the court's orders and for possibly the lies he told (perjuring himself) while under oath. An update on that would be something to celebrate. Jail time for Kevin is the closest thing folk's will get in terms of justice. The new document is a bit odd in my mind because you can't argue he paid some 100K+ to a given supplier and that he intended to defraud folks in the same breath. It seems like evidence to me that Kevin paid out the money to suppliers and intended to build games. I see zero evidence of Keith building a case for fraud here and in fact, just the opposite. Keith is just clawing for every cent he can get and will then pay himself first, and pennies on the dollar to the victims. Sorry to be a Debbie Downer.

#12539 2 years ago
Quoted from Brickshot:

How is getting money back from VirtuaPin going to ensure "Kevin doesn't get away with it"?? Especially considering Keith is going to get fully paid before everyone else. Just saying.

Because it ensures Kevin has liabilities that WON'T be flushed with the bankruptcy. I means Kevin will have a monkey on his back for ages.

Quoted from Brickshot:

If you want to focus on hurting Kevin then focus on his blatant disregard for the court's orders and for possibly the lies he told (perjuring himself) while under oath

Well you can't have 'disregard for court orders' if you don't have actual court actions... and that's where we are at.. and that's why this is good news.

Quoted from Brickshot:

Jail time for Kevin is the closest thing folk's will get in terms of justice

Actually for most people having Kevin not being able to live a free and stress free life is worth it. Criminal Action has already been looked at, with no traction. So don't point there. We can only hope with all the information flushed out in the bankruptcy that the criminal side will be looked at differently in the future.

Quoted from Brickshot:

The new document is a bit odd in my mind because you can't argue he paid some 100K+ to a given supplier and that he intended to defraud folks in the same breath. It seems like evidence to me that Kevin paid out the money to suppliers and intended to build games. I see zero evidence of Keith building a case for fraud here and in fact, just the opposite. Keith is just clawing for every cent he can get and will then pay himself first, and pennies on the dollar to the victims. Sorry to be a Debbie Downer.

1) Defrauding people isn't just about 'game or no game'
2) Paying a supplier in itself is not enough to satisfy good faith - What did Kevin pay for? What assets did he get in return? Was it in done in a manner that proper and not moving money away from other creditors?

I'm sure Keith could be pursuing cases with guaranteed payouts and chasing people with far more on the line. I highly doubt this is a 'get myself rich' scheme by Keith. And even if it was... as long as Kevin is burdened by it at the end... people will still thank Keith.

#12540 2 years ago
Quoted from OLDPINGUY:

To Keith.....We dont know each other, Im not on your list.
But personally, Thank you!
Your work has been astute and generous.
Pinheads should be glad that they retained you!

F#ck ya!!!! I hardily agree with the little chain smoking baby!!!!

QSS

#12541 2 years ago
Quoted from Brickshot:

But that's equally the point, right? The money recovered here IS all of these folk's money. I would think some of these items have significant more chance of being recovered than others. But it's all gravy for Keith because even defending the unlikely recoveries means more hours and more dollars in his pocket.
Isn't he billing this at $350 an hour or something crazy like that? Do the folks on this case have a rough idea on the number of hours Keith has logged to date?

350$ a hour is nothing in Charlottesville VA for a good lawyer. Could easily hit 500$ an hour.

20
#12542 2 years ago
Quoted from wolftownjeff:

350$ a hour is nothing in Charlottesville VA for a good lawyer. Could easily hit 500$ an hour.

Those fancy Charlottesville attorneys even put the dollar sign to the left of the number.

#12543 2 years ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

The rumor is that Kevin paid that money to Virtuapin for a bunch of powder coated stuff, or other goods, that in the end never got delivered to Skit-B.

If I remember correctly, the cabinet guy denied taking in that kind of money when you mentioned it earlier in the thread. I guess Keith found something that states otherwise.

#12544 2 years ago
Quoted from Razorbak86:

The trustee may be able to pursue avoidance actions for preferential transfers and fraudulent conveyances to recover proceeds for later distribution to creditors.

