I really didn’t know that you can make ramps! How, what materials, is it costly, what type of welds? Those look absolutely amazing compared to the plastic shit!
(Topic ID: 209985)
Kansas City, KS
Zartan https://pinballmakers.com/wiki/index.php?title=Construction#Custom_Parts scroll down a little bit to see about making wireworms.
Quoted from Zartan:I really didn’t know that you can make ramps! How, what materials, is it costly, what type of welds? Those look absolutely amazing compared to the plastic shit!
Loganpinball.com. We started that business just over the demand for wireforms for mandalorian pros.
Its $50 an hour plus materials. Everything is Tig welded. I wont list Acdc mod for sale as it took 21 hours to make.It would cost over 2k. It all depends on the final costs. I have found anything over $350 and it is a hard sale. But, visually stainless really changes the vibe over plastic..
If Matt needs any help ramp or rail related I owe him for his tips he shared with my Discovery machine.
1F4973F0-9ACB-4346-A212-5C5D2CDEB90F (resized).jpegF99E010A-B5B4-47AB-9C84-A1D1F7C1CC3C (resized).jpegQuoted from Zartan:Wow! That’s crazy but absolutely awesome!
If you get good you should start making money replacing plastic ramp sets!
Hahaha I think Loganpinball has that market cornered
it’s fun messing around with the welder but time consuming .. at least for me.
Loganpinball — that is good to know about the 19mm socket and staggering. Funny I was looking around the garage for hard round objects and never thought of the socket sets. The rings are tricky too - seemed to spring back after wrapping a few - what do you wrap around to get the right size once they relax? Or do you have a way to wrap tightly around something where they won’t relax once you release pressure?
— sidetrack to 3D printing - I did a quick sizing test for a church to go over the right ‘groups’ ball lock area. I think it will work out.. it’s tight tho. Ready to start some detail.
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Kind of symmetrical with the opposite side, on accident. Don’t know if I love it but my alternative idea of a semi clear ice cave like in the movie (guided meditation) seems too jarring against everything else that’s going on.
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Love the cup holder. Is the cup in the game going to do anything? A flasher perhaps? Maybe you could have a weak flipper mode where you have to fuel up on caffeine by hitting the cup a few times
I’m glad pointing out the Starbucks cup thing inspired some more theme integration. Now about putting in the single frame of a naked dude randomly showing up while you play…
Yes, I didn’t realize Loganpinball was around! Nice guy for sure! I’ve joined his website now. Pretty cool stuff still newer in the home hobby but learning as I go.
Quoted from Mbecker:Hahaha I think Loganpinball has that market cornered it’s fun messing around with the welder but time consuming .. at least for me.
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Quoted from toyotaboy:if you leave that mini starbucks cup over that target, you should play a clip of a starbucks cup everytime you hit it.
Maybe if nothing else is going on, it could be a hurryup with a barista callout of a complex coffee order then a characters name (occasionally misspelled/pronounced)
"Quad Venti White Mocha Frappuccino for Tayler"
Quoted from Mbecker:Hahaha I think Loganpinball has that market cornered it’s fun messing around with the welder but time consuming .. at least for me.
Loganpinball — that is good to know about the 19mm socket and staggering. Funny I was looking around the garage for hard round objects and never thought of the socket sets. The rings are tricky too - seemed to spring back after wrapping a few - what do you wrap around to get the right size once they relax? Or do you have a way to wrap tightly around something where they won’t relax once you release pressure?
— sidetrack to 3D printing - I did a quick sizing test for a church to go over the right ‘groups’ ball lock area. I think it will work out.. it’s tight tho. Ready to start some detail.
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Kind of symmetrical with the opposite side, on accident. Don’t know if I love it but my alternative idea of a semi clear ice cave like in the movie (guided meditation) seems too jarring against everything else that’s going on.
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I can post pictures if needed and will post sizes of dies.
All you need to do is find a long 1/2 drive socket that is smaller then the width you are trying to achieve. Place it in a vise and then vise grip a rod at the top of the socket. Then wrap the rod all the way down the socket by hand as tight as you can down to the lowest point you can get to. Then slowly let the pressure uncoil itself. It will snap like a whip, so do it slowly. The coiled rod will then look like a coil spring. After that I take it my bench cutter and cut the coil into equal rings. You will have a bunch. Once you have a cut ring you can measure the midpoint of the ring edgde to edge and see if you need to go bigger or smaller.
