(Topic ID: 70775)

The Firepower Club


By wiredoug

6 years ago



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There are 3653 posts in this topic. You are on page 26 of 74.
#1251 3 years ago
Quoted from CentralCACoast:

having some interesting problems

Don't know your familiarity with system 3-7 flaws/weak points -- but -- I I've had some recent success starting with:

(assuming it's an original mpu/driver board) Get all that potential flakiness from heat/motion/flexing/movement/transport out of the way first...

1. Reflow all header pins
2. repin 40 pin connector

...Am I forgetting anything?

-mof

#1252 3 years ago

Trying LEDs on Firepower thanks to Pinball Life!

IMG_0277 (resized).JPG

#1253 3 years ago
Quoted from CentralCACoast:

Just acquired A Firepower, having some interesting problems, I get different issues almost every time I fire it up, this is what I have seen so far on start up, display shows memory loss, try to get it in attract mode, won't go, batteries are good, sometimes LEDs flash once go out, do the switch test, lower one stays on, sometimes LEDs stay on, Sometimes LEDs flash once go out, do the switch test nothing happens, no LED. Have replaced batteries, IC's 12, 13, 16, and 19. Any help would be great, displays have shown various strange things and makes a weird sound that tapers off to silence when first fired up,
Thanks,

So any one of these issues can happen when you start it up? Nothing seems to consistently happen? Does it ever start without memory loss?

1) Make sure you have all the boards mounted snuggly with screws. This impacts the ground reference between boards.

2) Have you checked the ROM and chip sockets for Scanbe sockets? If you have those, you need to replace them all first thing. They are notoriously bad.

3) Have you replaced the 40 pin interboard connector? Also notoriously bad.

4) You are chasing your tail until items 2 and 3 have been completed.

EDIT: forgot to add mof's excellent suggestion - reflow or better yet - replace all the connector pins on all the boards.

If you are ordering parts, I would get electrolytic caps for the power supply board, sound board and the 100uf cap on the CPU and Driver boards.

#1254 3 years ago
Quoted from CentralCACoast:

Just acquired A Firepower, having some interesting problems, I get different issues almost every time I fire it up.........

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-bulletproofing-williams-system-6#

Check out vid's guide on this topic. He's da man!

#1255 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

Don't know your familiarity with system 3-7 flaws/weak points -- but -- I I've had some recent success starting with:
(assuming it's an original mpu/driver board) Get all that potential flakiness from heat/motion/flexing/movement/transport out of the way first...
1. Reflow all header pins
2. repin 40 pin connector
...Am I forgetting anything?
-mof

Thanks, did all those already,

#1256 3 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

So any one of these issues can happen when you start it up? Nothing seems to consistently happen? Does it ever start without memory loss?
1) Make sure you have all the boards mounted snuggly with screws. This impacts the ground reference between boards.
2) Have you checked the ROM and chip sockets for Scanbe sockets? If you have those, you need to replace them all first thing. They are notoriously bad.
3) Have you replaced the 40 pin interboard connector? Also notoriously bad.
4) You are chasing your tail until items 2 and 3 have been completed.
EDIT: forgot to add mof's excellent suggestion - reflow or better yet - replace all the connector pins on all the boards.
If you are ordering parts, I would get electrolytic caps for the power supply board, sound board and the 100uf cap on the CPU and Driver boards.

Thanks, it never starts without memory loss, I will replace the ROM sockets and see what happens, the 40 pin has been done already, so have the connector pins, thanks for your input,

#1257 3 years ago
Quoted from CentralCACoast:

Thanks, it never starts without memory loss, I will replace the ROM sockets and see what happens, the 40 pin has been done already, so have the connector pins, thanks for your input,

With the power off and batteries installed, check for battery power between pins 8 (ground) and 22 (Vcc) of the 5101 RAM chip. Did you remove the stock battery holder and install a remote battery holder?

#1258 3 years ago

Note: The company that supplied
---- Williams with their inserts went out
---- of business during the video game collapse.
---- The colors have a tendency to fade from the
---- heat of the lamps. The blue is a royal blue
---- that contemporary lens suppliers seem to
---- not want to make. Sad.

#1259 3 years ago

I would be in for a new set of Plastics if or when it happen's.

