WTF does this have to do with anything? The article is about hunger/starvation on a global scale, and you want to chime that you'll be fine because you have resources?

"If we change anything it will be way worse" is a very comforting thing to tell ourselves in the face of contemporary horrors, sure. But I'm not sure defending people making millions and billions right now really need to be defended. They're doing fine.

This really is more than just about Covid deaths isn't it? I thought we were talking about the death of the pinball economy as a result of shutting down the overall economy and the effects of doing so?

The results. Shit goes out of business. Everything. Daily.

Bottom line, it is what it is. Certain places are worse than others.

Once a vaccine is produced things will go back to normal and then there will be NEW pinball establishments that rise from the ashes.

Stern, Spooky, AP and now DR are making and delivering games again. CGC and JJP are next. Doom and gloom will be replaced with excitement again.

That's what we do. No point in arguing about it.

I really really really hope so!
By the sounds of it, it sounds like the manufacturers are now all doing OK and have no shortage of orders. It will just take the logistics of the "public sphere" to change for public pinball to be a thing again.
(although I had no idea Deeproot was delivery games! I'll have to go check the DR thread about that)

Spend local when you can, whatever money we can get to small businesses will help minimize the bloodbath...

And yet when those companies lose millions and billions because of faulty governmental policies, I’m sure you’re first in line to help bail them out?.. Companies with low growth rates need to attract investors with decent dividends. That props up the company share price which can help the company survive bad times. Those investors are taking a risk, why shouldn’t they be rewarded? If you take your company public, you understand it isn’t for the benefit of mankind- you work for the owners of the company- shareholders. Some of those shareholders might be surviving because they get that dividend.

My concern is what this does to the overall mentality of the populous living through it, and especially those with the resources to invest and open new businesses that could replace the ones we are losing. I don't know about you guys, but I had a couple of grandparents that lived through the Great Depression, and they lived their entire lives affected by those few years of austerity and skimping. My grandfather buryed money in the yard up until he died at age 95. Never trusted banks completely. Never learned to throw anything away.

Will those of us watching the barcades go down dare get into that pool after this clears up? Nothing has ever illustrated the fragility of simple business economics in my lifetime. Ugh.

yes, taxpayers have bailed them out time and time again, and fed them billions of subsidies. You don't need to use loaded phrases like "faulty government policies". Businesses would love to have all regulations cut and not have to worry about standards or safety.
This is way off topic, happy to take to PM if you want to continue though. <3

obviously there were WAY LESS out there back in 2008, but did lots of arcades shutter in that recession? I wasn't following the industry back then.

I'm simply stating that without invester funds, businesses won't exist which equals joblessness which equals poverty, starvation.
Without investors, new pinball company's wouldn't exist.

And based on the way they are counting "covid deaths" the actual number of people killed BY Covid-19 is probably about half that or less. The cool thing about statistics and the internet is that I can live in "Bison Corners, SD" and still have access to data that overwhelmingly shows that our lockdown and mask wearing is doing very little to curb the spread of Covid-19 but it still is killing far fewer people than we were told. In March some idiots (or more accurately, fear mongers) were saying IFR of 2-6%. Based on antibody testing available from some other countries at the time, I predicted the IFR to be closer to 0.05% and even the CDC numbers are trending towards that being pretty close to the actual IFR. I'm waiting for people to start calling for 5 mph speed limits everywhere because apparently we only access risk by looking at one thing and determine that any measures (despite how little evidence supports said measures) are worth all their cons for the possible pros of reducing that one risk. It's asinine, frankly.

Source?

I'm not going to link everything I've read and looked at for hours a day over the past 5 months.

.

*sigh*

Yeah, stay in here to discuss this mess.

Meteor? What... don’t forget about the threat of “alien invasion”

Go look at the stats. ATM or RFM will outsell Meteor on a ratio of 10 to 1 anyday

I have read thousands of books but cannot link any of them.

Aliens have already been here and left.
They want nothing to do with us at this stage in the evolutionary chain.

We have a thread to discuss Covid. Please post Covid related items there.

I agree with you that the restrictions have hurt or destroyed many barcades and restaurants especially here in Arizona we’ve lost several, both small and large. I am also very glad to hear that from your perspective in South Dakota and as a physician in rehabilitation medicine that COVID-19 is “FAR less severe”. As a board-certified physician in emergency medicine, working at the busiest emergency department/level 1 trauma center for over 10 years it is a very different reality here. With much respect to you I strongly disagree in your statement and I believe as a physician you’re using your authority to mislead people.

In Phoenix and other cities around the country conditions deteriorated where we were being flooded with critically sick patients. Due to lack of PPE, appropriate staffing, lack of rooms and medications we were maxed out on the availability to provide adequate care. In my hospital we opened up several hospital floors in the adjacent Children’s Hospital and had several floors of intubated ICU patients. I personally had several night shifts where each night I ended up intubating several patients with severe hypoxia and COVID pneumonia. As a physician you likely know this procedure generates the highest amount of respiratory droplets with viral load and is most dangerous to staff. Myself, the respiratory therapist and nurses would do this with inadequate PPE to help save the lives of others. Unfortunately several of my colleagues have had Covid with a small number paying the ultimate price. We accepted transfers from outlying rural hospitals that were maxed beyond capacity. I have personally pronounced many people dead from this between the ages of 19 to 88, some of which have had no pre-existing conditions. This may be FAR less severe in your community but in many areas of this country it is severe .

