Yeah it was a shitty camera. A Point and shoot with "video" capability. Long before really good smart phones

I'm still doing my research, it's all speculation at this point, but the motor in the STi has been around for what...8 model years now? So it's probably time for a new one. The WRX motor is direct injection, and would get better mileage than what's in the STi right now.

And what's with all the ringland issues I'm reading about?

Still...there is a lot about the STi that really appeals to me.

Here is the wheel setup. Tons of grip.

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1998 I think? Yeah it's super old...the 15-16WRX being so close to it you would think it has to change. So it can't even have the newer twin scrolling turbo in it...super outdated. Again, that's why it didn't pain me that much to get the WRX. I would for sure wait till more news on the 2017.

Most ring land stuff I always assume is over tuning. EDIT: I don't have much info on that though...seems to be a 2010+ problem...strange

It seems like it is, thank goodness. Funny to see guys do these stage 2 or 3 tunes under warranty and then try to get Subaru to replace their motor when it pops.

Seems like there are plenty of people who think the WRX is the better value and has the better (but less powerful) motor.

Hey, the new FA has the oil filter right on the top...that's worth something

Sweet...was at our local cruise in this past weekend and snapped this...the sy is mine.

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I'll be very interested in the actual mpg of these cars. From the display it didn't seem like they were getting anything near the claims, but those were dealership cars so I'm sure people were just full boost the whole time but you never know. Can't be any worse than what I get now so I guess it's fine.

The Shelby GT350 and it's motor look very promising.

526HP, 429 lb ft toque, 8250 redline!

THe bearing tolerances on that thing are going to be TIGHT. I'm guessing a 13 compression ratio or better. That isn't going to leave much room for the mod crowd given that redline.

12, so close!

can 13 motors run on today's pump gas? I thought 11 with aluminum heads was very hard to do with what is currently out there. Clue me in on this...

my 4'6" son doesn't even fit in the back seat of a mustang... at least not behind me! (i'm 6'5").

to reiterate what others and i have said previously, i don't think the challenger is even in the same class as a camaro or mustang. full grown adults can actually sit in the front and the back of the challenger.

E46 m3 runs 14 on pump gas but the tolences are so tight it's no wonder those engines grenaded. Even a small bearing issue caused an uncontrolled failure.

Higher compression ratios usually mean higher top end and lower torque. Not what you usually expect out of a "muscle" car. It's usually displacement wins all. I'm this case they are going the German approach. Smaller force fed block with long swing top end.

I figured as much. Reduces the practicality quite a bit. Hellcat's back seats are pretty good, but it's two doors so getting in and out of the backseat is a pain. But I couldn't buy a Charger Hellcat over the Challenger.

Of course there will be big ADM on these! Why? Because it's another car that I am interested in buying!

The only car that I am interested in that I can get without ADM is the STi, and that's because the motor has been around and people are waiting for them to put the FA in it.

The GT350 sounds bad ass! Just incredible the difference that flat plane crank makes.

Yeah, the torque is 429 ft lbs which is obviously good, but doesn't match what you'd get with more cubic inches. Will be interesting to see what the specs will be in terms of 0-60 and 1/4 mile times.

They are going smaller cubic inches in order to have a reasonable MPG number.

want... and just as my 5.0 mustang is about finished being paid off...

Yea, but your still driving around in a KIA lol. I'll take a so so interior backed by a healthy v8 over a nice interior powered with a few mice.

Who needs back seats? That's where the engine is supposed to go.

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I should add that that is my wife's new car, her reward for 20 years of letting me buy whatever I wanted. Except the taxidermy, she vetoed that.

My wife surprised me with a hellcat this weekend.

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I'm just curious why?

I actually prefer the charger hellcat. It's more practical (that sounds funny to say) for my purposes, and it's a bit more of a sleeper. Maybe I'm missing some options that are available to the Challenger that aren't to the Charger though (like M/T)?

to the best of my knowledge, the only option that you can get on the challenger and not the charger is the manual transmission.

I wish they still made the magnum and offered that in an SRT variant. I can't bring myself to buy a charger or challenger and lose the utility of the hatch on my wagon. If they made a hellcat magnum, i'd probably sell my charger to accommodate that purchase. haha!

Mmmmmm ... 707hp pinhauler .....

Smart husband.

Smart wife.

If that did exist, and could accommodate a pin, I'd already be scheming.

From my own perspective, I don't like the looks of the Charger.

The real reasons I bought the Challenger is because I love the looks and my kids can fit in the back seat.

tell the truth, you are on the fence about keeping it...

Is this the beginning or the end of a horsepower war?

I guess most everything is going forced induction as most new 911's will now be turbo as well as most new Ferrari and BMWs etc..

I'm old enough to remember when the Buick GNX was a powerful car.

It's solely based on my subjective preference, which is that the Challenger is the much better looking car. I'd rather have four doors, but I would always worry that I made too much of a compromise in looks to get those 4 doors in terms of overall appearance. The Challenger is the best job any company has done in terms of the retro look.

I was talking to a friend about this just two days ago. This is really sad that all these high end sports cars are going forced induction. Smaller motors with turbo's to make the power to be more efficient, but they simply aren't the same in terms of torque and drivability.

The 911 is going to 3.0L smallest in decades, however I'm not all about power, cars such as GTI, WRX or Miata are quick enough for me.

If priced similar I'd rather have a base level 911 over a C7 Corvette.

Subaru has had Ring Land Issues for quite some time on the Turbos. My 2005 Legacy GT turbo had half of its motor rebuilt due to Failed ring lands with 30k miles on it under Warranty. But now its has 163k on it and still going.

JJ

It still is a powerful car. That and the Turbo T/A still hold their own.

For me, it's all about handling (assuming there's "enough" horsepower). The Cayman handles like a go-kart, which makes it a lot of fun in the turns. The Nissan Leaf could probably overtake it in a 1/4 mile, though

(EDIT: I was wrong - Leaf's quarter mile is 3 seconds slower, 17 vs 14 seconds)

If you want something that handles like a go-kart, just buy a go-kart. Nothing else comes closer to the real open wheel racing experience. You will *never* get the adrenaline flowing in a Cayman like you would in a shifter kart!

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Why talk about GTI, WRX or Miata when the point you raised to begin with was cars like Porsche, BMW, and Ferrari going to smaller forced induction motors?

GTI, WRX, and Miata have always had small motors and aren't relevant to the new direction that those other car manufacturers are heading.

The whole rush to FI is for fuel efficency/emission standards.

Fact! I have a shifter and 2 rotax karts.

Man that looks like fun!

Yes, I know.

And it sucks.

Trust me, it is an absolute blast! It is *serious* racing. You need to be in good shape physically, or you will not be on the track very long.

It's by far the best bang for the buck racing that anyone can do. Way less expensive than racing any type of car. I really miss it.

Cmon, man. there has never been a point in automotive history where so much horsepower has been for sale. Maybe you'd prefer to go back to the good old days when elite supercars like the Lamborghini Countach and Ferrari Testarossa made 350 horsepower?

Looks like a blast.

I think you missed my point.

I agree with what you are saying. I am the one who just posted that we are currently living in the golden age of horsepower. Things like the Hellcat and Z06 aren't exactly efficient in terms of MPG. It's the fact that cars like the BMW M3 are going to forced induction instead of relying on torque from cubic inches. The cars don't drive the same. Turbos have come a long way, but all things considered, I'd much prefer going naturally aspirated (for the same horsepower).

Turbo Lag + A/C Lag

I'm the exact opposite...having had my fill of big block horsepower I much prefer the whine of a supercharger or the horse sneeze of a waste gate. Guess I'm weird that way