(Topic ID: 70775)

The Firepower Club

By wiredoug

10 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 4,611 posts
  • 389 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 17 hours ago by slochar
  • Topic is favorited by 183 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

20240222_162422 (resized).jpg
1 (resized).JPG
20240219_100955[1] (resized).jpg
20240219_100938[1] (resized).jpg
17081924482489220556429728668307 (resized).jpg
17081924197165365041866729559709 (resized).jpg
20240217_104945[1] (resized).jpg
20240217_104937[1] (resized).jpg
20240217_103551 (resized).jpg
IMG_4346 (resized).jpeg
20240114_214448.jpg
rtfm.jpg
20240113_134910.jpg
20231229_155014 (resized).jpg
20231220_191032 (resized).jpg
20231220_190741 (resized).jpg

There are 4,611 posts in this topic. You are on page 78 of 93.
#3851 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

Question to those of you that have installed a new playfield in your game. Did you install Cliffy protectors or not?

I cleared my old playfield and i wish I did the shooter lane before playing. At a minimum get the shooter lane protector, the saucers are good but probably not as needed. I should also be receiving Cliff's inlanes this week in the mail to help with the ball hop.

#3852 3 years ago
Quoted from topkat:

I will check what brand the pia is first..
You think I should investigate the board before checking the diodes in the game.? I ask bc i have confidence in being able to check diodes.
I’ll read up on how to check the path with the probe.

To me, I just don't see how a bad diode could cause this. I'm not going to say it can't be the problem, just that it seems unlikely to me. The other suggestion about a short somewhere is possible but the fact that the stuck lights reset when you start a new game points to it being an issue on the board.

Checking the PIA brand is super easy, AMI brand PIAs have a round AMI logo molded in the top. Also, is that PIA socketed?

pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png
#3853 3 years ago
Quoted from slochar:

Try disconnecting the connector to the insert board next time it happens and see if the issue goes away. With a lamp matrix issues could come from an row or column that's in common.
I'd check every single diode in the game to make sure it's not shorted out against something nearby. You have normal lamps in there or LED's?

It is all Led's..
Thanks to all for the replys. Now I have some leads to check...

#3854 3 years ago
Quoted from Teamhex:

I haven't even thought of doing that, but if you're going through the trouble of a playfield swap...might as well. Especially if you're going to play the hell out of it.

It's a Firepower! They always get played. A lot! The one I have needs the kickout done. It's a nice machine though. I picked up a 2nd Firepower (only game I've ever had two of) that someone started a playfield swap and lost interest. I enjoy the game so much I picked that up so I'll end up with a really nice example to keep. I may at least get that one for the kickout to project the new playfield. Going to be a winter project.

The one that is running now gets a lot of use. My son and his other college friends play it all the time. I know there are over 600 more games on it then the last time I checked it.

That prompted the question about installing the cliffy on a new playfield.

#3855 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

It's a Firepower! They always get played. A lot! The one I have needs the kickout done. It's a nice machine though. I picked up a 2nd Firepower (only game I've ever had two of) that someone started a playfield swap and lost interest. I enjoy the game so much I picked that up so I'll end up with a really nice example to keep. I may at least get that one for the kickout to project the new playfield. Going to be a winter project.
The one that is running now gets a lot of use. My son and his other college friends play it all the time. I know there are over 600 more games on it then the last time I checked it.
That prompted the question about installing the cliffy on a new playfield.

Good deal. Most of my friends are already bored of mine, but we've been to a bar that has 17 modern pins so I get it.
When you say the kickout, do you mean the one that kicks it into the shooter lane? I've got an issue with mine only being strong enough about half the time. I don't know if I should just replace the sleeve and plunger, or go all out and replace the coil as well.

#3856 3 years ago
Quoted from Teamhex:

Good deal. Most of my friends are already bored of mine, but we've been to a bar that has 17 modern pins so I get it.
When you say the kickout, do you mean the one that kicks it into the shooter lane? I've got an issue with mine only being strong enough about half the time. I don't know if I should just replace the sleeve and plunger, or go all out and replace the coil as well.

Coils don't wear out - either they work or they don't. Just check that it's the right coil spec. Swap the sleeve and maybe the plunger depending upon it's condition but the other thing to check is the kickout mech itself. The mech has a swing arm that comes up, striking the ball in the trough and kicking it into the shooter lane - if the swing arm is bent or not aligned, it may not be striking the ball cleanly.

#3857 3 years ago
Quoted from Teamhex:

Good deal. Most of my friends are already bored of mine, but we've been to a bar that has 17 modern pins so I get it.
When you say the kickout, do you mean the one that kicks it into the shooter lane? I've got an issue with mine only being strong enough about half the time. I don't know if I should just replace the sleeve and plunger, or go all out and replace the coil as well.

