(Topic ID: 108377)

The Official Pinside Kevin Kulek Skit-B Predator Discussion


By Xerico

4 years ago



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#5451 4 years ago
Quoted from Sjsilver:

I think you are casting too wide a net going after all the vendors. There is a big difference between taking someone's word that they had the license (like we all did here when we sent this guy money) and jumping up on a milk crate to assure all the doubters that everything is fine. LOTS of vendors sold goods and services to Skit-B, or entered into business arrangements with them in good faith, only 2 of them put their reputations on the line to promise things they did not know for sure was the truth. I have no ill will towards the first group, and no sympathy at all for the second group. If you want to put your neck on the line for something you haven't verified, you can't bitch when it gets cut off by the truth.

i'm not really "going after" them... what i'm saying is that i can't wrap my mind around the fact that these people "took some guy's word" for something as sensitive as licensing... i don't have a lot of sympathy for those who proclaimed (loudly and definitively) that a license existed when they had never actually seen it... whatever flack they get, they deserve... hopefully they added to their "business acumen" as a part of this disaster and learned their lesson as well...

you'll note i'm being very careful in these posts to NOT "blame the buyers for not knowing there wasn't a license" (i have noted that it was pretty clear for quite some time there wasn't)... although i have my own feelings about that, that's a topic for a much later date...

#5452 4 years ago
Quoted from spfxted:

Yours...for not learning how to swim...

And who are the non-swimmers in this situation? This guys life is ruined. His family will likely suffer from this. Yes, he's a fool and yes he bears the brunt of the responsibility. He started and perpetuated the charade. But OMG look at the impact from that. And all of this could have been stopped with a couple simple questions.....

#5454 4 years ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

And who are the non-swimmers in this situation? This guys life is ruined. His family will likely suffer from this. Yes, he's a fool and yes he bears the brunt of the responsibility. He started and perpetuated the charade. But OMG look at the impact from that. And all of this could have been stopped with a couple simple questions.....

they do not give purple hearts for self-inflicted wounds....

-14
#5455 4 years ago
Quoted from ccotenj:

they do not give purple hearts for self-inflicted wounds....

John Kerry got a Purple Heart, Silver Star and an Honorable Discharge for a self inflicted wound.

#5456 4 years ago
Quoted from the_one:

I am left with no other option than to abandon everything and make good on our promises that your investments are safe and return all money associated with the project until anything else happens, if anything else should happen. The refund process is expected to be swift and completed very soon.

"To the many of you who have continued to support us ...."

"Swift" huh? So everyone should have their money back this week apparently. If or when anyone gets any type of refund, please post it here. Good luck.

And Kevin's last part "To the many"? Really? There are many people here still supporting him?

#5457 4 years ago
Quoted from OLDPINGUY:

Predator MODS!
Anyone need a Neca Playfield Skull Set?
Too soon? Too Late? pred.JPG (Click image to enlarge)

I've got 2 boxes of those skulls and the official Predator, Jungle Dutch, and Predator-vision Dutch figurines. I've taken Predator off my wishlist but haven't had the heart to clear off my shelf of Pred-related stuff yet. I think I'm going to keep the skulls in case we ever get an Alien pin, or just made a big pile of them for my T-Rex to stomp around in. He's having fun screaming his disappointment at Arnold these days anyway.

Pred Rex.jpg
Pred Rex 2.jpg

#5458 4 years ago
Quoted from ccotenj:

they do not give purple hearts for self-inflicted wounds....

I'm not defending him, but I see self-inflicted wounds on both sides. I'm aware of the fraud that occurs online every day. Apparently many savvy, successful Pinsiders with disposable income aren't.

#5459 4 years ago

Has anyone ever talked to Aaron, his old partner? I think his story would be telling as far a timeline goes.

-21
#5460 4 years ago

I have a question. What made these people run to Fox and tattle that this guy was making these games? Why would they do this knowing the shit storm it would cause and that it would cause everyone to lose their game and money?