After you have the correct ring for your design you can do it one of two ways. Your lower rail can be welded to the bottom of the rings at your spacing. Looks better that way. Or you can weld your lower rail seperately then add the rings.
It is better making rings for rails. Once the lower rail is welded to the rings, you can mark the ring at the height desired for your upper rail. Weld the upper rail to the rings and when your done all you do is clip the upper ring off at upper rail. Then weld the clipped point. Mig welding is alot harder to do and clean up. It adds material to the rails and you have to clean it up more. With a tig welder you add no material, you are fusing the metal together. Looks way better..
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7BA36382-CA30-4858-BAD6-DBB53D58222D (resized).jpegQuoted from Loganpinball:I can post pictures if needed and will post sizes of dies.
All you need to do is find a long 1/2 drive socket that is smaller then the width you are trying to achieve. Place it in a vise and then vise grip a rod at the top of the socket. Then wrap the rod all the way down the socket by hand as tight as you can down to the lowest point you can get to. Then slowly let the pressure uncoil itself. It will snap like a whip, so do it slowly. The coiled rod will then look like a coil spring. After that I take it my bench cutter and cut the coil into equal rings. You will have a bunch. Once you have a cut ring you can measure the midpoint of the ring edgde to edge and see if you need to go bigger or smaller.
After you have the correct ring for your design you can do it one of two ways. Your lower rail can be welded to the bottom of the rings at your spacing. Looks better that way. Or you can weld your lower rail seperately then add the rings.
It is better making rings for rails. Once the lower rail is welded to the rings, you can mark the ring at the height desired for your upper rail. Weld the upper rail to the rings and when your done all you do is clip the upper ring off at upper rail. Then weld the clipped point. Mig welding is alot harder to do and clean up. It adds material to the rails and you have to clean it up more. With a tig welder you add no material, you are fusing the metal together. Looks way better..
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What do you use to weld?
Lincoln 220 Tig with 100% argon gas. Using Gold band lanthated tungsten rod (stainless steel requires this). Settings depend on grade of stainless. Stainless steel does not bend when overheated it just melts. Amp setting depends on your material, but it is pedaled output and it takes practice. But Tig welding produces the cleanest look. See picture. That is fused metal using Tig.
My last posts on welding here. Unless Matt needs it. I want to respect his topic of Fight Club.
89CE6A56-2914-4ABD-95CD-399CE58AC6FC (resized).jpegKind of my fault! I apologize fully! Been here almost 2 years and I still learn something new and pretty cool almost everyday! The fact that he built those ramps blew my mind!
Back to Fight Club!
Quoted from Loganpinball:Lincoln 220 Tig with 100% argon gas. Using Gold band lanthated tungsten rod (stainless steel requires this). Settings depend on grade of stainless. Stainless steel does not bend when overheated it just melts. Amp setting depends on your material, but it is pedaled output and it takes practice. But Tig welding produces the cleanest look. See picture. That is fused metal using Tig.
My last posts on welding here. Unless Matt needs it. I want to respect his topic of Fight Club.
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No worries, I enjoy the welding talk and the free bumps hahhaa TIG FTW for sure -- that is a clean weld! Pictures are helpful! Are you saying that you use diff. diameter rings for different rails? I figured they might be kinda standard.. hmm. I am using a fairly cheap HF one.. which is partially why I was questioning if I could even do it.. but it says it's good for mild steel, just not stainless. Lotta slag/cleanup, and not pretty welds but I think I can do better next time and I figure if they are plated that the plater would sandblast first so it would end up decent looking.
