(Topic ID: 154601)

The Genesis Project

By songofsixpence

8 years ago


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There are 88 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.
#1 8 years ago

I bought this Genesis a few months ago. At the time, I had several Williams projects. Those are pretty much completed.

It's time for me to buck up. Bite the bullet. Take the plunge. Jump in to the world of System 80

I committed to buying this game from a few, vague photos, so I really don't know what I am getting into. I've tinkered with a couple system 1's, but that's about it. Enough to know that my experience with Williams/Bally/Stern isn't going to be much help. This game is pretty dirty. The cabinet looks ok, if faded. The playfield that I can see looks all right. Oh, and it has a Burglar Alarm!
20160308_173616_(resized).jpg20160308_173616_(resized).jpg
This has got to be the heaviest lock bar I've ever seen! I'm frightened to think where this was routed that it needed this kind of armor.
20160308_174244_(resized).jpg20160308_174244_(resized).jpg

#2 8 years ago

Open that baby up and let us see inside!

#3 8 years ago

Genesis is the bomb, get it running.

#4 8 years ago

And Here's the Big Reveal.... DAAAAAAAN DAAAN DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!
20160308_175119_(resized).jpg20160308_175119_(resized).jpg
It actually looks pretty nice
Cautiously, I opened the front door - Careful not to set off the Burglar Alarm!
20160308_180251_(resized).jpg20160308_180251_(resized).jpg
Hmmm, no burglar alarm.... I guess it's already been removed!
I gotta say, the playfield is pretty nice
20160308_182949_(resized).jpg20160308_182949_(resized).jpg

#6 8 years ago
#7 8 years ago

Lookup member freeplay40 for some new ramps.

#8 8 years ago

I'll be watching this. I have been working on a Genesis I picked a while back. Its a fun game once you get all the bugs worked out.
My slingshot plastics are broken also. It seems nearly everyone has broken slingshot plastics. We all need to petition pinball resource to have them re made.

#9 8 years ago
Quoted from crlush:

Lookup member freeplay40 for some new ramps.

And Cliffy for ramp protectors.

Pinbits sells the the smoked window on the playfield if you need a replacement.

There is also an alternate translite someone named pugsotoys was selling on ebay a while back. I'm not sure if they made more or not.

#10 8 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

And Cliffy for ramp protectors.
Pinbits sells the the smoked window on the playfield if you need a replacement.
There is also an alternate translite someone named pugsotoys was selling on ebay a while back. I'm not sure if they made more or not.

Way ahead of you guys. I have purchased Freeplay40's new ramps (in clear), and Cliffy's protectors. I'll be posting about my thoughts on alternate translite

#11 8 years ago

More unveiling...
20160308_175212_(resized).jpg20160308_175212_(resized).jpg
The fluorescent tube is out. Probably the ballast. The rest of the boards look good.
20160308_180012_(resized).jpg20160308_180012_(resized).jpg
Im sure everyone reading this knows that smell of a decades-closed pinball. Just imaging that as you look at this pic.
20160308_205156_(resized).jpg20160308_205156_(resized).jpg
...a dusty, manilla envelope...
20160308_205212_(resized).jpg20160308_205212_(resized).jpg
Woo Hoo! a Manual!
20160308_205719_(resized).jpg20160308_205719_(resized).jpg

#12 8 years ago

Every time I look at that translite it reminds of a porno my guys used to watch in Iraq.

#13 8 years ago
Quoted from SealClubber:

Every time I look at that translite it reminds of a porno my guys used to watch in Iraq.

lol. One of the top reasons I am looking at alternates.

#15 8 years ago

Gottleib.

This game was going to be a litmus test for me. I have only been into pinball repair for a relatively few years. And only more recently in Solid State. (Since then I've pretty much given up on EMs). I've worked on early Bally and Stern (same thing, really). Williams system 6 through 11. On all these, there is copious amounts of information available online. Clay's guides. IPDB. Pinside. Every problem I've ever come across in a Williams SS machine, someone else before me has already had that problem, figured it out, and posted the solution online.

