(Topic ID: 108377)

The Official Pinside Kevin Kulek Skit-B Predator Discussion


By Xerico

4 years ago



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  • Latest reply 34 days ago by Cobra99
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#11652 2 years ago
Quoted from OLDPINGUY:

I have Kids and Bad health, Kindly Paypal $5000 for my fully licensed Judicial System Pinball..........

+1

I have a kid. I'd like 200 people to paypal me $8,000.00 USD right now for a product i'm not going to produce but lie to you all about.

#11653 2 years ago
Quoted from TigerLaw:

Not a terrible theme idea, sadly.

The game would be completely level, as to create a slow moving game, just like the justice system. Sometimes, you put your money in, and never get a chance to play, you got robbed!

#11654 2 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

We're talking tens of thousands here.

Keep going.....

#11655 2 years ago
Quoted from Roostking:

The game would be completely level, as to create a slow moving game, just like the justice system. Sometimes, you put your money in, and never get a chance to play, you got robbed!

The instruction card is 15 pages of Latin gibberish.

#11656 2 years ago

One.....Million....Dollars!

#11657 2 years ago
Quoted from KeithinMI:

Keep going.....

There is a document from the court with a list of names and amounts if someone wants to get the exact number.

#11658 2 years ago

New docket item: #16.

#11659 2 years ago

I can buy a statement that says buyers needed to have some understanding that there was a risk of pre-ordering from an unproven start-up and had the business failed legitimately, then, those who lost money could look at themselves in the mirror and say 'I took a risk and I lost', but that is not what happened here. This business was run fraudulently, it was built up on lies and then more lies and then more lies and that is why Kevin deserves to be treated as a thief. He did not fail due to his lack of business savvy, (although clearly he did not have any), he failed, because he was trying to do something illegally and he got caught.

While you hate for any child to have their well being harmed by a criminal parent, that does not mean that Kevin should be give any kind of a break, what so ever. There were other adults involved as well, including his wife and mother (and still not much info on why his partner left and if he is being pursued as well, he was certainly there when the money came in and had to know the license was not legit), so they did have a responsibility to step in on this to protect their family, and they chose to be a part of the fraud.

It has been clear for a while that it is likely that little money will be reclaimed but the need for Kevin to be held accountable and to pay a price for his fraud is the absolute minimum that is needed for those who were robbed to move on. I suspect very few want to see his kids be collateral damage, but that is Kevin's fault, not those looking for justice.

#11660 2 years ago

If there was aprox $300k-$400K taken and $30K paid for a house....where is the rest??

#11661 2 years ago
Quoted from Taxman:

There is a document from the court with a list of names and amounts if someone wants to get the exact number.

That's only what's been disclosed by the Debtor, and it's accuracy is only as good as the Debtor's truthfulness and records.

By my estimations the Schedule F is off by a factor of 2

#11662 2 years ago
Quoted from spfxted:

If there was aprox $300k-$400K taken and $30K paid for a house....where is the rest??

Triple that.

#11663 2 years ago

He didn't make his decision to lie in a vacuum. The first thing that would have gone through my (or any decent person's) head would have been my family. First, I surely wouldn't want to disappoint them by stealing from my fellow hobbyists.. but second, I DEFINITELY wouldn't want to put myself in a position to be removed from them due to that criminal activity.

The fact that he perpetuated this scam after it was very clear it was wrong to do so is definitely on him. The fact that he chose to do that knowing what potential effect that could have on his family makes him all the more despicable.

28
#11664 2 years ago

For your afternoon reading pleasure... the motion to extend filed by Keith today.

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#11665 2 years ago

Totaling over $1,000,000

#11666 2 years ago

That doesn't sound like the sort of court paperwork I'd enjoy...

#11667 2 years ago

Someone clear something up, I have a logic switch flipped somewhere..
Why would Keith WANT the time for Keith to be extended?

#11668 2 years ago
Quoted from Coyote:

Someone clear something up, I have a logic switch flipped somewhere..
Why would Keith WANT the time for Keith to be extended?

He needs more time for discovery so that he can mount the best objection to the bankruptcy. If its not filed in court by the time its due, the court can't consider it. So there's a bunch of information that has to be subpoenaed in order to figure out where certain assets might be hidden.

#11669 2 years ago

Deadline for objecting to discharge extended to 3/12/2017.

