(Topic ID: 70775)

The Firepower Club


By wiredoug

6 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 3,660 posts
  • 305 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 hours ago by alienpoker
  • Topic is favorited by 140 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

There have been 968 images uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

IMG_20200707_114707189 (resized).jpg
D55A4805-FAD8-4822-8275-21EB5AA7A165 (resized).jpeg
4B71ADED-74A1-426D-B73D-461510530199 (resized).jpeg
A27170FA-E62A-43EE-B0A0-06C203F9AB99 (resized).jpeg
1C7E40C1-F566-4CB6-9E3F-4C179397FD4E (resized).jpeg
D8F05A8F-07D9-4D87-8488-C752C10E0DE6 (resized).jpeg
20200624_212009 (resized).jpg
Screenshot_20200624-164248_Chrome (resized).jpg
E204909B-E607-4407-A33A-388390A782DA (resized).jpeg
F5123C92-5421-4C77-962D-0BF53C9CF6BB (resized).jpeg
pasted_image (resized).png
955D3845-F95B-40AE-AD3A-D964E3197B1C (resized).jpeg
20200621_112414 (resized).jpg
960D948A-C0A8-4A17-BCDD-9535D01EFF98.gif
20200520_171539 (resized).jpg
E0CF3423-D04F-426E-B803-52F67A9C69A6 (resized).jpeg

There are 3660 posts in this topic. You are on page 16 of 74.
#751 4 years ago

That's interesting. I can reasonably assert my new glass is in fact NOS because 1) the glass itself is the same weight and thickness, and 2) once installed in the game, you can see very very faint hairline cracks in the ink, typical of older glasses... Or at least not expected in newer reproductions.

Actually those hairlines raise the question of how best to seal and preserve it. I see too much arguing on that subject. But I have LEDs in there so bulb heat is not the concern...

#752 4 years ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

That looks an awful lot like the reproduction backglass that I bought from Mayfair but I can't be certain. I just realized how much thicker and heavier the original glass is!
Sorry about the crappy pictures!
Original glass below

Reproduction glass below

yeah, the mayfair one have more yellow from what i remember but i'd still buy one since there's nothing outhere.

i'm curious what was your final price for a canadian? you can shoot me a pm.

#753 4 years ago
Quoted from goingincirclez:

Anyway, comparing it to my original, the colors are different.

That can happen from keeping them too close to omnipolar speakers.

#754 4 years ago

Ha! Man, nothing gets by you

Those speakers are original Mirage OM-series. My uncle is a dedicated audiophile who custom designs and builds his own amps and arrays which are simply astonishing. He bought those when his employer relocated him "temporarily" and he wanted something small and quick to scratch the itch. Once he retired and moved back they gathered dust.

But apparently I've always been on his good side since I got into vinyl during the 90s when everyone was chucking it, so he surprised and gave them to me. I could never have afforded something like that at the time, but like the best free gifts, there was a hidden cost: they obsoleted everything else I had so I had to get all new receiver, surrounds, cartridges, etc. Oops.

First time I cranked them in my (relatively tiny!) living space, I knocked pictures off the wall and almost blew out the windows. It was freaking awesome. And songs I knew by memory even on vinyl, holy crap I heard things I never did before.

Then the wife said the sound was too much bigger than the TV, so we had to get a new one of those too. Heh, "free" speakers. But I absolutely am not complaining!

#755 4 years ago

The Mayfair backglasses are not recent reproductions. The story I heard is they were made in the late 80s or 90s when the originals started to fail prematurely.

#756 4 years ago
Quoted from goingincirclez:

I recently picked up a NOS back glass, allegedly from an artist estate and never used in a game. It's virtually flawless except for a few minor imperfections.
Anyway, comparing it to my original, the colors are different. My original has more of a reddish hue, but the other has more yellow and better contrast in the words, as well as thicker mirrored edges around the lettering, etc.
Sorry for the horrible photo, I never had time for photos until late last night and lousy indoor lighting is my potato cam's enemy...
... Anyway, does anyone know the history of these differences?

