If that was happening it would completely skew the figures to show more vaccinated people being hospitalized vs unvaccinated.

There’s no hate here, you’re just posting nonsense that has been debunked multiple times.

Are you just trolling now?

This image needs to be made into a t-shirt. Would probably get me killed though...

a mask worn incorrectly does not NOT count as wearing a mask.A mask worn correctly Helps.

As if by advocating for safety to help keep fellow humans alive we are really just hateful vigilantes.

That was the specific evidence you provide of miscounted cases? The question is still outstanding, and it looks like you cannot answer it.

There is subreddit forum on Reddit documenting anti-vax anti-mask folks who then go on to end up in the hospital or dead from COVID.

Https://old.reddit.com/r/HermainCainAward

It is quite sobering to see how many folks share the same memes and same arguments and then end up horribly sick or with sick family members. The propaganda effect is real.

The commentary there is quite dark. Lots of folks feeling like the deaths are deserved. I don't agree with that, but I do understand the frustration. I'm not sure how much blame is fair to lay at the feet of folks who have so clearly been sucked in by propaganda. Like they certainly bear some responsibility but I don't know where to draw the line.

Anyway, I think the posts there just highlight how similarly folks have reacted to COVID, for better or worse. Where can we even go from here?

I've been engaging a bit with my anti-vax friends. It was really spooky when all three entered the conversation with the exact same *second* sentence to me. First sentence would be a general declaration of their intention to not get the vaccine. The second sentence out of each of their mouths/keyboards, without missing a beat, "I know someone that died from getting one of the vaccines", followed by a couple more various sentences with random, debunked claims supporting their first sentence. Using some of the valuable information I have learned on this thread I would engage on that second sentence, and in every case the person they knew that "died after taking the vaccine" they believed that based on either a family member of said person believing/deciding that, or in one case supposedly the person's family doctor made the claim. But of course no further proof and no idea if an investigation was started to determine the cause of death, etc.

But remember everyone, they are all "following the science" except when they need a really powerful second sentence to state their position. Then really sketchy hearsay and rumor will do just fine.

Our mask mandate went back into effect a few weeks ago when the infection rate numbers hit a threshold and triggered it again. I like that my state uses infection rate data to determine the safety guidelines, rather than emotion or politics. I also like that they are willing to have mask mandates, because I'm working in person now and also am wanting to go shop, eat and drink safely with less worries about catching Delta, or worse, spreading it to my family members or friends that are older or have weakened immune systems and possibly killing them. Sure enough, even with schools starting again, our 7 day infection rate average is starting fall because of masking. It's a shame some states and people just don't get it, they are putting our loved ones, communities and economy at risk.

Look like you have some great leadership there in the US.
I’m hoping a similar mandate is rolled out in Aus

Desperate times call for desperate measures. Very happy with today’s announcement.

If you are anti-vax and have kids, don't put your kids in this position. Fear is a powerful motivator, but once you've got Covid and it ain't going well, you are going to want the vaccine, but it's too late...

https://www.wesh.com/article/father-dies-urges-vaccinations-deltona/37533549#

You All, are going to Love this one!

2 Nights ago, there was dinner at my mothers, with her friends, Ladies born in England, US, and Morocco, all 85 plus.
The discussion turned to Politics, and one shared that she learned something Political, where the current President is suffering from
a Plethora of old age issues and diseases. I sat and listened to all the "truths" about this, then all the truths she knew about Covid.
When I asked where she learned this info, she replied, "At the Supermarket".
As my elders all nodded their heads in agreement to her truths, I asked, "Was that info on a Paper Tabloid, eye height and center in the Checkout Line?". The quick reply, "YES! I get my News from the Checkout line at the Grocery Store!..Others nodded in agreement"
Nothing I could say, and I didnt want to offend, could reach her that this was a tabloid rag, with no concern for truth.

Her proof, was Facebook, they conformed it!

My Brain Hurts!

He's here to get Ratioed.

That’s why I always ask for names and to see the obituary.

True, but I always argue that nose out is still better than no mask at all. If the person's mouth is covered, then that helps block and slow expulsions when talking. Also, the air coming out of a person's nose is generally directed downward towards the ground, so this hopefully means that fewer viral particles are directed upwards or outward towards other people than if the person's mouth was also uncovered.

So yeah, although not great,, I've always thought nose-out was better than nothing. And please no "would you want your surgeon..." nose-out comparisons, because a surgeon is generally standing over the patient, so air being directed downwards is obviously a big problem.

From the generation that brought you "don't believe everything you see on TV" comes "you'll never guess what I saw on facebook".

