(Topic ID: 253582)

The Next American Pinball

By Charlemagne1987

2 years ago


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#1051 43 days ago
Quoted from MegaFeenix:

300 then to 500 is still a limited run. Not to mention we are still at the beginning now if in 2 years they release Ragnarok Edition that’s when I’m throwing the penalty flag.

Who knows if they are done increasing it yet. If these 200 additional sell today then why not up it to 1000? What does it matter if they are selling them quick. They already did it once so at this point they should get as much money as they can.

20
#1052 43 days ago

On the Plus side. They just bitch slapped the fools that only only bought to flip for profit so I find some positive there compared to recent LE title extortion.

#1053 43 days ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

On the Plus side. They just bitch slapped the fools that only only bought to flip for profit so I find some positive there compared to recent LE title extortion.

Very true.

#1054 43 days ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

On the Plus side. They just bitch slapped the fools that only only bought to flip for profit so I find some positive there compared to recent LE title extortion.

Unfortunately, It will still happen for anyone who gets theirs early and wants to flip.

#1055 43 days ago

Good for them, make some $$. I like AP a lot, I have a hot wheels and ordered LOV LE via Joe @ PinballStar.

Let’s hope they do well with this release so that they can achieve success along the likes of JJP

#1056 43 days ago
Quoted from Happy81724:

Unfortunately, It will still happen for anyone who gets theirs early and wants to flip.

True but a bit less incentive when you can but one at list price. I see this as a win for the consumer.

#1057 43 days ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

True but a bit less incentive when you can but one at list price. I see this as a win for the consumer.

Yep, I agree

#1058 43 days ago

There is very little "flip-worthy" in the Deluxe edition. The only things mentioned as exclusives are:
- powder-coated armour (which you could always do yourself)
- backglass (I suspect this will be a title with an alternative backglass available)
- topper (it ain't too special)

Most of the Deluxe extras are just pre-installed add-ons.

Oh yeah, are the sculpts exclusive? If I end up buying a machine I'll be looking to replace those....

#1059 43 days ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

On the Plus side. They just bitch slapped the fools that only only bought to flip for profit so I find some positive there compared to recent LE title extortion.

Irony

#1060 43 days ago
Quoted from Happy81724:

Who knows if they are done increasing it yet. If these 200 additional sell today then why not up it to 1000?

Why not indeed? Limited editions suck a lot of fun out of too many hobbies. Get F’ed LE worshippers and flippers!

#1062 43 days ago
Quoted from MegaFeenix:

Why not indeed? Limited editions suck a lot of fun out of too many hobbies. Get F’ed LE worshippers and flippers!

Yep, I was being serious about it with them already upping it. If it sells that quick then don’t have a set limit. Drive it up to demand levels. There maybe some fall out but it will probably be outweighed by additional sales

#1063 43 days ago
Quoted from dr_nybble:

There is very little "flip-worthy" in the Deluxe edition. The only things mentioned as exclusives are:
- powder-coated armour (which you could always do yourself)
- backglass (I suspect this will be a title with an alternative backglass available)
- topper (it ain't too special)
Most of the Deluxe extras are just pre-installed add-ons.
Oh yeah, are the sculpts exclusive? If I end up buying a machine I'll be looking to replace those....

If I'm reading right, some sculpts are exclusive to the DE, like Odin (but not the pile of skulls), along with the items you listed plus shaker, knocker, HD glass, and custom hand-painted shields on the boat. HD glass is a big one, personally. A $250-300 item purchased separately, and it makes a pretty noticeably difference when playing.

#1064 43 days ago
Quoted from VALIS666:

If I'm reading right, some sculpts are exclusive to the DE, like Odin (but not the pile of skulls), along with the items you listed plus shaker, knocker, HD glass, and custom hand-painted shields on the boat. HD glass is a big one, personally. A $250-300 item purchased separately, and it makes a pretty noticeably difference when playing.

Those items are included with the Deluxe, but they are not "exclusive" (HD glass, knocker, shaker) -- I'm more referring to whether we should be bothered by the increase from 300 to 500 Deluxe models. I personally don't think so because: art is the same; playfield is the same; things that are truly "exclusive" not going to add a ton of value to the game in the future.