#1260 3 years ago

New problem -- possible short dumps me into Game Over attract mode.

I rearranged my game room and moved my Firepower. I don't think anything has changed, but I'm now getting dumped into Game Over mode mid-turn. I don't see any obvious loose or shorted wires, but that doesn't mean there aren't any.

I do however notice some dimming of the general lighting when I hold the right flipper. Could a bad end of stroke setting be the issue here? (I'll probably start there, but would appreciate any advice.)

#1261 3 years ago

I swear I'm never going to roll this game. I just can't have more than one good ball on a game. crazy. Keeps me coming back for more though.

#1262 3 years ago

You and me both !, this game just kicks my butt !

#1263 3 years ago

I just picked up mine a couple of weeks ago. Rolled it the first week. Not even close since. It can be really tough.

#1264 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

I swear I'm never going to roll this game.

I've had mine for a couple of years now. I think I've rolled it 3 times. There are days where I can score 400K to 500K if I work at it but a lot of the time the game beats the snot out of me. Scores of less than 100K are common!

I've started playing in some tournaments and in local leagues over the last little while. To do well you have to understand the rule sets of the games and use some technique rather than just bashing away. When I play FP and focus on the rule set and making specific shots I tend to score much higher.

#1265 3 years ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

I've had mine for a couple of years now. I think I've rolled it 3 times. There are days where I can score 400K to 500K if I work at it but a lot of the time the game beats the snot out of me. Scores of less than 100K are common!
I've started playing in some tournaments and in local leagues over the last little while. To do well you have to understand the rule sets of the games and use some technique rather than just bashing away. When I play FP and focus on the rule set and making specific shots I tend to score much higher.

Yeah good points. Im a serious competitive player and play in two leagues and at least two tournaments a month. That's what's frustrating about this game. I've put in major work on it, still hasn't paid off. Good though cause it looks like this game has major staying power.

#1266 3 years ago

fully restored cq fire power w/drop targets and a super clean survivor fire power 2, both great games, fp2 is much faster, but i like fp the best.

IMG_0861 (resized).JPG

IMG_0860 (resized).JPG

#1267 3 years ago

Boy it's too bad you don't have a nice original Firepower back glass. Very impressive regardless

#1268 3 years ago

Anyone know where to find the original, OEM-style pop bumper mylar? I'd like to use this on the play field when it is finished.

#1269 3 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

Anyone know where to find the original, OEM-style pop bumper mylar? I'd like to use this on the play field when it is finished.

you mean around the pop bumper to put on the playfield?

http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/66-MFC

#1270 3 years ago

titan pinball also has mylar for sale

#1271 3 years ago

I did see that at Marco, but that seemed like it was a straight circle whereas the original stuff looked like it had the holes cut for the nails, etc...or do you have to do that yourself?

#1272 3 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

I did see that at Marco, but that seemed like it was a straight circle whereas the original stuff looked like it had the holes cut for the nails, etc...or do you have to do that yourself?

It's just a ring that should go around those holes that the pop bumper sits in.

#1273 3 years ago

I ended up cutting the standard mylar on the bottom two to avoid all of the posts, etc. I'm assuming that any die to cut it from the factory has been long since lost. At least you are a step ahead of me in that you realized it would be in the way prior to placing it...did not care for taking the razor to it once installed. Also, avoid overtightening the coil mech underneath...I sheared one of the 35 year old bolts trying to pull it flush.

#1274 3 years ago

Ill watch for those bolts!

Here is a picture of the mylar that I'm talking about: has anyone cut those notches out that are in it?

http://www.pinball4you.ch/okaegi/pro_playfield604.jpg

#1275 3 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

Ill watch for those bolts!
Here is a picture of the mylar that I'm talking about: has anyone cut those notches out that are in it?
http://www.pinball4you.ch/okaegi/pro_playfield604.jpg

Right and the stuff you can buy aftermarket just has a big ass hole in the middle so it can fit most games. Think ring toss. Haha

#1276 3 years ago

Kind of what I figured! hahaha nice with the toss...just what kind depends. So basically no one has that, just the generic stuff. Fair enough.