Gottlieb Solid State. Not so much.

My personal experience with Gottlieb Solid State was trying to fix a Dragon for a customer. It has a squirrely problem that I spent quite a long time trying to figure out. After many hours of research and repairing, I had finally diagnosed it had a bad spider chip. Game Over. Ni-Wumpf!
NI!_(resized).jpgNI!_(resized).jpg

For me, that was a Fail. The customer didn't want to spend the money on a new board. And I put in a lot of time an effort that I didn't get paid. Lesson learned. It really didn't do much for my confidence, though.

I heard that Clay had written up a nifty guide dedicated to this era of Gottlieb. No longer available on his site. Did they encroach on Gottlieb's intellectual property, or was there some other reason? Not sure. How about the IPDB? No Gottlieb manuals there. Sure, there is Pinside, and some other people I can ask, but I like to try to research before asking around.

So, I've taken care of all my non-Gottlieb projects before tackling this. At the same time, my Gottliebs are starting to pile up. I have a Black Hole that I really want up and running, and a The Games on the way. I gotta learn this stuff! I can't call myself a pinball repair guy until I do. And yet, when I look under the hood on this Genesis, I think: Yikes!

Anyway, I decide I'm going to throw caution to the wind, and turn it on. I figure I'll plug it in, then flip the switch. If it makes any kind of strange sounds / smells, or otherwise seems about to burst into flames, I can quickly shut it off. So, I plug it in. It makes a few clicking sounds. I hadn't turned it on yet, so I didn't think much of it. I stand up and walk around the power switch, and see some of the feature lights blinking on the playfield. Now I realize it was on when I plugged it in. Crap, I didn't mean to do that. Luckily, it seems to be in attract mode without any issues.
20160309_175308_(resized).jpg20160309_175308_(resized).jpg
The funny thing is on the entire playfield, there are 4 working lights. One GI bulb under the right sling, and 3 feature lights. The rest are out. Either every other bulb is burned out, or there is some other common issue.

#16 8 years ago

Get rid of the battery.
Lower cabinet ground mod needs to be done if its not already.
You need to clean the pcb edge connectors. I just used a scotch brite and gently buff and clean with rubbing alcohol. A rubber pencil eraser might work too. Don't go crazy just clean the edge connectors on the board same sort of thing as your NES carts.
I had to "re-pin" all the connectors in the back box to get things working properly. Until you do that you may still have intermittent issues.
I ended up going with a fred swemmer MPU, ni wumph driver board and ribbon cable interconnect. I'll get around to the original boards someday.

#17 8 years ago

Nice.
Most of the time, simply cleaning the lamp sockets and rubbing the bulb nipple will get a lamp working again. Gottlieb lamp sockets were pretty good.

There is a guide that we've been compiling.
Find it here:
http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Gottlieb_System_80

First order of business is to get that OEM battery off the MPU board.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://ChrisHiblerPinball.com/contact/
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

#18 8 years ago

If you need help/repair with the boards, drop me a line.
I do a lot of Gottlieb System 80/3 board work.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://ChrisHiblerPinball.com/contact/
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

#20 8 years ago
Quoted from 20eyes:

Get rid of the battery.
Lower cabinet ground mod needs to be done if its not already.
You need to clean the pcb edge connectors. I just used a scotch brite and gently buff and clean with rubbing alcohol. A rubber pencil eraser might work too. Don't go crazy just clean the edge connectors on the board same sort of thing as your NES carts.
I had to "re-pin" all the connectors in the back box to get things working properly. Until you do that you may still have intermittent issues.
I ended up going with a fred swemmer MPU, ni wumph driver board and ribbon cable interconnect. I'll get around to the original boards someday.

I use a rectangular pink rubber eraser. I prefer that since it's non-abrasive.