Our vacation was cut short by one day.

During the night my girlfriend started feeling very cold and shivering.

By morning she was hot and hurting all over.

I took her to a urgent care, her fever was 102.

All they gave her was a pill to help with her fever, and they did the Covid test, which they will call her back with the results, and let her know if she needs to go to get some infusion of something.

Keep in mind she already was in the hospital for 5 days back around February with this stuff, and since we have both been vaccinated.

We have been being very careful, although she did keep asking why do we have to sit outside to eat dinner, because it is hot outside, and the inside feels a lot better with ac, and I said we need to stay out in the open air. She keeps forgetting, but I don't.

Anyway, even before I took her to urgent care I told her that we would be heading back home, I just wanted her to see a doctor first.

They told her she needs to quarantine, she said not happening, my boyfriend already said after we leave here we are going back to the motel, getting our stuff, and going home a day early.

I feel fine. She slept through most of the 8.5 hour drive, and before that and during it when she was awake she seemed very weak and even fell one time.

I wanted to get her back home to doctors she is used to, and I also wanted to hurry up and get back home while I felt good, and limit my exposure to her as much as I could for now.

And I hope you notice this Doc, I am not trolling, but I am curious.

Very early on there was a news story, I think from England, about how smokers are not catching this virus.

The news story went away very fast, but I was talking to the motel staff while they were out smoking with me, and even they had remembered seeing that, and how the tar in our lungs were making it harder for the virus to get to us.

Of course a story like that would go away fast because smoking is not a healthy thing anyway.

My girlfriend used to smoke, but she stopped a few years ago, and now she has asthma.

I smoke outdoors, or if in a car, I keep the window cracked so that no smoke goes anywhere near her.

I do really wonder now if smokers do have some added protection from the virus stuff?

It seems to for me anyway so far.

Yes I do have minor issues from the smoking, and I would not encourage anyone to start doing that.

On another note, while on vacation, it was amazing how many people still think this stuff is a media hoax, and even think things like vaccinated people are causing this stuff to get worse.

I just had fun with the real nut cases, I told them do not worry, that computer chip that they put in your arm is just there to help you, and once you get it your smartphone will help you a lot easier with everything that you have been looking for that you may want to purchase.

And honestly, more people may would get vaccinated, if we started telling them that the computer chip in your arm is awesome, after you get it you will no longer receive any calls about your car warranty.

But seriously, my girlfriend was not doing well at all while ago, I am very worried, and she said she hopes that she does not have to go to the hospital again, and I said well at least so far, if you are vaccinated, most people do not get as sick and end up in the hospital.

We are trying to do good, vaccinated, only dine outdoors, masks, distancing, but something has kicked her ass so bad it was like dealing with a zombie all day, and I am very worried about her.

(and now she is in her house, 2 minutes away from my house, and we have already alerted everyone to stay away from us).

(and also, I did just skip the last 2 pages of comments here, before vacation I had kept up with the whole conversation here).

And currently I have a aunt in ICU, she has been there a few weeks now, and another person I only met once, but everyone I know was very fond of that person was buried today from this mess.

And it is just crazy how so many people think that this is just some political or media hoax and tiny computer chips are involved, while otherwise they seem to be very normal and fun to be around before this subject comes up.

I will say that I do have some tightness in my chest and stomach that hurts a tad when I cough a tad from smoking, but otherwise so far I am fine, and I am very worried about my girlfriend.

(sorry for the long post, just the way I am).

Actually, my comment back to them was "Wow, you know someone famous!". Which they didn't get, and I explained if what they just said was an actual truth there would be literally hundreds of articles about what happened in all the major news sites and channels, and their friend's name would be mentioned in all of those articles.

Also I realize I left out an important point in all these of these folk's stories. The person they were using as this vaccine death proof was never anyone they were close to, more like someone they went to school with 30 or more years ago.

I've been called out on why I won't believe what is in the articles and YouTube videos that they send me to try to convert me. I explain to them that in my current job I am the designated person everyone is supposed to go to if they receive a suspicious email or link before they go and click on it. So I've had all the spam/phishing/malware training I care to have been through, and I've seen more than my fair share of Internet-based bull crap.

"If I put up a web site with enough American flags in the background, and maybe have the Star Spangled Banner playing along, you patriots would believe ANYTHING I wrote on that site". Honestly it is getting increasingly hard every day to identify as a conservative with as gullible as a lot of my friends have become...

I am seeing stories like this one every day now.