Yes. The one that kicks the ball into the shooter lane. It came with a homemade cliffy that was a hack. Pushed the balls back enough so that the first ball could trigger the switch for the second ball. Yanked that off last night and trashed it. Game is working and a really cliffy would make it look better.

Since I’m going to order a set for that I was think of getting a second for the other game getting the new playfield.

#3858 3 years ago
Quoted from Manny65:

Coils don't wear out - either they work or they don't. Just check that it's the right coil spec. Swap the sleeve and maybe the plunger depending upon it's condition but the other thing to check is the kickout mech itself. The mech has a swing arm that comes up, striking the ball in the trough and kicking it into the shooter lane - if the swing arm is bent or not aligned, it may not be striking the ball cleanly.

Yeah the only coil I've had to replace was one where the sleeve melted inside the coil and I couldn't get it out(brittle too).
I even rebuilt the flippers and pops on a 72" EM and they were like new again. The only thing I see on this one is the arm that swings up has a flat spot from where it hits the ball....maybe I can just add a rubber sleeve or something to the tip and see if that does it. Shoot maybe just replacing that arm thing would help. Probably a good idea anyway because the metal will scratch the balls each time it send them up. I do have some extra sleeves laying around though so it should be easy to fix either way.

Robotworkshop Probably a good idea

#3859 3 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

To me, I just don't see how a bad diode could cause this. I'm not going to say it can't be the problem, just that it seems unlikely to me. The other suggestion about a short somewhere is possible but the fact that the stuck lights reset when you start a new game points to it being an issue on the board.
Checking the PIA brand is super easy, AMI brand PIAs have a round AMI logo molded in the top. Also, is that PIA socketed?[quoted image]

Here’s my ic 10. In believe it’s Motorola

image (resized).jpgimage (resized).jpg
#3860 3 years ago

That Is a Motorola part. Any other pictures of the board? Looks like one of the large Transistors below it was replaced. If any were was it an exact match or a substitute?

#3861 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

That Is a Motorola part. Any other pictures of the board? Looks like one of the large Transistors below it was replaced. If any were was it an exact match or a substitute?

I went through and checked all the diodes in the row and column. (Unsoldered one leg ) all of them were good. Bummer

Here’s a few photos

85BE1013-7295-4D02-B82D-FD802301DC6B (resized).jpeg85BE1013-7295-4D02-B82D-FD802301DC6B (resized).jpeg9D8672E1-B8F1-4B56-B381-728764CBC6F7 (resized).jpeg9D8672E1-B8F1-4B56-B381-728764CBC6F7 (resized).jpeg
#3862 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

Esa es una pieza de Motorola. ¿Alguna otra imagen del tablero? Parece que uno de los grandes transistores debajo de él fue reemplazado. Si lo hubo, ¿fue una coincidencia exacta o un sustituto?

that's a TIP122
Used by lamps just like the TIP42

#3863 3 years ago
Quoted from Waxon:

that's a TIP122
Used by lamps just like the TIP42

Is it? I don’t see the part number in the picture shown. Prior repairs and replaced parts are always suspect. Were the correct replacements installed? Can’t tell from here.

From the picture check the small transistors. Looks like a couple leads could be touching l

I did have a odd issue on lights on a Blackout. Found a leaky diode. Once replaced it fixed it.

#3864 3 years ago

It looks like the replaced transistor is tip31ag. I didn’t replace it but thought it was the same as the others.

I don’t believe any of the transistors are touching, but will check that again.
I tested all the diodes in the row and column, so my thinking is it’s not a diode..?

My next step, after I resolder the diodes will be to try another board set
Thanks

#3865 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

¿Lo es? No veo el número de pieza en la imagen que se muestra. Las reparaciones previas y las piezas reemplazadas siempre son sospechosas. ¿Se instalaron los reemplazos correctos? No puedo decirlo desde aquí.
En la imagen, compruebe los pequeños transistores. Parece que un par de clientes potenciales podrían estar tocando l
Tuve un problema extraño con las luces en un apagón. Encontré un diodo con fugas. Una vez reemplazado, lo arregló.

of course they are tip122 I changed the entire row of Tip transistors on the card, I wanted to update the components for more modern ones, they work very well

#3866 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

¿Lo es? No veo el número de pieza en la imagen que se muestra. Las reparaciones previas y las piezas reemplazadas siempre son sospechosas. ¿Se instalaron los reemplazos correctos? No puedo decirlo desde aquí.
En la imagen, compruebe los pequeños transistores. Parece que un par de clientes potenciales podrían estar tocando l
Tuve un problema extraño con las luces en un apagón. Encontré un diodo con fugas. Una vez reemplazado, lo arregló.

where are the square resistors are TIP122 and where are the 27ohms are TIP42, now I don't have a photo of my row, in a few days I'll be back at home so I'll show you my board with new and updated components

#3867 3 years ago
Quoted from Waxon:

of course they are tip122 I changed the entire row of Tip transistors on the card, I wanted to update the components for more modern ones, they work very well

I was referring to the photo by topkat since it looked like some of those transistors were replaced and the numbers on them weren't shown.