I just revisited the artwork on another recent unlicensed game, BKSOR, to compare. Wow, what a difference....

#1065 43 days ago
Quoted from dr_nybble:

Those items are included with the Deluxe, but they are not "exclusive" -- I'm more referring to whether we should be bothered by the increase from 300 to 500 Deluxe models. I personally don't think so because: art is the same; playfield is the same; things that are truly "exclusive" not going to add a ton of value to the game in the future.

I'm not sure why you think that. These are many of the same things that are on Stern LEs (powder coating, HD glass, shaker, different/better backglass, different apron) and those seem to consistently hold their value relative to prem and pro editions of the same game. In reselling, it's items like that that tend to keep their value.

Personally I don't care about the 300 vs. 500 thing. This wasn't the best way they could handle it, but it's not a huge crime or anything either. If people bought one to flip because of the very limited 300 number, well, ha ha. All of us who bought one to play (as I just did an hour ago) probably don't care about 300 or 500.

#1066 43 days ago

In case you wanted to check out the game in person today (or in a few days).

If you are in the midwest/west coast, the following locations will have Legends of Valhalla Deluxe Edition available to play the week of October 25:

 TILT Pinball Bar, 113 E 26th St #110, Minneapolis, MN 55404
 Colorado Pinball Pub, 6209 S Santa Fe Dr, Littleton, CO 80120
 Ayce Gogi Van Nuys, 7128 Van Nuys Blvd, Van Nuys, CA 91405
 Ayce Gogi West Hills, 6705 Fallbrook Ave, West Hills, CA 91307
 Next Level Pinball Shop & Museum, 1458 NE 25th Ave, Hillsboro, OR 97124

Currently several east coast arcades/barcades have games playable onsite.
 CoinTaker, 1437 PA-61, Sunbury, PA 17801
 Enterrium, 2 Woodfield Mall Unit A, Schaumburg, IL 60173
 Pinball Gallery, 81 Lancaster Ave, Malvern, PA 19355
 Bang Back Pinball Lounge, 741 Saluda Ave, Columbia, SC 29205
 Pocketeer Billiards, 2444 Clinton St, Buffalo, NY 14224
 Jackbar, 143 Havemeyer St, Brooklyn, NY 11211

#1067 43 days ago
Quoted from VALIS666:

I'm not sure why you think that. These are many of the same things that are on Stern LEs (powder coating, HD glass, shaker, different/better backglass, different apron) and those seem to consistently hold their value relative to prem and pro editions of the same game. In reselling, it's items like that that tend to keep their value.
Personally I don't care about the 300 vs. 500 thing. This wasn't the best way they could handle it, but it's not a huge crime or anything either. If people bought one to flip because of the very limited 300 number, well, ha ha. All of us who bought one to play (as I just did an hour ago) probably don't care about 300 or 500.

I agree with you 100%. So what if they raised the number to 500. I am so happy for API to finally release their next pinball machine.

Also in the mail today...

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#1068 43 days ago

I got 3 copies of the magazine in the mail today. I'll pass on the extra copies to pin friends.

#1069 43 days ago
Quoted from NoQuarters:

I got 3 copies of the magazine in the mail today. I'll pass on the extra copies to pin friends.

I was just about to ask if anyone had an extra to sell. Will paypal you if interested.

#1070 43 days ago
Quoted from Docpinball:

Quick Question Did anyone get this in the mail yet? Let me know.
Cheers
David Fix
[quoted image][quoted image]

Got mine in the mail today!! Just in time to bring it to Expo!!
Looking forward to playing it there!!

Phoebe

#1071 43 days ago
Quoted from Scoot:

I agree with you 100%. So what if they raised the number to 500. I am so happy for API to finally release their next pinball machine.
Also in the mail today...[quoted image]

I received mine in the mail today as well, pretty darned cool!

15
#1072 42 days ago

Newest team member at American Pinball!!
Steve Bowden
E670C44A-48A7-459D-A500-A354509FAE23 (resized).jpeg

#1073 42 days ago

Yes! Congrats Steve!