Nice work, Keith.

19
#12545 2 years ago
Quoted from Brickshot:

The new document is a bit odd in my mind because you can't argue he paid some 100K+ to a given supplier and that he intended to defraud folks in the same breath. It seems like evidence to me that Kevin paid out the money to suppliers and intended to build games. I see zero evidence of Keith building a case for fraud here and in fact, just the opposite.

You've obviously never heard of salting:

Salting or "salting the mine" are terms for a scam in which gemstones or gold ore are planted in a mine or on the landscape, duping the mark into purchasing shares in a worthless or non-existent mining company. During gold rushes, scammers would load shotguns with gold dust and shoot into the sides of the mine to give the appearance of a rich ore, thus "salting the mine". Examples include the diamond hoax of 1872 and the Bre-X gold fraud of the mid-1990s. This trick was featured in the HBO series Deadwood, when Al Swearengen and E. B. Farnum trick Brom Garret into believing gold is to be found on the claim Swearengen intends to sell him.

In this case, Kevin was paying people for painted spinal bones and cabinets to post here on Pinside the project was progressing forward as planned (*I'm not saying they were knowing participants in what Kevin appears to have been doing*), increasing everyone's confidence as they sent in their money or did not demand a refund. Absent the salting (showing that he was accumulating some parts and getting people to pledge he was moving forward) he may have faced the charge backs quicker when more people still had time to get a return of their money. This is just my personal opinion obviously.

Quoted from Brickshot:

Keith is just clawing for every cent he can get and will then pay himself first, and pennies on the dollar to the victims.

Keith has done a phenominal job on this case, a case most lawyers would not have taken on at all. I hope he gets paid, he's freaking earned it big time. $350 an hour is not an unfair wage: Keith has staff he has to pay, insurance he has to maintain, rent, research subscriptions, bar dues, continuing education requirements, etc. You'd be surprised how little of $350 an hour lawyers actually see when its all said and done.

#12546 2 years ago

Great work Keith. Surprised you didn't ask for the (5) new laptops from Christmas morning 2016.

13
#12547 2 years ago

lol

Tim Fife is an idiot.

#12548 2 years ago

Kevin's 2017.....

download (resized).jpg

-11
#12549 2 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

I'm sure Keith could be pursuing cases with guaranteed payouts and chasing people with far more on the line. I highly doubt this is a 'get myself rich' scheme by Keith.

I'm not suggesting this is a get rich scheme. I'm suggesting this is exactly how he makes a living and this is his bread and butter. He is a debt collecting lawyer. This pays for his Beamer or Jag, guaranteed. He isn't doing this out of the kindness of his heart.

Quoted from wolftownjeff:

350$ a hour is nothing in Charlottesville VA for a good lawyer. Could easily hit 500$ an hour.

But we're not talking a trial lawyer here and this isn't the dream team defending OJ. You're going after Kevin! How hard is that? I can't believe how people seem to treat him as some mastermind criminal. Kevin is handing this to Keith on a Silver platter by ignoring the Judge's orders and even posting videos and pics online that show his contempt for everyone.

Quoted from TigerLaw:

You've obviously never heard of salting:

I had not heard of salting and that is actually interesting (seriously). But are you really trying to pretend Keith is going to build a case that is what Kevin was doing? C'mon. Kevin is no evil genius.

Quoted from TigerLaw:

Keith has done a phenominal job on this case, a case most lawyers would not have taken on at all. I hope he gets paid, he's freaking earned it big time. $350 an hour is not an unfair wage

A debt recovery lawyer would normally not take a case to go after potentially 500-700K while getting paid $350 an hour? Really? They wouldn't do that, huh? And you're a lawyer yourself, right?

#12550 2 years ago
Quoted from Brickshot:

A debt recovery lawyer would normally not take a case to go after potentially 500-700K while getting paid $350 an hour? Really? They wouldn't do that, huh? And you're a lawyer yourself, right?

I'm still having a hard time understanding what you are getting at.

Can you clarify the point you are trying to make?

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