(Topic ID: 264520)

The official Coronavirus containment thread

By Daditude

10 months ago

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Topic index (key posts)

140 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

Display key post list sorted by: Post date | Keypost summary | User name

Post #1 Important warning Posted by Daditude (10 months ago)

Post #6 Coronavirus website with up-to-the-moment stats Posted by Daditude (10 months ago)

Post #172 Key posted, but no summary given Posted by Pinball_Gizzard (10 months ago)

Post #193 Name of disease and of the virus Posted by Pinball_Gizzard (10 months ago)

Post #209 Explains why you need social distancing Posted by Pinball_Gizzard (10 months ago)

Post #239 Comment on seasonality Posted by Pinball_Gizzard (10 months ago)

Post #251 Avoid ibuprofen Posted by Pinball_Gizzard (10 months ago)

Post #370 Info on chloroquine Posted by Pinball_Gizzard (10 months ago)

Post #530 News from Italy Posted by Pedretti_Gaming (10 months ago)

Post #693 Important info and advice Posted by ForceFlow (10 months ago)

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#9 10 months ago

Shockingly, Bing (yes, THAT Bing.) has a pretty great COVID-19 tracker that links to current news for the regions as you drill down in it.


#13 10 months ago
Quoted from silver_spinner:

italy is at 9% death rate, thats scary, not to mention that does not include people who have died before testing so its "official".
also, then figure how many people are serious enough to need hospital attention (if avail) even if they finally recover.
baffling numbers.
right now, the CDC stated in the USA, people ages 24 to 54 , 40% are ill enough to need hospital attention.
That is much higher than what was led to initially believe.

US has a lot of high blood pressure, heart disease, and diabetes relative to much of the world, and all of which are complicating factors that make it more likely you will have a harder time if you get infected. I haven't seen that CDC stat, but that may partially explain why.

Also, if you're taking NSAIDS (ibuprofen, advil, aspirin, etc) for pain relief/headaches, use something else like Tylenol until this passes. There's strong anecdotal evidence taking shape that the blood-thinning effect of NSAIDS somehow makes it more likely that the infection will take stronger hold and put people in the serious/dead category. Blood thinners are the same problem, but I can't recommend stopping those since that would be medically irresponsible as those are often needed for heart patients, etc. However, people on those blood thinning meds need to know that their risk of death is increased because of blood thinners and triple-down at avoiding getting exposed at all costs.

1 month later
#12293 9 months ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

Ok now im really confused and dont know what the hell to believe. Why do i feel like there is something fishy going on?

Don't get your news from Fox News. They have LOTS of opinion, and precious little fact. There's a reason Rupert Murdoch has massively lawyered up recently. He's preparing for massive lawsuits over the half-truths, misdirections, and lies broadcast on Fox News the last couple months. You don't hire an army of lawyers if you're innocent.

Watch PBS Newshour instead. You'll be quite surprised at how much more accurate actual journalism is over time, and PBS is a great source of old-school, impartial news coverage.

Also, Birx is a shill. You can't believe 80% of what comes out of her mouth, she's owned somehow. Fauci is more honest, his ratio is the inverse of Birx - believe about 80% of what Fauci says.

#12297 9 months ago
Quoted from Tranquilize:

PBS, npr, Al Jazeera, CBC in Canada, BBC... Lots of good news sources that are far less biased.

I'd agree with all of those except Al Jazeera, which has its own agenda. You'll never see an expose of Saudi misdeeds on AJ, they just aren't interested in factual reality there and are in some cases complicit in covering it up. Also, their western coverage (Europe/US) often has a subtle to not-so subtle agenda. Not nearly as bad as RT or Sputnik, but it's there. BBC also has started to let propaganda creep into their coverage, most recently with Huawei coverage.

But anyway, PBS, NPR, CBC for sure. I usually recommend PBS Newshour first because no one can come up with a reason why they're "libs" or "trump-lovers" - because in general, they're the switzerland of news, the way news used to be everywhere.

