My post about this terrible idea from the faulty PF thread:

Nah. I don't think lawsuits or the threat of such are good for anyone at all. JJP just needs to be gently prompted to do what they should have done 3 years ago and dump Mirco, then make these owners whole by at the VERY LEAST giving them the option to buy an at-cost spare playfield from the new manufacturer 6 months or whatever from now. If they were doing what they SHOULD do, they'd be sending out after-Mirco PFs to affected owners gratis. But actual cost (I estimate around $300) would be better than the "you'll keep it and shut up about it or we're buying it back and no GnR for you" approach they're using at the moment. All I can think of is Hogbog has to be gutted *AGAIN* now that his SECOND masterpiece is tainted by drama (remember #Discgate, #TrunkGate, #PoolingGate?) . The guy can't catch a break.

But class action? I don't think that's the way. It'd be better for someone with an affected machine in or near Chicagoland to contact one of those consumer advocate reporters on the local Chicago news stations (a quick google search shows at least two stations have one) and turn them on to this mess on $13k machines that JJP seems to want their customers to eat. It'd make a persuasive story for their viewers and maybe help JJP get off the fence with Mirco for JJP's long term benefit. Doesn't cost anything and keeps greedy lawyers from fattening their coffers and making an even bigger legal headache for JJP no one wants or needs.

For the record, JJP has always done right by me. Making the WoZ lighting upgrade available to me at a discounted price even though I was a second owner and 5 years out of warranty as well as sending a new jjPtoC playfield when the NIB stock one had pooling and chipping issues similar to what's being seen (but worse) on jjGnR. Other, smaller warranty issues have always been handled well. It bums me out to hear that now they're telling similarly-affected GnR owners to pound sand when they CLEARLY have defective playfields. Hopefully this delusion is short-lived and they get back on the straight and narrow with a long-term playfield supplier change and some actual relief for affected users.

The "spare playfield at cost" option costs them NOTHING but some administration overhead. Why wouldn't they DO that? I think 99% of users affected would even be happy to wait while a manufacturer change is made as long as they know a new, non-defective playfield is coming even if they worst-case have to pay $300 for it.

Talk, talk, talk.

Play pinball.

I agree that a class action lawsuit isn’t the best way. But JJP needs to experience a stronger repercussion than angry posts on a forum. That apparently hasn’t been enough to change their direction for the past few years.

Agree. The best way would be for JJP to replace playfields. But here we are.

We have a great charitable community. But JJP is a company, not a charity. There is no reason ever for us as a consumer to have to pay to fix our machines under reasonable warranty claim. It is just crazy to think some are suggesting we pay even at wholesale cost, for replacement PFs. That is like a new car manufacturer telling us after only driving a couple hundred miles, sorry the paint is chipping, peeling, cracking all over the place, but we will let you pay cost to have it repainted. No one, absolutely no one would agree to that scenario. Do we just roll over and say, just play pinball? That’s exactly what they want us to do, the cowards way. There are a bunch that are affected now, but it is only a matter of time when a wider number are affected. These PFs are ticking time bombs, as we have years of JJP PF known issues as examples to draw from. Voting with our dollars is the only thing JJP will understand. Stop buying till this problem is really fixed, not just a band-aide.

This is a repeat of the POTC fiasco, once again with attention-seeking types threatening lawsuits.

This community is so toxic.

Isn’t it sad that we are here again? You’re right, we didn’t learn from the POTC or WW fiascos and bought the next shiny from a known purveyor of poor quality products like JJP.

Don’t think you’re correct there at all, as no one is seeking this kind of attention, as they have nothing to gain from it. Think most seek the attention of a caring company that will back their hard earned big dollar purchase from JJP, by showing they care about the customer, with new populated PFs installed. That is the least that should be done or full refund for a faulty product. Every other industry does this, why is JJP any different??? Nothing toxic about this community, whom only want to enjoy their big dollar games and not have to constantly look at ugly destruction all over the PF. JJP spent a great deal of time to initially make their product look good, now is the time for JJP to support us the consumer in continuing to make it look good for the long haul, not just the first couple hundred plays. Not too much to ask is it???

You’re name calling the wrong people toxic...seems like the silent people (JJP) might be the toxic ones.

My GNR playfield isn’t chipping or pooling. It’s build date is 1994. Just sayin

1561A97D-B8A4-4FD5-A7CF-FD41AAC753D3 (resized).jpeg

Well crap...3rd Spotlight busted...this is with the newer white servos after my other 2 RMA's...