Yes! This! I'm getting REALLY damned tired of watching this jackholes wearing their face mask as a "Chin Hamoc"! These people need to be told to cover their F^&*$#g mouth AND noses!

pasted_image (resized).png

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/france-us-travelers-restriction-covid/index.html

Here is a video of what people are dealing with regarding Covid.

One guy's wife dealt with cancer for 12 years. Covid took her out in 8 days. So he is going to get the jab. But his buddy, who had Covid is saying no-way no-how to a vaccine. And some of what he is basing his decision on is not valid---so then, when he got caught in the fallacy of his logic regarding the Pied Piper---he just does not care.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/health/2021/09/08/deadly-coronavirus-surge-ozarks-missouri-elle-reeve-pkg-ebof-vpx.cnn

EDIT: Pay attention to what was said about those who were masks.

(Them not you)

F5FA7CC6-FE08-41BD-ACF4-3E2FB35D893E.jpeg

If that graph includes people in the covid section who ended up at the hospital for an unrelated reason and just happen to test positive for coivid, then I believe the graph is misleading. If the graph represents hospitalization due specifically to covid, then it should frighten everyone. Without knowing what it represents, I do not feel it's helpful.

This is just crazy. My girlfriend test came back negative for Covid, and she is sick, and went to urgent care again, for more tests and for meds to help her, and they did not give her anything.

I can tell she is very sick, and she has been to 2 different urgent cares, and no one has done anything to help her.

I told her to just see her regular doctor asap, but she dreads that because her regular doc keeps pushing other stuff on her like the colon test stuff, while she is there trying to get help with what she is actually in there in the first place for.

Just seeing first hand how my girlfriend is being treated, I big time hope I never need to see any doctor myself anytime soon.

(so far just being very careful to stay away from other people and crowded places I have not been sick in over 2 years myself, and I thought she was even more careful than me, and she keeps getting sick).

Maybe I need to be tested? Even though I have been fine the whole time and vaccinated.

I am just shocked that 2 different urgent cares did not give her any kind of meds, while I am afraid she was about to die as weak as she was/is.

Those urgent care places always gave me at least 2 meds, if not more when I went, and took good care of me.

I would love to know why she did not get any meds, with a 102 fever, and zombie like?

(and not a money thing, she has very good insurance).

All I know is when I eventually get sick with something again, they are going to give me some kind of meds before I leave their office.

If my girlfriend was not feeling so bad now, she would also have demanded some meds.

And right now I have a aunt in the ICU, she has been there for weeks, and I just learned that she was fully vaccinated.

(I never talk to her, but I had assumed that she was anti-vax).

Anyway, just seeing what my girlfriend is dealing with, the medical people are not doing their job too well at the moment.

I really hope soon everything can return to normal again.

My girlfriend is very sick, and 2 urgent cares have not offered her the first medication to help her to get better.

Something is very wrong with our medical system at the moment.

For most viruses my Doctor does not prescribe anything as they don't do anything. Dr's that just dole out antibiotics to make you feel good are not doing thier jobs. Did they say what the issue is?

Its official. President wants everyone vaccinated. I m curious, what happens next if every human on the planet gets vaccinated. Dies the c Ovid go away? Do I need monthly booster? Or does my dog spunky have covid now. And I m forced to get him vaccinated or he gets taken from me

Howard Stern gets it.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/10/entertainment/howard-stern-vaccine-comments/index.html

" Howard Stern to anti-vaxxers: 'You had the cure and you wouldn't take it' "

" Howard Stern is over the Covid-19 pandemic and is taking on anti-vaxxers who refuse to get the shot.

Speaking on his SiriusXM satellite radio show about the recent deaths of several anti-vaxxer radio hosts, Stern said people who won't get vaccinated are "idiots" and called for vaccinations to be mandatory.

"When are we gonna stop putting up with the idiots in this country and just say it's mandatory to get vaccinated? F--- 'em. F--- their freedom. I want my freedom to live," he said. "I want to get out of the house already. I want to go next door and play chess. I want to go take some pictures. This is bull----."

Stern, who is vaccinated, is also frustrated over Covid patients who chose not to get vaccinated causing hospitals to be overwhelmed.

"If you have a heart attack or any kind of problem, you can't even get into the E.R. And I'm really of mind to say, 'Look, if you didn't get vaccinated and you got Covid, you don't get into a hospital.'"

For emphasis, he added, "You had the cure and you wouldn't take it."

https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/10/business/united-no-pay-religious-objections-vaccine/index.html

"United Airlines workers with religious objections to the Covid vaccine will be placed on unpaid leave "

" The company's vaccine mandate is much tougher than those imposed by many other companies, or the ones announced by President Joe Biden Thursday....At United, it's essentially vaccination or termination."