#1074 41 days ago
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#1075 41 days ago

I watched the stream last night. Overall, I liked most of what I saw. The music, sounds, and callouts were all great. The game play seems really fun as well.

A few things I didn't like -

- The left ramp. You hit that thing fast and it curves so quickly that the ball damn near stops before gravity pulls it back down to the flipper. It needs to be a wider curve so the ball doesn't slow down so much. Every time someone hit that ramp with speed, I was just puzzled that they were okay with that design. It seemed so unsatisfying to hit it.

-The ship and ramp shot to it. The ramp shot seems very unsatisfying. It's so short and quick. Those side ramp shots are fun when they are like Tron and then wrap all the way around and come back to the flipper. Then it goes into this ship and physically locks a ball. I LOVE physical ball locks. But then there is this hazy clear dome over the ship covering this magic up. I have never seen a Viking ship with a clear dome over it. There is clearly an ugly mech in there that they didn't want to be seen, and didn't want to re-engineer it to hide the mech. Why not have the mech under the playfield and run the shaft or whatever is needed up through the top, so we can see the balls actually lock. What is the point of a physical ball lock when you can't physically see the balls locked?

-The upper left flipper. It only seems useful for the ship ramp and the stand ups to the far right. The inner orbit around the ship doesn't seem to be at the correct angle for this flipper to work with it. Most shots that hit the inner orbit would rattle around and not make it through.

-Thor's hammer. Seeing this in action was very disappointing. I would have assumed the ball would whip around, then an opto would see it on the magnet, then the hammer would come down with a great sound effect and light show. Not the case. The hammer would just come down and then the ball would reach the magnet. WTF? The hammer doesn't have the illusion of "striking" the ball at all. It seems so odd. When I'm hammering nail, I always get the nail in place, then I slam the hammer down into the nail. I don't slam the hammer down and then run the nail into the side of the hammer.

-The animations or lack thereof. Not really sure what to even say here. Honestly, I like the art style on the game. But there are almost zero animations on the display. They are just taking static images and zooming them in and out or shaking them. That's fine on a home brew game, but not on a production game in this day and age. Other manufacturers knock the animations out of the park. AP really needs to step up their game and hire someone who can handle this, if they want to compete with the big boys in pinball.

All in all, I think I'm out on this one. I was in with an order within the first 30 minutes of release. I was happy to pony up the money and support the company. AP customer service is incredible. I love to support the small guys. I love to support a home brew game that has come to life. But after AP pulled a bait and switch and then upped the numbers 67%, it left a sour taste in my mouth. Now after seeing the game in play, I don't see $8400 worth of game here. Trust me, I WANT to see $8400 worth of game here. I tried all night to justify in my mind that this game is worth $8400. It's just not though. Don't get me wrong, it looks incredible for a home brew game that has come to life. But it's still nowhere near what an $8400 game should be.

#1076 41 days ago
Quoted from NightTrain:

