....um...wouldn't Lobsters implode at 12.5 k feet under the sea? (In my best lobster accent) yes! we are saved boys! "The hand of Poseidon has reached up and....oh....sh%^ ...where is the seafloor?" *pop*

If that 2nd wave coming looks anything like the Fall 1918 wave, the choice will be made for everyone. The virus doesn’t give two wet farts about your or my economy. It’s not about anything but surviving, depending on your risk level, your area’s exposure threat and reality when the hospitals max out.

What kind of work do you do? Do you work in a hot ass factory? These masks arent going to do much anyways and to wear one for 8 hours is actually unhealthy. I am not against masks by the way and I wear one if I go into a store usually out of respect for other people but to wear one all day....not sure if I could do that.

Sweden has graciously volunteered to be the control group in this experiment. Educated, fantastic healthcare system, good social safety net, didn’t shutdown.

Time will tell what the final outcome will be, but at this point in time, it’s looking like they are going to have one of the highest death rates and their economy is still predicted to get hammered.

We are mandated to wear a mask at work at all times even walking to our cars. The people at work are freaking disgusting anyway in their hygiene habits. People having their pants completely pulled down touching the floor or putting notebooks on the floor while performing #2 Not washing after #2. Who knows what they have brewing.

I'll take a mask over having my lungs turn into a brick any day.

You are correct. I am retired. And I have to admit when this virus started coming on that I did not consider those who are still working need the cash that a job provides.

Several times throughout the years I found myself without work and no unemployment. I had to start digging around for anything I could sell to bring some money in. So, I understand that pressure to get some money rolling in. And the government money did not exactly get distributed equally. In the meantime, the electric bill keeps coming.

I won't insult you with the usual BS people spew forth when someone else falls on hard times. But I understand.

At the same time, in less than 3 months we have gone from zero deaths to what will over 100,000 deaths in less than 3 more days.

There are no easy answers here. I'll leave it at that.

I feel for those that are out of work because of this. I also totally understand the desire to open back up since the impact of no income is going to have a definite impact while opening up means you may or may not get the virus and it could be mild even if you do.

Opening back up will still mean some big economic impacts as its not like people will act the same.

In New Zealand things are pretty under control, only 28 active (known) cases in the country right now. Just about everything is open now. However, lots of people are still pretty careful going out and when you do go out things are subdued. I have been out a fair bit as I see it as very low risk (no new cases near me in over a month and all local cases have been recovered for weeks) Shops, cafes, bars, etc are all very quiet and have reduced seating, they are going to need to be able to weather the impact of the lockdown and a very slow recovery to survive. A lot will not. People are being careful on spending too.

It would be a lot harder here if we have to start worrying about it spreading again, particularly as we go into winter. There is no way that things are going back to 'normal' anytime soon.

This stuff just seems so arbitrary and made up.
It’s probably not a great idea for 100 people to get together. And if 100 people are now considered “safe” to hang with, why not 200?

Where’s the science behind “100 people is fine?”

Just telling us what some people want to hear I guess.

One thing I'm trying to understand from a United States perspective is the "second wave" people are talking about in the fall. I don't understand how it can be a seasonal weather thing when places like Brazil and Mexico are currently being devastated. While there may be secondary or tertiary or whatever waves I don't see how seasonal weather will dictate this. It would have to be something else if/when that happens.

Yeah, it is arbitrary. 100 people at a huge open-air bar is probably fine, while 10 people in a tiny cafe with no outside air could be deadly.

Taking the V8s out for a run today, Have a great weekend all, enjoying the Freedom and cheap petrol

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What job are they not letting you back to right now? Or are you like me, about to be unemployed due to cutbacks?

Just to be clear, I am still working and have not been impacted by any of this. So I am not looking for any sympathy. But I know that millions of people's lives have been destroyed by this and I do have sympathy for them. We must protect the most vulnerable. But I can see the writing on the wall if people do not get back to work. And yes I know that getting people back to work has not even come close to happening. Why? Because of mindsets like what I am seeing here and it not going to end well. Business's cant survive under all of these new mandates. Not to mention all of the lawsuits coming to the 50 states. You retirees and the rich and famous can have all the money in the world and it wont matter. When everyone around you everywhere is in the gutter. I sure hope you guys are ready for what will come. A lot more people will die and it likely wont be from covid. And for those wondering my location I am an American.