#5461 4 years ago
Quoted from nintendo:

I dunno...I keep thinking and "The Shadow" seems to be an appropriate title for the movie...

I like that one. But that's not what people were hoping for. This is the one the group from TX and Canada want made with big bright colors. But withhold the release of the movie at theaters or on DVD. Put it on Netflix and let other people online talk about "I heard there was a new movie about pinball that just came out....."

large_hMmfSIvTmI88tEVouo6QuoIMb16.jpg

22
#5462 4 years ago
Quoted from NoahFentz:

I sure did, and for that, I sincerely apologize. I was given every reason to believe it was fully licensed, as was every pre-owner and other vendor.
Kevin even let me stick my neck out there, just to get it cut off knowingly. For that, he will never be forgiven.
I'm just as pissed as every here, as I have a lot to lose over this fiasco, too.

I don't blame you for not going "papers please" on Kevin. This is a small hobby, and it's built on a lot of trust and community, and I don't really have any problem with that.

I don't really want things to get to the point where vendors helping each other start requiring forms signed in triplicate.

Your mistake wasn't trusting Kevin, you're hardly alone, it was speaking up the way you did. If you had simply said "I haven't seen any license, I'm going on Kevin's word alone" it would have been a very different story. Instead your post implied that you had some higher level of proof.

As with everything else, this comes back onto Kevin's head. I'm sure you learned a lesson from it all the hard way, doubt you'll make that same mistake again.

18
#5463 4 years ago
Quoted from zr11990:

I have a question. What made these people run to Fox and tattle that this guy was making these games? Why would they do this knowing the shit storm it would cause and that it would cause everyone to lose their game and money?

Another person upset that Kevin got caught? Seriously? Would you rather Fox found out 25 games into production and then halted everything? How much larger of a mess would it be then?

The fact is, forget the license issues. Kevin had no way to build these games. Period. He admitted as much. This thing was a mess before the lies came to light.

20
#5464 4 years ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

Look at this rage against the anonymous group. I believe they sent Pinside mods the allegations as well. Did Pinside warn anybody or even suggest some caution and prudence when things got sketchy? They apparently want to be a neutral party. At a time when any warning by an end user got skewered by others, a Pinside authority might have been the voice that was listened to.

Let me set the record straight. Pinside was not privy to any information beyond what was in the emails that were circulating from the anonymous group. These were the same emails that were apparently sent to many people in the community, and I'm guessing were forwarded to countless others. We chose not post these emails on Pinside for the same reason that nobody else posted them on Pinside. At the time, there was simply no way to know if the claims were legit. To make it even more confusing, none of the emails were sent directly to us. They were all forwarded to us second hand, making it even more difficult to discern if anything had been altered. We attempted to ascertain whether or not the information in the emails was factual, but we were unable to do so. The emails were written by an anonymous source, so it's not as if we could call them up on the phone and ask them to corroborate the story. Naturally, we reached out to Kevin, but he would not respond to any of our inquiries.

The bottom line is that we were just as much in the dark about this as everyone else. Even within our small group, there was disagreement about what was really going on. Since we could not verify the information, our hands were essentially tied. It is our practice not to officially endorse anything on Pinside that isn’t backed by evidence. This applies to everything, not just this situation. It should also be pointed out that most of the allegations made in the anonymous emails made their way on to Pinside anyway. We did not delete these posts or in any way attempt to control the flow of information. We just couldn’t officially take a position without all the facts.

-5
#5465 4 years ago
Quoted from zr11990:

I have a question. What made these people run to Fox and tattle that this guy was making these games? Why would they do this knowing the shit storm it would cause and that it would cause everyone to lose their game and money?

Laughing my butt off about this one. If they had kept their mouths shut this wouldn't be a fiasco. Fox had no clue this was a thing.