I watched the stream last night. Overall, I liked most of what I saw. The music, sounds, and callouts were all great. The game play seems really fun as well.
A few things I didn't like -
- The left ramp. You hit that thing fast and it curves so quickly that the ball damn near stops before gravity pulls it back down to the flipper. It needs to be a wider curve so the ball doesn't slow down so much. Every time someone hit that ramp with speed, I was just puzzled that they were okay with that design. It seemed so unsatisfying to hit it.
-The ship and ramp shot to it. The ramp shot seems very unsatisfying. It's so short and quick. Those side ramp shots are fun when they are like Tron and then wrap all the way around and come back to the flipper. Then it goes into this ship and physically locks a ball. I LOVE physical ball locks. But then there is this hazy clear dome over the ship covering this magic up. I have never seen a Viking ship with a clear dome over it. There is clearly an ugly mech in there that they didn't want to be seen, and didn't want to re-engineer it to hide the mech. Why not have the mech under the playfield and run the shaft or whatever is needed up through the top, so we can see the balls actually lock. What is the point of a physical ball lock when you can't physically see the balls locked?
-The upper left flipper. It only seems useful for the ship ramp and the stand ups to the far right. The inner orbit around the ship doesn't seem to be at the correct angle for this flipper to work with it. Most shots that hit the inner orbit would rattle around and not make it through.
-Thor's hammer. Seeing this in action was very disappointing. I would have assumed the ball would whip around, then an opto would see it on the magnet, then the hammer would come down with a great sound effect and light show. Not the case. The hammer would just come down and then the ball would reach the magnet. WTF? The hammer doesn't have the illusion of "striking" the ball at all. It seems so odd. When I'm hammering nail, I always get the nail in place, then I slam the hammer down into the nail. I don't slam the hammer down and then run the nail into the side of the hammer.
-The animations or lack thereof. Not really sure what to even say here. Honestly, I like the art style on the game. But there are almost zero animations on the display. They are just taking static images and zooming them in and out or shaking them. That's fine on a home brew game, but not on a production game in this day and age. Other manufacturers knock the animations out of the park. AP really needs to step up their game and hire someone who can handle this, if they want to compete with the big boys in pinball.
All in all, I think I'm out on this one. I was in with an order within the first 30 minutes of release. I was happy to pony up the money and support the company. AP customer service is incredible. I love to support the small guys. I love to support a home brew game that has come to life. But after AP pulled a bait and switch and then upped the numbers 67%, it left a sour taste in my mouth. Now after seeing the game in play, I don't see $8400 worth of game here. Trust me, I WANT to see $8400 worth of game here. I tried all night to justify in my mind that this game is worth $8400. It's just not though. Don't get me wrong, it looks incredible for a home brew game that has come to life. But it's still nowhere near what an $8400 game should be.

A few things I liked (10 words). A few things I disliked (10 paragraphs) lol. Not for everyone but does look like a really fun game and theme. Knowing API I suspect they will continue to add great additional content along the way.

#1077 41 days ago

Looking at the pictures in post #908 is it me or does it appear the ship is 3D printed? Anyone that has seen the machine in person confirm this? Apologies if this has been posted already.

#1078 41 days ago
Quoted from NightTrain:

-The animations or lack thereof. Not really sure what to even say here. Honestly, I like the art style on the game. But there are almost zero animations on the display. They are just taking static images and zooming them in and out or shaking them. That's fine on a home brew game, but not on a production game in this day and age. Other manufacturers knock the animations out of the park. AP really needs to step up their game and hire someone who can handle this, if they want to compete with the big boys in pinball.

I'm not picking on you because you're hardly the first to mention the lack of animations but as for other manufacturer's "knocking them out of the park" I will counter point with this and everyone loves this game:

My point is that a game can have pretty generic animations like this and still be plenty of fun to play AND cost over $8K.

#1079 41 days ago
Quoted from NightTrain:

You hit that thing fast and it curves so quickly that the ball damn near stops before gravity pulls it back down to the flipper. It needs to be a wider curve so the ball doesn't slow down so much. Every time someone hit that ramp with speed, I was just puzzled that they were okay with that design. It seemed so unsatisfying to hit it.

This^^ for sure. Seems like overall, the original prototypes played better. I'm on the fence on this one. Maybe the game just wasn't set-up perfectly, looked like it was leaning a bit left?

-1
#1080 41 days ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

A few things I liked (10 words). A few things I disliked (10 paragraphs) lol. Not for everyone but does look like a really fun game and theme. Knowing API I suspect they will continue to add great additional content along the way.

I know right! I wish there was more I liked.

To be fair, I pointed out 4 things I liked and then 5 things I didn't like. Next time, I will be sure to be more specific for you.

#1081 41 days ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

I'm not picking on you because you're hardly the first to mention the lack of animations but as for other manufacturer's "knocking them out of the park" I will counter point with this and everyone loves this game:
My point is that a game can have pretty generic animations like this and still be plenty of fun to play AND cost over $8K.

AIQ is one of the new games I haven't played. I have heard a lot of rumbling about the terrible animations though.

#1082 41 days ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

I'm not picking on you because you're hardly the first to mention the lack of animations but as for other manufacturer's "knocking them out of the park" I will counter point with this and everyone loves this game:
My point is that a game can have pretty generic animations like this and still be plenty of fun to play AND cost over $8K.

This is a good point. My AIQ is by far my favorite game but the animations are pretty static. I guess there is a balance or "ART" to using static images effectively.

#1083 40 days ago

So they've revealed LOV and that Bowden has joined the team, I wonder what "special announcement" David Fixx has held back for their session at expo (7:00 Central) tonight? LOV Classic pricing - probably, another new game, I doubt it. Might have a pricing surcharge on the first three games for new production too since he's hinted that is coming, can't really think of too much else it could be but here's to hoping they really surprise us!

#1084 40 days ago

I say another new game. Bring it!

#1085 40 days ago

I just locked in my order! Very excited. Awesome job Riot and I'm so glad to see that AP has a hit on their hands. This hobby needs the kind of quality craftsmanship and originality AP brings. Here's to bright days ahead for AP!

#1086 40 days ago

If the special announcement is Sherlock Holmes or Jack the Ripper I’m gonna shit!

#1087 40 days ago
Quoted from MegaFeenix:

If the special announcement is Sherlock Holmes or Jack the Ripper I’m gonna shit!

Those would both be great but I'd be even more excited if it's Sonic Spinball!

#1088 40 days ago
Quoted from parsonsaj:

I'd be even more excited if it's Sonic Spinball!

O.K. Yours is technically better because success seems to be driven by new games and licensing. I want American Pinball domination.

#1089 40 days ago

game looks like a real killer game with great art. no pops is a good choice here! really interested in a classic standard edition. hope its mid six thousand range!

#1090 40 days ago

I'd love if the announcement was just a preview of the next game, even if they tell us it'll be manufactured in 2022. I know that's not really AP's style but we can dream right?

20
#1091 40 days ago

If this isn’t the coolest this ever, I don’t know what is.

B3468CF8-6EDF-4369-93EA-13AD075381D7 (resized).png
#1092 40 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

If this isn’t the coolest this ever, I don’t know what is.
[quoted image]

Wow! That's pretty fecking awesome!

#1093 40 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

If this isn’t the coolest this ever, I don’t know what is.
[quoted image]

That is a big assumption that American Pinball can obtain any of the licenses to these contest entries. As an example, what if Mad Max wins and another pinball company has that license? What if the licence cannot be obtained for any other reason? Will the overall game get rethemed to something else? Or was it mentioned that it would have to be an unlicensed theme?

#1094 40 days ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

That is a big assumption that American Pinball can obtain any of the licenses to these contest entries. As an example, what if Mad Max wins and another pinball company has that license? What if the licence cannot be obtained for any other reason? Will the overall game get rethemed to something else? Or was it mentioned that it would have to be an unlicensed theme?

I'd assume they'll just re-theme it like Stern did with Keith's Archer if they can't get the license.

#1095 39 days ago
Quoted from FlippyD:

I'd assume they'll just re-theme it like Stern did with Keith's Archer if they can't get the license.

Yep, let's focus on what a cool idea this is for the pinball community and especially for all the talented Homebrew creators who finally have a realistic opportunity to see their games get turned into a full production machine with a company that knows manufacturing, has engineering support, etc. This should really build some goodwill for AP too.

#1096 39 days ago

Hell yeah!

#1097 39 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

If this isn’t the coolest this ever, I don’t know what is.
[quoted image]

Smart, and with Nordman back a good way for them to up it to two new releases per calendar year.

17
#1098 39 days ago

Met the team from American Pinball and attended the seminar. I even won a backglass - the team signed it for me! Everyone was very nice and they seemed genuinely happy! Very excited for the future of American Pinball !

C7D9FD1A-DA24-4BCA-B07C-FB3AB41BC4B3 (resized).jpeg
#1099 39 days ago

Just heard the home brew contest has to be a game that hasn’t been seen before yesterday. I hope they rethink that. Sonic spinball needs to be mass produced.

-1
#1100 39 days ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

Yep, let's focus on what a cool idea this is for the pinball community and especially for all the talented Homebrew creators who finally have a realistic opportunity to see their games get turned into a full production machine with a company that knows manufacturing, has engineering support, etc. This should really build some goodwill for AP too.

It’ll be great! </sarcasm> What’s normally a very supportive and co-operative community will turn cut-throat and competitive. People will be less inclined to help each other because now they’re “competition”.

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