#12341 9 months ago
Quoted from robertmee:

With that said, my further concern is that we've had coronaviruses of some form for a long time. SARs, MERs, the common cold. And yet there are no vaccines for any Corona. So why do we believe we will develop one in a timely manner, when we have not for so many decades? As I understand it, the epidemiology for Coronavirus is far different than influenza where we have had some moderate success in vaccines. Now, on the assumption that we ARE able to develop a vaccine, most timelines state a year to 18 months.

SARS just...disappeared. Once that happened all work on a vaccine that was no longer needed stopped.

There's a substantial amount of research on a coronavirus vaccine that works on all coronaviruses that's been amassed over the last 10 years or so, but the effort was very underfunded. Suddenly those researchers are the belle of the ball, and the spigots of cash for their research have opened wide. So they're not starting from zero, it's a pretty long trail of research into that class of viruses. But what's the timeline for a generic coronavirus vaccine? No one knows. One specific to the novel coronavirus is where most of the new effort is, and optimistically that's not available until next spring.

There are two likely possibilities. One, it disappears like SARS. I think this is unlikely. Two, there's a second wave in the fall like the Spanish Flu that kills a lot more than the first time around. This seems likely. I just hope they have better treatment by then. At least doctors are leaving their ventilator fetish behind as they see better survival rates overall without them.

#12349 9 months ago
Quoted from gweempose:

Can you elaborate on this? If a person can't breathe well enough to properly oxygenate their blood, what options are there other than a ventilator?

Oxygen masks, physical positioning (your BACK is the WORST place to rest for your lungs), and breathing/coughing exercises to clear the lungs (5x breathe in and hold 3-5 seconds (where possible), then on the 6th time cough deeply - repeat 3x every hour). Positioning people on their stomachs propped on pillows gives the lungs more volume and allows any fluids gathered in them to shift, freeing capacity of the lung tissues to transfer oxygen to the blood.

#12356 9 months ago
Quoted from robertmee:

Good info, thanks for sharing. I agree about ventilators...I believe I read a statistic that something around 80% of those that go on ventilators dont make it.

Pretty sure the number is more like 40% don't make it, but that's still bad...

#12361 9 months ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

I remember at one time they were saying if you went on a ventilator that you only had a 20% Chance of survival.

I never saw anyone say it was that low on the news I read or saw. 60% survival (40% mortality) is the lowest I saw, but even that is pretty damned bad. I'm glad doctors are banging out alternative treatment therapies with better survival rates.

#12372 9 months ago
Quoted from Dono:

I keep hearing that it's "more likely than not that there will be a "wave" of sickness worst than the first with this virus"... since this virus is obviously unique to other viruses since we've been tracking them in the early 1900s, what scientific evidence is out there that backs up this claim? Not refuting it necessarily but I just haven't been privy to the science behind the claim.

This covers a lot of the factors that lead many scientists to that conclusion about another wave of COVID-19 outbreaks in the fall/winter:


2 weeks later
#13895 8 months ago
Quoted from Jaybird815:

So I decided to take the plunge, I just went and took the antibody test. I’ll have results in 24-48 hours. I decided to because a good friend of mine who I hung out with a lot pre-quarantine just tested positive for the antibody.

Other than general information, this doesn't really help your avoidance strategy because they have no idea IF antibodies give you immunity and if they do, how long that immunity lasts. SARS and MERS immunity was only temporary.

And then you have the issue of false positives and negatives. The abbot labs one gives false results more than 40% of the time.

#13896 8 months ago
Quoted from Utesichiban:

Do you really believe those numbers are remotely close for China, Russia, India, and Mexico? I'll go along with you on Japan and So. Korea.

US number of fatalities is large and the government response completely and utterly negligent, but the deaths per 100k population are barely in the top 10. Belgium is top, followed by Spain and Italy, with the UK suddenly coming on strong. All of those have 2-3x as many deaths per 100k as the US does.