#5466 4 years ago
Quoted from dung:

Laughing my butt off about this one. If they had kept their mouths shut this wouldn't be a fiasco. Fox had no clue this was a thing.

Eventually it would have come to light, and then the police would be knocking on owners' doors with a signed warrant for possession of stolen property. Also, all the money would be gone

#5467 4 years ago
Quoted from Noahs_Arcade:

Eventually it would have come to light, and then the police would be knocking on owners' doors with a signed warrant for possession of stolen property. Also, all the money would be gone

No the police would not have knocked on owner's doors. Fox would have taken Skit to court. Skit would be screwed. The people who had games would still have games.

#5468 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I don't blame you for not going "papers please" on Kevin. This is a small hobby, and it's built on a lot of trust and community, and I don't really have any problem with that.
I don't really want things to get to the point where vendors helping each other start requiring forms signed in triplicate.
Your mistake wasn't trusting Kevin, you're hardly alone, it was speaking up the way you did. If you had simply said "I haven't seen any license, I'm going on Kevin's word alone" it would have been a very different story. Instead your post implied that you had some higher level of proof.
As with everything else, this comes back onto Kevin's head. I'm sure you learned a lesson from it all the hard way, doubt you'll make that same mistake again.

generally i'm in agreement with your posts/thoughts aurich, but part of "running a business" is ensuring that your contracts/agreements are in place...

i would HOPE that it gets to the point where vendors require forms from each other... because that alone would stop any potential fiasco like this from happening...

it's nice to look at pinball as a "hobby", and for the great majority of us, it is... however, when you are attempting to build/sell a commercial pinball machine, it is no longer a "hobby", it is a "business", and all normal "business rules and ethics" should apply... and that includes ensuring that whoever you decide to partner with has the proper "pieces" in place, and "trust me" does not count as "ensuring" for me...

#5469 4 years ago
Quoted from dung:

No the police would not have knocked on owner's doors. Fox would have taken Skit to court. Skit would be screwed. The people who had games would still have games.

Ok... In court, they would get a list of buyers. There is no statute of limitations on possession of stolen property

#5470 4 years ago
Quoted from gweempose:

Naturally, we reached out to Kevin, but he would not respond to any of our inquiries.

Everyone, we know there are some allegations floating around. We can't determine if they are factual or not. We've asked Kevin for his response and he will not reply to any of our inquiries.

That statement from Pinside wouldn't have caught everyone's attention?

#5471 4 years ago
Quoted from gweempose:

We attempted to ascertain whether or not the information in the emails was factual, but we were unable to do so. The emails were written by an anonymous source, so it's not as if we could call them up on the phone and ask them to corroborate the story. Naturally, we reached out to Kevin, but he would not respond to any of our inquiries.

Caveat and for the record, it still is 100% Kevin's fault.

Again, no problem with anonymous finding out there was no license. How they choose to communicate created so much of a mess, unnecssary drama and important - hindered action. For future learning, grow a pair and share info with your name attached. It will be more helpful.

11
#5472 4 years ago
Quoted from NoahFentz:

I sure did, and for that, I sincerely apologize. I was given every reason to believe it was fully licensed, as was every pre-owner and other vendor.
Kevin even let me stick my neck out there, just to get it cut off knowingly. For that, he will never be forgiven.
I'm just as pissed as every here, as I have a lot to lose over this fiasco, too.

How much money are you sitting on as a "deposit" for cabinets and what is going to be returned to the liquidation willingly?

#5473 4 years ago
Quoted from dung:

No the police would not have knocked on owner's doors. Fox would have taken Skit to court. Skit would be screwed. The people who had games would still have games.

um, no, not if fox decided to push the issue... the games would be impounded with no recompense to the owner, never to be seen again... the outcome of fox really pushing the issue if machines had been produced really isn't in doubt... the "owners" would have nothing in the end, other than the possibility of suing kevin...