#3868 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

Me refería a la foto de topkat, ya que parecía que algunos de esos transistores fueron reemplazados y los números en ellos no se mostraban.

Which tansistor number are you looking for? I know all the numbers, It´s very easy to know but if you want to ask about one in specific I would help you

#3869 3 years ago

Look I changed all the tip122 in my board

Screenshot_20201210-142240 (resized).pngScreenshot_20201210-142240 (resized).png
#3870 3 years ago

http://www.firepowerpinball.com/2ya/downloads/04-driverboard.pdf

Not sure if anyone already posted but this is pretty nice link if looking for driver board info

#3871 3 years ago

If someone can let me know, when you hit the power targets, how is that supposed to effect the fire Lanes? When I hit all three power targets it flashes the fire lanes and changes the number of lit lanes. Is this right ?
(Trying to figure my lamp issue )

#3872 3 years ago
Quoted from topkat:

If someone can let me know, when you hit the power targets, how is that supposed to effect the fire Lanes? When I hit all three power targets it flashes the fire lanes and changes the number of lit lanes. Is this right ?
(Trying to figure my lamp issue )

When you light all fire rollovers, it lights/says fire. When you hit all 3 power targets, it lights/says power. When you've completed both, the game says Fire Power and steps up your 3 bonus points between bumpers.

16076591985261612570267 (resized).jpg16076591985261612570267 (resized).jpg
#3873 3 years ago

So if when I hit all
Three power targets and then the fire inlanes all flash, then change which stay lit.. is that
Not correct ? It seems the power targets will alter my fire lane targets, after all 3 are hit

#3874 3 years ago
Quoted from Da-Shaker:

When you light all fire rollovers, it lights/says fire. When you hit all 3 power targets, it lights/says power. When you've completed both, the game says Fire Power and steps up your 3 bonus points between bumpers.
[quoted image]

I watched a video. So there’s where my problem must stem from. If when the 3 power targets Are all lit it changes the lights on my
Fire lanes. Either I screwed up soemthing else when resoldered all the diodes or the problem is on the power target group

#3875 3 years ago
Quoted from topkat:

I watched a video. So there’s where my problem must stem from. If when the 3 power targets Are all lit it changes the lights on my
Fire lanes. Either I screwed up soemthing else when resoldered all the diodes or the problem is on the power target group

Yeah that's definitely not right. They're independent of each other(in terms of game flow, not sure about board control wise).
The process is exactly like trk12 describes. Fire is only lit by the F.I.R.E rollovers and the power is lit by the three power targets on the right side of the playfield. There are some changes you can make in settings for what lights your shield, but there aren't any that would do what you describe.

Here's a test clip of me playing the other day. This part shows what happens when power is lit. The Power insert and 3 power target inserts should flash when you complete power.

#3876 3 years ago
Quoted from Teamhex:

Yeah that's definitely not right. They're independent of each other(in terms of game flow, not sure about board control wise).
The process is exactly like trk12 describes. Fire is only lit by the F.I.R.E rollovers and the power is lit by the three power targets on the right side of the playfield. There are some changes you can make in settings for what lights your shield, but there aren't any that would do what you describe.
Here's a test clip of me playing the other day. This part shows what happens when power is lit. The Power insert and 3 power target inserts should flash when you complete power.

Thanks for the post. That’s allot different than mine
Here’s how mine reacts
https://share.icloud.com/photos/0x5SQMkdXVNCi4ZnxAqkrvYMA#Los_Altos

I just don’t know if this a lamp matrix issue or board ? I had thought it was just incorrectly lighting inserts but there more going on

#3877 3 years ago
Quoted from topkat:

Thanks for the post. That’s allot different than mine
Here’s how mine reacts
https://share.icloud.com/photos/0x5SQMkdXVNCi4ZnxAqkrvYMA#Los_Altos
I just don’t know if this a lamp matrix issue or board ? I had thought it was just incorrectly lighting inserts but there more going on

That's really, really, bizarre. It's running the "fire completed" lamp animation when you complete power targets..... it should never do this.
Then it's adding lamps to it.... should also never do this.

