This really isn't a debate - if you like the way the red rubbers play, buy spares and keep them on hand. If you want them to last longer, put Titans on.

I personally keep a stash of both on hand but find that Titans are what I like to run most of the time.

I do not operate them no. But have friends that do. They simply replace rubbers a lot. Sterns stock rubbers hold up well but the the games need cleaned a lot more.

Super bands seem to be what lots of OPs switch to but competitive players hate them.

Silicone can last a decent amount of time if they aren’t too small and you can get to your games regularly. If not, I suggest using super bands.

So if you like defective red rubbers you should keep a bag of them and replace them every day?

You are right... this isn't a debate. Rubber on these games is not lasting like red rubber on other games. Yes you can swap out the product, but whatever they are using is subpar for the industry.

We use Red flipper rubbers on most of our games and get about 6 months of life out of them which is 3k+ plays. These rubbers seem to be defective. Our last batch from Marco specialties had this issue.

They aren't done just because they have some wear. I generally change flipper rubbers if they break, or the chunk out of the tip gets really deep. You can turn them too if you want to extend them.

This is not a game or manufacturer specific issue, these types of rubbers have a tradeoff between bounce and tread life.

Ah. That would be news to me if there's a batch that are more prone to wear than usual. I was just speaking on red rubbers in general.

I spoke with JJP support they did say they have a batch of defective rubbers. They are sending full replacements.

I have stock flipper settings and can backhand the left ramp at 6.6. Now it must be a perfect clean shot to get up there.

My buddy operates in ATL. What he sees is hardcore pinheads the first month or so then the ball times drop as more casuals get to play the game. But yeah over 5 mins isn’t optimal.

Optimal is 1:30 to 2:00 on average. I have given feedback suggesting an operator default. While I can remove posts and increase the pitch if I cannot get the game times lower I’ll be forced to sell it.

A few operators warned me about long ball times on Aerosmith which might be why you don’t see them on route regularly either.

I think they are blowing smoke.

I saw early wear on both the translucent rings and on the flipper rubber. It's not like those two things are made the same or from similar batches.

I might just replace them all with black rubbers or titans. Looking forward to doing a full tear down ... :/

Defective rubbers can cost you a lot of money and 18 years of headaches.

I guess I should just castrate the game then

I doubt they're Titans, because I've had 3 split already. All my other machine have Titans on them (everywhere) and they last for YEARS of play before needing replacement.

EDIT: In a home environment. Cant speak for commercial guys.

I’ve checked. They are pinball life. “PL”. Silicone rings.

Well, then, I'm going to compile a list of rings and order a Titan set. Because as much as I like the guys at Pinball Life, these rings are sub par.

Please share the size list!

If my average game time was 1:30 I’d never return to the location.

I backhand that shot all the time and everything is stock on mine. I also have a good pitch on it too.

Unfortunately though the rubbers on my game are taking a lot of wear it doesn’t look like they will last very long! I think I have about 200 plays on it.

So to clarify. I am able to backhand the left ramp I was questioning the ability to backhand that ramp to actually hit the lock? It will go up the ramp but not far enough currently to award a lock.

You can backhand that shot so it makes it into the upper playfield but I get a lot of them that goes straight into the locked ball area! Which is great when that happens!

If it doesn’t make it straight into the Bolock area then you have to end up trapping it on your small flipper of the upper playfield. Then a lot of the balls roll right off and drain in the hole of that upper playfield. Which sucks when that happens! Ha ha

I can usually get it to the upper flipper and then lock it.

So you guys that have had this game for 100 plays or more... do u love it? Gotten stale? Bolted?
Just curious on its lastability.

Thx a bunch!

I tend to agree. No question whether or not by designers choice or old inventory the use of old style rubber for the flippers is a bit of a miss. I switched to PL superbands within the first 50 plays. I do question (Just an Opinion!!!) if the gameplay of this title has a bit to do with it also. Meaning, an average pinball game may see say 5-6 balls in play during a standard game. With GnR I would only Guess per game there must be at least 40-50 balls in play (flipping)? Not an accuse for wear just an observation compared to playing say Avengers. Still an Awesome game but yes, Order New flipper rubbers on day one!!!

A machine game time average is your average. If players get bored of long game times means they stop playing the game. This means that a game that a factory wants operators to buy wont. Stop conflating collectors with operators.

I think the only people that will end up keeping this game is people who are fans of GnR. From a rules standpoint its pretty bland compared to other JJP and Stern games. It does a bad job giving good info to the player as to what to do and most players feel like they have no idea how they got a multiball which feels like it just happens. By default it hands out too many mystery awards and the game over uses the scoop which concerns me. Its too long playing to be a good tournament game without modifications. I'm on the fence about if its a good operator game at this point but ill know in the next few months of operating. It feels like a good beginner machine but only if you have more than a couple of machines in your line-up.

Keith said they were just white rails and there was no upgrade to color. However, what limited video I have seen of the SE rails, they don't look like the same animation as the color.

If you are playing the game the white rails do an amazing job lighting up the playfield. Best lit game i have ever seen and want the white rails on all games; they do a better job than pin stadiums.

Where do you operate?

100 plays? lol that is like a weeks worth.

So far the game to me is strong on the lastability standpoint because there are so many songs to choose from. You basically have 21 modes + a bunch of other modes in between to keep the game feeling fresh. If you play a couple of games a night you can go almost two weeks without repeating a song. It’s the perfect game if you want to de stress at the end of the day.

Which rubbers are you going to use on your GNR?

*sigh* I came on here to help provide issues to those who actually care. I'm done providing feedback to those on pinside.

Really? If my average game time was at 1:30 due to your settings I'd never play another game in your arcade

Is there an echo in here?

..

That's why there is a flipper up there

When it makes it all the way in one shot... bonus.

Cool. Thanks for the info!

Why did you edit your post where you stated the locations you operate? I didn’t find a Quarter Lounge in “South” Texas only the Dallas area. When I’m in the area I’d like to pay you a visit. Curious how your machines tuned for 1:30 game time actually play.

Simply Wow! Huge shout out to Matt at Backalley. Ordered and arrived in 2 days and looks fricken Awesome!! Simply amazed by the fine detail granted not surprised as thats what he does. Simple install and looks completely factory. Understand why JJP avoided adding guns to the game but Really glad Matt made this happen. Well done sir!

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Not a fan of it going over the beveled portion of the lockdown bar. But looks nice!

Not sure why it sits flush but understood.

I ordered one and was wondering if it sits flush all around with the curve of the lockdown bar. Looks really good. Definitely happy it has the guns.

Oh it does sit flush? Then I take it back. I thought it was hanging over with a gap underneath.

So you wont play any new in box stern left at default settings at 6.5 degree pitch? Thats the average game time on all out of the box sterns. You are arguing your play skill with a location play average.

For what it does and how little you use the center button during game play it just works. Especially for the price, great work.

They play like out of the box games because of your gameplay skills. Which is not the same as a location average.

Do you reckon JJP avoided this version with the guns due to roses being more family friendly?
Similar with the flipper bats idea on the topper - CE?
Would be strange given the whole theme.......

Umm, what about the big ass revolver that comes up for mystery, loads bullets into it then shoots one off?

That’s not family friendly…