#5474 4 years ago

The fact is, forget the license issues. Kevin had no way to build these games. Period. He admitted as much. This thing was a mess before the lies came to light.

I did not get this part. I thought everything was going well and games were being built. I don't get why he would go through all this without a license agreement unless they wouldn't give it to him and he decided to do it anyway. That being said I cant believe he would risk everyone's money like that.

So just to satisfy my curiosity, how was he planning on getting the games built?

#5475 4 years ago
Quoted from ccotenj:

i would HOPE that it gets to the point where vendors require forms from each other... because that alone would stop any potential fiasco like this from happening...

if you're really a scammer, it wouldn't be hard to fake some papers...

#5476 4 years ago

I would just to take a moment to thank Marcus for creating this thread (The Official Pinside Skit-B Predator Discussion) 4 months ago! If not, who knows how many threads three would be about this subject and how difficult they may be to follow!

Now back to your regularly scheduled programming...

programming.png

20
#5477 4 years ago
Quoted from spfxted:

if you're really a scammer, it wouldn't be hard to fake some papers...

I can only imagine how ridiculous his fake papers would have read...

"I, Rupert Murdoch, give my best bud Kevin permission to build the awesomest Predator pin ever. Oh yeah, Arnie and Jessie are cool with it too."

#5478 4 years ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

"I, Rupert Murdoch (huge pinhead)

-1
#5479 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I'm sure you learned a lesson from it all the hard way

On the contrary, if he gets to keep enough of the $$, it could be encouragement!

#5480 4 years ago
Quoted from zr11990:

"The fact is, forget the license issues. Kevin had no way to build these games. Period. He admitted as much. This thing was a mess before the lies came to light."

I did not get this part. I thought everything was going well and games were being built. I don't get why he would go through all this without a license agreement unless they wouldn't give it to him and he decided to do it anyway. That being said I cant believe he would risk everyone's money like that.
So just to satisfy my curiosity, how was he planning on getting the games built?

Nobody knows. But Kevin admitted he didn't have the resources to build the games and the presumption (I guess) is that he was going to reach out to other manufacturers to see what they would charge to build them. Then, chances are, he would come back to pre-order folks and tell them it really is going to cost more and if they wanted out he would understand. Just all speculation at this point though and now it's a moot point due to the license issue coming to light first.

26
#5481 4 years ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

Everyone, we know there are some allegations floating around. We can't determine if they are factual or not. We've asked Kevin for his response and he will not reply to any of our inquiries.
That statement from Pinside wouldn't have caught everyone's attention?

I hope you realize what an IMPOSSIBLE situation we were all in.

If we run to the masses and present the second (and third) hand forwarded anonymous emails as fact, and it turns out to be bogus....we killed a project for no reason.

If we do nothing, and it is true...that's a bad position, too.

Also, if we ran out with the information early and presented it as fact...it WOULD have killed the project, right then and there. We would have been blamed at that point....like, "why didn't you guys fact-check this?" and "how can you trust a bunch of anonymous guys? You don't even know who they are!"

Even now, I really can't judge if they had an agenda, or axe to grind. None of them came to us, that's for sure.

Pete

#5482 4 years ago
Quoted from zr11990:

The fact is, forget the license issues. Kevin had no way to build these games. Period. He admitted as much. This thing was a mess before the lies came to light.?

Good point, and one issue that seems to get glossed over (not hard to do with the multitude of lies Kevin told).

He admitted he didn't have the ability to make these games anyways! I forget who (aaron?) chimed in and confirmed there was barely enough money in the project for Kevin to assemble them inhouse, so shopping that out wouldn't be possible (without collecting more money).

Even without this recent meltdown, chances are you guys would be sitting around 6 months from now wondering why he still hadn't shipped any machines and hand-wringing over the next "biweekly update."

This thing was doomed from day1... before the fraudulent behavior even kicked in.