I think any differences are because they are from a different batch and maybe some colour changes over time on your original. It is definitely an original & not a repro/re-run as stated because it is the same thickness & weight as the original & not on thinner glass as the re-runs were. The Williams official backglass re-run (as has been mentioned & can be seen) has the solid yellow colour behind the lettering & also the wings on the jets are a much lighter blue on the repro compared to the original.

I was looking at buying that NOS backglass, but I was concerned about the fact the seller hadn't shipped a glass before & also the final cost (after factoring the cost of a third party freight forwarder) to get it to Australia would have been about $700.00!

Actually, as far as re-runs on Firepower backglass go, there was yet another earlier official Williams Firepower backglass re-run done sometime in the 80s. (I have one) That one is almost identical to the original except was on screened on thinner glass & one difference with the graphics, the "Firepower" lettering & some borders are pink instead of red!

Here is an example of one of these that sold on ebay recently, the pink seen is not the red faded, that's how they were made. The ink on these re-runs glasses was sealed, that's why that one looks so nice without any flaking like most of the originals.

ebay.com link » Pinball Machine Williams Fire Power Backglass Bally Williams Gottlieb Stern

#757 4 years ago

Check out the video in this threat - summarizes an extensive Firepower rebuild that turns out really nice...

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/firepower-restoration-adventure

-Rob
-visit http://www.kahr.us to get my daughterboard that helps fix WPC pinball resets or for Williams system 3-7 sound board potentiometer solutions

#758 4 years ago

Finally got my FPII running this weekend!
It needed a new transformer and some board work. I also installed a set of new WPC style flipper mechs and coils and repaired a busted pop bumper bracket. It still needs a really good shop, but otherwise it's 100% working again

#759 4 years ago

There's a used FP playfield up on eBay right now that can be purchased for $200. I can't quite tell from looking at the pictures on my phone but the playfield doesn't look too bad. Might be a good starting point for a restore. It looks like it comes with the wiring harness as well.

Here's the link:

ebay.com link

#760 4 years ago

Got some LED's in. Just ordered some Nova polish for the play field. This is game is KILLER.

image_(resized).jpeg

#761 4 years ago

Finally had a chance to take some (hopefully) better photos of my two backglasses. First, the thickness:

FpowerThickness_(resized).jpg

As you can see, they are the same thickness... so presumably they're from the same supplier or whatever.

Now, a better comparison of the graphics. My original, worn one is on the left (I got it signed by Steve Ritchie at Louisville this year, in the bottom left). The OEM NOS is on the right:

FpowerGlass2_(resized).jpg

At a glance the big differences are the NOS has more yellow in the explosions, deeper blue wings on the spacecraft, and a better fade behind the title marquee. More subtly, the NOS does NOT have that faded "gray" area at the 11 o'clock position on the "eclipse", nor does it have the faded gray edging the left of the explosion on Player 3.

Now, comparing to the Mayfair Repro by borrowing a photo posted earlier:

FpowerRepro_(resized).jpg

We can see the repro retains the gray areas, loses the fade behind the marquee in favor of a solid orange, and also seems to lose some blue in the spacecraft (cockpits, for example).

Anyway, it probably doesn't make a huge difference in the long run, but I tend to be OCD on this kind of stuff... guess I played too many "spot the difference!" games when I was little. But it's interesting that there are these variations in the first place! I wonder which ones are most preferred...?

#762 4 years ago
Quoted from goingincirclez:

Finally had a chance to take some (hopefully) better photos of my two backglasses.

Personally, I think I like your NOS glass the best. It seems to be a combination of the original and the Mayfair supplied glass, which I have. Don't get me wrong, the Mayfair glass looks really, really nice and about a million times better than my cracked and shitty original one. At the end of the day, a new or almost new backglass is going to look great in your game! And other than the experts and you, no one will be any wiser!

#763 4 years ago

Fellas, I have been having an issue with my "E" roll-over switch. It doesn't seem to work consistently at all anymore, and, in fact, doesn't work the majority of the time. I have checked the switch itself, which I have cleaned and made sure it has only a slight gap. I tested the diode, which appears to be good, transmitting only as much current in one direction as any of the others. The solder joints do not appear to be cold or jostled, although of course that's still a possibility as I only took a gross look at them.