I do believe the state of Arizona shut down too quickly in March and hence badly hurt the economy and peoples livelihoods with no benefit to the medical community. However I am extremely grateful that my community shut down in July, started wearing masks and social distancing and this significantly decreased the rate of transmission and allowed the staff at my hospital to catch up. We have been able to acquire PPE, ramp up staffing from out of state from areas less affected and are in a much better position to provide good care to those who need it. Here in Arizona we are we opening the economy as well as schools while simultaneously decreasing the number of COVID-19 that require hospitalization. I want to thank so many of you who are willing to sacrifice meeting in large groups and are willing to wear a mask and socially distance for the greater good. You are the ones who are helping win this fight.

In regards to your initial statements I ask that you be more reflective of downplaying this and trying to speak from a position of authority as a physician in rehabilitation medicine whose father is an epidemiologist.

Fair enough. How about just one credible source that backs up this claim?

This is false, masks work to curb the spread but it does depend on what type of mask people wear. Below is an article sharing results from a recent study done at Duke regarding mask effectiveness.

https://www.newsobserver.com/news/coronavirus/article244835552.html

"Not surprisingly, the fewest droplets (almost zero) were detected with a fitted N95 mask, the ones used by doctors, nurses and other health care workers in the highest-risk settings. A surgical mask was a close second.

Masks made of polypropylene also did very well, but so did various kinds of double-layer cotton masks. Several of the cotton masks produced less than 20% as many particles as someone wearing no mask at all.

Less effective was the bandana, which let through about 50% as many particles as someone not wearing a mask at all.

But the worst performer was the gaiter, which people wear around their necks and pull up over their faces like a mask. The one the Duke team tested actually made things worse. Rather than preventing the droplets from escaping, it turned the larger droplets into a cloud of smaller ones that hung in the air longer."

....PLEASE

I’m giving DR credit only because they say September AND I actually counted about 25 cars in the parking lot yesterday

Maybe they are noodling and doodling with Jpop? Lol

I should clarify. Having asymptomatic people wear masks, especially cloth masks, is useless at best and harmful at worst, and the potential downsides have not been properly studied but it is unlikely that the pros outweigh the cons (as the pros are so minimal). Symptomatic people should stay away from other people or wear a surgical mask if they have to be around others. An N95 or better protection should be used by anyone that has to be near severely ill people because being exposed to a high viral load is how this virus kills young, healthy people. I don't envy any ER or critical care docs taking care of these people and they have a completely viable reason to fear this. It has killed thousands and will kill thousands more. But that doesn't mean that it hasn't been shown (worldwide) to be far less severe than what was originally thought. As the ER doc above wanted to denigrate my expertise because of the type of doctor I am and the state I live in, his point is that I am not in the thick of treating these people and such a myopic view of my own experience will color my judgment. I would argue that I do not use my personal experience to judge the severity but rather the data. And that his anecdotal experience is coloring his judgment and skewing his perception of the actual severity of the pandemic that has an IFR around 50x lower than originally reported. So yes, it is way less severe than originally reported in mainstream news. The data was there 5 months ago that spoke against that severity but fear sells better than facts. My point is that having healthy people quarantine and wear masks isn't helping against the pandemic but is hurting a lot of other things, which I think is relevant to this discussion. This is my last post on this topic because I don't want to run afoul of the mods any more than I already have. I have also discussed this ad nauseam on Facebook and in person with too many people and I'm frankly tired of it and don't care enough about having the discussion to that depth on Pinside to continue.

I hear what you are saying but at the same time existing home sales just spiked an unprecedented 24% in the month of July

I have people in my line of business looking to buy up assets on the cheap. The problem for them is there is no panic selling. Just the opposite

A better comparison would be 2008 and here we are 12 yrs later. All time market highs and panic buying

Low interest rates and massive liquidity will keep fueling the self induced post shutdown rally

The only thing that could divert the other pathwe are on is higher taxes, lower GDP growth, less production which would lead to more dollars fighting for the that lower productivity and...

Inflation and higher interest rates

There isn’t a federal, state or local government around the world that can help pinball by taking more money out of the private sector, much less any other sort of business creation

I would consider doing a pinball related business like Helicon brewing. But it would be for fun

Take my direct concern of the pandemic out of the equation and there are still several other reasons I haven’t made it out to a local pinball place:

1) Babysitters/family are no longer available
2) Disposable income got severely shrunk
3) my wife’s hours have gotten insane and work is severely draining so she is in no mood to be schlept over to a pinball place and/or be left solo with kiddos.
4) I do not trust my kids to all keep their masks on at all times. Wouldn’t be able to enjoy any games as I would constantly be chasing them down or looking over my shoulder.