#5483 4 years ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

You are standing in front of a large, deep pool of water. You don't know how to swim. A person you don't know tells you to jump in. You'll be fine they say. You jump in and after a few minutes drown. Who's fault is it?

Sounds like an infocom game. You are likely to be eaten by a grue...

#5484 4 years ago
Quoted from zr11990:

I have a question. What made these people run to Fox and tattle that this guy was making these games? Why would they do this knowing the shit storm it would cause and that it would cause everyone to lose their game and money?

Damn I just pissed my pants!

#5485 4 years ago

I really wish that somebody had made a documentary film about the making of the Predator game. I think it would have turned out pretty awesome. So many twists and turns.

#5486 4 years ago
Quoted from DrStarkweather:

I really wish that somebody had made a documentary film about the making of the Predator game. I think it would have turned out pretty awesome. So many twists and turns.

No doubt. It's definitely more drama than one would have ever even thought possible in the pinball universe.

#5487 4 years ago
Quoted from pmWolf:

I hope you realize is what an IMPOSSIBLE situation we were all in.

yup... and some of it self-inflicted.

I suggested that moving forward, Pinside uses an OUNCE of foresight and thinks twice before supporting any Tom, Dick or Harry as a "pinball manufacturer"

However, that draws downvotes from moderators (?!?!!?) as if its some insane suggestion. Or the comment to "take that suggestion elsewhere" as if its no directly related to THIS conversation! lol.

Standard Disclaimer: 'Im not trying to blame anyone but Kevin...yada yada yada"

However, is silly not to take some lessons from this moving forward.

For instance:
1. Use Amex (they seem to be pretty awesome at supporting purchasers)
2. If you MUST pre-order (*cringe*), use the paypal chargeback window as your final "Go/No Go" line in the sand for staying in a project.
3. Trust, but verify.

Blame is 100% on Kevin. However, I'm a firm believer in the mantra:
"Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me"

Pinside, Fast Pinball, VirtuaPin, etc - you've all been fooled once. Let's not get fooled again.

21
#5488 4 years ago
Quoted from zr11990:

I have a question. What made these people run to Fox and tattle that this guy was making these games? Why would they do this knowing the shit storm it would cause and that it would cause everyone to lose their game and money?

perhaps they don't care for illegal activity...
perhaps they had an axe to grind...
perhaps there are other reasons...

however, i have a question for you... if you watch someone steal something, do you just go about your business like nothing happened, or do you report it to either the person it was stolen from or the police?

the "it's ok to break the law if you get away with it" attitude of many is downright scary...

#5489 4 years ago
Quoted from pmWolf:

I hope you realize is what an IMPOSSIBLE situation we were all in.

Pete

I offered a very neutral statement that makes everyone aware of the 2 facts you did have. There were allegations and Kevin wasn't responding to Pinside's questions regarding them. It would have safely prompted most people to take notice if they hadn't already without showing favor to one or the other.

#5490 4 years ago
Quoted from pmWolf:

If we run to the masses and present the second (and third) hand forwarded anonymous emails as fact, and it turns out to be bogus....we killed a project for no reason.

Actually, no. Had Kevin had a legit license, he could have produced it upon release of the emails, and the project would have gone on no problem. If he didn't have a license, the project's dead regardless. Point being, Pinside couldn't have killed anything that wasn't already dead.

Sometimes, silence isn't golden. Keeping the emails secret, even with "the wipe" and all other evidence pointing to problems, probably wasn't the best idea, but hindsight is 20.20

#5491 4 years ago
Quoted from pmWolf:

I hope you realize is what an IMPOSSIBLE situation we were all in.
If we run to the masses and present the second (and third) hand forwarded anonymous emails as fact, and it turns out to be bogus....we killed a project for no reason.
If we do nothing, and it is true...that's a bad position, too.
Also, if we ran out with the information early and presented it as fact...it WOULD have killed the project, right then and there. We would have been blamed at that point....like, "why didn't you guys fact-check this?" and "how can you trust a bunch of anonymous guys? You don't even know who they are!"
Even now, I really can't judge if they had an agenda, or axe to grind. None of them came to us, that's for sure.
Pete

no question in my mind that anyone who get this email first or second hand was thrilled to get it..how would anyone handle not being able to confirm or not? say what to who?again no way to confirm.you have a grenade in your hand with no pin and no where to throw it.