Any suggestions as to what else to look at?

#764 4 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

Fellas, I have been having an issue with my "E" roll-over switch. It doesn't seem to work consistently at all anymore, and, in fact, doesn't work the majority of the time. I have checked the switch itself, which I have cleaned and made sure it has only a slight gap. I tested the diode, which appears to be good, transmitting only as much current in one direction as any of the others. The solder joints do not appear to be cold or jostled, although of course that's still a possibility as I only took a gross look at them.
Any suggestions as to what else to look at?

I've had this problem before.
In my case, one of the little buttons (not sure what they're called) on the leaf, the parts that actually make contact, had come loose and were corroded. If I shorted the two switch leaves with a screwdriver it would work all the time. You can apply a bit of flux and attempt to drop in a little solder where it attaches to the leaf, or simply replace it.
Try shorting the switch leaves and see what happens. If it makes consistent contact, that's where I would look.

#765 4 years ago
Quoted from goingincirclez:

At a glance the big differences are the NOS has more yellow in the explosions, deeper blue wings on the spacecraft, and a better fade behind the title marquee. More subtly, the NOS does NOT have that faded "gray" area at the 11 o'clock position on the "eclipse", nor does it have the faded gray edging the left of the explosion on Player 3.
Now, comparing to the Mayfair Repro by borrowing a photo posted earlier:

We can see the repro retains the gray areas, loses the fade behind the marquee in favor of a solid orange, and also seems to lose some blue in the spacecraft (cockpits, for example).
Anyway, it probably doesn't make a huge difference in the long run, but I tend to be OCD on this kind of stuff... guess I played too many "spot the difference!" games when I was little. But it's interesting that there are these variations in the first place! I wonder which ones are most preferred...?

I longer no have my FP but was just checking out photos of its backglass. Just to confuse things even further, my old glass had both the gray areas to the left of the eclipse and explosion that are in your older glass, and the deeper blues in the ships and more yellow in the explosions of your newer NOS glass. I'm guessing that with 17k units made, they must have printed several different runs of the backglass, revising the artwork slightly each time. I've seen similar changes with Sorcerer; the tan satchel that he's carrying has at least three different versions.

FP_BG_(resized).jpg

#766 4 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

Any suggestions as to what else to look at?

Take a close look at the contacts of that particular switch. Some machines were made with leaf switches with the contact points assembled backwards. Also possible someone "cleaned" the contacts with sand paper or a file which ruins the contact points long term. You may be best off replacing the switch, especially if shorting the switch leads with a screw driver registers a hit.

#767 4 years ago

Schwaggs, I narrowed it down to spacing as well as some stubborn carbon deposits on the contact that didn't come off with regular index-card cleaning. To get that off, I used a 3200 grit sheet to coax it off. I didn't think that this would have anywhere near the effect of a file or someone using 240 grit. Seems to work much better and consistently now.

#768 4 years ago

Glad you got it working. Those contacts were gold plated at one time. Its possible the plating has worn through or someone before you filed it off and you are to the underlying metal. Don't be surprised if it stops working again sometime in the future. At that point, you can either sand it again or replace the switch.

#769 4 years ago

Instead of sandpaper, consider a burnishing tool. It was made to do just that job.

burnishing_tool_(resized).png

#770 4 years ago
Quoted from browne92:

Instead of sandpaper, consider a burnishing tool. It was made to do just that job.

Do not use a burnishing tool on low voltage, gold plated contacts such as are used on rollover switches and wire switches!

Burnishing tools are only for high current contact points like EOS and flipper switches.

#771 4 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

Do not use a burnishing tool on low voltage, gold plated contacts such as are used on rollover switches and wire switches!
Burnishing tools are only for high current contact points like EOS and flipper switches.

Is this something new? I don't recall ever seeing gold plated contacts in a pin before. But then I haven't worked on anything newer than a Williams System 7.