#21 8 years ago
Quoted from songofsixpence:

Gottleib.
This game was going to be a litmus test for me. I have only been into pinball repair for a relatively few years. And only more recently in Solid State. (Since then I've pretty much given up on EMs). I've worked on early Bally and Stern (same thing, really). Williams system 6 through 11. On all these, there is copious amounts of information available online. Clay's guides. IPDB. Pinside. Every problem I've ever come across in a Williams SS machine, someone else before me has already had that problem, figured it out, and posted the solution online.
Gottlieb Solid State. Not so much.
My personal experience with Gottlieb Solid State was trying to fix a Dragon for a customer. It has a squirrely problem that I spent quite a long time trying to figure out. After many hours of research and repairing, I had finally diagnosed it had a bad spider chip. Game Over. Ni-Wumpf!
NI!_(resized).jpg
For me, that was a Fail. The customer didn't want to spend the money on a new board. And I put in a lot of time an effort that I didn't get paid. Lesson learned. It really didn't do much for my confidence, though.
I heard that Clay had written up a nifty guide dedicated to this era of Gottlieb. No longer available on his site. Did they encroach on Gottlieb's intellectual property, or was there some other reason? Not sure. How about the IPDB? No Gottlieb manuals there. Sure, there is Pinside, and some other people I can ask, but I like to try to research before asking around.
So, I've taken care of all my non-Gottlieb projects before tackling this. At the same time, my Gottliebs are starting to pile up. I have a Black Hole that I really want up and running, and a The Games on the way. I gotta learn this stuff! I can't call myself a pinball repair guy until I do. And yet, when I look under the hood on this Genesis, I think: Yikes!
Anyway, I decide I'm going to throw caution to the wind, and turn it on. I figure I'll plug it in, then flip the switch. If it makes any kind of strange sounds / smells, or otherwise seems about to burst into flames, I can quickly shut it off. So, I plug it in. It makes a few clicking sounds. I hadn't turned it on yet, so I didn't think much of it. I stand up and walk around the power switch, and see some of the feature lights blinking on the playfield. Now I realize it was on when I plugged it in. Crap, I didn't mean to do that. Luckily, it seems to be in attract mode without any issues.
20160309_175308_(resized).jpg
The funny thing is on the entire playfield, there are 4 working lights. One GI bulb under the right sling, and 3 feature lights. The rest are out. Either every other bulb is burned out, or there is some other common issue.

(Off-topic: The pascal board is another option for system 1 machines.)

I wrote up this guide for testing machines in an unknown state:
http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Post-Purchase_Checklist

Basically--
1) Vacuum & collect loose pieces & labels
2) Inspect for loose parts or solder drippings that might cause a short
3) Inspect boards for damaged components
4) Disconnect playfield and all boards & test the electrical system
5) Connect boards one at a time to test each one sequentially. Power supply, aux power supply, mpu, displays, driver, sound
6) Connect playfield and go through diagnostic mode tests.

Having the game manual and system 80 service manual also helps.

If you've worked on other early solid state systems like you say, the general concepts are pretty much the same, so it shouldn't take you long to familiarize yourself with this system.

#22 8 years ago
Quoted from 20eyes:

Get rid of the battery.

Done!
20160313_214014_(resized).jpg20160313_214014_(resized).jpg

Quoted from 20eyes:

Lower cabinet ground mod needs to be done if its not already.

Was done already.

Quoted from 20eyes:

You need to clean the pcb edge connectors.

They're actually pretty clean.
The connectors are displacement type, so I don't see how to repin without replacing.

#23 8 years ago
Quoted from ChrisHibler:

Nice.
Most of the time, simply cleaning the lamp sockets and rubbing the bulb nipple will get a lamp working again. Gottlieb lamp sockets were pretty good.

I've been futzing with some of the bulbs, and they have been coming on.

Quoted from ChrisHibler:

There is a guide that we've been compiling.
Find it here:
http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Gottlieb_System_80
First order of business is to get that OEM battery off the MPU board.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://ChrisHiblerPinball.com/contact/
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

Thank you for this!

#24 8 years ago

Not to get too distracted, but I picked this up today

20160313_214043_(resized).jpg20160313_214043_(resized).jpg

#25 8 years ago

Genesis needs some parts.

- Pop bumper skirts. Will put mylar under them
- Titan Competition Rings. I'm thinking purple
- LEDs.

I have an idea for the alternate translite. Will post later.

So, I guess I can get a bit distracted with my latest purchase. I picked up this and a Stern Stars.

20160314_214117_(resized).jpg20160314_214117_(resized).jpg

Very clean game. Electronics look good. Backglass looks good. Plastics look good. Cabinet is OK. Playfield looks pretty fair. Maybe touched up with a sharpie. Looks like the original battery, which seems to be keeping the high score. Right flipper coil is shot. Won't take much to get it going

#26 8 years ago

Nice looking "The Games" game.
I'd encourage you to get the OEM battery off the MPU ASAP.
Even if it's still holding memory, there is a good chance that corrosion has begun under the battery.
Pick a method: http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Gottlieb_System_80#Relocating_the_battery_from_the_MPU_board
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://ChrisHiblerPinball.com/contact/
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

#27 8 years ago

I also just picked up a Genesis (between us we got the last of Freeplay40s ramps for now ).

I had all purple rings in my Titan basket but after careful thinking and review, opted for red almost all around. I'll possibly put clears on the slings, purple on the flippers (or red) and red all around. Should hopefully have mine fully shopped and reassembled as soon as everything gets here, hopefully by end of weekend.

#28 8 years ago

Anyone know who the people on the Genesis translate are? I cant get over the fact that i somehow recognize the dwarf and the old guy from somewhere, some sort of B-movie actor? Hollywood star?

#29 8 years ago

I always thought the vertically challenged gentleman looked familiar. He had to have been in some cheesy 70 and 80s films.

#31 8 years ago
Quoted from shimoda:

I also just picked up a Genesis (between us we got the last of Freeplay40s ramps for now).
I had all purple rings in my Titan basket but after careful thinking and review, opted for red almost all around.

When Freeplay40 was started making these ramps, my Genesis was still wrapped up in storage. I had never seen the condition of the ramps, but I didn't want to miss them, and need them later. Of course, I got Cliffys too.

I opted for the clear ramps. I liked that they show off the details underneath, but it does subtract some of the purple coloring. Also the pop bumper skirts are pretty chewed up. I was considering replacing these with purple ones. Not sure how they would look with the rest of the pop housing in white.

#32 8 years ago
Quoted from songofsixpence:

I was considering replacing these with purple ones. Not sure how they would look with the rest of the pop housing in white.

I'll let you know when I get them in this weekend hopefully

#33 8 years ago
Quoted from Luzur:

Anyone know who the people on the Genesis translate are? I cant get over the fact that i somehow recognize the dwarf and the old guy from somewhere, some sort of B-movie actor? Hollywood star?

Quoted from HFK:

I always thought the vertically challenged gentleman looked familiar. He had to have been in some cheesy 70 and 80s films.

Quoted from ForceFlow:

Was he in time bandits?

Lets talk about the translite. This one is from Marcos. Used without permission.
translite_(resized).jpgtranslite_(resized).jpg
And to a lesser extent, the cover of the manual. A different picture from the same photo shoot.
manual_cover_(resized).jpgmanual_cover_(resized).jpg

The Little Person. The Dwarf...? (Is that Politically Correct? Sorry, if it's not). Everyone seems to recognize him from somewhere. A B-movie actor? A 1970s porno? I googled pictures from Time Bandits, and I don't think he was in that one. Are we just remembering him from the Genesis backglass?