#5492 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

How much money are you sitting on as a "deposit" for cabinets and what is going to be returned to the liquidation willingly?

I asked him directly the same question. Aaron from fast made mention of him withholding money.

31
#5493 4 years ago

Been out of town and off line, and got clued in and I have to say this is just mind boggling.

I am somewhat in shock, even if the last couple of months seemed to be pointing towards this direction. While I believe Kevin was naive in some ways, thinking he could pull this off, meaning build a production machine in quantity and building a licensed machine and not get caught, etc. however, while he was naive in those ways, he was clearly acting in illegal ways and he certainly knew it.

Whether he could slip one past the goalie and not get caught is one thing, but it went beyond that since he out right lied about the license, loudly and publicly, and continued to do so, he collected money based on the lies and he also took friends on a ride that has now damaged their reputations and likely their businesses.

Since I was interested in pursuing a license I had a several long conversations with Kevin on licensing and building of machines, and in those conversations he gave me very specific details of what was in the alleged license agreement, including costs, restrictions and what he had paid. Most of the details matched up with license info I had gotten from an old friend who was C-level guy at Fox I was talking with (the subject of predator never came up, and I feel terrible that it didn't, since that may have brought this to attention sooner, although I am surprised that it did not come up when the Heighway guys were doing their license, which I know was completed and signed when I had this conversation, last spring). So, what Kevin was telling me sounded legit. I also saw an unsigned, agreement with the EoD guys, with a few things redacted, so that certainly provided further support to believe he had the license, especially when that was announced a Jamie was there with Kevin.

The fact that Kevin talked about the details shows he knew what the licensing requirements would entail, so any 'fair use' nonsense is just that nonsense.

Based on my conversations and the connection I established with Kevin, I had no reason to doubt his truthfulness, I even provided him help with getting the game running on a cubiboard single board computer he was looking at using for production. He sent me the board and the predator game code and I built the necessary system to get it up and running and tested.

I am sure Paul (virutapin), Aaron (Fast) and Matt (back alley), all believed Kevin had a legit license, just like I did as I"m sure the others who had those kind of conversations with him. I guess like any lie or con, the details are what make it believable. And while I believe Kevin had every intention of delivering Predator machines, that does not mean he was not conning people, he was and he was probably conning himself as well.

I think Aaron's bluster of late both in Predator and Jpop does mean he deserves a little bit of grief given his definitive statements and strong vocal support. Obviously he has an agenda for moving his business forward, and it certainly seems he ignored signs there was big trouble, in hopes that it would all work out and I'm sure he now feels like a schmuck for doing so. He has now learned in both Jpop and skit-B, that you need to be careful of who you get into bed with and you choose to support and that fixing broken situations is not easy. So, while Aaron does deserves some grief, he is certainly not at fault in this fiasco, and will certainly pay for what he has done in holding back info, by the damage it has done to his reputation.

Other then that one or two posts from Paul, I don't think he was a cheerleader in this and I don't recall much from Matt has far as being a campaigner so I really see those guys as victims, as much as the buyers, especially if they to end up losing money over this in addition to the damage to their reputations and businesses.

As far as whysnow, I can understand those who are angry at him feeling he was promoting the game heavily and came across as if he had inside knowledge. Clearly he didn't and I think he now sees how some of his posts would make it seem that way (certainly seemed to me he had inside knowledge), but everyone here is a big boy (or girl) and you make your own decisions, so, we all have to take these types of things and weigh them for ourselves, we all know he can't trust everything you read on the internet, let alone a forum. Plus, if you look at at lot of his posts, you know he talks more about shit then he knows. I'm sure he is feeling doubly screwed, both as an owner and the hit his reputation has taken. However, has obi-wan said, "who is the more foolish the fool, or the fool who follows him?"