1 week later
#772 4 years ago
Quoted from browne92:

Is this something new? I don't recall ever seeing gold plated contacts in a pin before. But then I haven't worked on anything newer than a Williams System 7.

Most Williams solid state switch contacts are gold plated .... they're just assembled backwards about half the time and have wrecked the gold plating.

-Hans

#773 4 years ago

What have you guys had success with to remove surface rust & polish the metal parts of the game? Legs, coin door, ball return mechanism, etc? Any specific products that have really worked well for you?

#774 4 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

What have you guys had success with to remove surface rust & polish the metal parts of the game? Legs, coin door, ball return mechanism, etc? Any specific products that have really worked well for you?

For surface rust I always soak everything in Evap O rust. For polishing I use polish in black, green, and white compounds using a high speed wheel.

#775 4 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

What have you guys had success with to remove surface rust & polish the metal parts of the game? Legs, coin door, ball return mechanism, etc? Any specific products that have really worked well for you?

As sohchx said, Evaporust is great, but whatever you do, DON'T use CLR or naval jelly as a substitute, they will remove rust but ruin the finish of your parts.

#776 4 years ago

That looks like some pretty good stuff...is it reusable? As in, after you do a few parts, can you pour it back into it's container and use it again?

What is most of the metal on the machine? Looks like steel, and some is chromed as I can tell. Can't be stainless since it rusts.

#777 4 years ago

Nickel plated steel, possibly with a top layer of chrome.

There's some very good information on the process here:

http://www.finishing.com/faqs/chrome.html

#778 4 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

That looks like some pretty good stuff...is it reusable? As in, after you do a few parts, can you pour it back into it's container and use it again?
What is most of the metal on the machine? Looks like steel, and some is chromed as I can tell. Can't be stainless since it rusts.

Yes, evapo rust can be used many times over. Just strain it back into the bottle if you can. It even works when it's filthy. Amazing stuff

#779 4 years ago
Quoted from jibmums:

As sohchx said, Evaporust is great, but whatever you do, DON'T use CLR or naval jelly as a substitute, they will remove rust but ruin the finish of your parts.

This is correct. Using CLR or jelly will permanently whiten the parts and most times you will see pitting and permanent staining.

#780 4 years ago

Does anyone have an extra top center plastic that says "target scores 1000" in nice condition? mine is broken.

thanks,
aaron

#781 4 years ago

I'm in the process of disassembling a play field...might have a good one.

#782 4 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

I'm in the process of disassembling a play field...might have a good one.

That would be great. Please let me know.

aaron

#783 4 years ago

Have a nice Firepower players game for sale in market area.
Will be @ pintastic on Friday

#784 4 years ago

La Porta,

I sent you a pm yesterday about your playfield. Please let me know.

Thanks,

Robert

#785 4 years ago

Would someone post a picture of the inside of the cabinet of the front of the machine(behind the coin door)? I'm doing a full restore and need to know how the ground braid is tied into everything. I thought I took pictures but can't find them Any help would be appreciated.

#786 3 years ago
Quoted from EAZ:

Would someone post a picture of the inside of the cabinet of the front of the machine(behind the coin door)? I'm doing a full restore and need to know how the ground braid is tied into everything. I thought I took pictures but can't find them Any help would be appreciated.

FP or FP2?

2 weeks later
#787 3 years ago

I need a 1000 point plastic that goes in the top middle of the playfield. Mine has a chunk broken off. Does anyone have an extra they could sell me?

thanks for looking.
aaron

1 week later
#788 3 years ago

I found the part I need. Thanks pinside!! Thanks Len!!

#789 3 years ago

I'm having an odd issue during switch test. It is fine for a while in switch test and then randomly the machine will "die". All the special solenoids that are normally active (pops, slings and flippers) are then dead. Sometimes it will reset into attract and sometimes it'll make a random sound effect and/or fire some solenoids and then all the special solenoids are dead. A power cycle brings things back to normal. All voltages are fine and gameplay seems normal except that sometimes on balls 3-5 it'll take a few seconds to register end of ball and tally the bonus. Has anyone experienced this? Thanks for any insight.