The wheels of justice do indeed move slowly. I guess better moving than stopped.

-18
#11670 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

If he didn't have kids, I'd be all for this "making his life hell" mentality. I know, I know, he brought it on himself. But he ain't exactly Bernie Madoff.
I hope that losing some discretionary income money on non-delivered toys is the worst thing that ever happens to all you victims. I know, I know, a few people prepaid multiple entire games... but they hoped to make a killing, and that was a huge risk. One shouldn't risk more than one can afford to lose, and pinball is not an investment vehicle.
If this comment brings on any thumbs downs, I'd like to hear what exactly I said that you "don't agree" with! It all seems unassailable to me.

Wow, 22 so far! Touched a nerve!

So which thing do we disagree with?

What, the innocent kids don't matter? He didn't bring it on himself? He was a Bernie Madoff, screwing thousands of investors out of their entire retirement funds? I should hope worse things happen than losing toy money? It wasn't a huge risk to give hat boy tens of thousands? They didn't hope to make a killing? One should risk more than they can afford to lose? Pinball is an investment vehicle?

See, none of it can be legitimately disagreed with. Y'all are misusing the thumbs down. It's not for expressing hurt feelings.

This is what I get for stating obvious things and feeling sorry for his kids. I am not blaming the victims. I certainly don't condone his actions. The guy was an idiot from start to finish. He should have started paying a lawyer a lot sooner, and listened to their advice. As soon as the intellectual property problem reared its ugly head, he should have cancelled the whole project and returned what money he could, including the comically inept hiding of money in the house in his wife's name.

Looking at those latest court docs, I see prison in his future after all. And he deserves it. It's just that I find the whole thing sad.

#11671 2 years ago

IMO there is no way Kevin spent anything close to $1,000,000 during this entire debacle.

If I was a suspicious person I would perhaps suggest that Kevin complied with the criminal/FBI investigation to a minimal extent and with the bankruptcy proceedings not at all in order to hide the fact that he has a lot of cash stashed somewhere and once the bankruptcy proceedings are finalised with a minimal financial penalty for himself he could have a rather pleasant lifestyle for a number of years. That's just if I was suspicious.

#11672 2 years ago
Quoted from Coyote:

Someone clear something up, I have a logic switch flipped somewhere..
Why would Keith WANT the time for Keith to be extended?

So he can spend more time proving there are assets out there that are not disclosed... to prove the wrongdoings to ensure the outstanding debts are NOT discharged (so later suits can continue against Kevin to collect)... and basically to ensure Kevin doesn't get to flush all this history through a bankruptcy petition.

It seems all those associates of Kevin that may have been helping him mask things like the operator business and other assets are going to be getting nasty grams soon enough It's gonna get juicy.

#11673 2 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

So he can spend more time proving there are assets out there that are not disclosed... to prove the wrongdoings to ensure the outstanding debts are NOT discharged (so later suits can continue against Kevin to collect)... and basically to ensure Kevin doesn't get to flush all this history through a bankruptcy petition.
It seems all those associates of Kevin that may have been helping him mask things like the operator business and other assets are going to be getting nasty grams soon enough It's gonna get juicy.

Quoted from Compy:

He needs more time for discovery so that he can mount the best objection to the bankruptcy. If its not filed in court by the time its due, the court can't consider it. So there's a bunch of information that has to be subpoenaed in order to figure out where certain assets might be hidden.

OH! Thanks guys - I thought the 'discharge' meant that the courts found Kevin liable, and that Keith was giving him more time to defend himself. Nono, I had it backwards - Kevin needs more time to find assets.

Gotit, thanks!

#11674 2 years ago
Quoted from Andy_B:

IMO there is no way Kevin spent anything close to $1,000,000 during this entire debacle.
If I was a suspicious person I would perhaps suggest that Kevin complied with the criminal/FBI investigation to a minimal extent and with the bankruptcy proceedings not at all in order to hide the fact that he has a lot of cash stashed somewhere and once the bankruptcy proceedings are finalised with a minimal financial penalty for himself he could have a rather pleasant lifestyle for a number of years. That's just if I was suspicious.