While I totally respect what the anonymous group did as far them first getting their refunds before doing the deeper investigation (plenty of these guys and others were screaming 'there is no license' for quite a while and everyone had the option to at least ask for their refunds, even if of late they were not getting issued). I do not agree that they should have kept their info to themselves. They owed Fox nothing to keep their mouths shut, but as members of this community they should have shared what they knew, since it may have made it possible for more people to get their money back. I'm sure some would still not have listened but it may have helped others.

As far as others who had knowledge of late and held off thinking 'a deal could get done', well, they should have known better on that. It is nearly impossible to see how any other company would want to step in on this and take it over, and certainly there is no way it could be done at that price point, which anyone who has built a machine or even looked closely at it, knew there was little to no margin on this.

Bottom line, at the end of the day the only one to blame for this is Kevin, he took lots of people for a ride, no matter how much money gets distributed back out, if any, damage has been done to way too many people.

I don't think this is the end of boutique makers, it was inevitable that we would see failures, and most of the others all seem to be doing things open and legit. I do think this will discourage companies from tying and buyers from buying, so while it may not kill it, it certainly will result in a major setback from that aspect of the ecosystem.

It is still a great time for pinball, despite this black eye. I wish the best for all of those who have been hurt by this and hope for the best possible outcomes for each of you.

#5494 4 years ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

I can only imagine how ridiculous his fake papers would have read...
"I, Rupert Murdoch, give my best bud Kevin permission to build the awesomest Predator pin ever. Oh yeah, Arnie and Jessie are cool with it too."

Made official with one of these:

Lacre-JP-VII.jpg

#5495 4 years ago
Quoted from ccotenj:

perhaps they don't care for illegal activity.
perhaps they had an axe to grind.
perhaps there are other reasons...

perhaps they don't care for illegal activity... Yes!
perhaps they had an axe to grind...YES!!!!!!!!!!
perhaps there are other reasons...Yes!

#5496 4 years ago

This.

keep-calm-and-blame-kevin.png
#5497 4 years ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

I offered a very neutral statement that makes everyone aware of the 2 facts you did have. There were allegations and Kevin wasn't responding to Pinside's questions regarding them. It would have safely prompted most people to take notice if they hadn't already without showing favor to one or the other.

The whole situation was not as cut and dry as you make it seem. Like mettalik said, hindsight is 20-20. Kevin had gone radio silent, and nobody knew why. A lot of people, including some of the mods, assumed it was because he was in the process of negotiating a last minute license deal with Fox. We weren't about to post anything that could potentially cause a panic and kill the project without facts to back it up.

#5498 4 years ago

Guys I like to throw turds at people too but I truly don't think the VP cab guy was being a Dbag.

He was given bad info like errrbody else.

I find it hard to believe he was like "oh not licensed, cool I'm in & sure I will lie". No way 250 empty cabinets would generate enough money to run to Brazil. The dude can't be that shortsighted, he's been around here for years!

Now I can understand being pissed at him for endorsing an imploded project but anyone with a 401K in 2008 did the same damn thing.

Note: Each of you likely lost a bundle of money & I do indeed have sympathy for you. A friend or two of mine got burned in this gauntlet

20
#5499 4 years ago
Quoted from s1500:

Tilt! The Battle to Save Pinball II:

Na. too depressing. How about

"Tit! The Battle to Save this Thread"

#5500 4 years ago
Quoted from ccotenj:

however, i have a question for you... if you watch someone steal something, do you just go about your business like nothing happened, or do you report it to either the person it was stolen from or the police?

You report it to the police - and use your own name.

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