#13922 8 months ago
Quoted from albummydavis:

Yep. Could we have done better? Probably. But for anyone to call what’s happened in this country negligent or anything else is insane. This is pretty much new territory for the modern world. No one is escaping unscathed.

Dismantling the pandemic early warning system literally a couple months before this happened. Negligent.

Ignoring numerous IC warnings as far back as Nov-Dec that a contagion was spreading in China. Negligent.

Completely disregarding the step-by-step, gamed out, years-in-the-making pandemic playbook created by the prior administration that was left for them. Negligent.

Failing to get masks and PPE production ramped up in January. Negligent.

Continuing to say it's "contained" well into March when it was growing. Negligent.

Then when all hell broke loose, stealing PPE the states managed to procure themselves because there was no Federal support. Negli...nah, criminal.

It's been a LOOOOOONG trail of well-documented negligence, much of it on video.

So yeah, negligent response by our Federal government and many states.

This recent article talks about all of this and more in depth:

#13977 8 months ago
Quoted from Utesichiban:

I'd wager China alone has had well over 100k deaths. Not a snowballs chance in hell the country where this started has only had 4600 deaths.

Just based on the number of cremation urns delivered to Wuhan ALONE once things calmed down, the death rate for just that area was 5-8x higher than China said. So even taking a lowball 4x more figure based on those Wuhan deception, that would make China's deaths over 300k. But if you take the actual Wuhan range, that's 400k-640k dead in China.

Russia's doing the same thing. I saw a news story last night that about 60% of their COVID-19 deaths are not being classified as such to hide the real death toll. They're being put down as heart attack, respiratory illness, cancer, etc.

So, yeah, there's a political component to all this that isn't helping anyone.

#13978 8 months ago
Quoted from cait001:

things are really starting to pick up in Brazil: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/brazil/
We think USA has it bad, but Brazil and India are where I'm watching over the next 2 weeks.

There are a lot of deaths in a fairly short time, but Brazil has a huge population, so on a deaths per 100k basis, they don't even rank and are a long way from ranking. Right now they're at about 7 deaths per 100k. The US is at about 25 per 100k. Spain is at 50-ish per 100k. Belgium is at over 75 per 100k. So Brazil is less than 10% the deaths per 100k of the worst in the world, Belgium.

#13980 8 months ago
Quoted from Reality_Studio:

That's good because it means you aren't suffering from one of the ailments he has used his billions to help cure or mitigate.

You're behind the times, our current administration has already added morality penalties. One example, I'm not entitled to any stimulus check or financial relief of any sort because I legally film girls for a living, so I effectively have been hit with a violation of the morality statute. Naturally they are happy to take my tax money though...

You still use film?

#13987 8 months ago
Quoted from hailrazer:

If you add all of this together, might it be that the virus is not as bad as we believe?

It's as bad as we believe, maybe worse once we're looking back and have more clarity. The hyper-coagulability feature alone turns your blood to gel, and there's no knowing how badly or even IF this special feature will hit any one person. That's a very bad thing, and massive clotting has contributed to strokes in young, healthy adults, and heart attacks and strokes and older adults. One doctor described removing a massive clot from a patient and seeing a new blood clot form in real time as he pulled the existing clot out.

It's also massively transmissible, which is really bad. And if you survive, whether symptomatic or asymptomatic, permanent organ damage will shave unknown years off survivor's lives just for having it.

And then there's the Kawasaki-disease-like symptoms that's hitting very young kids and killing some. There's a lot we still don't even know about the virus, but everything we learn about it so far has been bad.

#14001 8 months ago

So the question of whether you can get hit again is still open as sailors have tested positive again after having it once:


It's still not clear if this is actually a re-infection or down to testing inaccuracy the first time (or second time). Lots still to learn about this.

#14004 8 months ago
Quoted from rwmech5:

Another side to the Covid pandemic in Italy by MP Sara Cunial. Youtube Sara Cunial speaks truth about Covid 19. Perspective in their house of parliament from one of the worst affected countries in the world. Maybe Gates isn't a savior after all.