Didn't somebody say he was buying himself and kids a bunch of quads and gear and stuff too though? Sounds like he spent a lot of money on toys and BS

#11675 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

Wow, 22 so far! Touched a nerve!
So which thing do we disagree with?
What, the innocent kids don't matter? He didn't bring it on himself? He was a Bernie Madoff, screwing thousands of investors out of their entire retirement funds? I should hope worse things happen than losing toy money? It wasn't a huge risk to give hat boy tens of thousands? They didn't hope to make a killing? One should risk more than they can afford to lose? Pinball is an investment vehicle?
See, none of it can be legitimately disagreed with. Y'all are misusing the thumbs down. It's not for expressing hurt feelings.
This is what I get for stating obvious things and feeling sorry for his kids. I am not blaming the victims. I certainly don't condone his actions. The guy was an idiot from start to finish. He should have started paying a lawyer a lot sooner, and listened to their advice. As soon as the intellectual property problem reared its ugly head, he should have cancelled the whole project and returned what money he could, including the comically inept hiding of money in the house in his wife's name.
Looking at those latest court docs, I see prison in his future after all. And he deserves it. It's just that I find the whole thing sad.

One million dollars is Bernie Madoff money to me... You are missing the point. HE STOLE MONEY FRAUDULENTLY. In a civilized society, one does not do that to ones fellow civilized man.

At least you understand he deserves to be *** in prison. Not that I am advocating he get *** in prison, but I watch Locked up on the discovery channel. Bad things happen!

18
#11676 2 years ago

Dan, I thought others had debunked your thoughts, but, here, lets be specific . . .

Quoted from DanQverymuch:

If he didn't have kids, I'd be all for this "making his life hell" mentality. I know, I know, he brought it on himself. But he ain't exactly Bernie Madoff.

Why does having kids mean he should get a pass on being a criminal? Why should it matter if he is rich or not? While no one wants to see a child pay the price for having a father that is a lying crook, as I said earlier, the rest of the family should have stepped into protect them, but they chose to participate in the fraud. Since I have a family, I guess you would be okay if I ripped you off for a ton of money. In a perfect world, folks would like 'make his life hell' and not impact his kids, but him having kids does not earn him a free pass, by any stretch of the imagination.

Quoted from DanQverymuch:

I hope that losing some discretionary income money on non-delivered toys is the worst thing that ever happens to all you victims. I know, I know, a few people prepaid multiple entire games... but they hoped to make a killing, and that was a huge risk. One shouldn't risk more than one can afford to lose, and pinball is not an investment vehicle.

I also hope it is the worse thing that ever happens to those who were swindled. And as I've posted previously, if skit-b had failed as a business, and folks lost their money, I would have a lot less sympathy than I do now. Yes, it should have been clear to those buying, that there was risk of buying from a start-up, and it is possible that few were looking to make a profit on it, but that was not the case for most. They did not lose their 'investment' due to a failed company, there were swindled by a con man, so it is totally inappropriate for you to say 'the should not risk more than they could afford to lose'. None of these folks who lost money are saying "oh, I can't make my mortgage payment due to buying a pinball machine", they are saying "this fracking guy lied to me, and stole my money and he should be held accountable under the law". That is what should happen whether this was pocket change to someone, or life savings.

Many were paying early and when requested to help Kevin succeed, they wanted to see him succeed, the community did. They had no clue he was lying and committing fraud, so to come back and say 'your own fault', is total BS.

#11677 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

If he didn't have kids, I'd be all for this "making his life hell" mentality. I know, I know, he brought it on himself. But he ain't exactly Bernie Madoff.
I hope that losing some discretionary income money on non-delivered toys is the worst thing that ever happens to all you victims. I know, I know, a few people prepaid multiple entire games... but they hoped to make a killing, and that was a huge risk. One shouldn't risk more than one can afford to lose, and pinball is not an investment vehicle.
If this comment brings on any thumbs downs, I'd like to hear what exactly I said that you "don't agree" with! It all seems unassailable to me.

It seems you're confusing investing in a start up (risk of total loss) with buying a product from a start up company with no statement of implied risk from the vendor.

If you don't understand this simple concept there's little I, or anyone here, can do for you.

-12
#11678 2 years ago

I still don't think he went into this with the intention of scamming anyone. He was riding high on the adoration being heaped upon him, and when the devil in the details finally made reality come crashing down around him, he did and said all the wrong things, like a cornered rat, as I've said before.