Quoted from TreyBo69:Love the cup holder. Is the cup in the game going to do anything? A flasher perhaps? Maybe you could have a weak flipper mode where you have to fuel up on caffeine by hitting the cup a few times
I’m glad pointing out the Starbucks cup thing inspired some more theme integration. Now about putting in the single frame of a naked dude randomly showing up while you play…
Treybo you are always full of awesome suggestions for games, I love it. Hadn't considered a light in the cup or more incoroprtation to the game, I'll think about that. The clip of naked dude -- I have a still of the film splice from the movie and final version probably will flash it at some point.. but for now I'm keeping it "family friendly" .. as much as I can, just because it's going to shows. I do have tyler popups that show up for like .25 of a second on the display randomly, like the film.
Quoted from toyotaboy:if you leave that mini starbucks cup over that target, you should play a clip of a starbucks cup everytime you hit it.
I like this as well -- if it stays there, I will incorporate more. Right now I have limited features for that target.. it works with the captive ball as part of the playfield multiplier logic but thats about it. my only issue with the cup there is that it blocks the view to the upper flipper partially.
Quoted from TreyBo69:Maybe if nothing else is going on, it could be a hurryup with a barista callout of a complex coffee order then a characters name (occasionally misspelled/pronounced)
"Quad Venti White Mocha Frappuccino for Tayler"
..writing all these ideas down, this is great!
Unless your powder coating your rails a specific color you would really be impressed with the stainless rods once they are sanded, stoned and polished.
Forgive me as I am Canadian and really hate standard rulers. That being said, a 7/8 impact socket makes 3cm width rails. That will produce the guide shown below. Once you hard wrap the rod and then cut rings they maintain shape and you can also flex them out if needed. Depending on your design you can make the rings bigger and do the same process and find the size that works for you. I would go a hair bigger than this, but I had this left over rail to show you the process.
You lower rail gap also affects spacing and speed. The one pictured below is a tight rail. The ball speed is very fast and direct and good for fast runs. They also work with bends and turns. You can increase that rail gap and have the ball make more contact. It slows the ball travel and effects stability on fast turns. The fast rails work great, but the upper rails need to be narrower like pictured to keep the ball in that channel. Too wide and the ball jumps and bounces off the upper rail and affects speed.
And you also can make rails with different shapes. Gotg I made hexagons. Watch the video and you will see the speed of the narrow lower rails and doing something besides rings as a design choice.
Can you post overhead pictures of you rails showing the path and design when you have time.
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Thanks for all the details and photos Loganpinball !! I will get a couple overhead shots up soon.
In meantime, shifted gears for a moment - working on the 3d modeling for the church. This is going way faster than the house, after a year of Fusion under my belt.. but still not quick by any means.
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I thought of a rule idea for the Starbucks cup target that combines the other ideas
When nothing else is going on, it will start a hurry up like Stranger Things upside down. That’s when the game will do a little light show, do a barista callout, then a hurry shot starts at the cup with a countdown value. You get the points and it adds part of those points to the base value for Starbucks Multiball.
After three collected hurry ups, you get a weak flipper multiball mode where you have to hit the cup to keep up your flipper power. Dimming lights and turning them off from back to front to help visualize your energy level.
I haven't watched the movie in a while, but a lot of effort is being discussed about something that was 'hidden' in the film.
I think the starbucks drink holder is a GREAT touch, and if anybody asks you can say 'just watch the movie', but doesn't a visible cup on the pf and modes seem too much?
Valid point. I think of it as how Williams made major features based of minor things in 90s games. Part of that was not being able to see the finished movie while making the game
Yeah - fair points about major modes around it.. although i do love hearing all the ideas. As far as on the playfield.. I do think I like it there, but I may end up "hiding" it a bit more, back by the pops where it was designed for actually. Or go with a smaller version over that target, would be the other option. It will get more thought..
8 hours in.. getting closer. I have no idea if these details will print well at all or not, which is a little nerve-wracking to spend 15-20hours on a model and not know..
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Resin printer is the way to go for details. I just picked two up and love it for the toys in my game.
Quoted from Octomodz:Resin printer is the way to go for details. I just picked two up and love it for the toys in my game.
yeah i saw that -- you're absolutely right but I also don't want to deal with the mess and another printer 
We'll see how it goes with the X1c and go from there.. if I have to pay someone to resin print it that's fine too I guess.. although I am hoping to do it in the marbolized white I just bought..dunno if resin has that kind of option
Quoted from Mbecker:I was thinking about it and this may be the first game with a Catholic Church Ball lock lol
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Waiting for Stern to respond with a papal themed game. Hit the Popemobile to light rosary!