That chick is a hysterical wack bullshit peddler. Snopes investigated and (rightly) called her interpretation of Bill Gates' speech FALSE.


Gates arrived at the conclusion that by REDUCING childhood mortality (not killing people), you reduce population overgrowth. Seems counterintuitive, but it checks out. Read the Snopes analysis. They researched his statements well.

#14028 8 months ago
Quoted from RTR:

The news recently about the Abbott quick test having false negative rates higher than realized (as high as 48%) might account for this.
But you are right, there still is a lot to learn. I wonder if those that show a 'return' of the virus on testing are also showing a return of symptoms? I've seen several of these articles now, they never really say if the person got sick again.

The navy article I linked to said the sailors reported influenza symptoms again, which is why they were re-tested.

#14029 8 months ago
Quoted from BobSacamano:

TV commercials were always hard to sit through before The Virus, now they're excruciating...

TV commercials? What are those? If a streaming service requires we watch commercials, we don't use that service, or pay for the ad-free version. The OTA shows are on TiVo so they have commercial skip. I don't have the patience for commercials anymore.

#14030 8 months ago
Quoted from rwmech5:

98% of the info on line is suspect or skewed to the writers point of view. I'm just glad to see a forum where freedom of speech is upheld, not this youtube delete videos or opposing ideas crap. If there is a vaccine developed I'll still be skeptical so in Sala's words "You go first"

The problem with allowing wackadoo bullshit videos and posts about important stuff like pandemics and vaccines is there's a percentage of the population that accepts them at face value, and it makes more wackadoo bullshit people. So if someone is posting factually proven incorrect stuff, I'm all for asking them to delete it, and if they don't, letting the service delete it.

#14079 8 months ago

Boris Johnson's doctor is calling coronavirus this generation's polio because of the long-term health problems it will cause survivors:


#14084 8 months ago

Snopes is a great, quick resource for all this facebook-spread bullshit. 18 months 100k estimated-with-a-CDC-formula deaths in 1968 is not the same as 3 months 100k COUNTED deaths in 2020 we'll have by the end of May.

#14089 8 months ago
Quoted from albummydavis:

Yep, and everyone of this facts was acknowledged in the article. Stop looking for a fight. And it was far worse in the rest of the world

Also, it's interesting to note that flu fatalities are estimated using a formula. COVID-19 deaths are counted (and many say, under counted). So the real delta between any given flu and COVID-19 is likely MUCH larger because it's not an apples to apples comparison of actual mortality.

5 months later
#19727 89 days ago
Quoted from o-din:

I've gotta believe in my own immune system at this point, because this virus is going to spread no matter what feeble attempts man does to try to control it. I know that's not a popular opinion, but it is reality.

Unfortunately, your opinion is not reality, it's an opinion only that doesn't line up with facts. Masks work. How do I know for sure? All the places with high mask wearing compliance in the 90%+ range have miniscule COVID-19 cases and deaths, DESPITE some having very dense populations.

Total deaths to date per 100k population
Singapore 0.5
South Korea 0.9
Japan 1.3
Hong Kong 1.4
Norway 4.9
Germany 11.8
Canada 26.1
United States 66.9

The US has ~66x more deaths than South Korea and 47x more deaths than Hong Kong. The US has 5x the deaths of Germany more than 2x the deaths of Canada - western developed countries that are serious about controlling the spread. That's crazy, and telling.

Yes, all those Asian countries have some degree of contact tracing, too, but masks are the one thing all of them have in common at almost exactly the same levels. Hong Kong has massive population density, too, and yet it had a little over 1 death per 100k, which is nothing compared to non-mask-wearing New York when they had their initial burst. Given that it's been proven that the virus lingers in the air sometimes for hours after an infected person was in the room, the mask will at least REDUCE the viral load a person receives even if they touch it to adjust it, etc. That's important because the amount of virus a person receives frequently dictates how severe the infection will be, so even if you fail in avoiding it entirely, anything to mitigate the level of virus initially received is worth doing.