Hey, can I get some redemption if I just say I'll shut up about it now? If he pulled in a cool million, it must be somewhere, and I do hope justice is served and what money remains is returned. His kids will survive; hell, my parents barely scraped by and I'm doing okay...

#11679 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

I still don't think he went into this with the intention of scamming anyone. He was riding high on the adoration being heaped upon him, and when the devil in the details finally made reality come crashing down around him, he did and said all the wrong things, like a cornered rat, as I've said before.
Hey, can I get some redemption if I just say I'll shut up about it now? If he pulled in a cool million, it must be somewhere, and I do hope justice is served and what money remains is returned. His kids will survive; hell, my parents barely scraped by and I'm doing okay...

But he did not go in with a business plan
You want a loan from a bank, you need to produce a plan. You need to show that you understand what it takes to produce a product

15
#11680 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

I still don't think he went into this with the intention of scamming anyone...

You are fine to think this if you wish.

But what does that matter, when he had the chance to make right, knowing he was wrong, before he hurt so many people.

Had you been involved, invested, dreamed, worked hard and paid for, you might understand with the empathy you have for Kevin is misplaced 100% IMO.

#11681 2 years ago

Wow. So it would appear that it is likely that there is a big stash of money somewhere that has been hidden, right?
Nice to see some proper movement. Well done to all you guys that stuck with it.

35
#11682 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

What, the innocent kids don't matter? He didn't bring it on himself? He was a Bernie Madoff, screwing thousands of investors out of their entire retirement funds? I should hope worse things happen than losing toy money? It wasn't a huge risk to give hat boy tens of thousands? They didn't hope to make a killing? One should risk more than they can afford to lose? Pinball is an investment vehicle?
See, none of it can be legitimately disagreed with. Y'all are misusing the thumbs down. It's not for expressing hurt feelings.

You think that's why people gave you thumbs down? Because they can't come up with counter points? Maybe because there are no counter points to your weird point of view about it?

The innocent kids don't matter to the case at hand. This is between Kevin and the people he stole money from.

What do you want me to say? Yes, I want Kevin to have a tough go at it, his wife included. She knowingly took part in the fraud (i.e. titling the house in just her name, per his own admission)

Are their kids going to suffer because of what he did? Yes.

Is that my problem? No.

Is it ideal? Shit no. Ideal would have been Kevin not stealing people's money.

Sorry if that is callous or insensitive, but it's the way I feel about it.

Is that enough legitimate disagreement for you?

My argument should be that the kids will be better off without Kevin around. He is a bad role model.

#11683 2 years ago

Sucks to be his kids, and if kevin did start out with good intentions that Aaron guy... maybe that's a big If. From what I can remember Aaron bailed around the time he started asking for cash.

#11684 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

If he didn't have kids, I'd be all for this "making his life hell" mentality. I know, I know, he brought it on himself. But he ain't exactly Bernie Madoff.
I hope that losing some discretionary income money on non-delivered toys is the worst thing that ever happens to all you victims. I know, I know, a few people prepaid multiple entire games... but they hoped to make a killing, and that was a huge risk. One shouldn't risk more than one can afford to lose, and pinball is not an investment vehicle.
If this comment brings on any thumbs downs, I'd like to hear what exactly I said that you "don't agree" with! It all seems unassailable to me.

I'm giving you a thumbs down because I do not give a damn about his innocent children.
I do not feel guilt for wishing him "all the worst" financially and criminally, fully knowing that his kids will suffer the consequences.

#11685 2 years ago

"The road to hell is paved with best intentions" Its so exciting to see this fraudulent con artist may get some justice.

A real man provides and protects his children, not gamble their family livelyhood by being a criminal. All my hopes for his children, but he deserves everything he gets legally.

#11686 2 years ago

Anyone know people in Kevin's "circle" that have any insight what he's up to these days? I take it he's obviously still not working.

14
#11687 2 years ago
Quoted from TigerLaw:

Anyone know people in Kevin's "circle" that have any insight what he's up to these days? I take it he's obviously still not working.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess that he's smokin' weed and sitting on the couch.

#11688 2 years ago
Quoted from PorkChopExpress:

I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess that he's smokin' weed and sitting on the couch.

Probably some really expensive strain

#11689 2 years ago
Quoted from Coyote:

OH! Thanks guys - I thought the 'discharge' meant that the courts found Kevin liable, and that Keith was giving him more time to defend himself. Nono, I had it backwards - Kevin needs more time to find assets.
Gotit, thanks!