#790 3 years ago
Quoted from BriPin:

gameplay seems normal except that sometimes on balls 3-5 it'll take a few seconds to register end of ball and tally the bonus.

I've experienced this issue when the switches in the ball trough aren't set properly. The ball will gutter and nothing will happen until I hit the flipper buttons a couple of times or I bang the lock down bar a few times. You just need to get under the playfield and adjust the switches.

As for your other issues, I've never seen anything like that.

DZ.

#791 3 years ago

I have a beauty, but need to get it up and running.

IMG_20160806_120940463_(resized).jpg

#792 3 years ago
Quoted from BriPin:

I'm having an odd issue during switch test. It is fine for a while in switch test and then randomly the machine will "die". All the special solenoids that are normally active (pops, slings and flippers) are then dead. Sometimes it will reset into attract and sometimes it'll make a random sound effect and/or fire some solenoids and then all the special solenoids are dead. A power cycle brings things back to normal. All voltages are fine and gameplay seems normal except that sometimes on balls 3-5 it'll take a few seconds to register end of ball and tally the bonus. Has anyone experienced this? Thanks for any insight.

Do you have original CPU and driver boards? Have you replaced the 40 pin interconnect connector? Replaced or at least reflowed the header pins? Replaced ROM sockets?

Many of the problems you describe sound like an intermittent connection issue that can be solved by bulletproofing your original board set.

#793 3 years ago
Quoted from pinaholic:

I have a beauty, but need to get it up and running.

NICE! Looks like fun!

#794 3 years ago
Quoted from pinaholic:

I have a beauty, but need to get it up and running.

Holy crap!! Is that bare wood exposed to the left side of the 10 and 20??

#795 3 years ago
Quoted from canoncitypb:

I found the part I need. Thanks pinside!! Thanks Len!!

No problem...glad I could help out.

#796 3 years ago

I think it is a piece of cardboard on the glass

#797 3 years ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

I've experienced this issue when the switches in the ball trough aren't set properly.

I've adjusted the switches and replaced one but I'll try again. Weird it only happens on balls 3-5.

Quoted from Schwaggs:

Do you have original CPU and driver boards? Have you replaced the 40 pin interconnect connector? Replaced or at least reflowed the header pins? Replaced ROM sockets?

barakandl took care of those items for the previous owner. Maybe I should pull the boards again and give them another more thorough check.

Thanks for the replies guys.

1 week later
#798 3 years ago

To let everyone know, it appears that there are some new-manufacture pop bumper caps on eBay. They don't appear to be the crappy, rounded-edge ones that have been floating around. Can someone take a look at these and see if they look good?

ebay.com link » Firepower Pinball Machine Pop Bumper Cap Set

#799 3 years ago
Quoted from La_Porta:

To let everyone know, it appears that there are some new-manufacture pop bumper caps on eBay. They don't appear to be the crappy, rounded-edge ones that have been floating around. Can someone take a look at these and see if they look good?
ebay.com link » Firepower Pinball Machine Pop Bumper Cap Set

Ordered some and got a tracking number. Will have them in another day or so.

#800 3 years ago
Quoted from Travish:

Ordered some and got a tracking number. Will have them in another day or so.

Nice! Let me know, I may pick them up as well.

Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
$ 279.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball LEDs
$ 11.00
$ 17.00
From: $ 5.00
Cabinet - Other
Rock Custom Pinball
From: $ 9.00
From: $ 18.00
Apparel - Men
Pinside Shop
From: $ 40.00
Cabinet - Other
Rock Custom Pinball
$ 49.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball LEDs
$ 12.00
Cabinet - Other
Siegecraft Electronics
1,250
Sale Pending!
Gardner, MA
$ 22.50
$ 154.00
Cabinet - Toppers
Id Rather Play Pinball
$ 799.00
Flipper Parts
Mircoplayfields
There are 3660 posts in this topic. You are on page 16 of 74.

Hey there! Got a moment?

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside