TWD is so f'ing brutal, that after playing a few games, I can go to any of my other games and I almost always do well!

I look at TWD now as my practice machine haha!

Well I guess I just suck bad then...

I owned STTNG many years ago and really enjoyed the pin; but I felt the outlines were particularly unforgiving.
Currently, I find TWD can be quite punishing.

i'm sure you're not

BSD and Flash Gordon both are brutal if you miss shots.

GOT Premium is kicking my ass all day long lately...just brutal. I can get 6 houses completed, but it’s a struggle to make all of the required shots before timers run out on 3 balls and factory settings. I’ve been so close to Iron Throne wizard mode this last week, but always get a STDM or outlane drain right before completing the 7th house...have punched that cursed game a good number of times. Will keep trying until I defeat Iron Throne on factory settings.

Other games that are incredibly hard or impossible for me are WOZ, JJP POTC and Alice Cooper. BSD and Shadow, I’ve completed all objectives and blown the game up over the years due to learning the shots/angles, but both of those games are punishers. I had LOTR and TSPP back in the day and those are nearly impossible to beat as well. AC/DC is no walk in the park either, but Encore feels achievable. Houdini is also a ball buster.

The easy games don’t last long in my collection, so I like the hard titles and the challenge that comes with them. Some are definitely a love/hate relationship, though!

while i have now a Houdini home, cant agree with this, Houdini is a friendly game, with few hard shots i agree, but none are punitive

Happy drunky new year! Just played it.
Its Rick and Morty.
I love it, but i haven't broke 20 mill in 4 months.

Message from the drunken Freeeek Kingdom.

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I think of the pins that I've played I would have to say F-14 Tomcat

So many ways to drain on this one. The middle is as bad if not worse than Black Knight Sword of Rage (Pro). Every shot has to be calculated. Shoot L and you have to deal with General Yagov and the evil kick back pointed straight back at you. There is little to no leniency in this game just simply brutal punishing games but you keep going back because General Yagov pissed you off. Mind you that this game was built in 1987 during the Cold War.

I've played Iron Man and I guess I'm not seeing how its all that difficult especially compared to F-14. Played in a recent tourney and my opponent obviously hadn't touched F-14 before and she is a very decent player. The F-14 flat out owned her. I was so glad I had gotten some play time on it before hand. I think each of her balls were averaged around like 15-20 secs.

Reading these posts though I REALLY want to play Flash Gordon soon I may have to make the 1.5 hr drive to go play it now.

My vote definitely goes to F-14 its one of those game like Black Knight where you feel like its truly you vs. Gen Yagov or The Black Knight. Its definitely not my favorite but I'd say that F-14 hands down fits the bill. I have to completely disagree with the consensus on Iron man. I had read the reviews and I was really surprised when I played it it's not that difficult definitely not F-14 Tomcat difficult.

I find JP2 a great but challenging game - if I'm in the zone it's combos and flow is awesome, but brick a shot and you will pay! The difficulty is trying to stay alive long enough to make it all the way through the paddocks to the visitor centre, plus the mini-wizard modes and do Escape Nublar (and maybe even WDRTE)

I love my Shadow as well, but avoid the ramps which are brutal if you don't make the shot.

I've recently started playing some old SS games and got quickly reminded how fast to can lose your ball when there's no ball save

Rick and Morty is super tough as is SW.

Any pin with 2 inch flippers. Hard to save that ball from going down the middle.

I find TMNT to be pretty brutal, especially for the inexperienced. I had my buddy over who rarely plays, I put the game on five ball, he didn’t even score 2mil.

While I'm hardly the best of players I have a tough time with ACNC.

Basically no decent scoring outside of mode progression, tight punishing shots, have to work hard for anything beyond a 2 ball multiball.

One of the more brutal games I've played.

ghostbuster...walking dead...

Both of those because of geometry faults imo

1990’s or newer games with both relatively short ball times and difficult objectives:

BSD
Ironman
Fish Tales
Ghostbusters Prem/LE

A couple games with long ball times, but have super deep objectives that are really difficult to achieve:

LOTR
Stern Jurassic Park

Wizard mode (Do or die MB ) on Iron Man has got to be in the top 3 hardest to achieve. Drone objectives are a MF lol

I consider the Do or Die Hurryup straight into Jericho to be the wizard mode of Iron Man. Do or Die Multiball may as well not exist. I consider Valinor to be easier, and I’ve never been close to Valinor. I can do most of the things for Valinor, but not all in the same game. Nobody gets Drones flashing with the glass on.

What is/are the geometry faults on Ghostbusters? I have a GB Premium and I am not seeing it. It is just a tough pin to play---and that is why I like it.

Agreed.

The only "beef" I would have is the drop targets are so close to the flippers that they will often not drop when hit with a direct shot and send the ball right back in your face. You have to hit them with an "offside" shot on an edge to get a good drop which I'm fine with.

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I believe you have the Pro model. On the Premium there that right hand ramp with its tight U-turn and I saw a YT video where it was said the geometry was off on the that ramp. That right ramp is a tough, tight shot and it is so satisfying when you make it. Also, GB and that right ramp respond quite well with a fresh Novus and wax job.

Agree on the 2 drop targets. They keep you on your toes.

The right ramp is a difficult tight shot on the Pro as well.

I shouldn’t have used the word “geometry”.
When I bought my GB NIB I couldn’t keep the ball in play for more than a minute because of Scoleris/left outlane/middle flipper gap/etc. The final code had to be changed so much from the initial code that even when I play one now all I see on the screen is “ball saved”.

I REALLY enjoy tough games, but when most of the drains are cheap and not my fault, I consider it the games fault.

Ha ha ha.

Wheel

Of

Fortune!

Never seen a modern pinball game make “skilled” players lose their shit like this design does.

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South Park is a different kind of hard game because of code, not shots. It's such a grind to just start each characters/mode and if you drain the shots aren't carried forward to the next ball.

I've had it for a couple weeks and think I've gotten 2 replays? I can see how my buddy I got it from said it wasn't earning anything on location. If replay isn't achievable to the casual player, they won't pump dollars into it.

South Park is a classic horrible game that usually does awesome on location.

I do not like SP. It is not the callouts. I just don’t like the game play.

Yeah it's horrible. I wish i didn't pick it. It's such a grind that it's not fun. Hit something 4x to start a mode then hit it 4 more times to finish mode. Yawn. Code reminds me Austin Powers which I also dislike.

Well yeah everyone dislikes it, it's garbage.

I dare say that we are probably in the minority with regards to South Park

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Flash Gordon is brutally difficult. Those center pops are deadly, and to score points you have to go for the lower playfield drops to lite the spinners, and going for the drops creates a lot of lateral movement.

Star Wars is a brutal game.. shots are terrible
Zeppelin has the hardest shot in pinball with that right flipper..
Hardest is GNR JJP such a deep game.

Hard. How do you possibly define that? Ball time or rule set IMHO are two very different things reliant upon one another.
I consider myself an "ok" player at best. I've had 2 hour games and NOT beat the wizard mode. Does that mean the game is easy because of the time I played or is it hard because I couldn't beat it?

And if a machine is that brutal on short ball times does the depth of the code really matter?

That's why older games are always the correct answer. A modern Stern can never be the hardest game ever unless you change a bunch of settings.