Concert season is coming up. We need clearance for 10,000 people to get together or rock and roll might die

Total guess, but probably someone with a chart like this convinced them. Hopefully more updated (my chart is from mid March)

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My question is the 2nd wave people say is coming. How do we know when the 2nd wave is starting and not part of the current virus thats circulating? It seems Brazil is still getting lots of cases and its hot there.

Nice to hear we all have to stick together.
Business started up slowly four weeks ago where I work, but since we are depending on export we are probably pretty screwed anyway.
Unfortunately some people consider this pandemic to be a contest between different countries, no hard feelings but you might want to consider waiting a year or two with the conclusions since this pandemic has just started, we have had about 4000 death cases as of today and the latest prediction is a total of around 8000-20000, about 0.001%-0.002% of the population.
Every single death is counted as covid-19 if its a infected person no matter what other real reason it might have been but thats probably a small number of misguided death cause.
Even the most experienced epidemiologist doesnt seems to agree on whats the correct approach of how to handle this virus, I sincerely hope it works out better for the countries with the lockdown strategies in the end than the Swedish open voluntary restrictions and that we will have a fully working vaccine ready asap.
And like a lot of other countries the nursing homes is our biggest problem with about 50% of the death, healthcare has not been overwhelmed so far.
Lets hope Mr Giesecke is wrong about his predictions, personally I think he might be a bit low on the fatality rate.

In addition to discovering vaccines, I'll wager there are entrepreneurs and business's designing more efficient masks and other lifestyle products for our future. Who knows what it will look like even a year from now.

I sympathize with those complaining about wearing a mask, but wait till July and August hits especially in the high humidity areas. Air conditioning will be king and I can't imagine the unfortunate people and places without it.

Hopefully someone alerted PETA in 1912.

Wow. By your initial impassioned plea it sure sounded like you were directly affected.
Since we are apparently speaking for people here who aren’t us and pretending we know exactly what they want to say, let me give it a shot.

I’d like to passionately speak for all of those people who “can’t get to work” but also don’t want more of their friends, relatives and neighbors to die, as I know for a fact they would say to us if they were posting here:

Please make sure it’s safe to “reopen” before you do it. Please make sure when I go to my minimum wage job because they are threatening to replace me if I don’t, that it’s safe to work there, proper PPE is provided, and proper distancing protocol is implemented for employees, management, and customers. So many of these employers don’t care at all about me, just their profits.

Just like it seems many people want to just
Declare this over for political reasons, when over 1,000 Americans are still dying every day.

Thanks for listening to me!

Cait why do you think people are dumb for wanting their state opened back up so they can go back to work and not be homeless? Let me guess, you do not work and you have a husband that supports you right? People have to work, I dont care if theres a virus going around or not. You cannot shut down the whole damn world like this!

I like that green one on the left. What make / model is that?

Warmer weather means more UV rays and people generally spend a bit more time outdoors where wind disperses viral particles and less time indoors in groups. Fall comes and people move inside more, family gatherings happen in the fall and winter as the holidays come around. People fly in from out of town and bring fresh germs with them.

So, in general viral illnesses are less common in the summer vs the fall. It is expected that COVID will increase again in the fall but it has yet to be seen.

There won’t be any lawsuits. Mitch McConnell said Congress is working on the issues of liability.

So, if you get called back to work and then catch this stuff you are going to be on your own.

I find it amazing how that bastion of capitalism, Wall Street, has its hand out for the govt. bailout money but when it comes to some sort of healthcare for everybody the mantra is “we can’t afford universal healthcare. You are on your own and here is our middle finger salute.”

Tomorrow's NYT cover was revealed

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I'm confused, are saying to go outside? I thought we were supposed to stay home? Why were parks, golf courses and beaches closed if sunlight (UV rays) kills viruses and the wind help dissipate the spread of viral particles?

Are you saying that that UV rays are tied to warmer weather? I don't know if we are talking about the same thing here but temperature does not affect UV radiation.