Quoted from justyn:Waiting for Stern to respond with a papal themed game. Hit the Popemobile to light rosary!
Hahaha that’s great! Isn’t there also that swinging smoke ball ? Feel like a toy could be worked in there like the junkyard crane
Ate up a week, figuring out how to print this and combine bodies appropriately + add windows. Really close now, this will get assembled for a test fit. Then final adjustments + add a few attachment points as necessary. I went with the Marble PLA - which comes out great. The roof section I was surprised - prints almost completely w/out support and looks perfect on the bottom side after. Still tinkering with lighting and how to get a stained glass look thru the windows
Getting ancy to get back on code -- next up is to figure out this multiball for group lock and code it in. 5 months left till the next show...
1 week later
Integrated:
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Fit came out pretty good from the CAD. Some tweaks for the final version, including probably blocking some of the roof light bleed. But for a prototype, I'm happy.
Sort of a milestone achieved today I guess -- multiball is up and running for the group lock - meditation multiball inside the church. 2 physical balls lock in it, and a 3rd is served up from the trough. It is incredibly fun to play with 3 balls after years of only having 1! Succesfully started multi, qualified and started a mode inside the multi - and ended both w/out anything breaking. Actually almost shocked nothing broke.. it all just .. worked! Some work left on the mb to address little the smaller items like graphics, music, and lock/multiball callouts + the shot and points coding.
Quoted from Mbecker:Integrated:
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Fit came out pretty good from the CAD. Some tweaks for the final version, including probably blocking some of the roof light bleed. But for a prototype, I'm happy.
Sort of a milestone achieved today I guess -- multiball is up and running for the group lock - meditation multiball inside the church. 2 physical balls lock in it, and a 3rd is served up from the trough. It is incredibly fun to play with 3 balls after years of only having 1! Succesfully started multi, qualified and started a mode inside the multi - and ended both w/out anything breaking. Actually almost shocked nothing broke.. it all just .. worked! Some work left on the mb to address little the smaller items like graphics, music, and lock/multiball callouts + the shot and points coding.
Man your modeling skills have improved so much over time, church looks great!
1 week later
Did you get the AMS for the X1c? I love mine. Should check out www.fabreeko.com for his x1c honeybadger build plates.
Excellent job modeling - have you turned up the x1c to ludicrous speed yet? I built a voron and successfully hit "gone to plaid" (>10000 acceleration and nearly 1000mm/s)
If you have the AMS you could use black for a wall or two interior to block the light (and significantly increase the print time, so trade off versus spraying some flat black or even masking with gaffer tape)
Quoted from Mbecker:Integrated:
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Fit came out pretty good from the CAD. Some tweaks for the final version, including probably blocking some of the roof light bleed. But for a prototype, I'm happy.
Sort of a milestone achieved today I guess -- multiball is up and running for the group lock - meditation multiball inside the church. 2 physical balls lock in it, and a 3rd is served up from the trough. It is incredibly fun to play with 3 balls after years of only having 1! Succesfully started multi, qualified and started a mode inside the multi - and ended both w/out anything breaking. Actually almost shocked nothing broke.. it all just .. worked! Some work left on the mb to address little the smaller items like graphics, music, and lock/multiball callouts + the shot and points coding.
Looks Sick !!!!
Quoted from P1nhead:Did you get the AMS for the X1c? I love mine. Should check out www.fabreeko.com for his x1c honeybadger build plates.
Excellent job modeling - have you turned up the x1c to ludicrous speed yet? I built a voron and successfully hit "gone to plaid" (>10000 acceleration and nearly 1000mm/s)
If you have the AMS you could use black for a wall or two interior to block the light (and significantly increase the print time, so trade off versus spraying some flat black or even masking with gaffer tape)
I read this six times and still don’t know what it means but it sounds cool.
Nice job on the build, and good luck in the TWIPYS!