#1277 3 years ago

After owning a CPR Firepower for two years, I *finally* got all the parts together, printed out the instructions, and gathered about 15 hours of time, and installed drops on my Firepower this week, and booted it up tonight. Zero adjustments were required on first game.
I promise a full write up with pics but *when* I'll make time for it, I don't know. I've got to put some games on this thing.

I'm... speechless.
-mof
201703_Fire-drops-have-landed (resized).jpg

#1278 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

installed drops on my Firepower

Awesome! I would love to play one with drop targets and see what it's like. I have a CPR playfield and considered putting in drops but I'm not 100% sold. I would have to try one out before committing!

I look forward to the write up!

#1279 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

After owning a CPR Firepower for two years, I *finally* got all the parts together, printed out the instructions, and gathered about 15 hours of time, and installed drops on my Firepower this week, and booted it up tonight. Zero adjustments were required on first game.
I promise a full write up with pics but *when* I'll make time for it, I don't know. I've got to put some games on this thing.
I'm... speechless.
-mof

Keen to hear a review on how it plays. I plan to do one soon, I have a spare Firepower playfield I bought for a retrofit & now have all the parts I need now to do it.

#1280 3 years ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

Awesome! I would love to play one with drop targets and see what it's like. I have a CPR playfield and considered putting in drops but I'm not 100% sold. I would have to try one out before committing!
I look forward to the write up!

Cool that you can set up drops. How did you get that to work? I bet it makes the game much more friendly.

#1281 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

After owning a CPR Firepower for two years, I *finally* got all the parts together, printed out the instructions, and gathered about 15 hours of time, and installed drops on my Firepower this week, and booted it up tonight. Zero adjustments were required on first game.
I promise a full write up with pics but *when* I'll make time for it, I don't know. I've got to put some games on this thing.
I'm... speechless.
-mof

Looks GREAT mof! Interested to hear your feedback on gameplay differences.

#1282 3 years ago

Interested in seeing this write up! I have my CPR playfield installed and the drop mechs are just laying in the cab waiting.

#1283 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

After owning a CPR Firepower for two years, I *finally* got all the parts together, printed out the instructions, and gathered about 15 hours of time, and installed drops on my Firepower this week, and booted it up tonight. Zero adjustments were required on first game.
I promise a full write up with pics but *when* I'll make time for it, I don't know. I've got to put some games on this thing.
I'm... speechless.
-mof

Damn that's cool. i need to know as well since i just started my restoration, might as well do this at the same time.

a cool video would be nice also.

#1284 3 years ago

Thanks for the congrats fellas...

First observations after an hour of play:

1. "It plays slower with drops" is a myth, not sure why someone would start or reinforce it -- I could stop here.
2. When 2 drops are down, it of course plays faster than standups when you brick into a rubber
3. You frequently catch 2 at a time, which is really cool -- haven't seen a richochet of a 3 sweep yet
4. You can catch an edge to drop the one you need, which is really cool
5. It feels good to play drops (that's subjective to what I love in pinball)
6. You get the "thunk" of the 70's drops resetting, and that's a good feeling
7. You can "kiss" one with a slow-roll and it will drop and it's cool

...It is (like standups) that one bank will reset after you've earned them all -- so sometimes the User-Experience of the drops (being reset) and the controlled lamps (being out) are out of sync. That little oddity is well worth all the plusses.

-mof

#1285 3 years ago

I've had drops in my game for 3 or 4 years now and it defiantly makes for a totally different feel to the game, if you have the stuff its worth the time to do the conversion, the game is still as fast as it ever was, it just feels more complete, kinda like a firepower le.

#1286 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

Thanks for the congrats fellas...
First observations after an hour of play:
1. "It plays slower with drops" is a myth, not sure why someone would start or reinforce it -- I could stop here.
2. When 2 drops are down, it of course plays faster than standups when you brick into a rubber
3. You frequently catch 2 at a time, which is really cool -- haven't seen a richochet of a 3 sweep yet
4. You can catch an edge to drop the one you need, which is really cool
5. It feels good to play drops (that's subjective to what I love in pinball)
6. You get the "thunk" of the 70's drops resetting, and that's a good feeling
7. You can "kiss" one with a slow-roll and it will drop and it's cool
...It is (like standups) that one bank will reset after you've earned them all -- so sometimes the User-Experience of the drops (being reset) and the controlled lamps (being out) are out of sync. That little oddity is well worth all the plusses.
-mof

sounds like a much better game.

can you make a quick run down of what we need for this so i can get everything ready, i have a pretty good idea just want to make sure i don't forget anything. also curious where the coil is connected.

thanks, bob.