What kind of mpu board is in the game?

#3878 3 years ago
Quoted from topkat:

Thanks for the post. That’s allot different than mine
Here’s how mine reacts
https://share.icloud.com/photos/0x5SQMkdXVNCi4ZnxAqkrvYMA#Los_Altos
I just don’t know if this a lamp matrix issue or board ? I had thought it was just incorrectly lighting inserts but there more going on

Ohh man that is so odd. I wish I could tell you, but if you've reset it to factory settings and that didn't do the trick...not sure where I'd go. I can say my board is the original board.

#3879 3 years ago

It’s the original mpu And driver
Or should say it’s Williams.
I have a rd 327 I could try swapping out.

Trying to figure if something was rewired at some point. But don’t know the direction to look.

#3880 3 years ago

Try the RD board to rule out the playfield wiring.

The power targets are doing what they should until they get to completion.

#3881 3 years ago

I think that’s prob my best next step.. at least with my skill set on diagnosing something like this.
The rd had been in before, but I don’t remember how it played in comparison

Thanks

#3882 3 years ago
Quoted from slochar:

Try the RD board to rule out the playfield wiring.
The power targets are doing what they should until they get to completion.

Swapped out the rd board and the game functions properly. Thats good news in a sense.
Would anyone have thoughts on whether that is a mpu or a driver board causing the issue. I was leaning Mpu..

#3883 3 years ago

That is very interesting. My gut would be the CPU board. The system was scoring the switches properly but acting on them incorrectly. That feels like the program is not being processed correctly and would be the fault of the CPU board.

However, it could turn out to be either. I'd guess 80/20 CPU/Driver

#3884 3 years ago

Tonight's progress on my Hardtop restore and drop conversion. These Metal-Mods pop decals are not easy to do but look pretty spiffy.

Ajw1hMFjSVyAubp8I2cymg (resized).jpgAjw1hMFjSVyAubp8I2cymg (resized).jpgQbnweOKyT%qtImMbIE6s7A (resized).jpgQbnweOKyT%qtImMbIE6s7A (resized).jpg
#3885 3 years ago

Definitely a harder install than my other sets which have solid rings, but well worth the effort. Looks like they came out good!

1 week later
#3886 3 years ago

Anyone in need of this light strip?

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/under-playfield-light-strip

6CB0F350-CEAB-4BE4-BDF3-43C7A441390D (resized).jpeg6CB0F350-CEAB-4BE4-BDF3-43C7A441390D (resized).jpeg
#3887 3 years ago

I just replaced every component on this old power supply. What are the test points I should check to make sure it’s putting out the right voltages?

B0BD30C2-5C59-4C50-9E43-A3950CD827DA (resized).jpegB0BD30C2-5C59-4C50-9E43-A3950CD827DA (resized).jpeg
#3888 3 years ago
Quoted from mrm_4:

I just replaced every component on this old power supply. What are the test points I should check to make sure it’s putting out the right voltages?
[quoted image]

I guess I’ll ask in a different way to make it easier to help.
3J5 and 3J6 test out ok according to Firepowerpinball.com

C5EA6C21-BD9E-423B-A4A5-9487D04FDBBF (resized).pngC5EA6C21-BD9E-423B-A4A5-9487D04FDBBF (resized).png23E76A2A-DED1-427C-B9A0-B7DBDCCF73A9 (resized).jpeg23E76A2A-DED1-427C-B9A0-B7DBDCCF73A9 (resized).jpeg83C661B0-30D3-4760-AA91-77597E8F6AA6 (resized).jpeg83C661B0-30D3-4760-AA91-77597E8F6AA6 (resized).jpeg

However 3J4 should be testing at 16 but I get 21

C987A6B9-4751-45A2-AE51-A2312D9B7095 (resized).pngC987A6B9-4751-45A2-AE51-A2312D9B7095 (resized).pngA30591A7-49EE-4192-ABBB-E05003513268 (resized).jpegA30591A7-49EE-4192-ABBB-E05003513268 (resized).jpeg

And 3J3 should be testing at 28 but I get 40

44DBA286-BEE4-4563-9CEB-DF6C9A64D20D (resized).jpeg44DBA286-BEE4-4563-9CEB-DF6C9A64D20D (resized).jpeg

Are the higher voltages because I don’t have the other boards plugged in?

Would someone with an original power supply be willing to unplug your boards and verify I’m getting correct readings?