COVID-19 likely to be a leading cause of death amongst young people due to changes the virus causes in and around their hearts. So being young isn't the free pass many people still think it is. Reuters had an article on it just yesterday:

The problem is, many people are like, "well, 95% or more of people that get it recover." Unfortunately that's not really true. Even if you survive, you do not recover. My neighbor is a therapist at a hospital here and works with covid patients getting ready for discharge. He says to a person NONE of the people he's worked with RECOVERED from COVID-19, they all just SURVIVED it, because all of them have some issue(s) they didn't have before to deal with (brain/cognition, heart, lung, etc). He thinks that's the message missed by Americans. Regardless of age, you don't recover from COVID-19 - ever. You only survive it.

So, the goal is to do everything within your power to not even risk getting it.

Therefore, wear a mask.

#19728 89 days ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

The rub is if you are high risk and your kid goes to school, and then brings it home to you.

Our kids are past school age, but my daughter teaches sign language at a charter school that would not do remote classes, so I told her we would support her living expenses while she's out of work. She wasn't happy about it, but she understands why and as a result she's not bringing home potential infection. The school is out their sign language teacher because they were too stubborn. Their loss.

If we still had kids in school, they would be 100% home-schooled during this whole thing. I wouldn't want to send them physically damaged into adulthood because I was reckless with their health as kids or teens resulting in them getting COVID-19.

#19749 89 days ago
Quoted from o-din:

The facts don't always line up with the resulting people's actions.

You sir, are living in a dream world to think the USA will or can ever become as efficient in this department as any of those countries.
The people in those countries are well educated on how to wear a mask properly, and have the intelligence and will to do so diligently. Not to mention being sanitary.

The USA can do anything it sets its mind to with proper leadership. Yes, the educational PSAs have been sorely lacking to completely missing, and the initial plan to send every household in the US a supply of masks via USPS that was cancelled early on this year would have saved SO MANY lives, but these are all things that can happen and will make a difference.

Will we get to 90%+ mask compliance? I doubt it. Can we do 70% compliance with strong leadership, PSAs, mask distribution, and enforcement? Absolutely. The longer people resist masks, the longer this will be dragged out and they and our economy will suffer. We have the model. Asia has shown it works. We just have to have leadership that can press "GO" on the plan to do it well here.

#19758 89 days ago
Quoted from Jaybird815:

PSAs are an absolute waste of time and money, war on drugs? Billions wasted. Mask compliance I see in my travels is way above 70%, no matter who is the “leader”, there was going to be a decent percentage of people who chose not to comply.

I'm not talking about an announcer and a list of bullet points, but well done advertising spots that are actually PSAs but don't read like dry announcements. They can absolutely change thinking over time. Anti-cigarette advertising is a great example of this. Disney used to do them, too - cartoons with a message.

If we had clever, impactful COVID-19 spread commercials like the ones Scotland is running, they would make a dent and change behavior if the creative was as good and they ran all the time.

The fan-made "Wear a mask" Beauty and the Beast retheme hints at what is possible (without the explicit language and double entendres like "mask debaters" that are hilarious but limit the audience) if companies like Disney and Dreamworks (shrek/donkey mask song!) were recruited to make memorable videos, too:

#19770 88 days ago
Quoted from GolfKill:

What we need is not "mask compliance" with weak ass cosmetic masks that have a minimal function in actually stopping the disease from spreading - yes, it's better than nothing, but this stuff is airborne, it's not just in droplets.

The "weak ass cosmetic masks" are primarily what's in use in Asia with extremely successful results. If the majority of people are wearing them the "stuff" never gets airborne in any appreciable quantities because the mask catches most of it. Asia proved the weak ass masks work, we just need compliance to get into the universe of Asia compliance rates. We'll never hit the Asian rates of 90%+ but I've heard 70% as a number that would cut infection rates substantially, and I think that's achievable with good leadership. Maybe a 2 week "reset" lockdown would be needed to give us a running start with substantial public education spots saturating media during and after that that, and then strong mask enforcement should be enough to make a large enough dent to get contact tracing back in the toolkit on the way to controlling this while the economy gets back on track.