@johnnypinball007, did your girlfriend happen to get stuck by one of those spines on a saltwater catfish? Those can make someone pretty sick.

You mention the colon stuff. Does she have diverticulosis? I am no doctor, but if she has an infection there it probably needs to be diagnosed by testing.

No, they thought it was Covid, but that test was negative.

Very weird how bad of shape she was in, and they could not find anything.

I say "was", because now her fever is gone, and she just has a sore throat, headache, and feels tired.

Might want to go to your local quack supplement store and get some vitamin D, liquid elderberry, ashwaganda, and some vitamin c capsules. Not medical advice but those things could help.

And recommending supplements, eating well, exercise, etc doesn't pay the hospital bills.

So I'm curious how the pandemic ends and society heals. Right now there are two groups: vax vax booster + and no vax ever. The former loves the government/Biden the latter hates government/Biden. So how can we ever end the pandemic while it's so politicized?

Biden ordering all businesses to make employees get vaxxed is only going to galvanized the other side that much more.

Agreed. If it is a viral infection…usually not much besides over the counter fever reducers. In theory they could have ordered a few basic tests to determine what infection…if they had other reasons to suspect something like strep or hand/foot/mouth. Not like there is much to treat it with, depending on what it is.

She really should try to get in to see or shoot a message/call to her primary care doctor. They know her history better, and can do a deeper dive into the issues.

Also most urgent cares are primarily set up to deal with simple basic things from tick bites (prescribe antibiotics) up to a couple staples tops. Not set up to fix a broken leg or high blood pressure, etc..

Big misconception my wife deals with all the time is people treating it like an emergency room lite. (Ex: Patient comes in with acute chest pain but thought urgent care could treat it faster and cheaper than emergency room. A quick once over and nope, to the ER with you!)

In the current times we are living in, at least where we are at, staffing problems are similar to your favorite local restaurant. Wife’s org is begging people to pick up urgent care shifts. She decided to pick up a few just to help out…her last shift between her and the permanent urgent care doctor they banged out 50 patients and had to turn away another dozen or so. Most people were incredibly angry and frustrated too. It was…not fun. She is very reluctant to pick up another shift.

That permanent doc has been doing that 6 days a week for 3 months now. They go into the clinic at 8 am and after finishing notes leave at 9 pm. They are totally burnt out and on the cusp of flat out quitting because there is no end in sight.

So yeah, if your clinics are like our clinics...

It ends by one of:

A) The virus continues to mutate and becomes another version of a common corona virus cold.

B) The virus mutates into something far more scary and Group B vaccinates.

C) The virus mutates into something apocalyptic and kills us all.

As to society? It doesn’t heal. Not completely. But Group B becomes smaller and more insignificant and more angry and militant. It’s going to make for an ugliness that becomes a part of our culture.

Oaken,
People need to be careful with their insurance plans now regarding ER. Ours changed a few years back and people started getting $5,000 bills! I'm certain it was taken care of for the most part, it certainly makes one think before going. It was something along the lines of life threatening injury only.

The test could have been a false negative. I'd sure be looking for a way to get another test.

Not sure your premise is correct on what vaccinated and unvaccinated people love or hate. I know plenty of vaccinated non-Biden people and unvaccinated Biden voters. About 70% of the adult population in the US has at least one shot - are they all Biden/big government lovers? Maybe they are all science lovers and their love for science and belief in medicine transcends their views on politics. 96% of doctors have been vaxxed, that's a group that has many conservatives, but has a deep understanding of Covid risk too.

He tried asking nicely, tried encouraging, explaining the science, engaging leaders on the right and other vaccine hesitant groups in pro-vaccine ad campaigns (even ran ads on Breitbart), and answering questions for the last 9 months. They removed all kinds of barriers and have made the free shots available virtually everywhere. He waited until full FDA approval arrived before mandating. Not sure what else could motivate the "galvanized" aside from a mandate.

What would you suggest doing to motivate the unvaxxed while hospital systems are stressed and the pandemic rages on?

Out of curiosity, has anyone turned on the "Covid 19 Exposure Notifications " app that was forcibly installed on to everyone's cellular device quite sometime ago? Have you had many updates or Contact Tracers speak to you Thanks!

Former Kentucky state rep dies from COVID-19. He was fully vaccinated, loved ones say.

https://www.courier-journal.com/story/news/politics/2021/08/20/brent-yonts-former-kentucky-representatve-dies-despite-being-fully-vaccinated/8209027002/