#1287 3 years ago

You be the judge...
-mof

#1288 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

You be the judge...
-mof
» YouTube video

thanks for the video man, drops look like a lot of fun to play.
really love the orbit shot now.

... man you make a great homer simpson impression i laugh my ass off....

#1289 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

You be the judge...
-mof
» YouTube video

Nice video! Looks like a real blast...nice to see how it might have been all those years ago!

#1290 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

You be the judge...
-mof

That's a GREAT video! It perfectly captures the in-game frustrations that make the game so addictive. I think we all feel your pain - unbelievable how many times ball 3 drains with two balls locked...

It also is a great example of the gameplay change with the upper gate removed - the initial shot being more like a skill shot (demonstrated in your light plunges) and the loop-around when you reach the top with a strong shot on the right side.

-Rob
-visit http://www.kahr.us to get my daughterboard that helps fix WPC pinball resets or for Williams system 3-7 sound board potentiometer solutions.

#1291 3 years ago

The new siegecraft system 6 drop wipe boards work like magic. Not one single fail...
-mof

#1292 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

You be the judge...
-mof
» YouTube video

Thanks for the review & vid. previously all I had really heard was it played slower with drops, glad it's not the case. lots of positives compared to stand-ups. The fast ball rebound from the rubber when the target is dropped is great too. I hadn't thought of that. I have the siegecraft boards for mine too, glad to hear they are efficient.

#1293 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

The new siegecraft system 6 drop wipe boards work like magic. Not one single fail...
-mof

Quoted from Joydivision:

Thanks for the review & vid. previously all I had really heard was it played slower with drops, glad it's not the case. lots of positives compared to stand-ups. The fast ball rebound from the rubber when the target is dropped is great too. I hadn't thought of that. I have the siegecraft boards for mine too, glad to hear they are efficient.

I'm glad they're working well for you guys. I'm going to be ordering another batch of them soon, any suggestions on improvements to the circuit board at all before I do? Since I released the green version boards and started pre-assembling them, things have gone very smooth with these.

-Hans

#1294 3 years ago
Quoted from mof:

You be the judge...
-mof

Still hard to gauge how different the drops make to the game play. I would love to play two different machines back to back. I'm tempted to do the retrofit just because I like to tinker and I have the CRP playfield with the proper cutouts behind the stand ups. The removal of the top gate definitely changes the game.

There's just something about knocking down targets and seeing and hearing them reset that's satisfying. I might start looking for parts at some point!

#1295 3 years ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

...
There's just something about knocking down targets and seeing and hearing them reset that's satisfying. I might start looking for parts at some point!

i agree, that's why i got to have them. i love drops.

#1296 3 years ago

anyone remember the price of the firepower back glass at mayfair amusement. i know it's probably here somewhere in this thread... can't find it.

#1297 3 years ago

Fellas, can anyone tell me where in the world to get the proper 3M adhesion promoter for installing the inserts? Having a heck of a time finding the stuff.

#1298 3 years ago
Quoted from beatmaster:

anyone remember the price of the firepower back glass at mayfair amusement. i know it's probably here somewhere in this thread... can't find it.

i paid 250 about 3 years ago, i picked it up at pinfest, i emailed him and he had it waiting for me.

#1299 3 years ago
Quoted from beatmaster:

anyone remember the price of the firepower back glass at mayfair amusement. i know it's probably here somewhere in this thread... can't find it.

I paid him $300 USD last year for the glass and the trim kit. I had someone pick it up at the York show in Pennsylvania for me. That's the best way to get it. I would hate to have it shipped and have it arrive broken!

#1300 3 years ago
Quoted from rooftop:

i paid 250 about 3 years ago, i picked it up at pinfest, i emailed him and he had it waiting for me.

Quoted from dzorbas:

I paid him $300 USD last year for the glass and the trim kit. I had someone pick it up at the York show in Pennsylvania for me. That's the best way to get it. I would hate to have it shipped and have it arrive broken!

thanks guys, i suppose they know how to ship a backglass.

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