Oh, and this "medical reasons" thing as an excuse to not wear a mask in public should not be accepted, period. If you're too ill to wear a mask, you're too ill to be out in public in a pandemic because you're at high risk for dying from it. Stay home and have your necessities delivered. Stores need to enforce complete mask compliance with no "out" clauses, which are mostly used by mask deniers.

#19778 88 days ago
Quoted from Russell:

I would love to hear someone explain, without dodging the question or what-aboutisms, why the US is doing so poorly relative to other countries.

1. No unified leadership
2. No mask mandate
3. No contact tracing
4. Lies and disinformation from the administration, and even re-writing CDC recommendations to undo actual science-based directives.
5. Fudged statistics on cases/deaths
6. Politics over science (this is literally the dumbest reason, but it's a pretty big factor)
7. We have a pretty dumb electorate, and that's no accident. It's a program of education cuts spanning decades to raise poorly educated, non-critically-thinking people that will vote against their own interests in states where there's enough control to pass bills that support that goal.

That about covers it.

We could have 4x less deaths - about 60k instead of 220k, somewhere in the range of Germany deaths per 100k, IF we had leadership, a mask mandate, and contact tracing. But, we don't.

The ultimate slap in the face was the White House releasing a list of accomplishments and "ending the coronavirus pandemic" is one of them. That happened yesterday - as we're in our third and likely largest wave:


#19784 87 days ago
Quoted from frisbez:

Impossible to do without diving into the realm of politics.

Now you tell me.

I gave the request a shot and stayed as vanilla as possible, but still got burned.

#19805 87 days ago
Quoted from OLDPINGUY:

And teachers, well we hear everyday from family, and a teacher here or there out with the virus is an everyday event,
with individual schools closing one or two a week in Orange county. Some should have closed, and teachers, well many are scared, and exhausted already. Minimal learning, regardless of method. Kids feel the stress too.
How are those with children in school handling all this by you?
Are you getting good info in your state?

COVID monitor is trying to track school infections using public health records and anonymous reporting. Florida is easily the worst part of the map for schools, too.


#19840 86 days ago
Quoted from henrydwh:

It's like beating your head against wall! My wife and I have been good about being safe during all this, but lately she is starting to falter. She has her annual family Thanksgiving/ Christmas gathering and wants to go, I have fought her on this, especially with the recent spike in cases. She finally said if you're so scared, just stay home! So after trying to explain that is not how it works to no avail, I gave up and agreed to go. What do you do?!? Trying to explain to her it's not about me, it's about other people, I know she is not that stupid!

There's been some early reports that the flu vaccine makes it harder to catch covid-19 (but exactly what the reason for that is remains unclear), which has me considering a flu shot for our family for the first time ever.

If you're going to go into that tremendously risky family gathering, I'd take out some insurance with a flu shot for you and your wife at least 3 weeks in advance so your immune system has fully recovered from the shot and that may give you a boost in protection if you are exposed to the novel coronavirus from someone not yet symptomatic that has COVID-19 at the gathering.

#19849 86 days ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

By all means get a flu shot, but I read one of those studies. It compared rates of Covid infection in hospital employees who got a flu shot last year vs. those who didn't. If you work in a hospital and don't get a flu shot every year, I suspect you probably aren't as diligent about wearing a mask and social distancing as the hospital employees who did get the flu sghot.

Hospitals aren't like walmart where masks are optional even though they're supposedly required but no one polices individual customer compliance. If you're working in a hospital flouting mask/PPE protocols you won't be working there long I suspect. They police that stuff pretty heavily. So I doubt the unsubstantiated conclusion you made is much of a factor and will take the flu shot results at face value while waiting for followup studies. At the very least, it's an easy and cheap hedge.

#19859 86 days ago
Quoted from roffels:

Do you have any articles backing this? I'm not having any luck. Thanks!