Anyone have a hyperlink to the linkage arm? I'd really like to get some spares of these as they seem to break pretty easily...I would rather change them than have to keep buggin gmy distro for RMA's of the entire assembly...
20210523_174041 (resized).jpg

My new Jeep had a lot of scratches, chipped paint, and even a bent B pillar after a few hundred miles. Probably because I drove it through some pine trees while off-roading

I absolutely understand why someone would be angry if their playfield starts chipping in less than a year. Generally consumers expect their product to not experience damage if it’s used as intended and not put in unusual circumstances (like jousting a tree in a Jeep). I don’t think them expressing their disappointment makes them toxic, no more than others who lack empathy and tell them to eff off when they warned others about this problem earlier in this thread.

We each have own degree of tolerance for this kind of damage and wear. Personally, I’m ok with some small chipping adjacent to posts as long as it can prevented or concealed with washers and doesn’t spread further.

For better or worse, my preorder was so late that I’ll probably have 9+ months to see how this unfolds. I’ll be following Foo’s experience very closely - I hope his 3/4 inch washers solve the problem more or less permanently.

Me thinks mirco is what is toxic.

I am just so sick of playfield drama in this hobby. I wish it could at least stay in the playfield rant thread, and out of the owner's thread.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4854563

Here you go. I painted a light coat of JB weld on my new ones and also successfully “glued” my broken one together with the JB. The JB really strengthens the part. I also applied a little extra white lithium grease

This is very logical. I agree. Let's collectively and relentlessly not engage, but just reply and guide the playfield posts to that thread... stop feeding the cats.

I think this is the link
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/why-is-jjp-still-making-games-with-faulty-playfields/

I take it I need a 3D printer for that? Is there a way to order that from an online site with the 3D files?

Yes sorry this is what I thought you were looking for. It’s nowhere to be found online. You need a 3D printer or a friend that has one. Try some JB weld while you wait for a replacement

Ah gotcha!...

I went to Xometry and uploaded the files...

I know nothing about plastics etc but picked something I thought would work...Do these specs and material look good to you.

Thanks again

Screenshot 2021-05-23 213220 (resized).jpg

These posts have gotten so frequent here and fb that im considering trading my flawless game. I just dont want to deal with possible damage as Im not handy. One thing giving me some confidence is My wonka has held up pretty darn well over the last year ive had it.

I just did a search for Anycubic 3D printers...I didn't realize how the prices had come down...looks like I'm gonna get a new toy lol

Could you recommend the S, Pro or X version? - sorry to derail the GnR thread

Don't be. It needs a fucking good derailing.

This is not entirely true.

While it is true to say that class action lawsuits enrich lawyers (obviously true), it is not true to say that it "only" enriches lawyers, as this minimizes the enormous good that has been accomplished through class action lawsuits, especially with regard to consumer protection.

Toy Story on your radar?Right

Yes, Pat’s designs are so fun. Looking forward to it, if PF issues are really fixed. Have enjoyed playing both his offerings, DI and WW.

Toy Story is an extremely appealing theme for a pin to me, so I am very interested in it.

But how will we know if the PF issues are "really" fixed before we buy?

Lots of people bought GnR thinking that the JJP PF issues had been resolved.

Same for me. Been waiting years for both these rumored titles, but it’s difficult to buy until they sort it out. Honestly at this point, why would even think they’re trying to fix this? They won’t acknowledge or communicate anything, so why believe anything will change for the 4th straight game?

Probably will only know, if JJP actually changes processes with artwork. Ink separating from wood at stress points under posts PF artwork is a tell-tale sign. If artwork is not under posts, then we have a chance at good PFs. This is what all the other companies have done, along with applying far less clear coat. JJP orders very thick clear coat on all their PFs and that is one reason why there is so much damage at stress areas (clear coat adhering to Ink/artwork and then lifting it from the wood with repeated ball impact. Do like the look of thick clear coat, just not the results, lol.

Since JJP is silent on this issue, hard to believe they will actually fix it for the fourth time around. But we can all hope.

I’m with you on TS being an appealing theme and with the long experience of Pat on toy design, we can only hope it is packed, like he packed DI. GNR is quite disappointing with no real ball interactive mechs in the game.

Greatest game of the decade is disappointing because there aren't enough mechs?

Sorry I know nothing about 3D printers. Looks like you found a website to print them?