I suspect that there are many casual families/patrons in a similar spot as me.

I have zero stakes in the Deeproot thing, but damn do I want them to just put up or shut up...
The Predator saga ended in flames.
There is hope still that with Big Lebowski they will finally rectify past wrongs.
JJP strugged and persevered. American Pinball and Spooky are working hard and moving units.
Heck, even Thunderbirds came and went!
but here we are so many years later waiting for a new JPop game.

You and me both! Stfu and just deliver a damn game. One to start with

It appears Sept it actually happens. We shall see

"Absolutely not" evidence

That being said, the gaiter was only tested on a single person, making it likely that differences between individual speakers would overwhelm any difference between masks that they noted. What's more, the researchers tested a single neck gaiter (one that was very thin and made up of a mix of 8% spandex and 92% polyester).

The public should "absolutely not" use this as evidence that neck gaiters are worse than wearing no mask at all, Fischer said. "We tested one mask because we just had that mask lying around … there are plenty of other gaiters out there," some that could be more protective, he said. Even the way people wear them can change how protective they are, he added.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.livescience.com/amp/coronavirus-neck-gaiters.html

Yes, yes, yes and yes. We have heard all of these from customers or potential customers. An arcade is for when life if more carefree. It is not more carefree right now. Maybe next year

Not supported by the evidence.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/13/scientists-say-the-coronavirus-is-at-least-as-deadly-as-the-1918-flu-pandemic.html

Can you read? The mods requested no more Covid BS in this thread

I’m wondering who you really are from the past as a new Member. Lol

Thanks for your concern. I did not read all replies in thread, peaking my head in from time to time.

Not sure why you think I would be someone else. I just started looking for my first pin as of 2 weeks ago. Such a warm welcome.

So I bring evidence to someone making baseless claims, and your point isn't to challenge my evidence but to ad-hominem?

bold strategy

Dude really?

Counting cars?

Are you this desperate?

If you are this interested why not
Just knock on the door instead of stalking their parking lot? I’m sure they’ll be happy to give you a tour.

I remember when someone took a pic of JJP's parking lot back in the early days of WOZ. Then the speculation that followed on why there weren't more cars. Good times.

Pm me. You are obviously new. I can educate you. I will say your “opinion” is baseless, ignorant and uninformed. See how that works?

And when YOU say my opinion should be canceled you just lost the crybaby ad hominem attack argument

Go back to trolling the post office thread

On another note, I’m actually thinking about starting a brewery/pin location like Helicon once the coast is clear.

I have a few other investors/friends just looking for something to do

Arcades / Barcades all fall into the disposable income category and in today's economy that disposable income is shrinking and becoming less and less.

[Removed]

I hear you and was with you for like 90%. You lost me when you veered into the no-no zone and spouted bat shit crazy medical advice.

Who wants to invest in a brewery/pin cade with me?

$$$

Beer and wine license only

if we can put it close to the Texas / Ontario border I'm in.

What started off as an enthusiasm for craft beer has turned into a pretty decent career for me. I absolutely love the industry. If you are planning on investing in a brewery I wish you nothing but the best, and if there is pinball involved then that just makes it all the better!

A pinball machine sounds like a great way to distance people. Table of four, Spiderman LE, table for two, etc....

I'm all ears to how to make the "craft beer" part work. I really love it.

We have some great local craft breweries like Freetail with distribution outside of the location.

I'm thinking something like a micro brewery and a pinball/arcade experience such as Helicon.

Just breaking even would be worth it for us and maybe some longer term growth.

Don't we have a Canadian/Texas pipeline? I think we do. Can run the beer through the pipes when the oil and gas is shut down?

I would think Canada would be a no brainer for you. Beergut is in MN and close by.

I really do think it could be a great business opportunity that is fun.

It's not like buying Apple stock and watching it double since April but its a heck of a lot more fun.

Mr. Burns? Is that really you??

Find a master brewer that knows the ins and outs and make them an owner.

Silverball saloon in Rochester also threw in the towel today.
the silver ball was amazing.i was shocked at this one.

In Ottawa we have this amazing place called House of Targ and my friends operate the machines there. http://www.houseoftarg.com/
The operators got invited by local brewery Big Rig (named after Ottawa Senators defenceman Chris Phillips) to put machines in their brewery ( https://pinballmap.com/ottawa/?by_location_id=13666 ) which resulted in a very cool lineup: Addams Fam, Getaway, Maiden, IM, Jurassic Park Pro, Bridge of Pinbot 2.0, and Tron

so then Big Rig starts making beer for Targ: https://www.instagram.com/p/CDmYGDmhKcx/
and now during the pandemic Big Rig is hosting a Targ pop-up market as a place to sell their perogies: https://twitter.com/HouseofTarg/status/1297085985239506949

Cool to see 3 businesses help each other out and keep the cash flowing during these pandemic times.