The Girl I don't recognize at all. Was she an aspiring model, or just a relative of someone associated with the photo shoot? She looks a bit different in the unretouched manual cover, where she looks much less like the Bride of Frankenstein. At the shoot, was she provided that outfit, or did she arrive wearing it? And just how in the heck do the Batman earrings fit in?

The Mad Scientist - I feel certain that this was the beginning and end of his modelling career. I have convinced myself that man is a dentist, who was asked to wear his smock, and bring some dental tools to be used as props. The one that blows air on your teeth is the one used in the final cut. As for the maniacal, mad-scientist-brings-his-creation-to-life, wide-eyed smile? He's doing his best, but really comes off as some kindly old grandpa with moussed-up hair, on his way to teach about oral hygiene.

#34 8 years ago

Here's one to show what it will look like

2016-03-17_13.26.50_(resized).jpg2016-03-17_13.26.50_(resized).jpg

I've also got new clear mylar protectors from pinbits so I'll get the game waxed up really well before putting down that mylar. Should be able to keep the area around the pops clean from now on and looks like art will be lots easier to see. I maybe should have ordered the lit pop caps from pinball life but I'll see. That may come when I order el wire for the ramps.

#35 8 years ago

I put the Gottlieb "G" pop caps on mine. I wanted mine to still have a Gottleib factory sorta look to it. Most anything looks better than the original ones though.

I watched an interview with John Trudeau where he basically said a lot of the people in the flyers and translites were employees or friends. I love how cheesy and corny looking this translite is, however I do not think I can bring myself to spend $100 for a new one. No way I would ever replace it with an alternate.

#36 8 years ago

I like that clear purple - but I'm assembling a Marco order, and they're not available there.
I was thinking of the purple skirt, with a white with violet rings body
purplepop_(resized).jpgpurplepop_(resized).jpg purpleSkirt_(resized).jpgpurpleSkirt_(resized).jpg

#37 8 years ago
Quoted from 20eyes:

I put the Gottlieb "G" pop caps on mine. I wanted mine to still have a Gottleib factory sorta look to it. Most anything looks better than the original ones though.
I watched an interview with John Trudeau where he basically said a lot of the people in the flyers and translites were employees or friends. I love how cheesy and corny looking this translite is, however I do not think I can bring myself to spend $100 for a new one. No way I would ever replace it with an alternate.

Which color? Wish I'd thought about that cause I would be happy with that . I may have to order some of those. Wish they made purple but blue or red might have to do.

#38 8 years ago

I went with clear caps with white bodys and skirts. I believe you have to use the Gottlieb pop bumper bodies with those caps but I'm not 100% on that.

#39 8 years ago

Changed my mind on this. I'm switching to red skirts with the purple caps, they match the rings I'm using and really bring out the bits of red in the playfield. Still deciding on how I want to light these. 2016-03-18_16.36.50_(resized).jpg2016-03-18_16.36.50_(resized).jpg2016-03-17_22.15.39_(resized).jpg2016-03-17_22.15.39_(resized).jpg2016-03-17_23.01.15_(resized).jpg2016-03-17_23.01.15_(resized).jpg2016-03-17_22.15.36_(resized).jpg2016-03-17_22.15.36_(resized).jpg
2016-03-17_21.14.50-2_(resized).jpg2016-03-17_21.14.50-2_(resized).jpg

#40 8 years ago

I gotta say, I like what you are laying down. Had I seen this I might have considered the red rings.

#41 8 years ago

So... the translite
20160318_182739_(resized).jpg20160318_182739_(resized).jpg
What is the Theme of Genesis? Mostly I hear it's based on the 1927 film Metropolis. Much of the playfield art, and the under-playfield reveal of the robot really line up with the Metropolis theme. But at some point, Genesis kind of steers away from Metropolis, and moves towards a stereotypical Mad-Scientist-Builds-a-Beautiful-Human/Robot/Monster, vein. The theme is completely off the rails by the time we come up to the translite, where the Mad Scientist has turned into the Mad Dentist with his beautiful creation and his Dwarf/Igor/Sidekick.