Does Keith recall people seeing Kevin at that show buying arcade equipment?

#11690 2 years ago

There has to be some sort of trail of where the money at least originally went after the pre-order money was deposited. Then then probably pulled it out and moved it around to various accounts probably in other people's names in an attempt to hide it. This is why the discovery process will take so much time.

This guy is such a POS that he thinks he can hide 1 million dollars, declare bankruptcy with no proof where the money went, and then have all his debts forgiven. Then he'll live off the hidden money for the rest of his life. Keith should check Kevin's backyard. He probably has it buried back there.

14
#11691 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

I still don't think he went into this with the intention of scamming anyone.

Can we please get past this.
"I have a liscencing agreement with Fox movies to use Predator" was NEVER true. It was always a lie. That makes it a scam. From the beginning.

#11692 2 years ago

No one mentioned section 2 (b) where he deposited "over $54K Income" but reported no income 2013, 2014, 2105. To me this reads tax evasion. While good for getting him criminally it is bad because the treasury department will want to be paid first from any money discovered.

So yes the bad paperwork and disappearing money is big and leading to criminal. The treasury department considers you guilty until you can prove yourself innocent. And this guy does not have the paperwork to prove anything.

I'm also interested in the pinball machines and equipment held in other people's names statement. Are these other Predator games, vending equipment bought at auctions and/or paid for by Predator money and used to run a vending company. This is real interesting stuff.

#11693 2 years ago

Just want to throw this out there for Keith or anyone else interested... in another thread Kevin had said this:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/a-few-words-from-skit-b-pinball/page/2#post-2076923

We have been working very closely with PayPal for a long time to make sure that every penny that goes through us is well-protected and secure. They have been extremely helpful and have developed a strong personal rapport with us that affords us the luxury of open and direct communication in any and all situations. With the security of all funds being absolutely paramount in ANY foreseeable case, there are processes that must be followed and while they can take a bit of time to work with, the end result is that even if we were to literally die or encounter a license issue or disappear to Venezuela or whatever other rumors there may be, we do so without risking a cent of your money.

My take away reading that at the time, and still is today, is that Paypal's red flags went up when so much money went into his account and to protect themselves they likely froze it.

Kevin got some of the money obviously, because we know about the house now, and the undocumented business expenses, but the bulk of the money is still unaccounted for.

Likely Paypal can fill in some of these blanks, and who knows, maybe they still have some (after dealing with all the chargebacks). But you'd have to take it up with them.

#11694 2 years ago

I spoke with PayPal legal last year. The account has long since been drained. There has been nothing there for a long long time.

#11695 2 years ago
Quoted from Enaud:

I spoke with PayPal legal last year. The account has long since been drained. There has been nothing there for a long long time.

what someone tells you over the phone and what they have to show when legally obligated are 2 different things.

IME paypal will tell you whatever they can to get rid of you.

#11696 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

What, the innocent kids don't matter?

In all honesty, I think it's BETTER that his kids see and experience the outcome of his fraud. Perhaps they will learn a lesson (admittedly, the hard way) that lying and stealing isn't the best way to get ahead in this world.

#11697 2 years ago

What about the kids he stole from?

That's the problem with thieves and criminals...their actions hurt innocent people, both during the time the crime is committed and again during the punishment phase.

Only one person is responsible for the wreckage, and it's not the prosecuting attorney.

#11698 2 years ago

If Kevin's kids get hurt in any way in this process, it is a shame, but its nobodies fault but Kevin himself.

If you guys want to see some disgusting heffers in skimpy outfits taken with camera equipment bought with predator money I reccomend asking to be a part of kevin's wife's new group: Fae's secrets! https://www.facebook.com/groups/laumeboudoir/

I bet she's not telling all of her secrets on this FB page though notice how she has turned off comments and ratings on her normal photography buisiness FB page now.

#11699 2 years ago

She accidentally misspelled "lame".

Maybe he should have stolen some of the money to get her photography lessons.

#11700 2 years ago
Quoted from RCA1:

Can we please get past this.
"I have a liscencing agreement with Fox movies to use Predator" was NEVER true. It was always a lie. That makes it a scam. From the beginning.

Didn't he continue to collect funds after her received cies and desist letters for 20th Century Fox?

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