#3889 3 years ago
Quoted from mrm_4:

I guess I’ll ask in a different way to make it easier to help.
3J5 and 3J6 test out ok according to Firepowerpinball.com
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
However 3J4 should be testing at 16 but I get 21
[quoted image][quoted image]
And 3J4 should be testing at 28 but I get 40
[quoted image]
Are the higher voltages because I don’t have the other boards plugged in?
Would someone with an original power supply be willing to unplug your boards and verify I’m getting correct readings?

I tried rebuilding my power suppler and ended up with the exact readings. I sent the board out bc I wasnst sure what to do, and the component on the heat sink, I think its a voltage regulator was bad.. Dont know if thats the issue but maybe check that as well, if it wasnt replaced

#3890 3 years ago
Quoted from topkat:

I tried rebuilding my power suppler and ended up with the exact readings. I sent the board out bc I wasnst sure what to do, and the component on the heat sink, I think its a voltage regulator was bad.. Dont know if thats the issue but maybe check that as well, if it wasnt replaced

Yeah if you mean this baby here, it’s a new 5 volt regulator. Not sure that is tied to these.

image (resized).jpgimage (resized).jpg
#3891 3 years ago
Quoted from topkat:

I tried rebuilding my power suppler and ended up with the exact readings. I sent the board out bc I wasnst sure what to do, and the component on the heat sink, I think its a voltage regulator was bad.. Dont know if thats the issue but maybe check that as well, if it wasnt replaced

Quoted from mrm_4:

Supongo que preguntaré de otra manera para que sea más fácil ayudar.
3J5 y 3J6 se prueban bien según Firepowerpinball.com
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
Sin embargo, 3J4 debería estar probando a los 16 pero obtengo 21
[quoted image][quoted image]
Y 3J4 debería estar probando a los 28 pero yo obtengo 40
[quoted image]
¿Son los voltajes más altos porque no tengo las otras placas conectadas?
¿Alguien con una fuente de alimentación original estaría dispuesto a desenchufar sus placas y verificar que obtengo lecturas correctas?

If you changed the components for exact new ones or equivalent there is no problem, the board regulates the voltage to convert it from high to low, So it must be fine, in case you have put a capacitor of more UF or more Volts or less, there would be a problem, but I think that is not the case, when you placing the board it should regulate the voltage as it will be connected to the entire system

#3892 3 years ago
Quoted from Waxon:

If you changed the components for exact new ones or equivalent there is no problem, the board regulates the voltage to convert it from high to low, So it must be fine, in case you have put a capacitor of more UF or more Volts or less, there would be a problem, but I think that is not the case, when you placing the board it should regulate the voltage as it will be connected to the entire system

Yeah this is why I’m hoping someone will just unplug 4 connectors from their game and confirm the readings on 3J4 and 3J3

#3893 3 years ago

I plugged in a system 6 will psb (my installed is Kohout )
With just the two inputs j2 j1 I get 40 volts in the same spot..

#3894 3 years ago

And 20 the on the other

#3895 3 years ago
Quoted from topkat:

I plugged in a system 6 will psb (my installed is Kohout )
With just the two inputs j2 j1 I get 40 volts in the same spot..

Quoted from topkat:

And 20 the on the other

Awesome thanks for confirming!

#3896 3 years ago

Hardtop restore/drop target conversion complete.

IMG_7612 (resized).jpgIMG_7612 (resized).jpg
#3897 3 years ago
Quoted from Clytor:

Restauración de techo rígido / conversión de destino de caída completa.
[quoted image]

Amazing!

#3898 3 years ago

Quick question. I'm having a problem with some dim lights on Row 2 of the lamp matrix (Black / Red wire). All lights on this row are dimly lit. I did do some fiddling on adjusting some switches after I put on my hardtop.

I know I did something, but is this more of a function of a diode not making contact or a crossed wire? I've looked at all lights on the circuits and it appears they all have contact and diodes are in place from what I can see on them.

1 week later
#3899 3 years ago

MDBradley, inspect playfield harness connectors 8P2-12/8J2-12 and 2J7-2/2P7-2 for un-cleanliness, like green corrosion on male pin female socket, or pin not pushed fully into socket, etc.

Your description is not a diode failure, nor a switch maladjust.. It is MOST likely a connection with excessive resistance..

#3900 3 years ago

Anyone have issues with LEDs? The arrow lights for my targets are sketchy. They don’t blink correctly after a few targets are hit. The remaining lights, light solid although they should blink. Then on the next ball they are good. Do I need to add resistors?

Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
$ 20.00
Electronics
Yorktown Arcade Supply
Electronics
$ 150.00
Displays
Digipinball Shop
Displays
There are 4,611 posts in this topic. You are on page 78 of 93.

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/the-firepower-club/page/78?hl=waxon and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.