Does anyone know what the height of the game is with the head folded and legs off? (ie how big the opening of my SUV needs to be)

I was unpleasantly surprised when I had to remove the head of a newer Stern because it was too tall by 1/2”.

29.5" I believe

I'm asking my distributor tomorrow to delay my LE order until the playfield issues are resolved, if they are not resolved by then I'll just cancel. I can't believe how widespread the playfield issue now is, completely unacceptable.

That should work then - thank you!

Shield for GnR is almost ready. Test fit looks good. A couple very small adjustments on the cut-in part and it's ready to go (the final will be 1/8", this test is 1/16" polycarbonate).

GnR_shield_sml (resized).jpg

Is that to stop the airballs into left outlane? If so i need one.

That's looking great

Invisiwall mod rules! Not one rouge left plastic drain since we fitted one.

https://images.app.goo.gl/S9QruA89gY2LeBwM8

Yes, that's exactly what it's for. I originally was going to help drop ship the original creator's design, but took over the project since it would likely be cheaper for everyone involved since there wouldn't need to be crazy Europe to USA shipping. Only refined it a little. Should help a lot of people (including, eventually, me - once I get my GnR).

Here’s a bit of good news for this thread:

I’m happy to report no playfield issues…yet anyway! December build date. Delivered in January. No spotlight issues at this point. Fingers are crossed but just bought a 3D printer for the kids and that spotlight arm from thingiverse could come in handy.

Yep...

I'm also going the RMA route again (3rd times the charm) but want to have some of these on hand.

Attention mod makers, you can make a small fortune making these to ditribute on your Market shop

Hint Hint PinMonk (I know you're super busy, but I'm averaging 1 control arm every 275 plays)...maybe I'm playing the wrong songs

Cool. Will you have a retailer in the land of Aus?

Ride the boney beast does a lot of that kind of stuff, retailing TiltGraphix as well as others here. Nino is good pinball people too with a top reputation here.

https://www.rtbb.com.au/

I have to get caught up on orders or the mylar ring and Tibetan Breeze mobs will run out of patience and converge to take head. Hopefully I'll be clear in a week or so.

It seems like that arm would be better as metal with a nylon insert on each end. Can you scan it so I can get an idea of dimensions?

It'll be in the pinmonk store. I have a fabricator make these, so I won't be making anything on them to try to keep the price down. Low volume isn't super cheap.

Of course you can always get any of the stuff on pinmonk.com directly. Exclusive distributors are: Pinball Life for the US, and Ministry of Pinball for Europe. I do not have a distributor local to AU/NZ, Asia, Antarctica, or the Arctic. Stick a bug in your favorite distributor's ear if you're in any of those places. It would help to have some stock local to you.

Wow. "Screw You" you are telling me because I'm not going along with your "Be happy, use washers" vision? Sad and rude. You are acting like everyone should shut up about this issue, use washers, and keep quiet. Anyone delaying their order or cancelling wants a GNR, they like the actual game, but don't want to deal with a major issue such as pooling / chipping in an $8k - $12k+ pinball purchase of all things.

Yes but typing to the empty internet that you are all 'considering' cancelling your order or 'thinking about' taking legal action is not fixing the issue now is it?

The situation is that there is problems with these playfields. Also JJP does not seem to want to do a single thing about it.

Jumping up and down and making a noise here and holding your breath will not make it go away.
Telling other owners that you are considering cancelling your order is a fart in the wind and people saying it over and over only frustrates the rest of us.
We get it. Do it already.

I am in the exact same boat. I don't really know what good it's going to do to tell my distributor to delay my LE order until the issues are resolved though, because I don't know how we will ever know this?

Yeah I’m at least gonna give them a call and let them know this playfield issue is sketchy. They are going to have to give me word in writing they will cover this issue. If JJP can’t stand behind the product then I’d rather buy something else

Are you schizophrenic or something?

It was just a few days ago that you were defending a non-owner's right to discuss these very issues.

Not that i'm aware. I don't know who is an owner or not an owner/purchaser. Yes i'm all for peoples rights to discuss it, but empty threats of legal action/sale cancelations is not a discussion now is it?

Like honestly, no-one is going to start or maintain a class action for fucks sake.

Apparently it isn't a discussion in your opinion. But see, the way the forum works is that your opinion doesn't mean any more than anyone else. So you can expect many of us to continue to "discuss" our options, regardless of whether you think it's a discussion or not.