Flu season is a certainty. Flu season compounded with COVID-19 is a second wave. You can be infected with both at the same time. It's all about not overwhelming the hospitals right?

I can't imagine that that a second wave won't hit this summer. Some of the larger businesses (Costco is a great example) seem to take precautions pretty seriously, but I have noticed many smaller (and some larger) businesses just pencil whipping it. They have the appropriate signage up, some tape on the floor, but no employees with masks, no one washing hands, no regard for distancing, no hand sanitizer readily accessible, etc.

Even inside the businesses taking things fairly seriously, many are not requiring masks or distancing of the customers - at least in my area. And most people around here are definitely unmasked.

My money would be on, Its a Holden! Since the other 2 are Holdens too. (Going to guess it is a 1970 Holden Statesman.)

Abby took my chair while I was playing pinball

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read her sign again, sir. This is no "I need to work!" protester. The hashtag there is part of a cult of crazy conspiracy theorists that make the "Bill Gates wants to use COVID to implant a chip inside me" people seem reasonable.

A nearby rally today:
"We're being ruled like Slaves!!"
(a bad day for face mask sales, but probably a great day for Mr. COVID-19).
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No reason to be confused. There's a difference between sheltering in place with your own family and thus limiting the spread of the virus and going outside and mingling with others. The transmission from person to person is probably more difficult in warmer weather but still not impossible. By the way, sheltering in place does not equal staying inside all the time. My family goes on walks together, we spend time in our backyard, my kids play in our front yard, etc. We just don't come within 6 feet of people outside our family.

You are correct that temperature does not affect UV radiation however unless I'm mistaken the reason it is warmer in summer is because the earth's axis is tilted and thus we get more sunlight exposure during those months compared to winter. That IS related to how much UV radiation there is.

My mother was forced to stay in her room at her senior center for 4 weeks and not allowed to go outside and has no balcony or patio, that doesn't sound healthy or smart to me so not everyone has that same ability you mention.

You are correct that the Earth's axis is tilted and does impact the amount sunlight DEPENDING on where you live, so the length of UV exposure can be greater during those months however, this does not affect UV radiation levels.

Quoted from the Cancer Council:

"UV radiation can be just as high on a cool or even cold day as it is on a hot one, especially if skies are clear. Thick cloud provides a good filter, but UV radiation can penetrate thin cloud cover. And while UV radiation is higher in summer than in winter, it is still present every day of the year."

Ironically, it can even be greater if there is snow cover causing a reflection of the UV radiation... so to me it only makes sense to be outdoors and not sitting inside as much as we have been forced to do.

UV radiation is higher in the summer.

All deaths to this virus are tragic and sad, it's a shame they have to post this on the front page of a news paper because I'm not sure what their purpose is in doing so, having said that with my quick pig math on a sample size of one column, the average age of the deceased is 74.5 years old. This is very sad, I would be devastated if my mom of 84 died from this nasty virus but I would not want her name printed on there for whatever angle they are trying to play. These numbers and the average age, with exceptions, show what we should be doing, the elderly and vulnerable should be extremely careful but perhaps the rest of should continue on while being mindful of those at risk.

Correct, because when it is summer your hemisphere is tilted toward the sun.

Longer not higher...?

EDIT: Reverse that? lol

Actually both. The sun is higher in the sky in the summer. The closer to straight over head the higher the UV level. Clouds and the altitude also have a big effect.

At what angle should we tilt our heads towards the Sun with an open mouth, to allow as much UV radiation as possible to enter and protect our insides from the virus?

I’m sorry your mother was confined in her senior center, it sounds like she is probably a high risk individual and like most high risk individual she has to be more careful.

As for your assertions about UV radiation, they simply aren’t true. Do more research about the amount of sunlight and how direct that sunlight is in summer vs winter.

You seem to want to argue, I’m not really interested in arguing points that are well established and accepted.

Agreed and we are already seeing increases after a decrease and now we are in a holiday weekend where people are going to move around more. We can assume not everyone is going to listen to guidelines. I did hear Memorial Day travel is expected to be so low it's not worth recording this year, that number will be higher than a normal weekend.

The good news is up here in MN/WI most of the travels are families going to their cabin and hopefully not too much intermingling outside of family.