Lots of MSM articles referencing the study (which is preprint, and pre-peer review) this week, but here's the actual study:


#19860 86 days ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

By all means get a flu shot, but I read one of those studies. It compared rates of Covid infection in hospital employees who got a flu shot last year vs. those who didn't. If you work in a hospital and don't get a flu shot every year, I suspect you probably aren't as diligent about wearing a mask and social distancing as the hospital employees who did get the flu shot.

Also, the hospital observational study wasn't all they did. They also confirmed results isolated in-vitro. No human behavioral shortcomings there to skew the result and it also showed the effect.

The part that concerns me is the observed in-vitro effect was enhanced cytokine activity, which is normally good, but if you end up with the COVID-19 strain that blows up a cytokine storm from out of control immune response, I could see it making that worse. I wish all of this was more clear cut. We know much more than we did in Feb, but there's still so much to learn about this.

#19864 85 days ago
Quoted from Oaken:

North Dakota has the highest death rate per capita in the world right now.

Overall North Dakota's deaths per 100k population is low top 10 in the world, with 67.8 COVID deaths per 100k population. Peru is worst in the world with over 105 deaths per 100k, almost 2x North Dakota. US COVID in aggregate is 70 deaths per 100k.

#19964 80 days ago
Quoted from jlm33:

Thanks everyone for the support.
She's a tough lady. Already feeling better.

Stay vigilant. The 7-10 day mark after symptoms things can get dire quickly, even if the days before were much better.

1 week later
#20223 71 days ago

German government has a GREAT COVID-19 commercial for their new campaign (sorry, couldn't embed, there's not a youtube version yet):


#20226 70 days ago
Quoted from Jaybird815:

Mandates only work if the people follow them, here in Illinois they recently closed down indoor dining again. Every bar/restaurant in my town has defied the order and it’s pretty much the same in every other town in the area, especially the mom and pop joints. Enforcement is virtually impossible, local leaders/mayors have come out and said that it’s not their job to enforce. Stricter lockdown measures are more than likely coming Monday, which won’t go over well. It is and always will be about the people.

Once the state sends enforcement to start pulling liquor licenses permanently, the word will get around, at which point I would expect compliance to rise dramatically. Resisting the measures to get a handle on this is as dumb and selfish as it gets. The penalties will get more real-world for those that think their beliefs are stronger than science.

#20236 70 days ago
Quoted from Jaybird815:

Again the problem is with enforcement, if the local and county authorities won’t enforce, which is what’s happening, there’s no way the state has enough man power to do it. They’ve already pulled some liquor licenses and these places are still open and serving.
And Illinois is one of the bluest states in the country, so I could only imagine a mandate on a national level would go over like a Led Zeppelin. Cmon Stern make it happen!

Well, CA is sending state enforcement around to get around lack of cooperation from local law enforcement (we have that here, too in the red north of CA). They've been through our town a few times. If the place is obstinate and the liquor license pull doesn't stop them, health just closes them down. Yeah, it sucks, but there isn't a CHOICE. The virus has to be stopped, and these outlaws and their followers looking out for themselves aren't helping.

#20237 70 days ago
Quoted from Luckydogg420:

Jordan Peterson is a great speaker, thanks for that vid. I don’t think I’ve seen it before.

Think about all the people who think wearing a mask takes away their freedom. Just imagine how mad and irate they will be if real enforcement is applied to them. Especially if it’s by a new government they don’t support. Plus more guns then people.
I’m scared right now, and it’s not just from a virus.

Meh. We'll get through it. It's about to get a lot more painful, but we'll get through it.

#20245 70 days ago
Quoted from Manny65:

Needing 2 doses several weeks apart is common with some vaccinations based on the way they work. This vaccine exhibits characteristics of the covid virus and your body will produce the required antibodies when you have the first vaccinations shot but once you've "recovered" your body will stop producing those antibodies.

As I have read it, though, the timeframe for the second shot is very tight - like a 36 hour window or something crazy. Miss that 2nd shot window and you have to start over. Seems prone to user error/compliance problems.

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