1 month later
Whelp, 3rd place in the Twipys. Not 1st but I'll take it gladly -- stiff competition there and Elf deserved the win I think. Countdown now to the NW Pinball show in June. I had a to-do list for the 6 months leading up to it.. it's taking me 3-4 weeks it seems to get full modes in with all the logic, points, lights, video, image & sound assets - even with a template now.
I've got in (1) multiball, 2 scene modes, and 1 homework assignment mode. This all sits on the base "running" mode, which has 90% in. Ideally I'd like to get my main multiball in. Stretch goal is to get my lower playfield rebuilt in a new box, attached to my cab and running 1 fight mode in it.
I just am wrapping up the homework mode - Arson, where you light fires on the playfield - and realized I only have like 6 plastics and I had one pulled to work on stuff so I decided to just pull them off real quick and get them into CAD, so I can have new ones lasered and work on art for them. Because I still haven't gotten a phone setup to video some new gamplay yet - I'll sign off with a couple pictures of testing plastic models against the OG before calling them good to send.
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Thanks Ernie - I hope so! We’ll see what happens.
Today I got the stepper motor and billboard working for the first time in the cab, via MPF. Thought I burned the motor and spent hours wiring my spare, testing, and finally determining there was some software safety thing going on.. I think because it tried to pull too much power. Gotta work on the homing switch but otherwise functional.. one step closer to the main multiball.
I should have thought about the homing switch more before I originally installed it.. I think I was in a hurry at the time. Took an afternoon of trying different approaches between a physical and magnetic switch and various objects to trigger said switch. Finally ground down a set screw to the point it just triggers the switch barely. Positions have been figured out, and the servo is working via MPF as well so I can drop the locked balls into the playfield. Can start programming the locks now.
Quoted from Mbecker:I should have thought about the homing switch more before I originally installed it.. I think I was in a hurry at the time. Took an afternoon of trying different approaches between a physical and magnetic switch and various objects to trigger said switch. Finally ground down a set screw to the point it just triggers the switch barely. Positions have been figured out, and the servo is working via MPF as well so I can drop the locked balls into the playfield. Can start programming the locks now.
That’s awesome! Can you share what stepper motor you used? I need to have a slow, bi-directional motor for my game.
Mudflaps -- Thanks! The stepper is about the most compact one you can get - 17hs08-1004s should bring it up online. I would get something that can handle a bit more current unless you have space limitations.. but also note - the reason it turns so slow is that I'm doing 1/8 steps. You can go up to 1/16th with MPF /Tic controller.. I'm not sure if the main boardset (FAST/Cobra/P3) impacts that ability at all.. at any rate, any standard stepper should be capable of turning slowly.
Ha! Love that, thanks for sharing! Might have to include it as a easteregg in the attract mode via button press combo or something..
I've wrapped up the plastics conversion to CAD and sent off to have them lasered. Unfortunately running into issues importing DXF's into inkscape and retaining the splines.. gotta read thru some work-arounds for that before any art can get figured out minus the slings.
Spent yesterday redoing a wireform I had recycled from Apollo13.. nice to have that blue thing gone.. but I was impatient with it and didn't get the new one quite right, plus welding issues.. so I will have to redo it again later. I think after the show this year I may just pull them all and try to get a final version of each done to be sent off for chroming.
Back to code now.. I've given up on prospects of having the lower playfield working for the show, but at least I've got 5 weeks then to get another multiball in and we'll see what else.
1 week later
Dude, multiball is looking awesome. I need to come back to Seattle for work so I can crash your house and play it again!
Clermont-ferrand
1 week later
I've been following this project from the beginning and I really admire how far you've come!!!
It looks incredible and I hope to get to play it one day.
Regarding the plastics - do you have the art made?
I see the Tyler sling above that may be a good candidate for 3D printed lithopane
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Ha! Funny you mention that, just got an email from Bambu for a deal on their 4 color combo for litho prints. I’d never heard of them - had to look it up. Could be cool, that’s an interesting idea! I’ve only done the sling art, took some effort to figure out how to import dxf to Inkscape and I need to stop at the printer to look at options.
In MPF upgrade hell at the moment .. I ran into a bug in the old version I was using on something I need and it’s snowballed. Not great timing with the show 3 weeks away and FC unable to start a game.
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