I've seen alternate translites, and I do like most of them. In some, the backglass has the name "Metropolis"
metropolis_translite_(resized).JPGmetropolis_translite_(resized).JPG
It's really all that has to be done to complete a re-theme of this game.

#42 8 years ago

There is a complete set of cab decals and translite that change the art to Metropolis. It looks pretty awesome.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://ChrisHiblerPinball.com/contact
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info

#43 8 years ago

The alt translite I like the most is on the eBay link that ForceFlow posted above. It really ties in the Metropolis theme

genesisalttranslite_(resized).jpggenesisalttranslite_(resized).jpg
The criticisms I have, is that it's a bit monochromatic, and the scenes are a bit repetitive. Rotwang in the lower left, is supposed to be looking up at the robot, but the perspective is wrong, and he is looking off behind her. I do like it otherwise, but I don't $100 like it.

I have the poster this translite is based on:
20160318_182806_(resized).jpg20160318_182806_(resized).jpg

I wanted the Maria Robot, but I really wanted more colors. I also wanted to incorporate the pentagram, but I didn't want to over-Metropolize the backglass. My game is still Genesis, but with a more consistent theme, and less of an identity crisis. I'm pleased with the way it turned out.

New_Genesis_Translite4_(resized).jpgNew_Genesis_Translite4_(resized).jpg
20160318_193902_(resized).jpg20160318_193902_(resized).jpg

Looks a lot better in person!

#44 8 years ago

It looks ok, but abit....empty?

#45 8 years ago
Quoted from songofsixpence:

The criticisms I have, is that it's a bit monochromatic, and the scenes are a bit repetitive.

It was a black & white film...not much you can do about that unless you have an artist colorize it.

The way it is, it makes the robot (in color) the center of attention.

However, there are a number if changes I would like to make to the translite, but it was the best alternative translite I could find for sale at the time.

#46 8 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

However, there are a number if changes I would like to make to the translite, but it was the best alternative translite I could find for sale at the time.

I'm curious, what changes would you make?

On mine, I've thought long and hard about what to put in the negative space at the edges. One thing I've considered, was to put in the numbers of the clock

#47 8 years ago

This is the one I want:

gen2-1_(resized).jpggen2-1_(resized).jpg

Just have to find out how to get one. I think this is the best layout and mix I've seen.

#48 8 years ago
Quoted from shimoda:

This is the one I want:
gen2-1_(resized).jpg
Just have to find out how to get one. I think this is the best layout and mix I've seen.

Yeah that one looks more "alive"

#49 8 years ago
Quoted from songofsixpence:

I'm curious, what changes would you make?
On mine, I've thought long and hard about what to put in the negative space at the edges. One thing I've considered, was to put in the numbers of the clock

I don't like the text, shadowing, or diamonds between the letters. I'd redo the Genesis title on the backglass at the very least.

#50 8 years ago

Update on mine.
2016-03-21_15.45.25_(resized).jpg2016-03-21_15.45.25_(resized).jpg
Blues on the left ramp entrance are just temporary til I get my gazillionth Titan order, forgot all about needing these! On the ramps, had to do two mods to get this to work: grind down a bit and install a t-nut on the post just to the right of the drops, no other way. Also had to move the motor relays a bit to get to mounting the far left post. All good and solid now. Just waiting on a window from pinbits (first one was too big and had another issue but Pamela there is working on it). Hoping to get to play it soon. Got a strange power issue to track down, the GI was flittering, hope it's not the fuse connector but could be something else. Already resoldered the grounds on the power supply.

Also, managed to get the translite art for the Genesis translite I mentioned above. It had a couple issues/areas I didn't like, so I made some changes to it and took it to be printed. Should have by noon tomorrow.

2016-03-21_14.03.02_(resized).png2016-03-21_14.03.02_(resized).png

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